Cyrillic posters in America: How the presidential candidates reacted

David Clark4 said:In casual conversation, people say "sale" or "clearance"—I haven't exactly heard anyone insisting on using some archaic substitute. And honestly, this barely touches the actual topic, let alone this idea about the language dying out. It hasn't died out in the diaspora, so I doubt it'll just vanish here overnight.

There is no such thing as an "occupation" by the English language. It's never going to become our official state language, and frankly, this has nothing to do with the discussion at hand.

The rest of your post is pretty much off-topic too. Or are you trying to suggest we'll become some global superpower if we just start using Cyrillic as our official script? 🤣

After witnessing such a profound logical leap, I have a very clear idea of who I'm dealing with here.

I'm going to go walk the dog.

I’m not one for forcing anything on people, because honestly, that usually just backfires.
Those billboards will just end up being covered in the most disgusting content imaginable, and then everyone starts whining about how we're stuck in this endless loop of hate and toxic vibes. It's way better to build bridges based on things that actually bring Americans and Mexicans together—and there's plenty of that—rather than obsessing over Cyrillic script, which I'm pretty sure hasn't even been a big deal for Mexicans living here in the States throughout history.

Sam Martinez9 said:That’s just nonsense.

Thirty years after World War II ended—and indeed, quite a bit earlier than that—German and Italian were taught in almost every school throughout America.

No one was forcing people in coastal cities to purge Italian loanwords from their speech, nor were folks in the Midwest being told to scrub German influences from their dialects. Instead, there was a steady focus on nurturing the standard literary American language.

The American language, regardless of whether it was categorized under the Serbo-American umbrella back then, enjoyed far more protection within America than it does today.

Nowadays, the threats are much more pervasive: the dominance of the internet, the influx of English-speakers, scientific papers being published exclusively in English, and the fact that people simply don't read books anymore—and reading is how a language lives and evolves. It actually requires more protection now.

But the real dangers are invisible; most "patriots" only seem to lose their minds when they see Cyrillic script.

Nationalistic intolerance needs to be called out because it isn't civilized... but then again, our world has changed a lot over the last twenty-five years. Between global integration, transitions... and just changing ways of thinking.

Still, you have to consider the actual victims who suffered in that city (or anywhere else)—how can we truly understand if we haven't felt it ourselves?
Just try looking at the numbers for a second—the casualties, the missing.

America can't force Mexico to reveal where the executed are buried. (Even the American politicians over there—Milorad Pupovac and his crew... they don't know either, but maybe someone does.)
Because these guys wouldn't admit to a crime like this.
Maybe in another twenty years.

Sam Martinez9 said:That’s just nonsense.

Thirty years after World War II ended—and indeed, quite a bit earlier than that—German and Italian were taught in almost every school throughout America.

No one was forcing people in coastal cities to purge Italian loanwords from their speech, nor were folks in the Midwest being told to scrub German influences from their dialects. Instead, there was a steady focus on nurturing the standard literary American language.

The American language, regardless of whether it was categorized under the Serbo-American umbrella back then, enjoyed far more protection within America than it does today.

Nowadays, the threats are much more pervasive: the dominance of the internet, the influx of English-speakers, scientific papers being published exclusively in English, and the fact that people simply don't read books anymore—and reading is how a language lives and evolves. It actually requires more protection now.

But the real dangers are invisible; most "patriots" only seem to lose their minds when they see Cyrillic script.

It’s because almost all available literature is in English and free to access online. That was my entire experience during my college years. Much of our local academic material feels like a mere carbon copy of something else. In English, concepts are often explained with much greater clarity than they are in American. Now, setting aside the political baggage, is it really a bad thing to learn a different script? Americans know that certain symbols are often weaponized as provocations within our society. Even Zoran Milanović was busy installing barriers in El Paso late at night just to prevent incidents from breaking out.

As long as we have tourism keeping us afloat, everything will be fine; once that disappears, our language and its various scripts will be the very least of our worries.

Thomas Nelson25 said:Nationalistic intolerance needs to be called out because it isn't civilized... but then again, our world has changed a lot over the last twenty-five years. Between global integration, transitions... and just changing ways of thinking.

Still, you have to consider the actual victims who suffered in that city (or anywhere else)—how can we truly understand if we haven't felt it ourselves?
Just try looking at the numbers for a second—the casualties, the missing.

America can't force Mexico to reveal where the executed are buried. (Even the American politicians over there—Milorad Pupovac and his crew... they don't know either, but maybe someone does.)
Because these guys wouldn't admit to a crime like this.
Maybe in another twenty years.

And how would you know what I’ve felt on my own skin? I have felt enough that I don't need you to present me with any numbers.

Thomas Nelson25 said:Nationalistic intolerance needs to be called out because it isn't civilized... but then again, our world has changed a lot over the last twenty-five years. Between global integration, transitions... and just changing ways of thinking.

Still, you have to consider the actual victims who suffered in that city (or anywhere else)—how can we truly understand if we haven't felt it ourselves?
Just try looking at the numbers for a second—the casualties, the missing.

America can't force Mexico to reveal where the executed are buried. (Even the American politicians over there—Milorad Pupovac and his crew... they don't know either, but maybe someone does.)
Because these guys wouldn't admit to a crime like this.
Maybe in another twenty years.

Regarding nationalism, I struggle to understand nationalists who allow their ideology to limit them, preventing them from becoming free and fully realized human beings.

Here is a passage from Žižek's parallax: For a philosopher, ethnic roots, national identity, and so forth are simply not categories of truth. Or, to put it in precise Kantian terms, when we dwell on our ethnic origins, we are engaging in a private use of reason, limited by contingent and dogmatic assumptions. In other words, we act as unreasoning individuals rather than as free human beings inhabiting the dimension of universal reason. Of course, this doesn't mean we should be ashamed of our ethnic roots; we can love them and take pride in them—coming home might bring a glow to our faces—but the fact remains that all of this is ultimately irrelevant. We ought to behave like Saint Paul, who, despite being proud of his particular identity as both a Jew and a Roman citizen, was nonetheless aware that within the space of Christian absolute truth, there is neither Jew nor Greek.

placidnomad87 said:It’s because almost all available literature is in English and free to access online. That was my entire experience during my college years. Much of our local academic material feels like a mere carbon copy of something else. In English, concepts are often explained with much greater clarity than they are in American. Now, setting aside the political baggage, is it really a bad thing to learn a different script? Americans know that certain symbols are often weaponized as provocations within our society. Even Zoran Milanović was busy installing barriers in El Paso late at night just to prevent incidents from breaking out.

As long as we have tourism keeping us afloat, everything will be fine; once that disappears, our language and its various scripts will be the very least of our worries.

Well, sure. Everyone knows that.

But I decided to look at the bigger picture—I recognized a genuine threat to the American language (and no, I’m not talking about Cyrillic). I actually sat down and mapped out what needs to be done to mitigate or completely neutralize that risk—namely, by making an effort to read in English—and realized that absolutely nobody is taking this seriously. Ironically, the people who seem most concerned are the self-proclaimed "patriots." They spend all their energy fighting battles over scripts and symbols while ignoring the actual erosion of our own linguistic heritage.

Article 12.

In the United States, English is the official language and the Latin alphabet is the standard script.

Certain local jurisdictions may also adopt another language or a different script, such as Cyrillic, provided they meet the specific requirements set by federal or state law.

https://www.congress.gov/legislation/...7_85_2422.html

Polk County Statute
illustration
POLK COUNTY STATUTE, a manuscript dating back to the early 16th century, Washington, D.C., National Archives

The Polk County Statute, the governing document for the community of Polk County; the first draft was compiled in 1440, written in a shorthand American script with various local nuances. It consists of 116 articles (actually 206, as several sections contain multiple clauses).

http://www.britannica.com/topic/statute

The Constitution of the United States is clear. The historical use of other scripts in America is also quite evident. I don't see an issue here, unless some people just feel the need to overthink things, stir the pot, or act like experts.

Those OT posters are pretty mindless.☕

Thomas Nelson25 said:Some resistance to that script is justified—based on past trauma—while some of it is just straight-up nationalism (pure intolerance).

It would be way easier for them if we weren't part of this union... the way it is, they have to deal with bilingualism. Of course, those politicians over in the neighboring country are pushing this issue on purpose, even making it a talking point for these elections.

The bilingualism concept isn't even a big deal in most EU countries. It wasn't some requirement for joining the EU, and the European Commission couldn't care less about whether we have it or not.
We basically just decided to do it ourselves back in 2002, and both major political parties were totally on board.

As for those signs? Who cares. They can put whatever they want on them.

Cuka As I was saying:
I've always felt that OT posters are just completely underwhelming. There's nothing to them.☕

They don't stand out to me. They pull themselves away from the crowd, distancing themselves from everyone else just to grab attention and shock the senses. It’s a classic advertising tactic—I remember how Benetton used to operate back in the day. They’d run these provocative ad campaigns, like that one famous poster featuring a blood-stained shirt worn by a soldier from the North American conflicts.

Richard Wilson4 said:The bilingualism concept isn't even a big deal in most EU countries. It wasn't some requirement for joining the EU, and the European Commission couldn't care less about whether we have it or not.
We basically just decided to do it ourselves back in 2002, and both major political parties were totally on board.

As for those signs? Who cares. They can put whatever they want on them.

The way you're framing this makes it sound like the European Union doesn't care about bilingualism at all.

But actually, bilingualism exists throughout most EU countries. And in many of them, the threshold for minority populations to trigger bilingual requirements is as high as 10%.

Charles Fox10 said:

Article 12.

In the United States, English is the official language and the Latin alphabet is the standard script.

Certain local jurisdictions may also adopt another language or a different script, such as Cyrillic, provided they meet the specific requirements set by federal or state law.

https://www.congress.gov/legislation/...7_85_2422.html

Polk County Statute
illustration
POLK COUNTY STATUTE, a manuscript dating back to the early 16th century, Washington, D.C., National Archives

The Polk County Statute, the governing document for the community of Polk County; the first draft was compiled in 1440, written in a shorthand American script with various local nuances. It consists of 116 articles (actually 206, as several sections contain multiple clauses).

http://www.britannica.com/topic/statute

The Constitution of the United States is clear. The historical use of other scripts in America is also quite evident. I don't see an issue here, unless some people just feel the need to overthink things, stir the pot, or act like experts.

Those OT posters are pretty mindless.☕

Mexicans have adopted Cyrillic as a core part of their identity and use it as such. Meanwhile, Vučić and his inner circle tend to view Americans as nothing more than Catholic Mexicans. But the issue isn't just about how Americans are portrayed; many people refuse to accept the sight of Cyrillic because it triggers deep-seated associations with villainous Mexicans—think of figures like Šešelj.



We really have to consider the fact that, throughout history, American territories have consistently been caught in the crosshairs of powerful neighbors and massive empires. Is it any wonder that we still exist at all today? Over the last thousand years, we've essentially belonged to everyone. All too often, this part of our history is brushed aside in favor of focusing on the negatives. In reality, until 1990, we didn't even possess true independence.

Joshua Garcia12 said:The way you're framing this makes it sound like the European Union doesn't care about bilingualism at all.

But actually, bilingualism exists throughout most EU countries. And in many of them, the threshold for minority populations to trigger bilingual requirements is as high as 10%.

Most? Like which ones? Greece, France, Denmark?

The EU itself doesn't care. Some member states do.
But the EU? Not really.

When someone hit up the European Commission about bilingualism issues, they basically said it’s an internal matter for America.

Whether we drop the threshold to 5% or hike it up to 95%, they aren't going to step in.

Sam Martinez9 said:

Cuka As I was saying:
I've always felt that OT posters are just completely underwhelming. There's nothing to them.☕

They don't stand out to me. They pull themselves away from the crowd, distancing themselves from everyone else just to grab attention and shock the senses. It’s a classic advertising tactic—I remember how Benetton used to operate back in the day. They’d run these provocative ad campaigns, like that one famous poster featuring a blood-stained shirt worn by a soldier from the North American conflicts.

And? What's actually the point of those posters? Is it genuine support for the candidates or just something else entirely? Honestly, civilization will probably collapse long before any language disappears.

Roger Fisher44 said:And? What's actually the point of those posters? Is it genuine support for the candidates or just something else entirely? Honestly, civilization will probably collapse long before any language disappears.

What was the actual purpose behind Benetton's ads featuring that blood-stained shirt from a fallen soldier?

I suspect you can find the answer to that one on your own.

Since you're online anyway, take a moment to look up how many languages have vanished throughout history—it’s not just plant and animal species facing extinction—and see which ones are currently on the brink.

In some distant future, we might be left with only a handful of languages, eventually narrowing down to just one. I’m not quite sure if that will end up being Mandarin or English.

Sam Martinez9 said:What was the actual purpose behind Benetton's ads featuring that blood-stained shirt from a fallen soldier?

I suspect you can find the answer to that one on your own.

Since you're online anyway, take a moment to look up how many languages have vanished throughout history—it’s not just plant and animal species facing extinction—and see which ones are currently on the brink.

In some distant future, we might be left with only a handful of languages, eventually narrowing down to just one. I’m not quite sure if that will end up being Mandarin or English.

Why are you asking me? Ask Benetton. Like I said, civilization will likely collapse before any language actually dies out. So, what was the point of those SNV posters then?

Roger Fisher44 said:Why are you asking me? Ask Benetton. Like I said, civilization will likely collapse before any language actually dies out. So, what was the point of those SNV posters then?

I don't need to go running to Benetton; I already understand why they used it and what their endgame was. I was asking you because I wanted to see if you actually had any insight.

But since you’re still stuck on the idea that civilization will fall before a language dies out—there really isn't much point in me asking you anything else. Or telling you anything, for that matter.

Most extinct languages belonged to small, isolated tribes. There are plenty of those out there, but national languages have much more staying power. It’s often a matter of national pride; take Germans, for instance—they aren't going to adopt English as their official language, even though practically everyone understands it perfectly well.

Then there's the issue of loanwords. Sure, people pick up English terms here and there, but simply borrowing a few words doesn't change the fundamental structure of a language.

Sam Martinez9 said:I don't need to go running to Benetton; I already understand why they used it and what their endgame was. I was asking you because I wanted to see if you actually had any insight.

But since you’re still stuck on the idea that civilization will fall before a language dies out—there really isn't much point in me asking you anything else. Or telling you anything, for that matter.

I am. Look, what we have right now won't even last a thousand years. And again—what’s the point of a poster in Cyrillic? Who are they even trying to shock?

Melissa Stewart6 said:Most extinct languages belonged to small, isolated tribes. There are plenty of those out there, but national languages have much more staying power. It’s often a matter of national pride; take Germans, for instance—they aren't going to adopt English as their official language, even though practically everyone understands it perfectly well.

Then there's the issue of loanwords. Sure, people pick up English terms here and there, but simply borrowing a few words doesn't change the fundamental structure of a language.

I have to disagree. Here is some reading material for you:

Meet the languages that America has forgotten

According to research from the University of Helsinki, over 70 percent of languages in the West fall into the endangered category. While major global languages expand their influence through mass media, certain smaller, isolated ones are slowly fading from the collective consciousness. Because of this, we are bringing you a few interesting examples from the Old Continent.

In the US, according to the UNESCO list, there are a total of 300 languages spoken, and 277 of them are considered endangered. This staggering figure was confirmed by a study conducted a few years ago at the University of Helsinki, which covered a specific region of the Old Continent (excluding Russia and Turkey). Essentially, Finnish researchers concluded that out of 136 languages, only about 30 don't need to worry about their future.

Globalization and the cultural imperialism of "major" Western nations—fueled by mass media and educational systems—are quite literally trampling smaller languages until they vanish entirely. Language death has happened before, but never on the scale we are seeing during the 20th and 21st centuries. It results in new political and cultural shifts. Beyond dying out in the traditional sense, smaller languages sometimes assimilate or merge into larger ones, thereby losing their unique identity. Most minor languages in the West are being rapidly buried under internationalisms and English loanwords, so we are presenting a few that, while perhaps not the most critically endangered, remain relatively unknown.

Here is the full article:

And those are just the languages found in the West. The situation is even more dire for the rest of the world.

Sam Martinez9 said:I have to disagree. Here is some reading material for you:

Meet the languages that America has forgotten

According to research from the University of Helsinki, over 70 percent of languages in the West fall into the endangered category. While major global languages expand their influence through mass media, certain smaller, isolated ones are slowly fading from the collective consciousness. Because of this, we are bringing you a few interesting examples from the Old Continent.

In the US, according to the UNESCO list, there are a total of 300 languages spoken, and 277 of them are considered endangered. This staggering figure was confirmed by a study conducted a few years ago at the University of Helsinki, which covered a specific region of the Old Continent (excluding Russia and Turkey). Essentially, Finnish researchers concluded that out of 136 languages, only about 30 don't need to worry about their future.

Globalization and the cultural imperialism of "major" Western nations—fueled by mass media and educational systems—are quite literally trampling smaller languages until they vanish entirely. Language death has happened before, but never on the scale we are seeing during the 20th and 21st centuries. It results in new political and cultural shifts. Beyond dying out in the traditional sense, smaller languages sometimes assimilate or merge into larger ones, thereby losing their unique identity. Most minor languages in the West are being rapidly buried under internationalisms and English loanwords, so we are presenting a few that, while perhaps not the most critically endangered, remain relatively unknown.

Here is the full article:

And those are just the languages found in the West. The situation is even more dire for the rest of the world.

There is nothing here that contradicts what I said.