Religion classes in school - Megathread

The way they’ve scheduled this elective—it’s basically a nudge toward secularism since it’s plopped right in the middle of everything else. I mean, look, if they wanted to hold it during late hours or swap the shifts entirely, fine, nobody would complain... but as it stands? It’s just unfair. Anyone who didn't pick this specific class ends up stuck in a terrible spot—spending 45 minutes twice a week just wandering the hallways because there's this massive gap in their schedule. It feels a bit disorganized, honestly.

What do you mean, "different location"? You can just schedule this at the school during an after-school block, just like any other elective. It could be zero period or right after the regular school day ends.
We used to have electives set up exactly like that. One year, we even had a two-hour technical workshop held after hours, and nobody threw a fit about it—even though that wasn't an "elective."

I find all this drama over switching to an after-school slot or moving locations pretty funny. I haven’t noticed parents complaining when they have to drive their kids to church for religious ed, yet that’s the only version recognized for sacraments (at least in my parish). So, it’s perfectly fine for a kid to head to church in the afternoon before their First Communion or Confirmation, and it’s fine to show up for early morning mass before school starts—it's practically mandatory if you want to stay in good standing—but suddenly everyone loses it when someone suggests organizing religious ed at the school so it doesn't inconvenience anyone.

Honestly, this is such a hypocritical way to look at faith. If I'm fine with it, that's my business, but I don't care what anyone else thinks. 🙏 And then there's this idiotic excuse about how things were better back in the day because kids were more independent and needed to "toughen up." Frankly, people like this make me embarrassed to call myself a believer, because they immediately lump me in with their crowd.

edit: someone beat me to the punch and posted right as I was typing. 😁

Religious studies in schools just feels off to me. It teaches kids a perspective that isn't based on facts, which basically clashes with everything else they learn in science class. Plus, faith is such a deeply personal thing—it shouldn't really be part of a public school curriculum in a secular country like the US. Not to mention, it leaves huge gaps in the school day and creates this massive opportunity for bullying.

You keep bringing up how 86% of people in America are Catholic. But honestly, if we actually polled the elementary school kids, I bet the percentage of them who believe in Santa Claus would be just as high. Since parents are the ones planting those seeds of belief in both God and Santa, can we use that same logic we're seeing on this thread to introduce Frosty the Snowman into the curriculum too? Or something like that?

briskbison55 said:That's... uh, quite the comparison. So, what, you think religious fundamentalists are out there handing out weapons and inciting hatred too?

I mean, what would happen with them?

How does an election issue factor into that, though?

No, they wouldn't, because you still don't seem to get that this is an election matter—it was basically a compromise made for parents who can't just leave work to drive their kids somewhere else.

Besides, they have to head over to Sunday school for religious studies during the week anyway.

Sarah Hall53 said:The way they’ve scheduled this elective—it’s basically a nudge toward secularism since it’s plopped right in the middle of everything else. I mean, look, if they wanted to hold it during late hours or swap the shifts entirely, fine, nobody would complain... but as it stands? It’s just unfair. Anyone who didn't pick this specific class ends up stuck in a terrible spot—spending 45 minutes twice a week just wandering the hallways because there's this massive gap in their schedule. It feels a bit disorganized, honestly.

I mean, I think you might be missing the actual definition of what secular means.

melloworca6 said:What do you mean, "different location"? You can just schedule this at the school during an after-school block, just like any other elective. It could be zero period or right after the regular school day ends.
We used to have electives set up exactly like that. One year, we even had a two-hour technical workshop held after hours, and nobody threw a fit about it—even though that wasn't an "elective."

I find all this drama over switching to an after-school slot or moving locations pretty funny. I haven’t noticed parents complaining when they have to drive their kids to church for religious ed, yet that’s the only version recognized for sacraments (at least in my parish). So, it’s perfectly fine for a kid to head to church in the afternoon before their First Communion or Confirmation, and it’s fine to show up for early morning mass before school starts—it's practically mandatory if you want to stay in good standing—but suddenly everyone loses it when someone suggests organizing religious ed at the school so it doesn't inconvenience anyone.

Honestly, this is such a hypocritical way to look at faith. If I'm fine with it, that's my business, but I don't care what anyone else thinks. 🙏 And then there's this idiotic excuse about how things were better back in the day because kids were more independent and needed to "toughen up." Frankly, people like this make me embarrassed to call myself a believer, because they immediately lump me in with their crowd.

edit: someone beat me to the punch and posted right as I was typing. 😁

I'm going to ignore the rest because, well, it's following that same pattern of nonsense from previous years where they just leave kids wandering the halls instead of actually looking out for them. And look, regarding the "not my business" comment... I guess it wouldn't be totally wrong to feel that way if the elective wasn't actively messing up someone else's day. My god, just take one school as an example where religion class was placed right in the middle of the school day for some reason, and now they're acting like that's how it's supposed to be! Let's try to be a little serious here, okay? 😁

Jason Ortiz5 said:Religious studies in schools just feels off to me. It teaches kids a perspective that isn't based on facts, which basically clashes with everything else they learn in science class. Plus, faith is such a deeply personal thing—it shouldn't really be part of a public school curriculum in a secular country like the US. Not to mention, it leaves huge gaps in the school day and creates this massive opportunity for bullying.

You keep bringing up how 86% of people in America are Catholic. But honestly, if we actually polled the elementary school kids, I bet the percentage of them who believe in Santa Claus would be just as high. Since parents are the ones planting those seeds of belief in both God and Santa, can we use that same logic we're seeing on this thread to introduce Frosty the Snowman into the curriculum too? Or something like that?

I mean, Isaac Newton wouldn't exactly agree with that claim. Neither would Faust Vrančić or Roger Bacon.

Give me a break. Religious studies should be moved out of public schools and back into churches, where they belong. It’s ridiculous that kids are losing out on computer science because religious instruction is being treated as more important. Even art classes—which are huge for a kid's development—have been slashed to just two block periods a month, yet they get two full hours of religion every week. And half the time, you have these old-school instructors teaching them things like how yoga is somehow sinister.
And let's not forget, kids who don't participate in those classes aren't even looked after properly; they end up feeling totally sidelined, and the scheduling is a mess since it isn't always the first or last period of the day.

briskbison55 said:I mean, I think you might be missing the actual definition of what secular means.

I'm going to ignore the rest because, well, it's following that same pattern of nonsense from previous years where they just leave kids wandering the halls instead of actually looking out for them. And look, regarding the "not my business" comment... I guess it wouldn't be totally wrong to feel that way if the elective wasn't actively messing up someone else's day. My god, just take one school as an example where religion class was placed right in the middle of the school day for some reason, and now they're acting like that's how it's supposed to be! Let's try to be a little serious here, okay? 😁

I honestly don't get why I wrote something so nonsensical. If I had been working the opposite shift, and if a mandatory subject could be moved to a two-hour block during an alternate shift, then why couldn't religious studies be done the same way? Or like how kids at my school used to go to PE during the other shift. Anything is possible if you actually want it to happen. 🤷

I have no clue where you live. I’m guessing New York City, so maybe it would be a good idea to step outside the big city bubble once in a while. It isn't the center of the universe. You need to realize there are all kinds of different schools across the USA and all sorts of scheduling combinations. Look, I get it. It makes me sad too that our schools aren't standardized—from the equipment to the organization. In one school, you've got tech that even major corporations would envy, and in another, you can barely keep the heat on in the winter. But that's just how it is. If you think there's only one school where kids are sitting out on the playground or in hallways, relying on whether or not adults feel like watching them, you're wrong. Believe me, it’s happening in more than one place. Back in elementary and high school, religious studies was almost always right in the middle of the schedule. Usually, a school only has one instructor or chaplain teaching it, so unless you start cloning people, it's nearly impossible to organize it as the first or last period for everyone, especially if it meets twice a week.

I'm dying to know if the situation would change if it were a different setup—like if they offered Islamic studies that you didn't want your kid to hear, shoved right into the middle of the day, leaving your child wandering around unsupervised. Would you still be singing the same old songs about "who cares," "let them be independent," and "kids these days are too sensitive"? I bet not. I'm afraid we'd see the exact same movie: petitions being signed, referendums organized, maybe even people praying outside the school gates. 😁

melloworca6 said:I honestly don't get why I wrote something so nonsensical. If I had been working the opposite shift, and if a mandatory subject could be moved to a two-hour block during an alternate shift, then why couldn't religious studies be done the same way? Or like how kids at my school used to go to PE during the other shift. Anything is possible if you actually want it to happen. 🤷

I have no clue where you live. I’m guessing New York City, so maybe it would be a good idea to step outside the big city bubble once in a while. It isn't the center of the universe. You need to realize there are all kinds of different schools across the USA and all sorts of scheduling combinations. Look, I get it. It makes me sad too that our schools aren't standardized—from the equipment to the organization. In one school, you've got tech that even major corporations would envy, and in another, you can barely keep the heat on in the winter. But that's just how it is. If you think there's only one school where kids are sitting out on the playground or in hallways, relying on whether or not adults feel like watching them, you're wrong. Believe me, it’s happening in more than one place. Back in elementary and high school, religious studies was almost always right in the middle of the schedule. Usually, a school only has one instructor or chaplain teaching it, so unless you start cloning people, it's nearly impossible to organize it as the first or last period for everyone, especially if it meets twice a week.

I'm dying to know if the situation would change if it were a different setup—like if they offered Islamic studies that you didn't want your kid to hear, shoved right into the middle of the day, leaving your child wandering around unsupervised. Would you still be singing the same old songs about "who cares," "let them be independent," and "kids these days are too sensitive"? I bet not. I'm afraid we'd see the exact same movie: petitions being signed, referendums organized, maybe even people praying outside the school gates. 😁

Seriously, if nobody else had an issue with having a massive gap in their schedule and waiting around for hours during the opposite shift, why is suddenly this gap a "problem" just because it's for religious studies?????

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shadowcrane91 said:Seriously, if nobody else had an issue with having a massive gap in their schedule and waiting around for hours during the opposite shift, why is suddenly this gap a "problem" just because it's for religious studies?????

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It’s not "waiting hours," they just show up for the opposite shift at a different time.

And she was talking about subjects that aren't even izborni. If you really think no one complained, go ask her if kids are still switching shifts for shop class today.

Wait, hold up... if switching shifts for shop class wasn't an issue, and you're fine with that, then why is it a problem when your kids have to switch shifts for religion class?
Either way, you'd be driving them yourself, so you clearly don't care...

briskbison55 said:I mean, Isaac Newton wouldn't exactly agree with that claim. Neither would Faust Vrančić or Roger Bacon.

And honestly, if you brought them back to life today and gave them a crash course on everything we've figured out since their time, what do you think they'd actually say?

James Alvarez2 said:It’s not "waiting hours," they just show up for the opposite shift at a different time.

And she was talking about subjects that aren't even izborni. If you really think no one complained, go ask her if kids are still switching shifts for shop class today.

Wait, hold up... if switching shifts for shop class wasn't an issue, and you're fine with that, then why is it a problem when your kids have to switch shifts for religion class?
Either way, you'd be driving them yourself, so you clearly don't care...

Can you point out a single place in my posts where I said I'd have a problem with religion class being during the opposite shift....????

I have zero issues with that.....

Take my first graders, for instance...... five of my kids take an elective computer lab taught by our teacher..... three of them don't stay for after-school care...... so they have a one-hour gap before computer lab and just hang out in the hallway..... and nobody's complaining.... everyone just dealt with it.

And how on earth do you know those kids went home and then came back for tech and PE???
Maybe the situation was such that for some families, it wasn't even worth the trip home.

Andrew Doyle said:Fantastic! I mean, those Norse myths really do carry some weight, don't they? 👍

But does your guy even have a clue what atheism actually means? I tried explaining the whole concept to him the other day when he came home claiming he was autistic. Honestly, I was baffled—I had no idea where he was getting this from... so I asked him why on earth he thinks he's on the spectrum 🤷 and he tells me straight to my face that he's autistic simply because he doesn't believe in God. 🤣 Naturally, I had to sit him down and walk him through the actual definitions of atheism versus theism... though I didn't dive too deep into the clinical side of autism. 😬

He lacks the vocabulary for "atheism," but he understands what his grandmother believes and what his friends believe; everything has been laid out for him, and he has simply concluded that he doesn't believe in a deity.
Until, of course, he decided that a god does exist after all. Not the one his social circle tries to push on him, mind you, but rather Thor and his associates... wouldn't you agree? 😬

shadowcrane91 said:Can you point out a single place in my posts where I said I'd have a problem with religion class being during the opposite shift....????

I have zero issues with that.....

Take my first graders, for instance...... five of my kids take an elective computer lab taught by our teacher..... three of them don't stay for after-school care...... so they have a one-hour gap before computer lab and just hang out in the hallway..... and nobody's complaining.... everyone just dealt with it.

And how on earth do you know those kids went home and then came back for tech and PE???
Maybe the situation was such that for some families, it wasn't even worth the trip home.

You simply, absolutely do not grasp the situation.
Waiting for an ELECTIVE SUBJECT (like computer science) with a gap in the schedule is fundamentally different from being forced to wait for a MANDATORY subject because of how an elective was placed—specifically regarding religious studies in high school.
In the first scenario, you made the choice to have your child wait for a class they didn't strictly have to attend. You chose to let them sit in a hallway for something non-obligatory.
In the second, the waiting is imposed upon the child; they are stuck waiting for a required class because the administration shoved an elective into the schedule that creates a conflict.
If they had scheduled Islamic studies on one day, perhaps some other faith group on another, and a Jewish studies class on a third, and your child was left standing in the hall because they had English right before the religious studies block followed by Math, you would be making quite a fuss. But as long as things remain convenient for you, who cares about the "others," right?...

Look, just imagine if the roles were flipped—and I’m talking about fifteen kids choosing elective computer science instead of just five. If that class happened during third period, and your kids were part of that group sitting out in the hallway because, for whatever reason, you didn't sign them up for the elective... would you really be totally fine with that? Would everything just be sunshine and rainbows?

Sarah Hall53 said:Look, just imagine if the roles were flipped—and I’m talking about fifteen kids choosing elective computer science instead of just five. If that class happened during third period, and your kids were part of that group sitting out in the hallway because, for whatever reason, you didn't sign them up for the elective... would you really be totally fine with that? Would everything just be sunshine and rainbows?

Yeah... a gap in the schedule is still a gap in the schedule...
My stance is that they don't take it, and if there's no other option, they sit on a bench. Period.

I’m cool with it, so I don't see why everyone needs to lose their minds and start a massive drama over nothing.

First off, we are talking about small children here. Furthermore, injustice is always a valid reason to stir up a bit of trouble and cause a scene, is it not? Much like how it is fundamentally wrong to separate or label children based on their religious background.

black lotus, :5, you hit the nail on the head with that one. But what can one truly expect when dealing with someone who simply refuses to understand...?

Honestly, I’d be just as worked up as anyone else if kids were being stuck out in the hallway just because of some computer science scheduling conflict—assuming they don't actually have to be there. To me, it feels like someone was cutting corners at the expense of the students, and in my book, those kids should be the absolute top priority in any school district.

analogseal18 said:First off, we are talking about small children here. Furthermore, injustice is always a valid reason to stir up a bit of trouble and cause a scene, is it not? Much like how it is fundamentally wrong to separate or label children based on their religious background.

black lotus, :5, you hit the nail on the head with that one. But what can one truly expect when dealing with someone who simply refuses to understand...?

What really gets under my skin is how everyone assumes kids are totally helpless... walking to school by themselves, coming home alone, handling a gap in their schedule... I was already heading to the corner store or the bakery by myself when I was seven.

Are my kids just "weird" because they actually have that kind of independence at seven years old???

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My own daughter was raised to be fiercely independent, and now at fourteen, she possesses a level of autonomy that far exceeds most of her peers who grew up with more traditional, hovering parents. Of course, I am not suggesting my experience represents the universal standard; certainly, most seven-year-olds require constant supervision. However, even if we move past the majority, it only takes one child who lacks self-reliance, shows signs of ADHD, or is simply immature—or perhaps just a boy—to prove the point. It is the fundamental responsibility of the school system to oversee these students and structure their schedules so they actually learn how to manage their time effectively. Leaving them to loiter aimlessly in a hallway is simply not an acceptable solution.

My eighth grader has had a free period since last year due to her religious studies class, and she is quite literally the only student in her entire grade who uses that hour to actually get her homework done. She sits right there by the window in the hallway. Meanwhile, a certain segment of the student body spends that time socializing and being loud, while another group heads off to the local park to light fires. Is this truly considered normal or socially acceptable? And let us be clear: the children are not the ones at fault here; the blame lies with the parents who insist on having religious education offered at school. They choose to avoid the minor inconvenience of driving their children to a local church, opting instead to teach them prayer at home to save themselves the trouble. I am primarily concerned with my own child's welfare, but one cannot help but observe the chaos surrounding everyone else.