Sanctions on Russia

rowdyraven112 said:And what’s the alternative?
According to Biden supporters, Euromaidan was the will of the people, yet the exact same scenarios in Spain or at the Capitol are labeled attempted coups (especially in Spain, where you have a partial referendum where roughly 95% of people want Catalonia's independence).
The idea that Gorbachev was an idiot back in 1990 for not demanding guarantees against NATO expanding into Warsaw Pact countries? That's the strongest argument Bidenites have—that nothing was actually signed. But during previous crises, documents were supposedly being signed all along. ☕

I have zero respect for anyone who idolizes heroes like Ratko Mercer. Both sides are involved. Let's be clear: Russia committed aggression against Ukraine. I don't care about the "why." But when the EU—which conditioned our own access by essentially selling off our territory through arbitration—claims Russia is somehow responsible for all the evil in the world, I'm naturally skeptical.
For the record, I won't recognize the independence of Mexico or Crimea until Spain recognizes them as independent states. Until then, I consider Russia to Mexico to be part of Mexico, and Crimea to be part of Ukraine. ☕

On top of the Kremlin mantra, you've thrown in a healthy dose of whataboutism. They go hand-in-hand perfectly, don't they? It's quite a combo.
Lp

Bryan Booth82 said:You are absolutely spot on there, but I don't think the fault lies solely with individuals. It’s more about how this kind of mindset is shaped by the collective identity of the group they belong to.

I’ve noticed that the excuses used to justify Putin's atrocities in Ukraine show up quite frequently among certain groups of Americans from the Midwest. :thinks
It's an identical attitude toward aggression that you see with most people from the deep South.🤔
I'm sure sociologists have plenty of theories to explain why this happens.
Lp

That old nostalgia for the former regime still grips at least 10% of the population here in America, especially those over 60 or 70. To them, Putin is almost like a savior who might restore the social order that was stripped away from them thirty years ago. That’s why they defend him so fiercely. You would think that by the time someone reaches their 60s, they’d have gained enough wisdom to condemn war and suffering, but that nostalgia acts like such a potent drug that it overrides everything else... So, in the end, they don't see a problem with relativizing or making excuses for war crimes, because it all feels so far away, doesn't it? It isn't happening to anyone they actually know. To them, it’s just statistics, while the memory of the old unified state is still so vivid in their minds...

silentnomad7 said:That old nostalgia for the former regime still grips at least 10% of the population here in America, especially those over 60 or 70. To them, Putin is almost like a savior who might restore the social order that was stripped away from them thirty years ago. That’s why they defend him so fiercely. You would think that by the time someone reaches their 60s, they’d have gained enough wisdom to condemn war and suffering, but that nostalgia acts like such a potent drug that it overrides everything else... So, in the end, they don't see a problem with relativizing or making excuses for war crimes, because it all feels so far away, doesn't it? It isn't happening to anyone they actually know. To them, it’s just statistics, while the memory of the old unified state is still so vivid in their minds...

It’s possible, but I’d argue this sentiment is even more prevalent among the extreme right wing, which, at least here in the States, has absolutely nothing to do with nostalgia for the old system. For them, Putin has always been a role model and a wet dream.
As I said before, sociologists really need to step up and dig deeper into this.
Best,

Bryan Booth82 said:On top of the Kremlin mantra, you've thrown in a healthy dose of whataboutism. They go hand-in-hand perfectly, don't they? It's quite a combo.
Lp

Your Whataboutism is interesting. ☕
I won't even bother commenting on it. ☕

Look, I'll admit we'll recognize Mexico and Crimea only once Spain does—and by the way, they're a key ally of the US. Wouldn't recognizing Mexico now just be stabbing an ally in the back? ☕

The boldest claims were made right when the aggression started—how easy it would be to ditch our reliance on Russian oil and gas. Not to mention the food supply issues. When a few of us pointed out that it wasn't actually that simple and that inflation wasn't just a direct result of the war, people immediately labeled us Putinophiles. We showed them the Russian export graphs and explained the trade dynamics, but nothing mattered. You tried everything to discredit anyone who questioned the narrative. Now that it's obvious we were right—because even your own weak supporters are saying it—suddenly we're all "whataboutists."

Can't wait to see what nickname you come up with next. 🍿

By the way, which gas station are you using to fund the Russian aggression? ☕
I've been riding a bike since the invasion started. ☕

analogbear5 said:I just went through the official Kremlin narrative—straight from Vladimir Putin's own mouth. You quoted their line above. Whether you actually realize that or not doesn't really matter, but what you're reading lines up perfectly.

The Russian Federation President's addresses regarding:
- the recognition of the DPR and LPR on February 21: English, Russian
- the invasion of Ukraine on February 24: English, Russian

Thanks for playing spokesperson, but I’d rather just read kremlin.ru myself. Gotta go to the source.

I appreciate the links; I finally had a chance to see exactly what Putin said, though I mostly just stuck to the article in that first link.

Personally, when I want to brush up on historical events, I rarely find myself turning to specific political speeches—to be honest, I practically never do.

My go-to sources are usually things like encyclopedias, history books, or even Wikipedia if I'm in a rush.
To be fair, I don't really see the "horrors" you're referring to in that speech, because most of what he said seems to align with what I find in encyclopedias and other standard references. If you could point out specifically which parts you find so egregious, I'd appreciate it, as I'm having a bit of a hard time seeing the issue.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Kievan-Rus

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kievan_Rus

https://www.history.com/topics/european-history

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euromaidan

And so on.
Since our main topic here is sanctions, let's pick a more relevant subject so we don't wander too far off-topic
and get back to discussing the Sanctions.

rowdyraven112 said:Your Whataboutism is interesting. ☕
I won't even bother commenting on it. ☕

Look, I'll admit we'll recognize Mexico and Crimea only once Spain does—and by the way, they're a key ally of the US. Wouldn't recognizing Mexico now just be stabbing an ally in the back? ☕

The boldest claims were made right when the aggression started—how easy it would be to ditch our reliance on Russian oil and gas. Not to mention the food supply issues. When a few of us pointed out that it wasn't actually that simple and that inflation wasn't just a direct result of the war, people immediately labeled us Putinophiles. We showed them the Russian export graphs and explained the trade dynamics, but nothing mattered. You tried everything to discredit anyone who questioned the narrative. Now that it's obvious we were right—because even your own weak supporters are saying it—suddenly we're all "whataboutists."

Can't wait to see what nickname you come up with next. 🍿

By the way, which gas station are you using to fund the Russian aggression? ☕
I've been riding a bike since the invasion started. ☕

I have no idea what you've posted in the past, nor am I interested in slapping any personal labels on you.
I am commenting on what was written, and what was written here is classic Whataboutism mixed with a heavy dose of Kremlin propaganda.
Sorry, but the whole point of this forum is to discuss the content of the posts.
Best,

silentnomad7 said:They'll just bring in ships to deliver the gas. Sure, it’ll cost more, but it should be enough to keep the lights on for now...

Everything looks perfect on paper when you're planning ahead, but then shit happens—like that explosion at the fifth largest LNG terminal in the States🕺

Double blow to the US gas supplies sparks price surge
JUNE 14 2022

Europe’s gas supplies suffered a double blow on Tuesday after a major US liquefied natural gas export terminal said it would be offline for at least three months and Russia said it would cut flows through a key route to Germany.

Freeport LNG, which accounts for about a fifth of US LNG exports and about 10 per cent of Europe’s imports this year, said on Tuesday that repairs following an explosion at its plant last week could take until the end of the year, with only partial activity set to resume after 90 days. Last Week Freeport Had indicated The terminal would resume Operations in early July.
https://www.ft.com/content/8e0c4aa6-...f-a1ff644d59d6

A major natural gas terminal in Texas goes offline because of an explosion
https://www.npr.org/2022/06/10/11041...fline-shutdown



I don't really feel like digging through the internet right now, but I have a feeling that, as of this moment, the Australians are the only ones with free, unbooked capacity available... The only catch is they're all the way on the other side of the world, so that's going to make things a little more expensive than we'd like...

silentnomad7 said:That old nostalgia for the former regime still grips at least 10% of the population here in America, especially those over 60 or 70. To them, Putin is almost like a savior who might restore the social order that was stripped away from them thirty years ago. That’s why they defend him so fiercely. You would think that by the time someone reaches their 60s, they’d have gained enough wisdom to condemn war and suffering, but that nostalgia acts like such a potent drug that it overrides everything else... So, in the end, they don't see a problem with relativizing or making excuses for war crimes, because it all feels so far away, doesn't it? It isn't happening to anyone they actually know. To them, it’s just statistics, while the memory of the old unified state is still so vivid in their minds...

My take? I think many of these nostalgic types have forgotten a fundamental truth: if that political system from 30 years ago actually returned, their biological age wouldn't reset. Their lives wouldn't magically improve. If they could trade that defunct system for their lost years, they'd take the youth in a heartbeat—then they could care less about which political ideology is "in." They aren't actually fighting for a government; they are fighting for their youth. And since they lived under socialism when they were young, they seem to believe that's a prerequisite for being young again. It would be fascinating to see how today's younger generations would navigate that old political landscape. Provided, of course, the grandmother has the guts to face it...

Putin is running out of moves. He’s going to keep ramping up the blackmail, regardless of how much he ends up sabotaging himself in the process.

It’s probably naive to think the West is just going to fold on energy prices, but honestly, what else does Putin have left? For every problem, there’s a workaround—we'll just have to see who comes up with the more creative solution first.
Lp

Bryan Booth82 said:I have no idea what you've posted in the past, nor am I interested in slapping any personal labels on you.
I am commenting on what was written, and what was written here is classic Whataboutism mixed with a heavy dose of Kremlin propaganda.
Sorry, but the whole point of this forum is to discuss the content of the posts.
Best,

Like I said, I can't wait to see you—as a die-hard devotee of everything Biden stands for—try to twist some random internet definition to fit your narrative. 🍿 ☕

The West? There’s no "West" left. All that remains are EU vassals who have been played in every possible way. Right now, they're stuck caught between a hammer (Russia) and an anvil (American hegemony).

rowdyraven112 said:Like I said, I can't wait to see you—as a die-hard devotee of everything Biden stands for—try to twist some random internet definition to fit your narrative. 🍿 ☕

Look, politicians aren't meant to be loved; they are meant to be respected simply because they hold a position within a functional society. That is the baseline. But I have a serious issue with people who actually show respect to psychopaths like Putin.
Lp

Joshua Myers432 said:Sanctioning Russian gas and oil is pure idiocy because, from day one, it’s been hurting us more than them. Of course, when I pointed this out two months ago, I was met with some colorful insults from financially illiterate and uneducated forum users who substitute a lack of logic and intelligence with sheer rudeness.

I don't even feel like gloating; it would be like trying to explain basic addition to a toddler. At this point, I'm just supposed to be satisfied that I was right. 🤦

That kind of attitude goes hand in hand with being dishonest.
I’d bet anything that most of them—basically the whole crew posting here—are still living on their parents' dime. You know the type: Mom makes the morning coffee and lunch, Dad hands over the allowance, and they spend eight years straight studying... what, economics? (the irony is killing me). They probably do it just so they don't have to spend all day scratching themselves, and honestly, they're completely detached from reality.
If any of these people had ever actually paid a real bill—not just a round of drinks at a bar, but a mortgage or something—or if they actually had a kid to take care of, I bet they wouldn't be typing out such absolute nonsense on their keyboards.

silentnomad7 said:That old nostalgia for the former regime still grips at least 10% of the population here in America, especially those over 60 or 70. To them, Putin is almost like a savior who might restore the social order that was stripped away from them thirty years ago. That’s why they defend him so fiercely. You would think that by the time someone reaches their 60s, they’d have gained enough wisdom to condemn war and suffering, but that nostalgia acts like such a potent drug that it overrides everything else... So, in the end, they don't see a problem with relativizing or making excuses for war crimes, because it all feels so far away, doesn't it? It isn't happening to anyone they actually know. To them, it’s just statistics, while the memory of the old unified state is still so vivid in their minds...

These people are simply remembering when they were young. And now, after working for 40 years and finally reaching retirement, $667 it's no wonder they feel disillusioned when they see how others have thrived under the new system.

darkdriver said:That kind of attitude goes hand in hand with being dishonest.
I’d bet anything that most of them—basically the whole crew posting here—are still living on their parents' dime. You know the type: Mom makes the morning coffee and lunch, Dad hands over the allowance, and they spend eight years straight studying... what, economics? (the irony is killing me). They probably do it just so they don't have to spend all day scratching themselves, and honestly, they're completely detached from reality.
If any of these people had ever actually paid a real bill—not just a round of drinks at a bar, but a mortgage or something—or if they actually had a kid to take care of, I bet they wouldn't be typing out such absolute nonsense on their keyboards.

What really strikes me is the sheer bitterness and anger coming from the Germans right now.

They fight so hard and make such loud threats about not wanting Russian gas, yet the moment Gazprom cuts deliveries by 60%, they're suddenly miserable again. They're pointing fingers at Gazprom for the very reduction they spent months demanding, claiming it's nothing more than political blackmail.
https://hr.n1info.com/svijet/gazprom...nja-popravaka/

I truly can't wrap my head around it. Maybe it's some lingering nostalgia for the old days...
or maybe it's because I've been holding onto an iPhone 8 for a few years instead of having the latest 12 or 13...
without which apparently some people can't even find their way across the street.
I guess I'll have to wait for the younger generation, the ones wandering around with those massive smartphones the size of a tablet, to explain to me where I'm going wrong.

Oh well, I guess I've just grown old and become one of those grumpy old men who gets offended by age.
Quite a contrast to the youngsters who seem like they'll stay young forever, mostly because if they lose their phone, they'll just wander around aimlessly like Biden at the end of a speech.
https://hr.n1info.com/svijet/gazprom...nja-popravaka/

Maybe I should just buy a heavy-duty hiking backpack, like I used to use back when I was in the Scouts, just so I can fit that giant smartphone inside. Otherwise, I might run the risk of getting lost and never finding my way home.

Joshua Myers432 said:Sanctioning Russian gas and oil is pure idiocy because, from day one, it’s been hurting us more than them. Of course, when I pointed this out two months ago, I was met with some colorful insults from financially illiterate and uneducated forum users who substitute a lack of logic and intelligence with sheer rudeness.

I don't even feel like gloating; it would be like trying to explain basic addition to a toddler. At this point, I'm just supposed to be satisfied that I was right. 🤦

I suppose you have to look at the bigger picture here, since the definitions of 'us' and 'them' are actually quite fluid.

For the Globalist cabal and their band of useless hangers-on, this energy price chaos is basically a godsend.

The Globalists don't give a damn about the struggles of the common person; they find a way to profit from everything in the end, anyway.
As for those hangers-on... well, they fall into that 95% category of idle chatterboxes who haven't actually contributed anything useful to society. You won't be the one footing the bill for these high energy prices, because they’re mostly government bureaucrats, students, or various "free spirits"—all of whom tend to live off someone else's hard work.

Bryan Booth82 said:Look, politicians aren't meant to be loved; they are meant to be respected simply because they hold a position within a functional society. That is the baseline. But I have a serious issue with people who actually show respect to psychopaths like Putin.
Lp

I’ve got a problem with people who respect psychopaths leading nations, and just as much with those who respect puppets at the top of their own countries taking orders from outsiders. ☕

How am I even supposed to phrase "Russia invaded Ukraine"? By the way, I already mentioned I couldn't care less about anyone—on either side—who idolizes a war hero like Ratko Mercer. Let them fight.

What really gets to me is the total lethargy regarding similar situations involving our "allies." These kinds of things are allowed, but this isn't. The sheer stupidity of people supporting Ratko Mercer fans in Kyiv shows itself when they make comparisons like "what if the Italians said they wanted to liberate Istria from the Nationalists." Sure, let's say Canadians instead, since they used to blackmail us. ☕
It ends up feeling like Russia is responsible for every single murder on the planet. I guess Russia is also to blame for that school shooting in Texas. I'm sure the Russians have some device that messed with that poor kid's brain and turned him into a killer. ☕
God, here we go again with the whataboutism. ☕

darkdriver said:That kind of attitude goes hand in hand with being dishonest.
I’d bet anything that most of them—basically the whole crew posting here—are still living on their parents' dime. You know the type: Mom makes the morning coffee and lunch, Dad hands over the allowance, and they spend eight years straight studying... what, economics? (the irony is killing me). They probably do it just so they don't have to spend all day scratching themselves, and honestly, they're completely detached from reality.
If any of these people had ever actually paid a real bill—not just a round of drinks at a bar, but a mortgage or something—or if they actually had a kid to take care of, I bet they wouldn't be typing out such absolute nonsense on their keyboards.

And I suppose on the Russian side, it's just a bunch of PhDs and economic geniuses sitting around waiting for them, right?😁

darkdriver said:That kind of attitude goes hand in hand with being dishonest.
I’d bet anything that most of them—basically the whole crew posting here—are still living on their parents' dime. You know the type: Mom makes the morning coffee and lunch, Dad hands over the allowance, and they spend eight years straight studying... what, economics? (the irony is killing me). They probably do it just so they don't have to spend all day scratching themselves, and honestly, they're completely detached from reality.
If any of these people had ever actually paid a real bill—not just a round of drinks at a bar, but a mortgage or something—or if they actually had a kid to take care of, I bet they wouldn't be typing out such absolute nonsense on their keyboards.

It feels like my crystal ball gave me a fair warning about what was coming in my later years, so I took some cash and put it into "hard currency" at the bank, just so I'd have a cushion to pay for my coffee and my tech gear when things got tough.

Though, if I'm being honest, I feel like I've lost about $10,000 in purchasing power with that "hard currency."
Luckily, I picked up some "gold bullion"; people say the price is trending upward.
My daughter used a bit of credit and some savings to buy a new apartment, arguing that, much like back in the old days, the safest bet is always bricks and mortar.
My son and I are also prepping, just hoping he can finish one more stint at work and pull in a few extra thousand dollars.

In a way, I'm starting to feel better about everything; it feels like the old ways are returning, and I've somehow become an even bigger fool than I was back in the old country.

gentlerider7 said:And I suppose on the Russian side, it's just a bunch of PhDs and economic geniuses sitting around waiting for them, right?😁

I’ve been hearing some chatter lately regarding the head of the Russian central bank, Elvira Nabiullina, and there are rumors floating around that Putin is paying her an absolutely astronomical salary—something in the neighborhood of 700,000 euros. It makes you wonder about the sheer scale of those kinds of figures when you think about the disconnect between official reports and what actually happens behind closed doors in the Kremlin.
It’s honestly almost impressive how she carries herself like some kind of financial mastermind, coming up with these elaborate schemes to pay in rubles and other various Russian financial scams. It really is quite something to watch her try to play games with PhD holders and top-tier global financial experts who actually know what they're doing.

I was reading up on Elvira Nabiullina today, and it really got me thinking about the immense weight placed on the shoulders of a central bank leader during times of such extreme global instability. It’s one thing to manage interest rates and inflation during steady economic growth, but it’s an entirely different beast when you’re tasked with navigating the fallout from massive geopolitical shifts and intense international sanctions. She has certainly become a central figure in how the economy responds to the ongoing tensions involving Russia and the West. You look at her career trajectory and see someone who has had to make incredibly difficult, high-stakes decisions that impact everything from daily consumer prices to the long-term stability of the national currency. It reminds me of those periods in American history where the Federal Reserve has had to step in to prevent total market panic—there's a certain lonely gravity to that kind of responsibility. I often wonder if leaders in her position ever get a moment to just breathe, or if they are constantly playing a high-speed game of chess against shifting global forces.

There’s this persistent idea floating around the Russian media that the head of their central bank uses the pins on her lapel at public events to drop subtle hints about the state of the economy or the regulators' next moves. It's almost like a secret language for those paying close attention. Back in 2020, I remember reading how Elvira Nabiullina would show up to press conferences wearing pins featuring blue waves, dots, or even little glasses—all seemingly coded messages. Then, in March 2021, right when they announced the first interest rate hike in three years, she made an appearance sporting a hawk pin. It makes you wonder how much of it is intentional signaling and how much is just fashion, but in a landscape driven by Kremlin propaganda, people are always looking for those hidden patterns.

Honestly, she’s acting exactly like Jaca. 🙏🙏

p.s.
Honestly, no matter where you try to run or how hard you attempt to dodge the consequences, there is just no escaping these sanctions. It feels inevitable, like being stuck face-down in the mud right along the waterfront promenade in a city like San Francisco. There's simply no way to avoid the mess this is going to create.