Religion classes in school - Megathread

5 out of 23

Michelle Nelson4 said:Well, we haven't had our back-to-school nights just yet; those aren't happening until next week. And honestly, this "top secret" information is surprisingly hard to track down—even if you go asking during the meetings! Of course, once classes actually get rolling, it won't take long at all to figure out how many kids are in each group. On our side, the schedule includes a block period in the morning, which is great. I’m really hoping they stick with that! 🙂

They told us everything at our PTA meeting, and nobody even had to ask.

They switched up the schedule again this year, so sophomore year now includes religion class twice a week during 3rd period.
Last year I had it first thing in the morning, which was great because I could actually sleep in.

Michelle Nelson4 said:I'm curious, what kind of attendance are you seeing in your classrooms lately? In my experience, we had about 6 kids out of 23 missing last year.

12 skip, 7 show up. Just one first-grade class in the whole building. Honestly, with those ratios, we’re just praying they sleep in longer in the morning.

So, back when I was working as an assistant in one of those classrooms, I noticed that at least half the kids—like, seven out of fourteen, easy—wouldn't even bother showing up for their religion class... and then you have these kids just drifting through the halls from the library and whatnot, and I honestly feel like it’s such a massive waste of their time. Plus, since computer lab was always such a drag in the afternoon, they ended up basically stuck in the school building all day anyway. I guess what I'm trying to say is that if we're talking about teaching faith in the 21st century, it really ought to be happening in places actually designed for that kind of thing rather than just squeezing it into a standard school schedule...

Around here, they’ve got one class stuck right in the middle of the day, and then they shoved the others all the way to the end, like during 8th period... I really feel for those kids. It feels like they're being forced to pull a double shift or something.

14 kids, one isn't showing up. Same block period in the morning for now, at least.

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frozenrider15 said:I’m probably going to get flagged for drifting off-topic here... which technically violates the rules. Then again, we all know rules are often treated more like suggestions than actual mandates😵.
The reality is, we need intentional "holes" in the daily schedule. Why? So we can jump in and cover for one another when someone inevitably calls out sick. That was one of the non-negotiable requirements given to the administrator when they were drafting the master schedule.

Sure, it’s not universal, but listen: if the scheduler is working within those specific constraints, a teacher could practically perform a miracle and still find a way to fit religious studies into the middle of the day instead of being stuck with the first or last period.

We already have a dedicated thread about teacher schedules, but I'll weigh in here:
Just because you need buffer gaps in the schedule doesn't mean religious studies can't be placed during regular class hours. What's the issue there? 😕
Well, even with the Department of Education's guidelines, the math behind scheduling often makes it impossible to ensure everyone has the same start or end times.
For us this year, we have first period once a week, and then second period the next time.
(The teacher doesn't have both those early slots, so the subject teachers just rotate out and then the religion teacher steps in. 😬)

In our district, block scheduling isn't really an option. It just doesn't work well for the kids in religious studies who would have to sit through two hours straight 😬
(plus, most of them would probably prefer to sleep in a bit more anyway!)

Susan James said:We already have a dedicated thread about teacher schedules, but I'll weigh in here:
Just because you need buffer gaps in the schedule doesn't mean religious studies can't be placed during regular class hours. What's the issue there? 😕
Well, even with the Department of Education's guidelines, the math behind scheduling often makes it impossible to ensure everyone has the same start or end times.
For us this year, we have first period once a week, and then second period the next time.
(The teacher doesn't have both those early slots, so the subject teachers just rotate out and then the religion teacher steps in. 😬)

In our district, block scheduling isn't really an option. It just doesn't work well for the kids in religious studies who would have to sit through two hours straight 😬
(plus, most of them would probably prefer to sleep in a bit more anyway!)

I didn’t say religious studies had to be squeezed into a single hour just to leave gaps for scheduling buffers. What I actually said was that the scheduler is handed a specific set of constraints they have to follow when building the master timetable—and in my school, one of those non-negotiable rules is leaving room for those gaps. Besides, religious studies holds the status of a core subject under our agreement with the Holy See. And look, if you're building a schedule based on fixed parameters, you can't exactly have everyone taking that class during the first or last period. It's simply not how the math works.

Look, let’s get one thing straight right off the bat. Please refrain from using that dismissive "what's it to you" attitude when addressing me. I don't engage in that kind of low-rent, disrespectful banter with you, so there's no reason for you to start it now. Let's maintain some level of basic decorum.

frozenrider15 said:I didn’t say religious studies had to be squeezed into a single hour just to leave gaps for scheduling buffers. What I actually said was that the scheduler is handed a specific set of constraints they have to follow when building the master timetable—and in my school, one of those non-negotiable rules is leaving room for those gaps. Besides, religious studies holds the status of a core subject under our agreement with the Holy See. And look, if you're building a schedule based on fixed parameters, you can't exactly have everyone taking that class during the first or last period. It's simply not how the math works.

Look, let’s get one thing straight right off the bat. Please refrain from using that dismissive "what's it to you" attitude when addressing me. I don't engage in that kind of low-rent, disrespectful banter with you, so there's no reason for you to start it now. Let's maintain some level of basic decorum.

Sorry, I was just surprised. It wasn't intentional.

From a purely mathematical standpoint, once you factor in coordinating subject teachers—especially those teaching at multiple schools—arranging gym availability, and trying to follow Department of Education recommendations, I really think teacher prep periods are the very last thing on anyone's mind.
Mathematically speaking, gaps in the schedule are inevitable, but I don't see why someone would intentionally schedule a gap for a teacher. There will always be some downtime somewhere, especially in fourth grade when you've got music or art teachers, or when teachers nearing retirement aren't teaching certain electives, which often leaves them with even more free periods.
Plus, a substitute or an aide can always step in.

But while we're talking about substitutes:
What happens if the religious studies teacher calls in sick? Does she have to show up for the first period, or are we going to be called in too? 🤣
In our school, our teacher missed a few days last year, and classes just proceeded as normal.

So, look—if you’re working at a two-way school, you don't necessarily have a dedicated specialist on staff during your specific shift. And if it's one of those smaller schools, they might just share a counselor or a specialist with another campus, so that person isn't even there every day. That's the first thing. Plus, when you get an unqualified sub, you end up having to play catch-up later. But once a certified teacher steps in to cover for you, they actually handle the stuff you were supposed to be doing.
The rule of thumb, though, is that unless there's some special arrangement made, gaps in a teacher's schedule shouldn't really exceed two periods, twice a week. Anything beyond that feels like something straight out of a movie like "Whiplash."

Sarah Hall53 said:So, look—if you’re working at a two-way school, you don't necessarily have a dedicated specialist on staff during your specific shift. And if it's one of those smaller schools, they might just share a counselor or a specialist with another campus, so that person isn't even there every day. That's the first thing. Plus, when you get an unqualified sub, you end up having to play catch-up later. But once a certified teacher steps in to cover for you, they actually handle the stuff you were supposed to be doing.
The rule of thumb, though, is that unless there's some special arrangement made, gaps in a teacher's schedule shouldn't really exceed two periods, twice a week. Anything beyond that feels like something straight out of a movie like "Whiplash."

And honestly, those gaps shouldn't be longer than two hours anyway.
Having two hours of language arts and two hours of religious studies fits that perfectly.
I don't see anything wrong with it; in fact, I think it’s actually better for the kids if the teacher manages to get those classes during the first two periods or if the scheduler sets it up that way on purpose.

One of my main arguments against having religious studies in public schools—and even starting foreign languages in first grade—is exactly this: we shouldn't be switching teachers on them too frequently.
Last year at our school, the same teacher always had them for the first few periods, and I actually thought that was great because it's nice for the kids to walk into a classroom where the same person is waiting for them. Even though, personally, I wouldn't mind if my kid could sleep in a little longer! (Though, to be fair, the teacher would have been the first period for her too.)

Oh, man, those study halls can be absolute killers depending on how much the hourly proctor decides they dislike you
and then you’ve got the homeroom periods—if you get lucky enough to have a block of language classes followed by religion, you're looking at a three-hour gap. Or if music class gets shoved into fourth period and everything just starts spiraling...

Sarah Hall53 said:Oh, man, those study halls can be absolute killers depending on how much the hourly proctor decides they dislike you
and then you’ve got the homeroom periods—if you get lucky enough to have a block of language classes followed by religion, you're looking at a three-hour gap. Or if music class gets shoved into fourth period and everything just starts spiraling...

I was actually thinking about homeroom. I meant more about the teacher.
I definitely get the situation with subject-specific classes; I know how much of a puzzle that is. That's where the issues start because some professors teach at several different schools (we actually discussed that in another thread), so while they're trying to coordinate all those schedules, it trickles down to the subject classes in the lower grades, and then the teacher just has to fill whatever gaps are left over.

So, there was this one year where I ended up rushing into the classroom at the exact same moment as the religion teacher—it was such a mess. We both had the same period blocked off just to help with the scheduling, so yeah... it was pretty chaotic.

Sarah Hall53 said:So, there was this one year where I ended up rushing into the classroom at the exact same moment as the religion teacher—it was such a mess. We both had the same period blocked off just to help with the scheduling, so yeah... it was pretty chaotic.

Wait, so the kids just had two hours of language arts and two hours of religion class, and that was it for their entire schedule that day?
That sounds like an absolute dream 🙏

We had our teacher for the first period, then it was just the two of us—or maybe the two of us followed by some extra tutoring during fifth period, or even an ExxonMobil seminar, since teachers aren't allowed to be stuck without a class all day long.

Susan James said:Sorry, I was just surprised. It wasn't intentional.

From a purely mathematical standpoint, once you factor in coordinating subject teachers—especially those teaching at multiple schools—arranging gym availability, and trying to follow Department of Education recommendations, I really think teacher prep periods are the very last thing on anyone's mind.
Mathematically speaking, gaps in the schedule are inevitable, but I don't see why someone would intentionally schedule a gap for a teacher. There will always be some downtime somewhere, especially in fourth grade when you've got music or art teachers, or when teachers nearing retirement aren't teaching certain electives, which often leaves them with even more free periods.
Plus, a substitute or an aide can always step in.

But while we're talking about substitutes:
What happens if the religious studies teacher calls in sick? Does she have to show up for the first period, or are we going to be called in too? 🤣
In our school, our teacher missed a few days last year, and classes just proceeded as normal.

Look, if it’s planned ahead of time that religion class isn't happening, the main teacher handles their usual lesson, and then the religion teacher makes up the hour once they're back from sick leave—coordinated with the other teacher. You just let the students know they'll have religion instead of another subject that day, and that's that. Simple enough.
If the religion teacher catches a bug unexpectedly and can't make it, they have to notify the school immediately in the morning so a sub can be arranged. This is where those gaps in the schedule actually prove useful; some other teacher who has a free period can jump in and lead something. If it happens to be first period, nobody is calling her in—for heaven's sake, how could she even get there that fast? Instead, the administration steps in, or a teacher who has that class next will supervise them, or maybe they'll head down to the gym if PE is on the schedule. The kids won't be left unsupervised, but the teacher certainly isn't getting summoned to school mid-flu.

Around here, only about 5 out of 20 kids are actually signing up for religious education this year. It’s wild. We had two students move away with their families to other states, one kid who went last year but decided to skip it this time, and even a new girl who just joined us isn't attending...

Has any parent actually taken a good look at the second-grade textbooks lately? Like, really scrolled through the content?

For second grade, those books are absolutely slammed with religious themes. Honestly, the Social Studies and Civics textbooks seem to be leading the charge on that front more than anything else..

Patrick Harris5 said:Around here, only about 5 out of 20 kids are actually signing up for religious education this year. It’s wild. We had two students move away with their families to other states, one kid who went last year but decided to skip it this time, and even a new girl who just joined us isn't attending...

Has any parent actually taken a good look at the second-grade textbooks lately? Like, really scrolled through the content?

For second grade, those books are absolutely slammed with religious themes. Honestly, the Social Studies and Civics textbooks seem to be leading the charge on that front more than anything else..

Is that a quote from the Piedmont group? We don't really have much of a global perspective over here.
I haven't actually had a chance to check out Aneca yet—honestly, I probably won't get around to it until after the weekend.

What’s the debate about?