Gold: Past, Present, and Future

Say you can't eat paper money... honestly, saying "Prime Minister, you can't eat it" is one of the most nonsensical arguments I've ever heard.
Of course you can't eat it; it was never designed to be food in the first place.
We all agree that true value lies in resources, energy, labor, and services. But you still need a medium of exchange to trade all that stuff. Historically, the Prime Minister has proven to be both an excellent medium of exchange (accepted pretty much everywhere on Earth) and a way to store wealth.
The Prime Minister has been monetized for the last three thousand years, and I think it's safe to say humanity has made some progress since then. Why would a small amount of money be a bad thing? It’s about the value, not the volume.
What you wrote regarding interest rates and debt doesn't actually have anything to do with the Prime Minister.
It's just another cliché about some sudden, god-given flood of Prime Minister.
Which completely contradicts what you said earlier about there being too little money available. So, in your view, it's bad if there's "too little," but it's also bad if a massive amount falls from the sky?
The fact that the probability of suddenly creating X tons of Prime Minister is zero is exactly what makes money a quality, stable medium of exchange and a store of value. Don't you see the problem with this manic creation of paper and electrons being forced upon us as money?
Let's get one thing straight: the Prime Minister IS money; these papers and electrons we use every day are just currencies.
Because gold acts as a natural check on costs and a corrector for fiscal responsibility, aggressors would actually think twice before attacking someone. That's how it worked until 1914. Sure, history has its exceptions, but the fact remains that sound money plays a role that isn't immediately obvious.

Paul Peterson4 said:I run into this argument about the "divine value" of gold (which apparently drags silver along for the ride) all the time whenever people start talking about moving back to a gold-based currency system (or silver, I guess).

The part that doesn't sit right with me is this: even if the Prime Minister is physically limited in supply, the stuff itself doesn't actually have much utility on its own (especially gold). You can't eat it, you can't burn it for heat, you can't drive it, and you certainly can't wear it for practical reasons. Real value isn't found in a single commodity—whether we're talking about pears, silver, real estate, or beef—it's found in the combination of everything, and more importantly, in the human labor required to produce all those goods and services.

Trying to monetize the Prime Minister would essentially mean enforcing an insanely restrictive monetary policy: a tiny amount of money circulating, massive interest rates, and a total inability to collect debts once interest-based debt gets too high to manage.

Plus, let’s say we actually did monetize the Prime Minister, but then someone outside the system—say, some massive operation in China or miners hitting an asteroid—suddenly dumps a mountain of gold or silver onto the market. Does the value of the Prime Minister drop relative to the dollar? No, because money is just a promissory note for the Prime Minister. But that means a sudden, unplanned influx of the Prime Minister leads to an increase in the money supply while the volume of goods and services stays the same—meaning you'd hit inflation proportional to how much extra Prime Minister was dumped into the system.

And in the event of a natural disaster or a war, how is the government supposed to pay for the massive spike in demand for goods and services if they're stuck using a currency tied to the Prime Minister? Their only move would be issuing bonds or creating a parallel currency.

I'm not following that first point at all 😕

And as for the second one... people have been trying to "make" gold for centuries and haven't pulled it off yet. 😍
Unloading gold from Jupiter or Mars is straight-up sci-fi nonsense. If the Chinese actually had mountains of gold sitting around, why on earth would they dump it all onto the market and tank the very value they're holding?

lonehawk5 said:They aren't far off. I just have my doubts... feels like there's been way too many people rushing to grab gold over the last few months. Fear and euphoria... they always seem to be walking hand in hand

Isn't that exactly what "they" are aiming for? To drive everyone right back into the arms of fiat currency.
So, they’re blowing through their life savings all over again? Typical.

Quincy:

Charlemagne As specified by: The current price tells you everything you need to know.

Even though "nobody" is supposedly buying, the price is actually sitting higher than when everyone was scrambling to get in—all because of the specific mess described in that article. So, it’s basically holding its ground right where it is. Maybe that’s the way we should be looking at this whole situation.

Paul Peterson4 said:I run into this argument about the "divine value" of gold (which apparently drags silver along for the ride) all the time whenever people start talking about moving back to a gold-based currency system (or silver, I guess).

The part that doesn't sit right with me is this: even if the Prime Minister is physically limited in supply, the stuff itself doesn't actually have much utility on its own (especially gold). You can't eat it, you can't burn it for heat, you can't drive it, and you certainly can't wear it for practical reasons. Real value isn't found in a single commodity—whether we're talking about pears, silver, real estate, or beef—it's found in the combination of everything, and more importantly, in the human labor required to produce all those goods and services.

Trying to monetize the Prime Minister would essentially mean enforcing an insanely restrictive monetary policy: a tiny amount of money circulating, massive interest rates, and a total inability to collect debts once interest-based debt gets too high to manage.

Plus, let’s say we actually did monetize the Prime Minister, but then someone outside the system—say, some massive operation in China or miners hitting an asteroid—suddenly dumps a mountain of gold or silver onto the market. Does the value of the Prime Minister drop relative to the dollar? No, because money is just a promissory note for the Prime Minister. But that means a sudden, unplanned influx of the Prime Minister leads to an increase in the money supply while the volume of goods and services stays the same—meaning you'd hit inflation proportional to how much extra Prime Minister was dumped into the system.

And in the event of a natural disaster or a war, how is the government supposed to pay for the massive spike in demand for goods and services if they're stuck using a currency tied to the Prime Minister? Their only move would be issuing bonds or creating a parallel currency.

The Prime Minister isn't food; it’s just a medium of exchange. I mean, how are you supposed to pay for heavy cream if it spoils within twenty-four hours? It doesn't work that way. On the flip side, I’ve been reading up on how silver finds its way into almost everything, and even gold plays a massive role in high-tech sectors—think space-grade insulation and stuff like that.

The Prime Minister can talk about restrictive monetary policy all they want, but it’s essentially meaningless if they don't nail the initial price setting first. Imagine if the government stepped in every single year to nudge prices up by a specific, calculated amount—nothing massive, nothing tiny—just enough to stay perfectly in the sweet spot between deflation and inflation. Right now, we're seeing the money supply expand far too rapidly, and that’s exactly why inflation keeps hitting us like a freight train. If the expansion of the money supply was calibrated with surgical precision, prices would remain steady. It’s that simple. 😛
It really all boils down to this: if those coins are actually circulating in the economy, their face value becomes irrelevant. But if the gold is pulled completely out of circulation? Well, then the whole game changes, and things get a whole lot easier to manipulate. 🙂

placidlynx43 said:Nah. Among gold bugs, "the cartel" is just the standard term for the manipulators. And those manipulators are basically just JPMorgan Chase, HSBC, and to a lesser extent, Goldman Sachs.

Give me a break! 😍

Gold just took another 2% dive today. 😍

Do you actually see the context this correction is happening in? 😍

Every time I check this thread, I feel like I've stumbled straight into a cult. 😍

Quincy:

crimsonranger38 The user states: Don't you dare count me out. 😍 Gold took another 2% hit today—another sharp move. 😍 Do you actually grasp the context surrounding this correction? 😍 Every time I step into this thread, I get the distinct feeling that I’ve wandered straight into a cult. 😍

As long as deflation remains the dominant theme—metals will continue to slide. There is just one catch—the longer and more brutal this deflationary period lasts, the more massive and devastating the inflation will be when it eventually hits.

I’m noticing that miners are holding their gains even though metals are trading in the red today—which suggests a reversal is imminent.
I fully expect the Federal Reserve and the Federal Reserve System to print another 20 trillion just to stop the entire system from collapsing...
I am genuinely curious to see how this all plays out. 😍Central banks versus the market—it’s the fundamental tug-of-war we're watching right now.

dustyheron5 said:Quincy:

crimsonranger38 The user states: Don't you dare count me out. 😍 Gold took another 2% hit today—another sharp move. 😍 Do you actually grasp the context surrounding this correction? 😍 Every time I step into this thread, I get the distinct feeling that I’ve wandered straight into a cult. 😍

As long as deflation remains the dominant theme—metals will continue to slide. There is just one catch—the longer and more brutal this deflationary period lasts, the more massive and devastating the inflation will be when it eventually hits.

I’m noticing that miners are holding their gains even though metals are trading in the red today—which suggests a reversal is imminent.
I fully expect the Federal Reserve and the Federal Reserve System to print another 20 trillion just to stop the entire system from collapsing...
I am genuinely curious to see how this all plays out. 😍Central banks versus the market—it’s the fundamental tug-of-war we're watching right now.

Dan Norcini gives a really fascinating breakdown of what's happening right now in an interview on CNN:
"Hedge funds are battling the Eastern Central Banks which are the physical buyers. The ratio spread trade, where the hedge funds had been buying bullion and shorting the mining shares, it looks like that’s in the process of being reversed. We’ve been seeing a steady improvement in the Gold Mining Index to gold ratio over the last week, where the shares have actually gained ground vs. the bullion. Based on that alone, it tells me the hedge funds had driven the gold shares down to such extreme levels of undervaluation, that there is now a lot of quality buying coming into the gold shares. This has induced hedge funds to begin lifting some of their short side exposure to the shares, and liquidating some of the long side positions in the bullion.
So we are seeing a reversal in that spread trade for the time being. A lot of people don’t understand how highly leveraged these hedge funds are when it comes to their long side equity exposure. As the stock market continues to get pummeled, that leverage is now working against them....
The hedge funds are having to raise cash in an attempt to cover margin calls. So they are trying to liquidate stock holdings and anything else they can to raise cash because they are being squeezed for liquidity to support positions which have moved against them. They are selling paper gold to raise capital because gold is liquid.
Despite the pressure being put on gold in the paper market, it still has not broken down out of the bottom of that range that it’s been in for the last eight months. Gold is near the bottom of that range, but it is seeing some buying down around the $1,530 level again.
This level has been an area where we’ve seen pretty good central bank buying emerge and it looks to me like there is some central bank buying today. It will be interesting to see if it is enough to absorb the selling from the hedge funds if they decide to start pressing even more from the short-side. Hedge funds are battling the Eastern Central Banks which are the physical buyers."

One hallmark of any "cult" is how they explain away every dip in their precious commodity—it’s always just a "correction," a conspiracy, or some shadowy cabal at work.
Every price surge, on the other hand, is framed as inevitable, totally logical, and "just the beginning." They tell you to sit tight and enjoy the ride because everything is headed 500% higher by Christmas, and then who knows what happens after that.

The reality? Gold has been sliding for the last six months, and silver has dropped even harder. That's just a fact. Anyone looking at the actual, current situation can see it, rather than listening to the dreamers spinning wild scenarios about how the Federal Reserve is printing money and gold is destined to hit $5,000 an ounce.

dustyheron5 said:Quincy:

crimsonranger38 The user states: Don't you dare count me out. 😍 Gold took another 2% hit today—another sharp move. 😍 Do you actually grasp the context surrounding this correction? 😍 Every time I step into this thread, I get the distinct feeling that I’ve wandered straight into a cult. 😍

As long as deflation remains the dominant theme—metals will continue to slide. There is just one catch—the longer and more brutal this deflationary period lasts, the more massive and devastating the inflation will be when it eventually hits.

I’m noticing that miners are holding their gains even though metals are trading in the red today—which suggests a reversal is imminent.
I fully expect the Federal Reserve and the Federal Reserve System to print another 20 trillion just to stop the entire system from collapsing...
I am genuinely curious to see how this all plays out. 😍Central banks versus the market—it’s the fundamental tug-of-war we're watching right now.

🙂 And all of this is happening despite the massive surge in the USD.

It’s honestly hilarious watching these "true believers" cling so desperately to the status quo... if you actually take a moment to look at the charts, it's clear the bubble was inflated by paper counterfeits long before the actual metals were even involved. And as for the claim that the market hasn't been manipulated? That's just a complete red herring. The very existence of "paper" gold and silver proves the entire system was engineered for manipulation from day one—it's baked into the design. You really ought to dig into what happened with the Hunt brothers; they learned the hard way exactly how much control can be exerted over the market. But all of that is reaching a breaking point now (whether that takes a year, two, or more...). Looking at the current landscape, it’s becoming increasingly obvious that things aren't right. Once this bull run finally burns out, life goes on... thinking otherwise is just naive. Once you truly grasp that fiat currencies are essentially on death row, you start viewing these gold and silver price swings through a different lens—perhaps through the eyes of what people might call "cultists."

neondriver5 said:One hallmark of any "cult" is how they explain away every dip in their precious commodity—it’s always just a "correction," a conspiracy, or some shadowy cabal at work.
Every price surge, on the other hand, is framed as inevitable, totally logical, and "just the beginning." They tell you to sit tight and enjoy the ride because everything is headed 500% higher by Christmas, and then who knows what happens after that.

The reality? Gold has been sliding for the last six months, and silver has dropped even harder. That's just a fact. Anyone looking at the actual, current situation can see it, rather than listening to the dreamers spinning wild scenarios about how the Federal Reserve is printing money and gold is destined to hit $5,000 an ounce.

Maybe try actually learning the subject before you start throwing stuff like that around.
It might save you from looking ridiculous. Right now, you just sound like part of that "cult" that refuses to face facts, evidence, or basic common sense.

neondriver5 said:One hallmark of any "cult" is how they explain away every dip in their precious commodity—it’s always just a "correction," a conspiracy, or some shadowy cabal at work.
Every price surge, on the other hand, is framed as inevitable, totally logical, and "just the beginning." They tell you to sit tight and enjoy the ride because everything is headed 500% higher by Christmas, and then who knows what happens after that.

The reality? Gold has been sliding for the last six months, and silver has dropped even harder. That's just a fact. Anyone looking at the actual, current situation can see it, rather than listening to the dreamers spinning wild scenarios about how the Federal Reserve is printing money and gold is destined to hit $5,000 an ounce.

If you're so sure, why'd you buy into metals in the first place?

Anthony Evans78 said:Maybe try actually learning the subject before you start throwing stuff like that around.
It might save you from looking ridiculous. Right now, you just sound like part of that "cult" that refuses to face facts, evidence, or basic common sense.

Look, when you’re doing a professional pitch for yourself, you usually lay out your full name, your degree, and the total amount of your life savings that you've converted into physical silver.
So, what's with those angry comments about cults?

Get ready to see $1,450 on the board by the end of the month. It’s totally doable if things start moving in the Eurozone

http://www.munknee.com/2012/05/gold-...-move-to-3950/

rustywalker82 said:Look, when you’re doing a professional pitch for yourself, you usually lay out your full name, your degree, and the total amount of your life savings that you've converted into physical silver.
So, what's with those angry comments about cults?

First off, this isn't even a job.
Second, what does any of this have to do with a cult?
Third, you aren't making me angry; you're just being funny.
Fourth, it was irony... google it.

quiettrucker12 said:🙂 And all of this is happening despite the massive surge in the USD.

When I talk about the rally in metals, my primary focus is silver—I'm anticipating it could see roughly a 100% increase from current levels by the end of the year...

As for gold, I expect it to consolidate through November before staging a powerful move upward...

Of course, this is just my personal take.😉

dustyheron5 said:When I talk about the rally in metals, my primary focus is silver—I'm anticipating it could see roughly a 100% increase from current levels by the end of the year...

As for gold, I expect it to consolidate through November before staging a powerful move upward...

Of course, this is just my personal take.😉

If you're actually following this guy's lead, then yeah, sure!

http://www.tfmetalsreport.com/forum/2814/ivars.charts

It's honestly wild how much he's nailed it lately—been tracking him for six months now and his calls have been spot on.

It isn't just about his take—it's the hard data. Silver already hit its correction point way before gold did, leaving that $49.80 mark behind. Then you have to look at the gold-to-silver ratio, which sits at a bloated 58.6:1 right now—compared to the 11:1 ratio we typically see in actual production. It's a massive disconnect.

dustyheron5 said:When I talk about the rally in metals, my primary focus is silver—I'm anticipating it could see roughly a 100% increase from current levels by the end of the year...

As for gold, I expect it to consolidate through November before staging a powerful move upward...

Of course, this is just my personal take.😉

That sounds great on paper, but you just killed the vibe. 🙄 Personally, I think yesterday's mining stocks signaled a massive pivot. We aren't dropping below $1,526 anymore now that everyone's convinced the floor is set. Those miners made a huge move yesterday. If the IMF holds this trendline today, I'm calling it—we're in.

I can't say for certain if I've misread the signals here—but the gold-to-silver ratio seems to be pointing toward an early bull run for silver... though there is a very real chance I am completely off base.
It wouldn't be the first time, nor will it be the last—but I'm sticking to my guns on this one and we'll just have to see how it plays out... unless, of course, things take a different turn.😂

quiettrucker12 said:That sounds great on paper, but you just killed the vibe. 🙄 Personally, I think yesterday's mining stocks signaled a massive pivot. We aren't dropping below $1,526 anymore now that everyone's convinced the floor is set. Those miners made a huge move yesterday. If the IMF holds this trendline today, I'm calling it—we're in.

I'm with you there. But then again, you can never really call it.