Discipline: What is it, really?

Wikipedia says:

In its most traditional sense, discipline refers to the systematic instruction provided to disciples, training them as students in a specific craft or trade, or teaching them to adhere to a particular code of conduct or an established "order."

There are all sorts of different methods of discipline out there, but the one I’ve really been pondering lately is self-discipline.

Self-discipline can be defined as the ability to motivate oneself even when you're dealing with a negative emotional state. It’s usually linked to qualities like sheer willpower, a strong work ethic, and steady persistence.

So, by definition, self-discipline is essentially a capability—something deeply intertwined with motivation.
What I’m truly curious about, though, is how one actually develops this internally when you don't have that external structure or discipline imposed by others to lean on throughout life. Is it even possible to cultivate that kind of inner strength from scratch, and just how much raw motivation does it take to make it stick?

brightridge59 said:Wikipedia says:

In its most traditional sense, discipline refers to the systematic instruction provided to disciples, training them as students in a specific craft or trade, or teaching them to adhere to a particular code of conduct or an established "order."

There are all sorts of different methods of discipline out there, but the one I’ve really been pondering lately is self-discipline.

Self-discipline can be defined as the ability to motivate oneself even when you're dealing with a negative emotional state. It’s usually linked to qualities like sheer willpower, a strong work ethic, and steady persistence.

So, by definition, self-discipline is essentially a capability—something deeply intertwined with motivation.
What I’m truly curious about, though, is how one actually develops this internally when you don't have that external structure or discipline imposed by others to lean on throughout life. Is it even possible to cultivate that kind of inner strength from scratch, and just how much raw motivation does it take to make it stick?

Self-discipline is doable, sure, but it happens pretty rarely because humans are naturally passive creatures at heart.

Behind every successful person, there's usually some kind of mentor or coach standing there.
And if you look closely, discipline is the defining trait of anyone who makes it.

There’s already a thread about life coaches... people seem to have this weird grudge against them for some reason. But why is that? A football coach isn't looked at that way, even though they’re doing the exact same thing—training someone.

And based on the definition you provided, discipline practically requires a teacher, a coach, or a mentor. Whatever you want to call them.

brightridge59 said:Wikipedia says:

In its most traditional sense, discipline refers to the systematic instruction provided to disciples, training them as students in a specific craft or trade, or teaching them to adhere to a particular code of conduct or an established "order."

There are all sorts of different methods of discipline out there, but the one I’ve really been pondering lately is self-discipline.

Self-discipline can be defined as the ability to motivate oneself even when you're dealing with a negative emotional state. It’s usually linked to qualities like sheer willpower, a strong work ethic, and steady persistence.

So, by definition, self-discipline is essentially a capability—something deeply intertwined with motivation.
What I’m truly curious about, though, is how one actually develops this internally when you don't have that external structure or discipline imposed by others to lean on throughout life. Is it even possible to cultivate that kind of inner strength from scratch, and just how much raw motivation does it take to make it stick?

Forget about motivation, because once you start overthinking it, you won't get anything done at all.

Self-discipline is just the ability to do the things you really don't feel like doing.
To put it simply... when you want to do something, you have motivation, but when you don't, you need discipline. 😁
Practice saying "no" to yourself. 🤷

Harold Ramos4 said:Self-discipline is doable, sure, but it happens pretty rarely because humans are naturally passive creatures at heart.

Behind every successful person, there's usually some kind of mentor or coach standing there.
And if you look closely, discipline is the defining trait of anyone who makes it.

There’s already a thread about life coaches... people seem to have this weird grudge against them for some reason. But why is that? A football coach isn't looked at that way, even though they’re doing the exact same thing—training someone.

And based on the definition you provided, discipline practically requires a teacher, a coach, or a mentor. Whatever you want to call them.

You think so? 😁
Just look at any single day in your life; isn't it basically just a series of tasks you complete because you've built up some level of discipline? Otherwise, you'd just spend forever procrastinating on everything you need to get done because you just can't be bothered.

Quincy:

...And by the definition you just gave, discipline requires a teacher, a coach, or a mentor (whatever you want to call them).

I wouldn't say that; you can definitely figure it out on your own.

Harold Ramos4 said:Self-discipline is doable, sure, but it happens pretty rarely because humans are naturally passive creatures at heart.

Behind every successful person, there's usually some kind of mentor or coach standing there.
And if you look closely, discipline is the defining trait of anyone who makes it.

There’s already a thread about life coaches... people seem to have this weird grudge against them for some reason. But why is that? A football coach isn't looked at that way, even though they’re doing the exact same thing—training someone.

And based on the definition you provided, discipline practically requires a teacher, a coach, or a mentor. Whatever you want to call them.

She said it. 😁

I can't help but wonder why just discipline would necessitate someone else's involvement. On a side note, I have absolutely zero interest in life coaching; honestly, it feels like overpriced nonsense marketed toward superficial people who simply don't know where else to dump their cash. I certainly do. 😁

Sandra Parker3 said:Forget about motivation, because once you start overthinking it, you won't get anything done at all.

Self-discipline is just the ability to do the things you really don't feel like doing.
To put it simply... when you want to do something, you have motivation, but when you don't, you need discipline. 😁
Practice saying "no" to yourself. 🤷

You think so? 😁
Just look at any single day in your life; isn't it basically just a series of tasks you complete because you've built up some level of discipline? Otherwise, you'd just spend forever procrastinating on everything you need to get done because you just can't be bothered.

Quincy:

...And by the definition you just gave, discipline requires a teacher, a coach, or a mentor (whatever you want to call them).

I wouldn't say that; you can definitely figure it out on your own.

But then how else can any real change be achieved if not through motivation?

Quincy:

self-discipline is basically the ability to go ahead and do the things you really don't feel like doing. To put it simply... when you want to do something, you have motivation, but when you don't, you rely on self-discipline.😁

The thing is, there are usually several waypoints between the starting line and the finish line. Points D, E, and F might be quite pleasant, but points A, B, and C can be pretty grueling. 😁

My ultimate goal is still a long way off from where I am now, and there are quite a few uncomfortable steps in between. I wonder if those pleasant milestones down the road can serve as enough motivation to push through these unpleasant ones? 😁

Quincy:

practice self-denial.🤷

Piece of cake, right? 😬
Quincy:

Just take a look at a typical day of yours—isn't it made up of a whole string of activities you perform simply because you've developed discipline? Otherwise, you'd spend forever procrastinating on everything you need to do because you just didn't feel like it.

That's just muscle memory and habit, not true self-discipline. 😁

Sandra Parker3 said:Forget about motivation, because once you start overthinking it, you won't get anything done at all.

Self-discipline is just the ability to do the things you really don't feel like doing.
To put it simply... when you want to do something, you have motivation, but when you don't, you need discipline. 😁
Practice saying "no" to yourself. 🤷

You think so? 😁
Just look at any single day in your life; isn't it basically just a series of tasks you complete because you've built up some level of discipline? Otherwise, you'd just spend forever procrastinating on everything you need to get done because you just can't be bothered.

Quincy:

...And by the definition you just gave, discipline requires a teacher, a coach, or a mentor (whatever you want to call them).

I wouldn't say that; you can definitely figure it out on your own.

But what if a person is wired that way—literally incapable of functioning when it comes to almost anything they actually need to get done?

brightridge59 said:She said it. 😁

I can't help but wonder why just discipline would necessitate someone else's involvement. On a side note, I have absolutely zero interest in life coaching; honestly, it feels like overpriced nonsense marketed toward superficial people who simply don't know where else to dump their cash. I certainly do. 😁

But then how else can any real change be achieved if not through motivation?

Quincy:

self-discipline is basically the ability to go ahead and do the things you really don't feel like doing. To put it simply... when you want to do something, you have motivation, but when you don't, you rely on self-discipline.😁

The thing is, there are usually several waypoints between the starting line and the finish line. Points D, E, and F might be quite pleasant, but points A, B, and C can be pretty grueling. 😁

My ultimate goal is still a long way off from where I am now, and there are quite a few uncomfortable steps in between. I wonder if those pleasant milestones down the road can serve as enough motivation to push through these unpleasant ones? 😁

Quincy:

practice self-denial.🤷

Piece of cake, right? 😬
Quincy:

Just take a look at a typical day of yours—isn't it made up of a whole string of activities you perform simply because you've developed discipline? Otherwise, you'd spend forever procrastinating on everything you need to do because you just didn't feel like it.

That's just muscle memory and habit, not true self-discipline. 😁

Isn't that basically what discipline is?
Training yourself until you can just do things on autopilot, I guess. 🤷

@placidwolf27 if that's the case, he's probably hopeless. 🤣

placidwolf27 said:But what if a person is wired that way—literally incapable of functioning when it comes to almost anything they actually need to get done?

I don't know, it's pretty damn bad, because you either screw something up, stay constantly miserable, or...
you end up with some massive deficit in life since it's nearly impossible to function in any community like that.
You have to break the cycle... just stop doing it every single time you feel like putting things off without having a vague idea of when that "tomorrow" is actually going to happen.
Unless, of course, you're just lying to yourself thinking it's fine. 😁

Sandra Parker3 said:Denial isn't exactly a pleasant way to start, though I suppose you can rationalize it if that helps you cope until the habit finally sticks, 🤣

I feel like my ability to rationalize things has been slipping lately. 🤣

Not really; it’s much easier to just sit around and lament about having poor motivation ☕

That’s true. Especially with this massive blizzard dumping snow all over the neighborhood right now. 😬

If you repeat an action enough times, yes, it shifts into autopilot, and at that point, it doesn't have much to do with discipline, which is usually tied to willpower and conscious effort.

Most of our daily routines are just repetitions of habits we picked up when we were kids, or things that didn't require much mental struggle to become second nature.

That is why I was asking how one actually disciplines themselves to tackle those tasks that weren't part of our upbringing or forced upon us by our parents growing up. 😁

You just... had to start doing something that wasn't particularly enjoyable in order for it to become automatic. And it would never have become a habit if there wasn't a foundation—and goodness knows, that foundation isn't motivation, it's self-discipline. 😁

But doesn't motivation drive every decision to practice self-discipline? Take getting out of bed in the morning to head into the office when you absolutely don't feel like it; you need discipline to move, but the motivation behind it is the paycheck that covers your bills. 😁

No, that was more of a commentary on how rare self-discipline actually is.
It's not that it's rare, it's just that sometimes we don't perceive it that way because we don't have any breathing room to hesitate—we simply do what has to be done.

I see your point. You also mentioned that you "would otherwise procrastinate..." But what if someone is just naturally the type of person who procrastinates...? 😁

brightridge59 said:I feel like my ability to rationalize things has been slipping lately. 🤣

Not really; it’s much easier to just sit around and lament about having poor motivation ☕

That’s true. Especially with this massive blizzard dumping snow all over the neighborhood right now. 😬

If you repeat an action enough times, yes, it shifts into autopilot, and at that point, it doesn't have much to do with discipline, which is usually tied to willpower and conscious effort.

Most of our daily routines are just repetitions of habits we picked up when we were kids, or things that didn't require much mental struggle to become second nature.

That is why I was asking how one actually disciplines themselves to tackle those tasks that weren't part of our upbringing or forced upon us by our parents growing up. 😁

You just... had to start doing something that wasn't particularly enjoyable in order for it to become automatic. And it would never have become a habit if there wasn't a foundation—and goodness knows, that foundation isn't motivation, it's self-discipline. 😁

But doesn't motivation drive every decision to practice self-discipline? Take getting out of bed in the morning to head into the office when you absolutely don't feel like it; you need discipline to move, but the motivation behind it is the paycheck that covers your bills. 😁

No, that was more of a commentary on how rare self-discipline actually is.
It's not that it's rare, it's just that sometimes we don't perceive it that way because we don't have any breathing room to hesitate—we simply do what has to be done.

I see your point. You also mentioned that you "would otherwise procrastinate..." But what if someone is just naturally the type of person who procrastinates...? 😁

no. 1

Quincy:

That’s why I asked how you actually discipline yourself to do things that weren't part of your upbringing or just forced on you growing up. 😁

Well, maybe through rationalization. Like, what happens if I don't do this or that? Which is worse—forcing myself to do it, or just dealing with the fallout later?
Quincy:

Doesn't motivation drive every decision for self-discipline? To get out of bed and head to work when you really don't want to requires discipline. But behind that is motivation—the money that pays your bills. 😁

Motivation is basically just consequences (which is clearly a pretty terrible way to live). It's more like rationalization -> forcing yourself -> results.
Money, dammit, only becomes important once it's already gone.

I get it. You also mentioned that "otherwise you would procrastinate..." What if you're someone who always procrastinates....? 😁

That's me.
I basically ignore a fire until my shoe is literally on fire—hoping maybe it'll just go out on its own—and only then do I actually move.
My way isn't great; honestly, it's just enough to keep my head above water, and frankly, screw that.
How do you actually manage to swim toward the shore? I have no clue.
Is that even possible?
Man, now it feels like I was having this exact same internal debate ages ago.

brightridge59 said:I feel like my ability to rationalize things has been slipping lately. 🤣

Not really; it’s much easier to just sit around and lament about having poor motivation ☕

That’s true. Especially with this massive blizzard dumping snow all over the neighborhood right now. 😬

If you repeat an action enough times, yes, it shifts into autopilot, and at that point, it doesn't have much to do with discipline, which is usually tied to willpower and conscious effort.

Most of our daily routines are just repetitions of habits we picked up when we were kids, or things that didn't require much mental struggle to become second nature.

That is why I was asking how one actually disciplines themselves to tackle those tasks that weren't part of our upbringing or forced upon us by our parents growing up. 😁

You just... had to start doing something that wasn't particularly enjoyable in order for it to become automatic. And it would never have become a habit if there wasn't a foundation—and goodness knows, that foundation isn't motivation, it's self-discipline. 😁

But doesn't motivation drive every decision to practice self-discipline? Take getting out of bed in the morning to head into the office when you absolutely don't feel like it; you need discipline to move, but the motivation behind it is the paycheck that covers your bills. 😁

No, that was more of a commentary on how rare self-discipline actually is.
It's not that it's rare, it's just that sometimes we don't perceive it that way because we don't have any breathing room to hesitate—we simply do what has to be done.

I see your point. You also mentioned that you "would otherwise procrastinate..." But what if someone is just naturally the type of person who procrastinates...? 😁

Man, some of those early years were just training, I guess; like, even when I'm making dinner every night, I still get this nagging feeling that I'm missing out on something better or more meaningful.🙄

Quincy:

That’s why I asked how we can actually build discipline for the things that weren't forced on us by our parents or our upbringing. 😁

Maybe try a similar approach—you know, set a goal for yourself and then... implement a reward or a penalty if you fail.

Quincy:

Doesn't motivation drive every decision to be disciplined? You need discipline to drag yourself out of bed for work when you don't feel like it, but the motivation is the paycheck that covers your bills. 😁

There's always a motive, which is why I think the whole concept of "motivation" feels a bit overused.
If you view lack of discipline as just another habit, then willpower is really all you have; motivation is just there to act as a little extra support. 🤷
Personally, I still prefer not to overthink it—just do the thing and worry about the reward later, because if I start looking for a "reason why," I'll just end up finding a hundred reasons why I shouldn't.
It seems simple enough. 😁

Quincy:

I get it. But you also mentioned that you would "otherwise procrastinate..." What if you're just someone who procrastinates by nature...? 😁

Well, people are just different; it really depends on whether it bothers you or the people around you, and once it starts causing problems, you either change your ways or you start losing things.

George Carlin really does have this incredible way of breaking everything down so simply and making it all make sense...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCDxvVRGias

brightridge59 said:She said it. 😁

I can't help but wonder why just discipline would necessitate someone else's involvement. On a side note, I have absolutely zero interest in life coaching; honestly, it feels like overpriced nonsense marketed toward superficial people who simply don't know where else to dump their cash. I certainly do. 😁

But then how else can any real change be achieved if not through motivation?

Quincy:

self-discipline is basically the ability to go ahead and do the things you really don't feel like doing. To put it simply... when you want to do something, you have motivation, but when you don't, you rely on self-discipline.😁

The thing is, there are usually several waypoints between the starting line and the finish line. Points D, E, and F might be quite pleasant, but points A, B, and C can be pretty grueling. 😁

My ultimate goal is still a long way off from where I am now, and there are quite a few uncomfortable steps in between. I wonder if those pleasant milestones down the road can serve as enough motivation to push through these unpleasant ones? 😁

Quincy:

practice self-denial.🤷

Piece of cake, right? 😬
Quincy:

Just take a look at a typical day of yours—isn't it made up of a whole string of activities you perform simply because you've developed discipline? Otherwise, you'd spend forever procrastinating on everything you need to do because you just didn't feel like it.

That's just muscle memory and habit, not true self-discipline. 😁

threats and penalties are probably the best motivation there is

I mean, if your life were actually on the line, you'd get stuff done, whether you wanted to or not.

Or maybe, if you're lucky, you just do things for yourself... for some sense of comfort or looking good.
Like brushing your teeth for more than three minutes.
Losing weight.
Cleaning the house.

I suppose that works for some people. 🤷

brightridge59 said:Wikipedia says:

In its most traditional sense, discipline refers to the systematic instruction provided to disciples, training them as students in a specific craft or trade, or teaching them to adhere to a particular code of conduct or an established "order."

There are all sorts of different methods of discipline out there, but the one I’ve really been pondering lately is self-discipline.

Self-discipline can be defined as the ability to motivate oneself even when you're dealing with a negative emotional state. It’s usually linked to qualities like sheer willpower, a strong work ethic, and steady persistence.

So, by definition, self-discipline is essentially a capability—something deeply intertwined with motivation.
What I’m truly curious about, though, is how one actually develops this internally when you don't have that external structure or discipline imposed by others to lean on throughout life. Is it even possible to cultivate that kind of inner strength from scratch, and just how much raw motivation does it take to make it stick?

Self-discipline can also feel like a cage. I made plenty of stupid mistakes in my life simply because I lacked discipline. Eventually, those very mistakes became the best motivation I ever had to step up and build something for myself. As for everyone else, they are just a part of what constitutes ME.