What's the point of required reading?

David Torres6 said:Since you brought up politics—we’d be better off with a leader who collects bottles on the street and can barely string three sentences together; at least they understand what a failing nation feels like and might actually possess empathy. As it stands, the man running this country is a polished orator, but he's essentially trash—driven by self-interest rather than any willingness to sacrifice himself for his country, which should be the fundamental moral duty of any statesman.

And those standardized state exams? They are easily the single greatest stupidity in the history of education over the last 10,000 years.

For instance—what does it matter to me that some character in an elementary school book left home, or that a train got stuck in the snow in some Mark Twain novel I read in fourth grade? I remember the gist of them, sure, but I couldn't care less—I have no intention of becoming an English professor, and besides, people understand me just fine, so there's no need to polish my literacy for show.

By the way, regarding basic biology—every living organism adapts its lifestyle (verbal communication included) to its circumstances, its habitat, and its environment. If I speak with a regional accent or use certain colloquialisms, I’m not doing anything wrong; I’m simply living according to my nature.

There are 1,001 smarter things to do—studying biology, geography, tech, math, or any other actual subject—than reading mindless literature. Students tend to ignore the English language after sixth grade anyway; they just copy their homework or skim a book to scrape by with a passing grade just to get through school.

If students are already choosing that path of resistance, there is no point in wasting hundreds of years forcing the opposite. Kids today evolve faster than ever; plenty of potential musicians, artists, and brilliant minds never find their footing simply because instead of being encouraged toward their interests, they are forced to waste time on mandatory reading and similar nonsense.

Look at Americans—they are the prime example of over-educated, burnt-out people who, from age eight to twenty, see nothing of the real world beyond what the system of schooling and family upbringing dictates. Even a bird on a branch can see that the youth in that nation are incredibly dim-witted.

And naturally, at twenty-one, they head off to Afghanistan, firmly convinced they are fighting for freedom, despite being unable to locate Europe on a map—not to mention how naive they are.

The national SAT is easily the most ridiculous thing ever forced upon our education system in the last 10,000 years.

Honestly, I struggle to see how any of this matters to me now. What does it really change that Segert Hlapic left home back in second grade? Or that the train got stuck in the snow in that fourth-grade Mark Twain story? It just doesn't seem relevant.

I have read both of those books. My memory of them remains somewhat superficial.
Honestly, I don't lose any sleep over it. I have no intention of becoming an English professor, and since people understand exactly what I mean both verbally and in writing, I see no reason to obsess over perfecting my grammar.

From a biological standpoint regarding organic life, every living creature adapts its way of life—which includes verbal communication—to its specific circumstances, homeland, and environment. Therefore, since I speak with a coastal accent and write using certain regional dialects, I am doing nothing wrong; I am simply living according to my nature.

There are a thousand better ways to spend one's time. Students could be studying biology, geography, math, or any other practical subject instead of wasting hours on mindless reading assignments. Most kids just breeze through English language classes after middle school anyway, usually by just copying homework or skimming a book just to scrape by with a passing grade and get it over with.

I don't know about you guys, but I’ve been sitting here thinking about that whole "harbinger" concept lately—you know, those little signs or omens that suggest something big is right around the corner? It’s funny how life works like that sometimes. One minute everything is just cruising along, totally normal, and then you see that one weird little thing—a strange coincidence, a sudden shift in the weather, or even just a gut feeling—and suddenly you realize the vibe has shifted completely. It’s like the universe is tapping you on the shoulder, trying to get your attention before the storm actually hits. Honestly, I’m a bit of a sucker for that kind of stuff, even if I try to act all logical about it. I remember back when I was living in Chicago, I had this weird feeling every time the wind picked up from a certain direction... it always felt like a warning of some massive blizzard coming through, and man, I was usually right. Anyway, just a random thought crossing my mind today. What do you all think? Do you believe in those little warning signs, or am I just overthinking things again? kaže:
Since you brought up politics—man, honestly? I’d much rather have someone running this country who spends their days picking up bottles on the street and can barely string three grammatically correct sentences together. At least that person actually knows what it feels like when everything is falling apart—they might actually have a shred of empathy left in them. But the guy currently steering the ship? He’s some silver-tongued orator, totally polished and smooth, but deep down he's just trash. He’s all about looking out for himself instead of being willing to lay it all on the line for the country. That’s supposed to be the whole point of the job, isn't it? It’s the moral core of being a public servant—putting the nation before your own skin.

Honestly, that whole SAT craze is easily the biggest load of garbage ever shoved into the education system—like, seriously, in the last ten thousand years of schooling, we haven't seen anything quite this useless.

I mean, honestly—what does it even matter to me that Segert Hlapic left home back in that second-grade book? Or that train got stuck in the snow in that Mark Twain story I read in fourth grade? Sure, I read them both, but if I’m being real, those memories are pretty thin at this point. The truth is, I don't really care. It’s not like I’m planning on becoming an English professor or anything. Besides, people seem to get what I’m saying whether I’m talking or typing—even if I write like this—so there’s really no reason for me to go out of my way to polish up my grammar or act all fancy with my writing.

Look, if we’re talking about the basic biology of life—just looking at things from a broad perspective—every living thing naturally adapts its way of being to fit its surroundings. That includes how we communicate, too. It's all about the environment you're dropped into, the local vibe, and where you actually call home. So, if I happen to talk with a bit of a West Coast drawl or use certain regional slang, I’m not doing anything wrong—I’m just living according to my nature, you know? It's just how I'm wired to exist in my corner of the world.

There are literally a thousand better things a kid could be doing with their time—I mean, seriously, they could be diving into biology, geograhpy, some hands-on tech stuff, math, or pretty much any other subject that actually matters—than sitting there grinding through these mindless required reading assignments. It’s such a waste. Most students basically tune out of English class the second they wrap up middle school anyway. They just end up copying the homework or skimming the book just enough to scrape by with a D and call it a day so they can finally be done with it.

Look, if students are already pushing back this hard, there’s honestly no point in wasting hundreds of years trying to force them down a path they don't want to walk. Kids today—man, they evolve at such a crazy speed. We've got so many potential musicians, artists, and just straight-up brilliant minds who probably never got their shot simply because the system was too busy forcing them into a box. Instead of actually nurturing that spark or leaning into what they’re clearly passionate about, we basically just make them kill time reading old, dusty classics and other total nonsense that doesn't mean anything to them. It's like we're stifling all that raw talent before it even has a chance to breathe.

Honestly, if you want to see what I mean, just look at Americans—they’re basically the ultimate example of being over-educated yet totally out of touch. From the time they hit third grade all the way through college, most of them aren't actually experiencing life, you know? They're just living through this rigid loop of whatever the school system dictates, combined with that whole "family-meets-school" conditioning. It’s like they’re just following a script from birth. Honestly, even someone who isn't paying close attention can see it—it feels like the younger generation in the US is just completely clueless when it comes to how the real world actually works.

And then you’ve got these kids—barely twenty-one, right?—heading off to Afghanistan, totally convinced they’re out there fighting for freedom and all that. It’s wild. Honestly, most of them couldn't even point Europe out on a map if their lives depended on it, let alone understand the actual geopolitics of what's happening. I mean, don't get me wrong, I get the spirit, but man... the level of naivety is just off the charts.

David Price5 As follows:
What’s the point of having an educated man—someone who can actually articulate a thought and understands the nuances of law and economics—when we could just settle for some random person off the street? Unless, of course, you apply those same standards to a surgeon or a pilot.

Did things go south during your encounter with her?
It’s likely Mark Twain—he’s the one who penned Huck Finn.
They say you live and you learn—though some lessons are harder to swallow than others.

Even regional dialects have their own internal logic—and their own rules to follow.

If you intend to interact with people—which most of us do—you're going to need a language.

What sci-fi books have you actually read?

David Torres6 said:

David Price5 As follows:
What’s the point of having an educated man—someone who can actually articulate a thought and understands the nuances of law and economics—when we could just settle for some random person off the street? Unless, of course, you apply those same standards to a surgeon or a pilot.

Did things go south during your encounter with her?
It’s likely Mark Twain—he’s the one who penned Huck Finn.
They say you live and you learn—though some lessons are harder to swallow than others.

Even regional dialects have their own internal logic—and their own rules to follow.

If you intend to interact with people—which most of us do—you're going to need a language.

What sci-fi books have you actually read?

So, here we have your "educated" politicians—take someone like Sanders, for instance. He’s a polished orator, highly educated, a true statesman through and through—a real man of the people, an ideal American. I have nothing but respect for him; he turned this country into a global powerhouse, tackled unemployment head-on, slashed taxes, and drove down gas prices. A truly honorable politician... and a scholar, too. 😂😂😂 (And once again, it’s all about having that "degree" and being "qualified"—on paper, at least.) Hahaha.

I didn't take the SATs this year—I'll sit for them next year instead. Since cramming for a few days isn't exactly rocket science, it shouldn't be an issue—I'll just study, pass, and leave the whole ordeal behind me.

Look, like I said—my memory is a bit fuzzy on the details, and frankly, I’m too lazy to spend my afternoon scrolling through Google just to fact-check every tiny little thing I'm not absolutely certain about.

A person learns throughout their life only what they truly desire—those specific interests and ambitions that define them. It’s what makes an individual unique. Imagine if we were all just products on an assembly line, everyone possessing the exact same knowledge—or lacking it in the exact same ways. We would never actually progress.

Dialects have their own internal logic and rules—but as you’ve likely noticed, even modern Americans don't speak the way people did a century ago. Language is fluid; it bends, shifts, and deforms through natural usage. Between constant abbreviations, slang, and the endless influx of English loanwords, speech is constantly evolving. Even the classic, old-school American profanity is now often dismissed as primitive—which, if I'm being honest, I actually find somewhat refreshing.

I deal with all sorts of people—I talk to my crew like I’m some big-shot local tough guy, yet when it comes to the police, professors, or anyone I'm debating, I pivot to polished, philosophical arguments. It isn't hypocrisy; it’s more like having three different personalities—and that’s before you even see my performance as a lost tourist from Texas. I actually managed to convince an American that I was a local from the Lone Star State once. SF 7

SF 7—Star Wars, all the episodes (though I haven't quite finished the first one or episode four)—Mass Effect comics, Wernher von Braun’s autobiography, and one of his books regarding his visions for space exploration.

Aside from everything else, I picked up a 1926 edition of Mein Kampf on eBay—I wanted to be certain I was reading the original text rather than some modern version doctored by Zionist propaganda.

I'm currently working my way through the Guns N' Roses biography and Slash's autobiography—plus some technical manuals on Jane's Weapon Systems from the '80s—alongside bits and pieces of psychology I stumble upon online. Nothing strictly structured; just picking up whatever catches my interest as I go.

Children ought to be taught from infancy the value of loyalty, sacrifice, courage, devotion, and discipline—the grit required to forge their own policies and laws. Instead, books and schools aim to turn them into little masters of their own destiny.

They graduate today only to lose themselves to mindless pop lyrics, bingeing on Twilight and soap operas—pure media brain rot—while wasting time on FarmVille, Texas Hold'em, and cheap tabloids. I know plenty of them—basically 90% of the American population—and even within that group, 90% spent their youth cramming school readings, only to end up utterly clueless by the time they hit 18 or 19.

What possible use is such bottom-of-the-barrel human refuse?

And by the way, a primitive person judges others based on grammatical precision and verbal polish—the kind of superficiality taught in schools.

A real man respects someone who is equally honorable, good, and loyal—someone willing to act for another. (I’ve actually considered tattooing "Semper Fidelis" on my back) If you truly understand that phrase, you’ll know exactly what I mean about what matters most in life and how people should actually judge one another.

Vladimir, it is true that Americans can be foolish because they simply do whatever they please—but their whims are strikingly similar to those of our youth. They drift through life doing nothing, chasing distractions, hitting clubs, working some dead-end job as a pizza delivery kid or at McDonald's, or perhaps finishing a degree just to rot in a cubicle for the next 45 years—all while harboring a hundred undeveloped talents buried deep within their minds.

2. I didn't take the SATs yet; I'll take them next year. Since memorizing stuff for a few days isn't really my thing, it shouldn't be much of a struggle. I'll just cram, write it down, pass, and leave the whole exam and everything in it behind me.

3. Sorry, like I said, I only remember bits and pieces, and I'm too lazy to go surfing on Google just to verify every little detail I'm not 100% sure about.

4. People learn throughout their lives "things they want, things they like, and things they show interest and ambition toward, which automatically makes a person more individualistic and unique. Imagine if everyone was like they were on an assembly line—imagine if everyone knew the exact same things or if nobody knew anything; we would never progress like that."

5. Dialects have their own rules and grammar, but as you can see, even today's Americans don't speak like they did 100 years ago. That's because natural speech evolves, bends, forms, and shifts. (Abbreviations, word deformations, and loanwords from English are becoming increasingly common), while even classic local slang and vulgarities are considered primitive nowadays (which, in a way, I actually appreciate).

6. I interact with all sorts of people. With my buddies, I talk like I’m some big-shot local from New York, but when I’m dealing with the police, professors, or anyone I’m debating, I stick to highly structured, philosophical arguments. It isn't being two-faced; it's more like being three-faced. (Wait until you see how well I can play the part of a lost tourist from Texas.) One American even fell for it and thought I was actually from Texas SF 7.

7. SF, all the Star Wars movies (though I didn't finish the first and fourth ones), Mass Effect comics, Wernher von Braun's autobiography, and one of his books regarding his visions for space exploration.

As for other books, I read Mein Kampf (I bought a 1926 edition on eBay to ensure I was reading the original rather than some modern version altered by Jewish propaganda).

The Guns N' Roses biography, Slash's autobiography... U2 from '95, Jane's Weapon Systems from 1980-1989, and occasionally some psychology articles online. Nothing too heavy; I just pick up things that catch my interest.

David Torres6 said:It’s some work by an American author I read back in second or third grade—though honestly, I can’t even remember what I had for lunch last weekend, let alone the name of some children's book writer. And by the way, the movie is garbage. By that age, I was already watching things like *Saving Private Ryan* or *Apollo 13*—I even sat through *Philosophy of a Knife* while my peers were gagging at the sight of a bloody papercut—so a simple little story about a > meant absolutely nothing to me.

Regarding the stuff I mentioned, I actually read those books cover to cover. There are probably another hundred titles where I just skimmed the chapters that caught my eye; I skimmed Stephen Hawking too, along with that nonsense *2001: A Space Odyssey* or whatever you call it, and all that silly literature from the 40s and 50s written before we knew even 1% about space—back when everything was pure fairy tale without any real scientific foundation. I couldn't bring myself to read that junk, and frankly, 80% of sci-fi literature is just composed of that kind of ridiculous, unrealistic old trash.

Then I discovered YouTube and documentaries. Ever since I started watching documentaries, I began thinking in English—thinking in English, and perhaps even describing certain things better in English than I ever could in American.

Watching documentaries and science programs eventually became much more practical and high-quality for me than reading a book.

Now, I could certainly speak with professional sophistication and grace, but that feels less like communication and more like a way to verbally screw people over just to gain unearned respect and reputation.

When I argue with people, I use technical philosophical arguments—it’s how I drive them toward madness, rage, and aggression, while I remain perfectly calm, firing off these turbo-provocative points. I love the sight of people losing their minds, getting worked up, and resorting to swearing as their final, useless weapon, while I just sit there with a slight smile—using a combination of philosophy, provocation, and cold blood to essentially "wreck their headspace."

While everyone else is busy enrolling in courses or reading empty books,

I just type "how to..." or "what is..." or "what does it mean" into Google or YouTube—whatever happens to interest me at any given moment.

A slightly more advanced and evolved method of self-education won't hurt anyone.

The older generation can only be excused; in their day, reading books was the equivalent of watching YouTube today. You shouldn't force them to adapt to modern standards of learning unless they want to—and if they do, more power to them.

Regarding those titles I mentioned, I actually finished reading them entirely. There are probably another hundred books where I only skimmed the chapters that caught my interest.

I also only skimmed Stephen Hawking. And all that nonsense like 2001: A Space Odyssey or that silly literature from the 40s and 50s—written when we knew absolutely nothing about space. It was all just fairy tales without any real scientific basis or facts. I couldn't bring myself to read stuff like that. About 80% of sci-fi literature consists of those ridiculous, unrealistic old stories.

Sure, I can express myself in a sophisticated, gentlemanly manner, but to me, that just looks like verbal manipulation to gain unearned respect and reputation.

When I argue with people, I use professional philosophical arguments. That is how I drive people to madness, rage, and aggression, while I remain perfectly calm, firing off my turbo-provocative points. I love the sight of people getting angry and losing their cool, resorting to swearing as a final, useless weapon, while I just sit there with a slight smile, using a mix of philosophy, provocation, and cold blood to essentially blow their minds.

rustyjackal10 said:Oh, absolutely, they would have to. Honestly, that’s what makes a great teacher, and frankly, we need way more people like that in our school systems (though let’s be real, the shortage of actually competent teachers is a whole other headache entirely). Right now, the whole "What did the author mean?" thing usually just boils down to the student giving the answer the teacher WANTS to hear.
Like, imagine an author writes that their curtains were a strikingly bright blue. The teacher asks little Perica what the author was trying to say. They’re expecting some deep, philosophical epiphany, but little Perica just concludes that the sentence was meant to highlight the fact that the curtains were, well, really blue—which totally ticks the teacher off.

But in reality, one person might see a longing for the sky and freedom from sorrow, someone else might see a yearning for love, and little Perica is just pointing out that the curtains WERE indeed blue. We shouldn't be looking for a single "correct" answer or forcing kids to memorize plot points and literary critiques by rote. We should be encouraging free thought—where students talk it out among themselves until they realize the point is that the author’s intent eventually meets whatever the reader concludes.


"Wouldn't it stop being about just checking boxes and start being about recognizing how someone personally connects with a text—using language to back up an opinion, almost like presenting a thesis from a book?"

That’s exactly it.

"Some books are to be tasted, others to be swallowed, and some few to be chewed and digested"
- Francis Bacon book

You’re supposed to experience a book, chew on it, form your own take, and then defend it—that’s basically the whole reason we even assign reading in the first place.

brisktiger56 said:to me, it feels like kids would actually dive into books to find answers to everything under the sun IF there wasn't this sense of forced compliance—assuming, of course, that the books actually contain interesting insights that can blow their minds or help them grow...

Obligations and homework make sense on paper, but let's be real—who actually enjoys them??
What percentage of kids actually tackle a task, or a required reading list, with genuine enthusiasm?
Where's the disconnect? Is it the pressure?

rustyjackal10 said:

I don't know about you guys, but I’ve been sitting here thinking about that whole "harbinger" concept lately—you know, those little signs or omens that suggest something big is right around the corner? It’s funny how life works like that sometimes. One minute everything is just cruising along, totally normal, and then you see that one weird little thing—a strange coincidence, a sudden shift in the weather, or even just a gut feeling—and suddenly you realize the vibe has shifted completely. It’s like the universe is tapping you on the shoulder, trying to get your attention before the storm actually hits. Honestly, I’m a bit of a sucker for that kind of stuff, even if I try to act all logical about it. I remember back when I was living in Chicago, I had this weird feeling every time the wind picked up from a certain direction... it always felt like a warning of some massive blizzard coming through, and man, I was usually right. Anyway, just a random thought crossing my mind today. What do you all think? Do you believe in those little warning signs, or am I just overthinking things again? kaže:
Since you brought up politics—man, honestly? I’d much rather have someone running this country who spends their days picking up bottles on the street and can barely string three grammatically correct sentences together. At least that person actually knows what it feels like when everything is falling apart—they might actually have a shred of empathy left in them. But the guy currently steering the ship? He’s some silver-tongued orator, totally polished and smooth, but deep down he's just trash. He’s all about looking out for himself instead of being willing to lay it all on the line for the country. That’s supposed to be the whole point of the job, isn't it? It’s the moral core of being a public servant—putting the nation before your own skin.

Honestly, that whole SAT craze is easily the biggest load of garbage ever shoved into the education system—like, seriously, in the last ten thousand years of schooling, we haven't seen anything quite this useless.

I mean, honestly—what does it even matter to me that Segert Hlapic left home back in that second-grade book? Or that train got stuck in the snow in that Mark Twain story I read in fourth grade? Sure, I read them both, but if I’m being real, those memories are pretty thin at this point. The truth is, I don't really care. It’s not like I’m planning on becoming an English professor or anything. Besides, people seem to get what I’m saying whether I’m talking or typing—even if I write like this—so there’s really no reason for me to go out of my way to polish up my grammar or act all fancy with my writing.

Look, if we’re talking about the basic biology of life—just looking at things from a broad perspective—every living thing naturally adapts its way of being to fit its surroundings. That includes how we communicate, too. It's all about the environment you're dropped into, the local vibe, and where you actually call home. So, if I happen to talk with a bit of a West Coast drawl or use certain regional slang, I’m not doing anything wrong—I’m just living according to my nature, you know? It's just how I'm wired to exist in my corner of the world.

There are literally a thousand better things a kid could be doing with their time—I mean, seriously, they could be diving into biology, geograhpy, some hands-on tech stuff, math, or pretty much any other subject that actually matters—than sitting there grinding through these mindless required reading assignments. It’s such a waste. Most students basically tune out of English class the second they wrap up middle school anyway. They just end up copying the homework or skimming the book just enough to scrape by with a D and call it a day so they can finally be done with it.

Look, if students are already pushing back this hard, there’s honestly no point in wasting hundreds of years trying to force them down a path they don't want to walk. Kids today—man, they evolve at such a crazy speed. We've got so many potential musicians, artists, and just straight-up brilliant minds who probably never got their shot simply because the system was too busy forcing them into a box. Instead of actually nurturing that spark or leaning into what they’re clearly passionate about, we basically just make them kill time reading old, dusty classics and other total nonsense that doesn't mean anything to them. It's like we're stifling all that raw talent before it even has a chance to breathe.

Honestly, if you want to see what I mean, just look at Americans—they’re basically the ultimate example of being over-educated yet totally out of touch. From the time they hit third grade all the way through college, most of them aren't actually experiencing life, you know? They're just living through this rigid loop of whatever the school system dictates, combined with that whole "family-meets-school" conditioning. It’s like they’re just following a script from birth. Honestly, even someone who isn't paying close attention can see it—it feels like the younger generation in the US is just completely clueless when it comes to how the real world actually works.

And then you’ve got these kids—barely twenty-one, right?—heading off to Afghanistan, totally convinced they’re out there fighting for freedom and all that. It’s wild. Honestly, most of them couldn't even point Europe out on a map if their lives depended on it, let alone understand the actual geopolitics of what's happening. I mean, don't get me wrong, I get the spirit, but man... the level of naivety is just off the charts.

Honestly, it feels like you don’t really get how politics actually works in this country. Look, being a politician isn't just about standing around complaining that everything is going downhill or whining about having a low salary—though, let's be real, everyone loves to do that. Sure, they’re supposed to work in the best interest of the people (cough, Washington D.C., cough), but there’s way more to it than that. To actually pull this off, you need a solid grasp of basically every field their job touches. You can't just wing it. Plus, since they’re representing the entire nation, they really ought to be highly cultured and well-educated. It’s part of the gig. And honestly, what do you even mean when you throw around a phrase like "giving your life for the country"? That’s a pretty heavy thing to say without much context.

Honestly, I think the SATs are a great idea. Look, students are basically the end product of an entire educational system—I’m definitely oversimplifying here, so bear with me—that needs to be put through a standardized test of general knowledge before they can dive into specialized college majors. The real question isn't actually about the tests themselves, though. It's more about whether the K-12 system is actually doing its job to prepare kids for those exams, and if different school districts are even teaching from the same playbook. That's where the real debate lies, not in the testing itself. At the end of the day, the SAT is just there to act as a baseline—making sure students have hit that specific threshold of knowledge required by the big-shot academic institutions.

Saying Mark Twain wrote *Snowbound*?! Man, I actually feel a little embarrassed reading this... honestly, that’s why we have required reading in school—so we don't look totally clueless about general culture and accidentally claim Twain wrote some random book he didn't. If there were an American author like Jack London, they'd be spinning in their grave right now 🙂
Look, you don't need to be an English teacher (which, by the way, isn't capitalized unless it's at the start of a sentence) just to get this. It's about being well-rounded and knowing authors from here and abroad, which helps spark your imagination and sharpens your critical thinking regarding the book itself—you know, the message the writer is sending and how they express it. Plus, it helps you "polish up" your literacy.

It's obvious you adapt to whoever you're hanging out with, and hey, nobody's stopping you from using whatever regional slang you want (personally, I tend to sound pretty much like a New Yorker), and nobody's gonna come after you if you're illiterate. It's just that people won't exactly look at you with huge respect, and you might miss out on certain opportunities down the road. Nobody's forcing your hand, but you've gotta live with the consequences.

The fact that students try to dodge English class is probably more about *how* it's taught rather than the subject itself. But the subject is incredibly important, and this avoidance you're talking about doesn't seem like a good sign to me, don't you think?
I agree that the system doesn't push ambition enough, but that means we should expand the curriculum, not slap more restrictions on it. Certain educational standards have to be met, otherwise we'll end up like those Americans you mentioned (though you used them in a totally wrong context) where we won't even be able to hold our own on the global stage.

Americans are anything but overeducated. They have this super narrow education system with basically just three core mandatory subjects plus some electives they have to pick from. Their lack of knowledge comes directly from a system that encourages them to just do whatever they feel like, and that definitely doesn't involve building up any real general knowledge or culture.

And trust me, Afghanistan is a way more complicated story than just finishing a required reading assignment...

wanderinggardener12 said:Good grief. Looking back through some of these threads, I’m struck by just how much heavy lifting is actually required here—and I don't mean the writing itself, but the fundamental cultivation of a reading habit.

But we aren't talking about the way things are currently handled in our schools.

Every one of us is a unique individual from the moment we're born, yet isn't it true that there exists a core collection of perhaps a hundred books that almost anyone would find captivating if they had the chance during their formative years? If those books were actually selected specifically for the person being recommended, wouldn't it be nearly impossible not to catch the reading bug? And if you pair that right choice with an environment that actually encourages exploration, aren't we all just a few steps closer to meaningful communication on every possible level?

It honestly pains me to think that some of you missed out on the sheer joy and intellectual nourishment that comes from a good book. You can look directly at your parents or your teachers for that; go ahead, hold them accountable for the deprivation they caused. It’s fundamentally the same as someone trying to strip the pleasure out of intimacy or the satisfaction of a great meal by forcing you into a hollow encounter with someone you find repulsive, or making you choke down something you consider absolute garbage, all while demanding that you sit there and provide a detailed, clinical description of the experience...

rustyjackal10 said:

I don't know about you guys, but I’ve been sitting here thinking about that whole "harbinger" concept lately—you know, those little signs or omens that suggest something big is right around the corner? It’s funny how life works like that sometimes. One minute everything is just cruising along, totally normal, and then you see that one weird little thing—a strange coincidence, a sudden shift in the weather, or even just a gut feeling—and suddenly you realize the vibe has shifted completely. It’s like the universe is tapping you on the shoulder, trying to get your attention before the storm actually hits. Honestly, I’m a bit of a sucker for that kind of stuff, even if I try to act all logical about it. I remember back when I was living in Chicago, I had this weird feeling every time the wind picked up from a certain direction... it always felt like a warning of some massive blizzard coming through, and man, I was usually right. Anyway, just a random thought crossing my mind today. What do you all think? Do you believe in those little warning signs, or am I just overthinking things again? kaže:
Since you brought up politics—man, honestly? I’d much rather have someone running this country who spends their days picking up bottles on the street and can barely string three grammatically correct sentences together. At least that person actually knows what it feels like when everything is falling apart—they might actually have a shred of empathy left in them. But the guy currently steering the ship? He’s some silver-tongued orator, totally polished and smooth, but deep down he's just trash. He’s all about looking out for himself instead of being willing to lay it all on the line for the country. That’s supposed to be the whole point of the job, isn't it? It’s the moral core of being a public servant—putting the nation before your own skin.

Honestly, that whole SAT craze is easily the biggest load of garbage ever shoved into the education system—like, seriously, in the last ten thousand years of schooling, we haven't seen anything quite this useless.

I mean, honestly—what does it even matter to me that Segert Hlapic left home back in that second-grade book? Or that train got stuck in the snow in that Mark Twain story I read in fourth grade? Sure, I read them both, but if I’m being real, those memories are pretty thin at this point. The truth is, I don't really care. It’s not like I’m planning on becoming an English professor or anything. Besides, people seem to get what I’m saying whether I’m talking or typing—even if I write like this—so there’s really no reason for me to go out of my way to polish up my grammar or act all fancy with my writing.

Look, if we’re talking about the basic biology of life—just looking at things from a broad perspective—every living thing naturally adapts its way of being to fit its surroundings. That includes how we communicate, too. It's all about the environment you're dropped into, the local vibe, and where you actually call home. So, if I happen to talk with a bit of a West Coast drawl or use certain regional slang, I’m not doing anything wrong—I’m just living according to my nature, you know? It's just how I'm wired to exist in my corner of the world.

There are literally a thousand better things a kid could be doing with their time—I mean, seriously, they could be diving into biology, geograhpy, some hands-on tech stuff, math, or pretty much any other subject that actually matters—than sitting there grinding through these mindless required reading assignments. It’s such a waste. Most students basically tune out of English class the second they wrap up middle school anyway. They just end up copying the homework or skimming the book just enough to scrape by with a D and call it a day so they can finally be done with it.

Look, if students are already pushing back this hard, there’s honestly no point in wasting hundreds of years trying to force them down a path they don't want to walk. Kids today—man, they evolve at such a crazy speed. We've got so many potential musicians, artists, and just straight-up brilliant minds who probably never got their shot simply because the system was too busy forcing them into a box. Instead of actually nurturing that spark or leaning into what they’re clearly passionate about, we basically just make them kill time reading old, dusty classics and other total nonsense that doesn't mean anything to them. It's like we're stifling all that raw talent before it even has a chance to breathe.

Honestly, if you want to see what I mean, just look at Americans—they’re basically the ultimate example of being over-educated yet totally out of touch. From the time they hit third grade all the way through college, most of them aren't actually experiencing life, you know? They're just living through this rigid loop of whatever the school system dictates, combined with that whole "family-meets-school" conditioning. It’s like they’re just following a script from birth. Honestly, even someone who isn't paying close attention can see it—it feels like the younger generation in the US is just completely clueless when it comes to how the real world actually works.

And then you’ve got these kids—barely twenty-one, right?—heading off to Afghanistan, totally convinced they’re out there fighting for freedom and all that. It’s wild. Honestly, most of them couldn't even point Europe out on a map if their lives depended on it, let alone understand the actual geopolitics of what's happening. I mean, don't get me wrong, I get the spirit, but man... the level of naivety is just off the charts.

Honestly, it feels like you don’t really get how politics actually works in this country. Look, being a politician isn't just about standing around complaining that everything is going downhill or whining about having a low salary—though, let's be real, everyone loves to do that. Sure, they’re supposed to work in the best interest of the people (cough, Washington D.C., cough), but there’s way more to it than that. To actually pull this off, you need a solid grasp of basically every field their job touches. You can't just wing it. Plus, since they’re representing the entire nation, they really ought to be highly cultured and well-educated. It’s part of the gig. And honestly, what do you even mean when you throw around a phrase like "giving your life for the country"? That’s a pretty heavy thing to say without much context.

Honestly, I think the SATs are a great idea. Look, students are basically the end product of an entire educational system—I’m definitely oversimplifying here, so bear with me—that needs to be put through a standardized test of general knowledge before they can dive into specialized college majors. The real question isn't actually about the tests themselves, though. It's more about whether the K-12 system is actually doing its job to prepare kids for those exams, and if different school districts are even teaching from the same playbook. That's where the real debate lies, not in the testing itself. At the end of the day, the SAT is just there to act as a baseline—making sure students have hit that specific threshold of knowledge required by the big-shot academic institutions.

Saying Mark Twain wrote *Snowbound*?! Man, I actually feel a little embarrassed reading this... honestly, that’s why we have required reading in school—so we don't look totally clueless about general culture and accidentally claim Twain wrote some random book he didn't. If there were an American author like Jack London, they'd be spinning in their grave right now 🙂
Look, you don't need to be an English teacher (which, by the way, isn't capitalized unless it's at the start of a sentence) just to get this. It's about being well-rounded and knowing authors from here and abroad, which helps spark your imagination and sharpens your critical thinking regarding the book itself—you know, the message the writer is sending and how they express it. Plus, it helps you "polish up" your literacy.

It's obvious you adapt to whoever you're hanging out with, and hey, nobody's stopping you from using whatever regional slang you want (personally, I tend to sound pretty much like a New Yorker), and nobody's gonna come after you if you're illiterate. It's just that people won't exactly look at you with huge respect, and you might miss out on certain opportunities down the road. Nobody's forcing your hand, but you've gotta live with the consequences.

The fact that students try to dodge English class is probably more about *how* it's taught rather than the subject itself. But the subject is incredibly important, and this avoidance you're talking about doesn't seem like a good sign to me, don't you think?
I agree that the system doesn't push ambition enough, but that means we should expand the curriculum, not slap more restrictions on it. Certain educational standards have to be met, otherwise we'll end up like those Americans you mentioned (though you used them in a totally wrong context) where we won't even be able to hold our own on the global stage.

Americans are anything but overeducated. They have this super narrow education system with basically just three core mandatory subjects plus some electives they have to pick from. Their lack of knowledge comes directly from a system that encourages them to just do whatever they feel like, and that definitely doesn't involve building up any real general knowledge or culture.

And trust me, Afghanistan is a way more complicated story than just finishing a required reading assignment...

rowdypanther12 said:Oh, I don't think it's quite that simple. It isn't strictly the fault of teachers or parents, though there is certainly a group of people who grew to hate books because of school assignments—even if they usually end up finding a book they love later on.
I've always been a total bookworm. I'd say I owe it to my mom, who read to me constantly growing up. But my sister hasn't read three books in her entire life, despite my mom trying just as hard with her. She just wasn't interested. My partner is the same way; he just doesn't care for books or reading.
Since I think he's a smart guy 😍 and, as a lifelong lover of the written word, I struggle to understand how someone can dislike books, I tried to "convert" him. It didn't work. 😁
To him, books are just ink on paper. He reads the words, but he doesn't truly see them.
Even when a story is interesting, it's just letters on a page rather than a magical new world waiting behind the cover.
That isn't something you can force; maybe you can spark it in childhood, but not if you're just handing out random books instead of ones tailored to the person. 😁
I suppose it's just one of those things you either have or you don't.

Daniel Gomez10 said:I'm right there with you. Some people just aren't readers (and as someone who always has a book in my bag, I find that hard to wrap my head around 🙂), and you can't force that passion to happen.
I don't even think the point of required school reading is to make kids fall in love with books. It’s part of the English curriculum, and its main job is to give them a foundation in literature. It’s kind of like how in music class, students listen to specific classical pieces; in lit class, they read certain classics because of their historical importance.
Plus, there's everything else we've touched on before—mastering language, improving writing skills, learning how to think critically, analyzing themes, and building up that imagination...

rowdypanther12 said:I feel like we should draw a clearer line between elementary and high school when it comes to required reading. In elementary school, kids should be engaging with modern books that actually grab their attention; that’s where they can build all those essential literacy skills. Then, once they hit high school, they can move on to the classic "must-read" literature 😁
Personally, I'd even let them skip parts of a book if they could give me a solid, reasoned explanation for why it wasn't clicking or why they found it boring 😁

Sarah James4 said:Even with that kind of American system, most states actually see better results than what we have here.

As for reading... a culture of literacy starts at home and in school. People should be reading every day—parents to kids, kids to parents, teachers to students, even in preschool. Here, reading and writing feel like a guessing game, and that applies to books too.

Assigning a book is the easy part. Especially for a ten-year-old kid... especially if most of them haven't ever had to read before.🤷

Karen Richardson3 said:Personally, I have a massive issue with how we approach American English classes—specifically this rigid principle of teaching literary history.
To me, it feels like a total fog, and I honestly can't see a logical reason why it's structured this way, other than the fact that the curriculum is clearly dictated by PhDs specializing in literary history. 😁

Don't get me wrong, studying literary history is definitely valuable. But what about the modern era? How many works by contemporary authors, whether they're American or international, have you actually read or discussed during your English classes?

Isn't it just common sense that books reflecting the world we actually live in right now would be much more relatable and engaging for teenagers?

Why is it that a fifteen-year-old is stuck reading The Iliad, then moves on to The Decameron at sixteen, followed by some Neoclassical drama at seventeen, only to reach senior year at eighteen where they barely even glance at a few mid-20th-century authors because everyone is too busy stressing over SAT prep and graduation?

I've always been a reader—actually, I still am—but most of my required school readings were just an absolute drag.
I would finish them (most of them, anyway), and I could always figure out "what the author was trying to say," which meant I always pulled straight A's in English, but man, those selected books were just brutal.

For kids who don't already love reading, these mandatory lists just reinforce the idea that books are boring things to be avoided at all costs. Meanwhile, the kids who actually enjoy reading know there's a huge, fascinating world of literature outside the school curriculum, so they usually just suck it up and endure it.

Of course, studying literary history is important. But what about everything happening right now? I'm curious, how many books by modern authors—either from here or abroad—have you actually read or covered in your American literature classes?

I've always loved reading, but honestly, most of my school assignments were just such a drag.
I could probably follow most of them. I always understood exactly what an author was getting at—honestly, I used to pull straight A's in my English classes back in high school. But yeah, the required reading list they gave us? Total garbage.

People who hate reading always pick the most boring books, which just proves their point. But those of us who actually love it? We know there’s a whole massive world of great stories outside the school curriculum, so we usually just power through the dull stuff.