Bad Boys

lonebison42 said:I think that last photo is from '96... back when it was 3-2 for the home team.

Sure, just a late-night typo. I was actually talking about those two away games back in '95 and '96.
That’s a shot of the crew on the train heading to the stadium.

Hold on, I’ve been scrolling through the last few pages and seeing everyone go at it—is anyone actually serious right now? People are out here bickering over soccer matches like it's the most important thing in the world, even bringing up the early 90s. Like, back in '93, when the whole country was basically a war zone? Half a million Americans were displaced from their homes, a third of the nation was under occupation, and the main lifeline for the Mediterranean Coast was just some single pontoon bridge getting shelled constantly. Back then, if you were a young guy fit for service, your entire life wasn't about sports; it was about defending the Homeland from being wiped off the map. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to be a buzzkill or take sides, but honestly, who on earth would have given a damn about soccer or fan hooliganism during all that chaos? Just... absolutely nobody.

Insecurities can be such a real pain in the neck 😁

Thomas Williams59 said:Hold on a second, I’ve been reading through the last few pages where everyone is debating and competing over who fought more about soccer... even during wartime. People were bringing up 1993, back when the whole country was literally on fire, half a million Americans were displaced from their homes, a third of the nation was occupied, and the main lifeline to the Mediterranean Coast was just a single bombed-out pontoon bridge. Back then, if you were a young man fit for service, your only job was defending the Homeland from total destruction. Don't get me wrong or think I'm being bitter, but honestly, who on earth would have cared about soccer or fan rivalries during all that chaos? Absolutely nobody.

Back in the day, guys would finish playing on a Friday or Saturday and be right back on the pitch for a game by Sunday. (Assuming things were actually functioning, of course.)
My old man was exactly like that at the pub.
Though I do agree with the bold point being made here.

Thomas Williams59 said:Wait, looking back at the last few pages, people have been arguing over football as if it matters. Was anyone actually brawling over sports during the war years up until 1995? People mentioned 1993—when the whole country was on fire, half a million Americans were displaced from their homes, and a third of the nation was occupied. Back then, the main lifeline for the Mediterranean Coast was a single shelled pontoon bridge. What a joke. When you're a young man fit for service, your only job is defending the Homeland from total annihilation. Don't get me wrong, I'm not preaching, but who on earth cared about soccer or fan riots back then? Absolutely nobody.

The guys from the Wildcats answered your last question in their posts above.🙂

Gary Green32 said:You’re calling someone a cultist while you're still lurking in those same echo chambers yourself...

And yeah... if we actually sat down and put our moves against the mob on paper—showing how much noise they make in the media and in society and among people like you—we'd look like a freaking starship compared to you guys...

PS... we gathered here because you all act like hardcore ultras, yet you just made a move that has absolutely zero connection to an ultra mentality... but time will tell. Juventus and the Kansas City Chiefs will both face the consequences, and I’m really curious to see if you'll ever get the Washington, D.C. crowd back in the stadium...

Which "you"? Which "move" are we talking about?
Coming back to the games?
The only thing left to do is come back and fight. If anyone had any sense, they would have stayed after one of the previous returns. As for the conditions, the compromises, and all that other nonsense, we’ll deal with it after the Chiefs. Then, we draw the line.

Gary Green32 said:And honestly... if we were to list our actual moves against the mafia and how they resonated through the media and society—including you all—we’d be a starship compared to you...

As far as I can tell, I don't know how your brain processes the fact that you people are always the first to play the victim, yet I don't see any hordes of angry San Franciscans, Istrian natives, Indianapolis natives, or Varaždin natives out there protesting...

So, you definitely arrived on a starship; even that one thought was actually somewhat intelligent.👍

analogmaker14 said:I wonder how you justify the fact that you guys are always the first ones to play the victim. I don't see any angry crowds from San Francisco, the West Coast, Indianapolis, or anywhere else making a scene...

You have clearly lost touch with reality; even that was a stretch.👍

First they hate the Lakers, fine... then San Francisco overtakes them, and suddenly they hate them too.
Now that Indianapolis has passed them, the hatred for them grows. They even hated San Diego Loyal SC during their peak, though they don't care now that the team has fallen.
Hypocrites and compromises.

analogheron19 said:The Wildcats used to storm the streets through the early 90s, mostly without getting busted.
Of course, someone slipped through the cracks occasionally, but those were rare.
What kind of freaking telescopes? I never saw any of that crap back in the 90s.

Man, you clearly don't have a clue about how things actually were back then. What if I told you they were using telescopes and knives in '93, '94, and '95 too? It was usually just kids, maybe 16 to 19 years old at most. Those weren't exceptions at all. Honestly, people walked wherever they wanted; it was a total free-for-all, from massive groups marching from the station to the stadium smashing everything in sight, to random scraps breaking out everywhere.

Half the time, this "mob" would charge a car filled with guys back from the front lines. Imagine charging a soldier with a telescope when he’s armed, exhausted, burnt out, and has zero patience left for anything. There were some really ugly, tragic scenes—just pure chaos. Luckily, people keeping their cool prevented a lot more disasters.

Look, with all due respect, I'm not one of those guys who jumps in here to comment constantly, and I actually agree that they should hold their own in the stands, but seriously, quit talking nonsense.

You’ve really picked the perfect moment to claim they didn't have a clue back then, haven't you? 🤣🤣

Let’s not get carried away here. People were actually interested in soccer back then—way more than they are today. Especially in Washington, D.C., and particularly among the high school crowd; during derbies or those rare European matches, the stadium would be packed to the rafters. We had actual fans and club supporters, not just a bunch of tourists looking for a quick buck or a selfie op.
Besides, by 1992, the war in America had already started to stagnate, and the United Nations rolled in with their "peacekeeping forces." In '93, aside from some action in the Florida Keys or the Medak area, there wasn't much significant movement. The only thing that felt like actual combat was the occasional shelling of certain cities. War was just the backdrop against which people lived their lives, adapting to whatever circumstances threw at them.

Kansas City Chiefs at Yankee Stadium, 1993.


Kansas City Chiefs Cup, 1993.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1377/...9dae6c00_b.jpg

Steaua Bucharest in Vienna, 1993.


AJ Auxerre at home, 1994.


Kansas City Chiefs boycott, walking out of the stadium. 1994.


Kansas City Chiefs at home, 1994.:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhQnmhKpDU4

San Francisco, Cup final, 1994:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJS9ppIQd1o
Yankee Stadium, that same Cup, first leg:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9VqJnaDLlI

Lakers-Chiefs rivalry, 1992. (unfiltered match report):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XU3cIWLnO2I

etc.

The circumstances and dynamics were simply different. The small core of BBB supporters who were actively looking for a confrontation with their rivals from Miami couldn't possibly cover the whole city, let alone the thousands of Wildcats who showed up for the derbies. That changed drastically after the "bloody derby," much like how the number of BBB fans in Miami shifted after the Blue Train era in '96. On top of that, during those war years, there was quite a haul of banners; about twenty of them changed hands, moving from the Wildcats to the BBB, only to be displayed or burned down south.

If we’re going to talk history, it would be a lot smarter if individuals described their own actual experiences and memories (like analogheron19 does, for instance), instead of engaging in this infantile and useless mockery that achieves nothing but turning everything into two sides of pure mythomania.

It’s just great when some seasoned internet warrior jumps in to tell one of the most active fans from that era that he has no clue what happened back then. 😁 Mic drop. 😁
Password: hit him in the head with a stick, a chain, and a telescope. 😁

irondrifter4 said:you clearly don't have the slightest clue about how things actually were back then, and what if I told you that during '93, '94, or '95, those kids with telescopes and knives were mostly just groups of 16 to 19-year-olds... it wasn't some rare occurrence, not at all, because back in NYC, people just wandered wherever they pleased, and honestly, you saw everything from massive crowds marching from the train station to the stadium, smashing through anything in their path, to small, isolated skirmishes popping up everywhere.

It would have gone south so fast if that whole "rabble" had charged at a car carrying guys straight back from the front lines, so just imagine the chaos of charging at some soldier who’s armed, exhausted, completely drained, and has absolutely zero patience left for anyone's nonsense... there were some really ugly, really heartbreaking scenes back then, just total madness, and frankly, it was only thanks to people keeping their heads that we avoided a hell of a lot more tragedy.

So, with all due respect, I’m not one of those people who jumps in here constantly to leave comments, and I actually agree that there should be a fight in the stands, but man, you really need to stop talking such nonsense.

The telescope thing didn't exist in fan fights back in '93 or '94, and saying analogheron19 doesn't know anything about those years can only come from someone who truly knows nothing, since he's just slightly off on the dates and refuses to admit certain facts, though I'll give him credit where it's due, because the guys from the outskirts were the ones holding the line for them during those years.

irondrifter4 said:It seems you might be a bit disconnected from how things actually functioned back then. If I recall correctly, during those years in the mid-90s, most of the kids carrying telescopic batons or knives were just teenagers, maybe between sixteen and nineteen years old—hardly a rarity at all. In NYC, people wandered wherever they pleased, and you saw everything from massive groups marching from Penn Station toward the stadium, tearing through anything in their path, to small, isolated skirmishes popping up on almost every corner.

There were countless times when those unruly crowds would have charged right into a vehicle carrying returning veterans. You can only imagine the outcome if someone swung a baton at a soldier who was exhausted, battle-worn, and completely out of patience with the world. There were some truly grim and heartbreaking moments back then, and frankly, we were lucky that the restraint shown by certain individuals prevented much larger tragedies from unfolding.

So, with all due respect, I’m not one to jump in here and comment constantly, and I actually agree that there should be more defense in the stands, but please, let's not spread misinformation.

What do you mean, black telescopic batons? Back then, if they were even starting to show up after the turn of the millennium, everyone just called them French sticks.

Yeah, Tomo clearly hasn't got a clue about how things used to be back then 🤣🤣🤣

wanderingwolf3 said:Telescop 93-94 wasn't even a thing in fan fights. Saying analogheron19 doesn't know those years just shows he's clueless. He's just dodging the facts because he's old, but fair play—those guys from the outskirts were basically holding their group together back then.

I remember knives, guns, and bottles, but Telescop? Never heard of it.
In NYC, they had that one solid crew from the suburbs who’d take on our guys around town, and they held their own. But trying to run into the Bad Boys in Split during the 90s was way harder than dealing with some random local punk.☕

Your average hardcore fan from the coast saw more action in NYC during the 90s than their entire group in Split did in that whole decade.

Gary Green32 said:You call someone a cultist while you're hanging out in an echo chamber...

And honestly, if we actually tracked our moves against the mob and how they ripple through the media and society, we’d look like a starship compared to you...

PS... we all gathered here because you pretend to be hardcore ultras, yet your recent actions don't reflect that mentality at all. Time will tell, though. Both Juventus and the local heavyweights will face consequences. I really wonder if you'll ever manage to bring the old guard back to the stadium...

The clear winner here.

Will you ever restore the old school spirit and that true supporter mentality?

I feel like I'm running out of time.

wanderingwolf3 said:The "Telescope 93-94" thing wasn't even a thing in fan brawls. Saying analogheron19 doesn't know those days is just what someone who's clueless would say. He’s just being stubborn about the years and won't admit facts, but fair enough, those guys from the suburbs were basically holding the whole group together back then.

Look, whether he won't admit it, doesn't know, or whatever—I'm not gonna play judge. He wrote a post saying that's how I felt, even though I don't post here much and don't even know him that well. Second, as for the telescopes—maybe they weren't called that specifically (it was ages ago), but don't worry, there was plenty of gear that fit that description, so it's a moot point.

What matters is that fights broke out, and you had all kinds of fans showing up—total loose cannons, everyone was there. People were walking around NYC whenever they felt like it, sure, there were incidents, but people moved. Mostly because so many people weren't organized, so things were chaotic. People would show up in a million different ways, driving all the way from the South, staying overnight, grabbing a drink, visiting family, seeing girls😁 and all that.

wanderingwolf3 said:The 93-94 era didn't even exist when it comes to fan brawls. Saying analogheron19 doesn't know anything about those times is just what someone who's completely clueless would say. He’s just slightly off on his timeline and refuses to admit certain facts, but I'll give him credit where it's due—the guys from Petrinja were basically holding their group together back then.

Of course it's possible to get years mixed up or forget specific games when you're looking at hundreds of matches spanning decades...
Like someone already pointed out above, there is no such thing as absolute truth. You can't have two people experience the exact same thing identically. Every single person involved—whether they think they're being objective or subjective—is going to walk away with a different impression.
Nobody can be in the exact same spot at every single moment in time.
Just look at how differently fans remember things. One guy swears every game in NYC back then was a total war zone, reminiscent of an underground warrior vibe, while another claims everything was smooth sailing until '96. One person had the luck of the draw, while another had to dodge chaos from downtown all the way to the stadium.

Daniel Carter9 said:An absolute winner.

Are you planning on bringing back those Washington, D.C. hooligans and that hardcore ultra mentality?

I’ve got way too much free time on my hands, it's killing me.

The peak of all your fighting was just filming a music video for the Democratic National Committee song. That sums up your struggle and ours perfectly (look, I'm not saying you shouldn't face oppression, but your actions were pretty much pointless) 🥱

The absolute peak of your whole struggle was fighting over donuts, hahahaha!
man