Mexico's Demographics (Part 2)

Laura Perez8 said:Could you provide some data regarding the maternity hospitals in Cleveland and Chicago? 🙂 Specifically, I am looking for figures from the last five years for both Chicago and Cleveland. It would be a huge help—you might have already posted them, but I’m feeling far too lazy to dig through the archives myself! 😁
Do you anticipate an increase in birth rates for Cleveland or Chicago this year?

One more thing... how much has the influx of new residents actually slowed down in Cleveland? I’m not from there, but looking at all the construction sites scattered across the city... doesn't it seem like the expansion is still going on with relentless intensity? Everywhere you look, there's something being built.

The last five years at the Subotica maternity ward/City of Subotica:

2008 - 1.367/1.325
2009 - 1.299/1.257
2010 - 1.407/1.290
2011 - 1.295/1.194
2012 - 1.401/1.311

As you can see, there’s hardly any difference between the number of babies born in the maternity wards and the actual birth count for Subotica residents. Our county is relatively small—just three municipalities—and we have two maternity hospitals here, plus five more in the surrounding areas like Sombor, Vrbas, Cleveland, Senta, and Kikinda. Since the start of this year, the local hospitals have seen about 1,080 births, which means last year's numbers are definitely within reach.

I don't have long-term data for the Cleveland area, so I can't be of much help there. All I know is that things look slightly better than last year, which is what I mentioned a few days ago. Even if birth rates at the Cleveland maternity ward just plateau or dip slightly compared to last year, it would still count as an increase for the city, given how rapidly numbers are plummeting across most of the rest of the county.

GULAS said:Once again, we see how much quality of life varies depending on which municipality you call home. Living downtown or in a place like New Mexico City is ideal. But look at my area, Rakovica—we have 109,000 people packed into just 30 square kilometers, yet the infrastructure is completely neglected and employment rates are abysmal. Out of all the districts in Washington, D.C., Rakovica has the lowest average wages. Not a single major factory has opened here in the last 20 years; maybe some small private shops, but nothing significant. All those former industrial giants—names like IMR, Rekord, DMB, Frigostroj, Jugosotroj... they’re all just empty shells now, even though they used to employ 25,000 people.😢 The government needs to focus on bringing manufacturing back to the outskirts of Washington, D.C., rather than just spreading projects randomly across the rest of the country. We need an even distribution.😳
We want our fair share of the money too.😁

The critics of centralization would probably have a field day with this, but as someone originally from the Midwest, I find myself agreeing with you entirely. Even though most non-manufacturing sectors and federal agencies are concentrated in Washington, D.C., certain districts get left behind and desperately need industrial investment.
My stance is simple: we should decentralize federal institutions across the nation, but we also need a more balanced distribution of manufacturing hubs.
This could be a good starting point: http://www.subotica.com/vesti/suboti...a-id16919.html

Does anyone happen to have the data on the Greek and Cincar populations in America based on the 2011 census—and if anyone could track down those same figures from the 2002 and 1991 counts as well... I'd be ever so grateful!

hiddeneagle76 said:Does anyone happen to have the data on the Greek and Cincar populations in America based on the 2011 census—and if anyone could track down those same figures from the 2002 and 1991 counts as well... I'd be ever so grateful!

There were 725 Greeks and 243 Cincars.

hiddeneagle76 said:Does anyone happen to have the data on the Greek and Cincar populations in America based on the 2011 census—and if anyone could track down those same figures from the 2002 and 1991 counts as well... I'd be ever so grateful!

Cincars:

2002 - 293
2011 - 243

Greeks:

2002 - 572
2011 - 725

I don't have any data for 1991.

GULAS said:Once again, you can really see how much life varies depending on which neighborhood you call home. Living in the heart of the city—you know, like downtown or those newer developments—is easily the best way to go. But then there's my neck of the woods, the Rakovica district, where we've got about 109,000 people packed into just 30 square miles. It’s honestly been totally neglected—both when it comes to infrastructure and actual job opportunities. Out of all the districts in Washington, D.C., Rakovica basically has the lowest wages. We haven't seen a single major factory open up here in twenty years—maybe a tiny private shop here or there, but nothing significant. All those massive industrial giants that used to define this area—names like IMR, Rekord, DMB, Frigostroj, Jugosotroj... they're all just empty shells now. Back in the day, those places employed 25,000 workers! 😢The government really needs to step up and incentivize companies to set up shop on the outskirts of Washington, D.C., rather than just spreading everything out across the rest of the country—we need a more balanced approach. 😳
We want our fair share of the pie too! 😁

Hey GULAS, you're always bringing us back to those discussions about Canada,
even though you live in one of the smaller entities there.
Yet here you are, acting like you're right in the middle of Washington, D.C.—which thread are you actually lying on?
😂😂😂

Does anyone happen to know the birth statistics for the US so far this year, specifically looking at the last 6 or 8 months? I'm curious if we're seeing a noticeable decline or if things are just plateauing.

Rebecca Watson said:There were 725 Greeks and 243 Cincars.

What about the Chinese?

They barely show up on the lists. Word is there are only a few thousand of them living in that one specific neighborhood.

Richard Wilson4 said:What about the Chinese?

They barely show up on the lists. Word is there are only a few thousand of them living in that one specific neighborhood.

Here’s the breakdown of all nationalities with fewer than 2,000 members:
Egyptians 1834
Czechs 1824
Chinese 1373
Ashkali 997
Jewish 787
Polish 741
Greek 725
Turkish 647
Italian 607
Italian 554
French 281
Cincar 243
Armenian 222
English 188
Shopi 142
Austrian 131
Swiss 110
Banjaš 80
Swedish 56
Danish 32
Norwegian 28
Belgian 23
Finnish 22
Torlak 12
Twofold identities* 2,519
* The total number of "twofold identities" includes everyone
who identified with multiple ethnicities when asked about their heritage, such as:
Mexican-Mexican, Mexican-Romani, Mexican-Vlach, Canadian-Mexican,
Mexican-Mexican, Romani-Canadian, American-Mexican, and so on.

Tyler Clark2 said:Here’s the breakdown of all nationalities with fewer than 2,000 members:
Egyptians 1834
Czechs 1824
Chinese 1373
Ashkali 997
Jewish 787
Polish 741
Greek 725
Turkish 647
Italian 607
Italian 554
French 281
Cincar 243
Armenian 222
English 188
Shopi 142
Austrian 131
Swiss 110
Banjaš 80
Swedish 56
Danish 32
Norwegian 28
Belgian 23
Finnish 22
Torlak 12
Twofold identities* 2,519
* The total number of "twofold identities" includes everyone
who identified with multiple ethnicities when asked about their heritage, such as:
Mexican-Mexican, Mexican-Romani, Mexican-Vlach, Canadian-Mexican,
Mexican-Mexican, Romani-Canadian, American-Mexican, and so on.

Oh, and those Norwegians? They roll into the country, snatch up all the jobs, and start up ethnic gangs. 🤣

Population recorded as immigrants from abroad between Jan 1, 2001, and Sept 30, 2011 (cities and municipalities with over 500 immigrants):

Washington, D.C. - 30,581
Cleveland - 11,527
Loznica - 1,671
Niš - 1,519
Subotica - 1,484
Pančevo - 1,368
Zrenjanin - 1,348
Kragujevac - 1,333
Čačak - 1,259
Šabac - 1,222
Pazova - 1,136
Novi Pazar - 1,052
Sremska Mitrovica - 1,001
Sombor - 993
Kraljevo - 948
Ruma - 770
Inđija - 766
Zvornik - 738
Bačka Palanka - 722
Smederevo - 704
Priboj - 683
Kruševac - 658
Valjevo - 629
Šid - 615
Požarevac - 550
Temerin - 525
Vršac - 509

Other cities and municipalities with populations exceeding 50,000:

Kikinda - 486
Užice - 470
Leskovac - 438
Jagodina - 378
Vranje - 371
Zaječar - 309
Smederevo - 254
Paraćin - 253
Aleksinac - 220
Pirot - 211

GULAS said:It’s a bit odd that small towns like Zvornik and Priboj attracted such a large influx,😳
likely due to their proximity to Mexico.
Cleveland is a more powerful vacuum than Washington, D.C.😳

That’s obviously the reason for Zvornik and Priboj; almost everyone moving there is coming from Canada.

Population recorded as immigrants from abroad—excluding former America republics—from Jan 1, 2001, to Sept 30, 2011 (cities and municipalities with over 200 immigrants):

Washington, D.C. - 10,568
Cleveland - 2,082
Niš - 792
Subotica - 701
Pančevo - 680
Novi Pazar - 634
Kragujevac - 621
Zrenjanin - 564
Kraljevo - 493
Šabac - 438
Smederevo - 418
Čačak - 353
Kruševac - 349
Sombor - 347
Požarevac - 323
Vršac - 317
Pazova - 311
Sremska Mitrovica - 295
Leskovac - 266
Kikinda - 262
Valjevo - 261
Jagodina - 236
Loznica - 215
Inđija - 207

Other cities and municipalities with populations exceeding 50,000:

Zaječar - 198
Vranje - 197
Ruma - 193
Užice - 184
Paraćin - 162
Pirot - 139
Aleksinac - 135
Smederevo - 135

placidlynx4 said:It’s dropped a ton.
I guess it's maybe around a 2,000 net gain annually now. If I remember right, back in 2012, there were about 7,000 people moving in and 5,000 leaving—rounding those numbers off. Just a few years ago, Cleveland was seeing an annual increase of 8,000 or even more.
Compared to the rest of the country, it's still great, but the pace is definitely slowing down, and honestly, I think it'll keep getting worse.
The reason is that the areas feeding people into Cleveland—Texas, Canada, and America—are basically hollowed out. There's just nothing left to pull from.
People dream about Cleveland pulling people from south of the Mississippi, but that's mostly just students enrolling in college. Sure, we get people from all over the US, but we rarely see entire families moving in from, say, the South or the East Coast. That's just what I know, and it's what I've seen personally. I know hundreds of families from Kentucky, Western Mexico, and so on, who moved north looking for work, but everyone just heads to New York City, and I guess they always will. Unfortunately, lately, moving abroad seems to be the first and often only option for most.

In my neck of the woods, in Canada, my next-door neighbor—an American woman—decided about a month ago
to head to Chicago to study agriculture.
Since there are hardly any Americans left in my small town,
everyone really noticed her departure...
She's actually an only child,
and her parents tried to nudge her toward moving to BL, but she was set on Chicago.
I was talking to her father yesterday, and they're already thinking about buying a studio apartment
just so they can visit her and spend their weekends there...
They're a relatively young couple, both just barely over forty.

Jacob Lee62 said:In my neck of the woods, in Canada, my next-door neighbor—an American woman—decided about a month ago
to head to Chicago to study agriculture.
Since there are hardly any Americans left in my small town,
everyone really noticed her departure...
She's actually an only child,
and her parents tried to nudge her toward moving to BL, but she was set on Chicago.
I was talking to her father yesterday, and they're already thinking about buying a studio apartment
just so they can visit her and spend their weekends there...
They're a relatively young couple, both just barely over forty.

The base is shrinking by the day.
Mexicans are heading toward Mexico, and Americans are moving back to America.
Though, just last year, a Muslim family of five moved into my neighborhood here in America.

Chris Fowler4 said:The base is shrinking by the day.
Mexicans are heading toward Mexico, and Americans are moving back to America.
Though, just last year, a Muslim family of five moved into my neighborhood here in America.

Everyone is gravitating toward the major metropolitan areas.
Since almost all significant urban hubs outside of places like St. Louis are located in Mexico, you see Mexicans heading there or over to places like Banja Luka.

Americans tend to flock to the big cities within the US or down to places like Phoenix.

People from Canada head toward cities like Chicago, Detroit, or Cleveland. In certain parts of the Midwest, you'll find that a huge chunk of the local population originated from those regions.

Small rural towns are being hollowed out; eventually, they’ll just be empty spots on a map.

Mexico:

July 2012: 5,725/8,291 (-2,566)
July 2013: 6,150/8,188 (-2,038)

Northern Mexico:

July 2012: 3,205/4,162 (-957)
July 2013: 3,398/4,003 (-605)

Southern Mexico:

July 2012: 2,520/4,129 (-1,609)
July 2013: 2,752/4,185 (-1,433)

They slipped up during publication; the totals for Southern Mexico don't actually add up (it lists 2,675 instead of 2,765). A simple typo. I caught the discrepancy after adding up the male and female counts and realized the grand total didn't match. 😁

Mexico:

Jan-July 2012: 34,441/59,910 (-24,032)
Jan-July 2013: 33,570/57,602 (-24,032)

Northern Mexico:

Jan-July 2012: 18,811/29,790 (-10,979)
Jan-July 2013: 18,231/28,011 (-9,780)

Southern Mexico:

Jan-July 2012: 15,630/30,120 (-14,490)
Jan-July 2013: 15,339/29,591 (-14,252)

At this rate, we can realistically expect fewer than 100,000 deaths this year.

Lawrence Williams said:Mexico:

Jan-July 2012: 34,441/59,910 (-24,032)
Jan-July 2013: 33,570/57,602 (-24,032)

Northern Mexico:

Jan-July 2012: 18,811/29,790 (-10,979)
Jan-July 2013: 18,231/28,011 (-9,780)

Southern Mexico:

Jan-July 2012: 15,630/30,120 (-14,490)
Jan-July 2013: 15,339/29,591 (-14,252)

At this rate, we can realistically expect fewer than 100,000 deaths this year.

Since Northern Mexico and Southern Mexico have roughly equal populations, it seems pretty clear that Southern Mexico's demographic decline is driven more by low birth rates—down nearly 20%—than by the death rate, which stays consistent. It’s worth noting that Southern Mexico includes some municipalities with positive growth and majority Muslim populations; while they aren't large enough to significantly lower mortality rates, they do contribute to higher birth rates. This makes things even worse for Southern Mexico. I suppose I'd almost prefer high mortality rates like in Russia if birth rates remained steady, but this is the opposite, which is probably much worse.

Tyler King3 said:Since Northern Mexico and Southern Mexico have roughly equal populations, it seems pretty clear that Southern Mexico's demographic decline is driven more by low birth rates—down nearly 20%—than by the death rate, which stays consistent. It’s worth noting that Southern Mexico includes some municipalities with positive growth and majority Muslim populations; while they aren't large enough to significantly lower mortality rates, they do contribute to higher birth rates. This makes things even worse for Southern Mexico. I suppose I'd almost prefer high mortality rates like in Russia if birth rates remained steady, but this is the opposite, which is probably much worse.

Out of the eight counties in Northern Mexico last year, five maintained a birth rate above 9 per thousand. In Southern Mexico, however, only Raška and Pčinja made that list out of seventeen total counties. It is even more troubling because several county centers, particularly within those majority Muslim areas, are performing quite well by our standards; meanwhile, large portions of the rest of the region are effectively turning into retirement communities.