Wage garnishments and collections

John Clark6 said:1. What "extra costs" are we talking about here? The notice fee? Which is illegal anyway? There is no way a judge is going to strike down the legal fees.
2. I think it’s been explained sixteen times already that the statute of limitations isn't a flat 10-year rule, and you don't necessarily need to seize specific assets to interrupt that period—there are plenty of other legal actions that can reset the clock.
3. She isn't being rude; she’s just describing the likely sequence of events if they actually come to seize her property. Maybe she’s being a little dramatic, but honestly, it’s all very realistic under certain circumstances.

Come on then, step up and try me. 😍

She's really just bringing up Inkas and claiming those specific $167... are the only issue. But for any other action to actually reset the statute of limitations, there has to be a court order involved. You can see you're actually agreeing that this woman is just being 😛

You can't expect a freebie without a full meal first; I'm not exactly some cheap date. 🙂

My husband just got hit with an enforcement order and a collection notice all in one envelope from Baker McKenzie.
He picked up the notice on August 22, 2011, but the bill was actually already paid back on July 6, 2011.
We filed a formal objection and attached the proof of payment, yet here we are two years later still dealing with an enforcement action.
I’ve searched the entire house and found the postal receipt proving we sent it via certified mail, but I can't find the actual return receipt anywhere—dammit. I was positive it had been mailed back to us.

We never received any official notification that the enforcement order was finalized, but they’ve already frozen his account, probably to cover their own legal fees.
Tomorrow he’s heading to the Federal Reserve with copies of the payment, our previous objection, and the postal receipt.
Should we try calling Baker McKenzie or CNN? We tried calling before but couldn't get a soul on the line.
Can we argue that he never received a legally binding final decision?
Under what specific circumstances will the Federal Reserve unfreeze the account?

Let's go over this for the hundredth time—it really all comes down to when the public notary actually received the proposal, not just when you guys got notified, especially when we're talking about whether payments were made on time... I mean, if you haven't changed your registered address, or if that address doesn't even match where you're actually living right now, then everything just ends up posted on the court's bulletin board. So, any guesses as to which scenario would actually lead the Federal Reserve to unfreeze an account?

John Clark6 said:Let's go over this for the hundredth time—it really all comes down to when the public notary actually received the proposal, not just when you guys got notified, especially when we're talking about whether payments were made on time... I mean, if you haven't changed your registered address, or if that address doesn't even match where you're actually living right now, then everything just ends up posted on the court's bulletin board. So, any guesses as to which scenario would actually lead the Federal Reserve to unfreeze an account?

We filed the seizure motion and signed the objection right on schedule.
Shouldn't we have received a summons from the court by now?

Eric Fowler19 said:We filed the seizure motion and signed the objection right on schedule.
Shouldn't we have received a summons from the court by now?

Well, you absolutely should—and honestly, it’s something worth looking into—though I suspect they might not even grant you the same consideration... at this stage, you really ought to be looking into vacating the clause due to finality... maybe just go ahead and hire an attorney...

Some people here have been asking about what happens at a debt collection agency hearing (for example, me 🙂 )

Steven Grant37 said:1) Has anyone here ever ended up in court because they filed an (unjustified) appeal against a garnishment order?

2) Has anyone reached out to a lawyer regarding issues with wage garnishments (like for NPR bills, utility companies, etc.)?

I'm really curious about what that process actually looks like and what the typical costs or legal fees might be.

Thanks!

Here’s some layman's info based on my own experience; hopefully, it helps clear things up for someone:

- The whole thing lasted about fifteen minutes.

- My trainee and I sat on one side of the table, and two women were on the other—one speaking, the other taking notes.

I had two main objections to the lawsuit:
1) Regarding my claim that this was intentional stalling—I mentioned being unemployed and sick, but the judge just brushed it off as standard legal jargon, basically saying it didn't matter.
2) Regarding the request for late interest on the public notary fees dating back to June 2011, even though I didn't receive the bill/judgment until December 2012 (18 months later)—apparently, that's considered correct calculation under the law.

There will be another hearing soon just to read the verdict. Most people don't bother showing up for that, but maybe I should go anyway(?!)

The trainee's costs are around $300 plus $33 for the verdict reading. The previous public notary fees are supposedly going to be slightly lower once a few items are removed.

I think there might still be grounds to appeal the length of the proceedings, though I'm not sure if that makes sense or if I messed up by admitting to the debt (under pressure from the judge; I really only wanted to admit that I hadn't paid yet).

From what I've heard elsewhere:
Even if I had ignored the summons, the verdict theoretically would have been the same, and if it wasn't, I wouldn't have had any right to appeal the procedure.
If the hearing is held outside of Washington, D.C., the opposing party can request travel expenses (like an extra $27 for traveling to Columbus)

Your whole "post" is just completely incoherent—and honestly, it looks like you managed to blow every single opportunity you had by filing such a baseless appeal, and now you're going to be stuck footing the bill for the debt collection agency's fees too, right?

John Clark6,
When I asked my question here recently, you were being insulting (the post was deleted), so there’s really no point in me trying to have a discussion with you.

Sometimes the perspective of someone who isn't actually working in debt collection can be more helpful than that kind of "expert" advice, so here is my take.

Well, once again, what you wrote is just a bit too vague for me—you clearly intended to share your personal experience, but there isn't really a solid takeaway to be found here, so maybe give it another read? I certainly wasn't feeling quite bold enough to jump to any definitive conclusions myself 🙂

ps. I honestly have no idea if I’ve offended anyone, nor am I aware of any deletions, but I suppose the truth can sting sometimes

John Clark6 said:Let's go over this for the hundredth time—it really all comes down to when the public notary actually received the proposal, not just when you guys got notified, especially when we're talking about whether payments were made on time... I mean, if you haven't changed your registered address, or if that address doesn't even match where you're actually living right now, then everything just ends up posted on the court's bulletin board. So, any guesses as to which scenario would actually lead the Federal Reserve to unfreeze an account?

I just checked. The public notary issued the debt collection order on July 15th, while CNN provided the ledger extract back on June 28th.
The payment was made on July 5th, 2011.

I’m not entirely sure if I’m hitting the right sub here, but I was hoping someone could point me in the right direction so I don't spend all day clicking through random threads
Here’s the situation. A while back, my husband ran his own small business. Naturally, he left behind a mountain of unpaid payroll taxes and social security contributions. That total has ballooned to about $50,000 now... yeah, just great.
He’s been unemployed for a while and we don't actually own anything—we don't even have a car anymore. We’re currently living in a house owned by his parents, though they live down at their place on the coast. My big question is this: if a debt collection agency comes knocking, can they come after the house we're living in, even though it legally belongs to his parents? We are both officially registered as residents at this address.

Patrick Doyle70 said:I’m not entirely sure if I’m hitting the right sub here, but I was hoping someone could point me in the right direction so I don't spend all day clicking through random threads
Here’s the situation. A while back, my husband ran his own small business. Naturally, he left behind a mountain of unpaid payroll taxes and social security contributions. That total has ballooned to about $50,000 now... yeah, just great.
He’s been unemployed for a while and we don't actually own anything—we don't even have a car anymore. We’re currently living in a house owned by his parents, though they live down at their place on the coast. My big question is this: if a debt collection agency comes knocking, can they come after the house we're living in, even though it legally belongs to his parents? We are both officially registered as residents at this address.

Running a business a long time ago might mean the statute of limitations has kicked in—and even if it hasn't, they can't seize the house since it isn't legally yours.

John Clark6 said:Look, Grba, I’ll be honest—I’m not entirely sure I follow your logic here—or maybe I just missed your point—but I really don't see the utility in filing an objection if the debt is legitimate and hasn't hit the statute of limitations. It feels like you're just objecting for the sake of objecting, which, in my opinion, is pretty much pointless. All you're doing is potentially dragging things out and forcing yourself to pay for yet another legal consultation, which just inflates your total costs. Honestly, the only smart move is to settle the full amount now to avoid those extra notary fees used to certify the finality of the debt—though, from what I've seen lately, some lawyers actually include those fees right in their initial collection proposals anyway. If you file an objection without any real grounds, you aren't stopping anything; you're just delaying the inevitable, and that enforcement order will eventually become legally binding regardless. As for what you mentioned regarding the principal amount... hmm... I don't think that works quite that way, and here is why: enforcement costs kick in the very moment the collection proposal is drafted—basically, as soon as the notary receives the request. You can only dodge those specific costs if you pay off the debt *before* the enforcement order is actually issued. Even if you were to pay off just the principal, the attorney still has a perfectly valid legal right to claim their procedural fees—which is totally standard practice. Plus, you might be overlooking a big one: by paying even a portion of the debt, you are essentially acknowledging that the debt exists and validating the enforcement action itself. It’s almost a contradiction in terms—you're complaining about the debt while simultaneously paying it! At the end of the day, both the court-mandated and the attorney's fees are completely justified and legitimate.

Hey, Alex—would you mind walking me through that one more time? I might be totally off base here, but I'd love a bit more clarity!

Let's go over this one more time. This time, we'll break it down into three parts. In all three scenarios, we're talking about people who actually WANT to pay their debt.
Why file an objection.
Scenario one. (The debtor pays the debt in full)
This thread is 162 pages long. Go ahead and count how many posts say, "I paid the debt, but it still hit my account at the Federal Reserve and froze everything." That happened because they didn't file an objection; the enforcement became final and hit the Federal Reserve. All those people whining are responsible for their own mess because they ended up losing money. First off, there's no guarantee all creditors will return the money they seized (about 90% will, but there's always that one stubborn type where your only option is court, and we all know how that goes). Furthermore, the creditor is NOT going to pay you back the fees the Federal Reserve took for their own processing.
Is it really too much to ask for people who have already paid to take thirty minutes to pull their tax exemption status to avoid court fees and send that as an objection to the public notary? I think it is. Actually, I don't think—I consider it a basic responsibility for any citizen who receives an enforcement notice.

Scenario two (The debtor wants to pay in installments)
It's the exact same situation as scenario one. Except, 90% of creditors will gladly agree to a payment plan, provided it follows their specific timeline. So, an objection is mandatory.

Scenario three (The debtor can't keep up with the creditor's demands, or the debt is massive and would take years to pay off, or the creditor refuses a payment plan)
Basically, every month after filing the objection, the debtor sends a specific amount to the creditor's account labeled "principal." Yes, you're technically acknowledging the debt, because debts have to be settled. It's common sense. But by doing this, you're settling the enforcement under much better terms—terms similar to most European countries, where you prioritize paying off the principal first.
What happens when the hearing comes up? You simply present all the documents you sent to the creditor requesting a payment plan, along with, say, a letter from a bank stating you don't qualify for credit, and finally, a visual chart of your repayment plan (for a debt of $23 with a 2-year term and current interest rates of...$6.75) If that debt collection agency were to actually become final, we're looking at a 30-year stretch, even though the debtor's repayment plan says it should only take 10. Also, don't forget the part of the law that makes us prevent predatory lending. The judge's first move will be cutting the principal because they have no choice. In our legal system, if there's a tie, the court leans toward what’s more favorable for the defendant. It's just how it works. Look at the case involving the guy from Chicago and the woman from Mexico—the judge handed down a "light" sentence simply because the law forced them to favor the accused.

And one last thing... it's true that judges usually toss out extra costs for the debtor if they see the person is actually willing to settle their debts.

Enough said? I bet the pearl-clutchers will completely ignore my first two points since they're obvious, and instead go straight for the third. Why? Because nobody—and I mean absolutely nobody—can predict exactly how a judge will rule in that specific scenario. 😉

Bottom line: pay your debts, but MANDATORY file objections against everything you can. Just keep in mind you need to pull your tax clearance to prove you aren't a tax delinquent; if you aren't, you're exempt from most of those court fees.

Eric Fowler19 said:I just checked. The public notary issued the debt collection order on July 15th, while CNN provided the ledger extract back on June 28th.
The payment was made on July 5th, 2011.

No, no, no, no, no. Once again... no, no, no, no, no, no, no. (Check John Clark6's post)

Look at the date on the front page showing when it was filed. That’s the official date and year. People mess up the year all the time. The front page needs to have a stamp with the date next to or above the "FILED" notation.
YOU MUST FILE AN OBJECTION
If it was filed before July 5th, 2011, you’re still stuck with some attorney and public notary fees (though not all of them). I wrote up a guide for filing objections here.
If it was filed after that, just write one sentence stating the debt was already paid, contest the entire collection order, and attach a copy of the payment receipt.
The only thing I'm unsure about is if it was filed exactly on July 5th, 2011. Maybe someone more experienced who dealt with that can chime in.

Daniel Martinez9 said:Let's go over this one more time. This time, we'll break it down into three parts. In all three scenarios, we're talking about people who actually WANT to pay their debt.
Why file an objection.
Scenario one. (The debtor pays the debt in full)
This thread is 162 pages long. Go ahead and count how many posts say, "I paid the debt, but it still hit my account at the Federal Reserve and froze everything." That happened because they didn't file an objection; the enforcement became final and hit the Federal Reserve. All those people whining are responsible for their own mess because they ended up losing money. First off, there's no guarantee all creditors will return the money they seized (about 90% will, but there's always that one stubborn type where your only option is court, and we all know how that goes). Furthermore, the creditor is NOT going to pay you back the fees the Federal Reserve took for their own processing.
Is it really too much to ask for people who have already paid to take thirty minutes to pull their tax exemption status to avoid court fees and send that as an objection to the public notary? I think it is. Actually, I don't think—I consider it a basic responsibility for any citizen who receives an enforcement notice.

Scenario two (The debtor wants to pay in installments)
It's the exact same situation as scenario one. Except, 90% of creditors will gladly agree to a payment plan, provided it follows their specific timeline. So, an objection is mandatory.

Scenario three (The debtor can't keep up with the creditor's demands, or the debt is massive and would take years to pay off, or the creditor refuses a payment plan)
Basically, every month after filing the objection, the debtor sends a specific amount to the creditor's account labeled "principal." Yes, you're technically acknowledging the debt, because debts have to be settled. It's common sense. But by doing this, you're settling the enforcement under much better terms—terms similar to most European countries, where you prioritize paying off the principal first.
What happens when the hearing comes up? You simply present all the documents you sent to the creditor requesting a payment plan, along with, say, a letter from a bank stating you don't qualify for credit, and finally, a visual chart of your repayment plan (for a debt of $23 with a 2-year term and current interest rates of...$6.75) If that debt collection agency were to actually become final, we're looking at a 30-year stretch, even though the debtor's repayment plan says it should only take 10. Also, don't forget the part of the law that makes us prevent predatory lending. The judge's first move will be cutting the principal because they have no choice. In our legal system, if there's a tie, the court leans toward what’s more favorable for the defendant. It's just how it works. Look at the case involving the guy from Chicago and the woman from Mexico—the judge handed down a "light" sentence simply because the law forced them to favor the accused.

And one last thing... it's true that judges usually toss out extra costs for the debtor if they see the person is actually willing to settle their debts.

Enough said? I bet the pearl-clutchers will completely ignore my first two points since they're obvious, and instead go straight for the third. Why? Because nobody—and I mean absolutely nobody—can predict exactly how a judge will rule in that specific scenario. 😉

Bottom line: pay your debts, but MANDATORY file objections against everything you can. Just keep in mind you need to pull your tax clearance to prove you aren't a tax delinquent; if you aren't, you're exempt from most of those court fees.

Exactly, because they’re getting paid for it, they've got the expertise, and they have the full authority to dive into the actual specifics of the case files.

Daniel Martinez9, regarding that case of yours—if I were to write a half-page just on that, I’d probably lose my breath! You might be able to get a waiver on the appeal costs if you meet certain criteria, provided you have the right documentation and everything—so basically, you can't just file an appeal and assume it's a free pass. It’s not quite that simple. As for this idea of paying back the principal in installments... well, I honestly wouldn't even comment on that part. Whether the creditor actually agrees to a payment plan is entirely up to their goodwill. And even then, we're just talking about the principal itself. What happens to the interest, the attorney fees, or the court costs? I truly don't follow your logic here. Even if they *did* grant you a payment plan, you'd still be on the hook for everything required by law, right? If you showed up to a hearing with arguments like those, I—to put it mildly—would absolutely "bury" you at the hearing, and I might even charge you extra just for showing up! From my experience, simply filing an appeal will trigger additional expenses—things you seem to be overlooking—like the cost of the appeal itself plus the costs for one or more hearings for the creditor. They are perfectly entitled to collect all of that if your appeal lacks merit; the only way out is if you are waived from the costs of the appeal. Personally, I don't offer anyone a payment plan once I've already initiated the collection process—unless they reach out proactively after receiving a warning. For those who just complain for the sake of complaining and bring up nonsense? There is absolutely no room for negotiation there; they're just creating more work and dragging out the legal process. That's just the perspective of a debt collection agency 🙂, so sorry if that sounds a bit blunt. This is why I have the reputation I have 🙂

Daniel Martinez9 said:No, no, no, no, no. Once again... no, no, no, no, no, no, no. (Check John Clark6's post)

Look at the date on the front page showing when it was filed. That’s the official date and year. People mess up the year all the time. The front page needs to have a stamp with the date next to or above the "FILED" notation.
YOU MUST FILE AN OBJECTION
If it was filed before July 5th, 2011, you’re still stuck with some attorney and public notary fees (though not all of them). I wrote up a guide for filing objections here.
If it was filed after that, just write one sentence stating the debt was already paid, contest the entire collection order, and attach a copy of the payment receipt.
The only thing I'm unsure about is if it was filed exactly on July 5th, 2011. Maybe someone more experienced who dealt with that can chime in.

The collection proposal doesn't have a date; instead, it says CNN is seeking the debt $83 plus interest up to June 28, 2011, and includes an extract from the accounting books dated June 28.
We paid on July 5, 2011, and the collection order was written on July 15.
The collection order was sent on August 18, 2011, and picked up at the post office on August 22, 2011.

Objection written on August 23, 2011, and sent via certified mail.
Finally found the documents and the postal receipt at home.
In the objection, we state we paid, include a copy of the payment, and I'll argue that I can only pay the interest from June 23 to July 5, and that we shouldn't have to pay the collection costs.
I am requesting that the collection proceedings be stayed.

Never received a call from the court. Tomorrow I'm emailing them the objection with scanned copies of everything, demanding they stay the collection.
I'm also going to demand proof that they forwarded the objection to the court.
Is there any chance they will stay the collection? Or should I ask for the payment info, pay it, and then sue the court for a counter-claim?
Has anyone actually succeeded with this?

Eric Fowler19 said:The collection proposal doesn't have a date; instead, it says CNN is seeking the debt $83 plus interest up to June 28, 2011, and includes an extract from the accounting books dated June 28.
We paid on July 5, 2011, and the collection order was written on July 15.
The collection order was sent on August 18, 2011, and picked up at the post office on August 22, 2011.

Objection written on August 23, 2011, and sent via certified mail.
Finally found the documents and the postal receipt at home.
In the objection, we state we paid, include a copy of the payment, and I'll argue that I can only pay the interest from June 23 to July 5, and that we shouldn't have to pay the collection costs.
I am requesting that the collection proceedings be stayed.

Never received a call from the court. Tomorrow I'm emailing them the objection with scanned copies of everything, demanding they stay the collection.
I'm also going to demand proof that they forwarded the objection to the court.
Is there any chance they will stay the collection? Or should I ask for the payment info, pay it, and then sue the court for a counter-claim?
Has anyone actually succeeded with this?

But wait, did you guys actually send over the payment slips to Baker McKenzie right after you settled things—you know, covering the principal, the interest, and their specific fees—because isn't that exactly what it said on that first notice they sent you?

See, part of those costs listed are stuff you definitely owe Baker McKenzie for, because they didn't just do all that work for fun, right? They were forced into it because you guys didn't settle up when CNN sent out those initial warnings.

vividraven26 said:But wait, did you guys actually send over the payment slips to Baker McKenzie right after you settled things—you know, covering the principal, the interest, and their specific fees—because isn't that exactly what it said on that first notice they sent you?

See, part of those costs listed are stuff you definitely owe Baker McKenzie for, because they didn't just do all that work for fun, right? They were forced into it because you guys didn't settle up when CNN sent out those initial warnings.

I sent it over to the network, but now I realize I should have sent it directly to the receiver's legal representative. That’s obviously Scalia. 🙂
It’s written that way on purpose. They want to make sure nobody knows exactly who to report this to. And what about that notary who's partnered up with Scalia?
I sent him a formal complaint about their lack of cooperation.
What kind of global scum are we dealing with here?
I’m filing an objection tomorrow. Everyone gets one.🙂

Here is a quick little guide for you 😁
So, you’ve just received a notice regarding a legal judgment or debt collection. First—and I mean this figuratively, since it isn't technically the first step—grab your calendar and count out eight days starting from the day after you received the notice. Make sure you mark that eighth day clearly; if that day happens to fall on a weekend or a federal holiday, just skip ahead to the next business day and keep that date in mind.
Once you have that specific deadline noted, take a close look at the judgment itself, because you really only have two paths forward depending on whether you actually owe the money or not.
1. If you believe the debt isn't yours (for instance, if you have proof that you already paid, they charged you for a fee that shouldn't exist, or the statute of limitations has passed), you'll need to file an Objection. There isn't a strict template you have to follow, but you must clearly explain why you aren't liable. You should submit four identical, signed copies of this objection either in person or via mail to the notary public who delivered the notice, and you absolutely must do this by that deadline we calculated earlier. From there, the matter moves to the court system, where you'll get your chance to present the evidence proving the claim is baseless.
2. If you actually owe the debt, check to see if the creditor is being represented by an attorney or a law firm. If they aren't using legal counsel, you simply pay the debt plus the service fees listed on the back of the document, making the payment directly to the creditor rather than the notary.
However, if an attorney or a law firm is representing the creditor, flip the page over to look at the costs, because there are two different scenarios here.
a)If the listed costs only include the notary's fee, the delivery charge, the certification fee, and the attorney's fee for drafting the initial filing, then just give the attorney a call. Ask them how and where you can settle the debt along with those specific costs, and then go ahead and pay them.
b)On the other hand, if the charges include all of those items plus additional fees for things like obtaining extra certifications or serving the final judgment—basically extra administrative stuff related to the finalized order—then be careful. If it's just the single certification fee mentioned before, don't sweat the small stuff over $10, but if there are other extra charges, follow this: pay only the basic costs I described in option A (excluding that one certification fee). Once that's settled, write up an Objection stating that while you have paid the principal debt, you are contesting the additional fees under section B because those specific costs were never actually incurred, and hand four copies of that to the notary.
Everything I've laid out here needs to be handled by that specific deadline you marked on your calendar.
Best,