161 posts shown.
Nicholas King said:How are you reading the other parents' attitudes?
I suppose I'd say that your chances of actually resolving this depend heavily on whether the other parents are still clinging to those outdated, old-school views about corporal punishment—you know, that "back in my day" mentality. If they are—and if they truly believe that kind of discipline is acceptable—then I suspect your prospects are quite slim... because, in all likelihood, the teacher and the rest of the school administration will end up siding with them and turning the whole situation against you.
For some, that harsh approach is perfectly acceptable—even preferred—while others seem relatively indifferent toward the school system and their children's education, essentially thinking, "as long as they just make it through middle school."
The teacher is certainly aware of this dynamic; he actually told me, "We'll have to see what the other parents think—you can't force my hand here."
I would appreciate your perspective or perhaps some advice regarding this situation:
My child is currently in third grade at a small rural school. There are four students in his specific class, making a total of twelve in the grade. The teacher commutes every day from a town roughly 16 miles miles away.
The issue stems from his relationship with the students. His aggressive and condescending attitude—referring to them as "stupid hillbillies"—manifests almost daily; he screams at the children so loudly that the noise reaches our house, which is about 150 yards away.
Last year, my son came home in tears because the teacher had slapped him. I called him immediately, of course, but he denied everything. It was simply his word against my child's, which I pointed out to him. After a few minutes, he actually called me and demanded that I come to the school right then with my son so we could "settle things." When we arrived, he loomed over my child and asked, "Do you even know what a slap is? Let me show you: a slap is when I hit your cheek with my palm. But I didn't hit you with my palm; I used a textbook. That isn't a slap."
At that point, I lost my patience and asked him if he preferred to "slap him with a textbook or a chair?"
He then began making excuses, claiming it isn't easy working with so many kids, or asking if I realized he was alone with nine students (last year there were nine).
I requested that this never happen again. I didn't want to report him initially, as I felt bad thinking he might lose his job—he has a family to support.
It seemed as though that gave him a sense of impunity, as the daily screaming continued unabated.
Because of this, I complained to the principal of the main school (though I kept the slapping incident to myself at that time), and she said she would have a conversation with the teacher.
This school year hasn't brought any changes whatsoever. The constant yelling has reached a point where my son has started crying every single day. He would even break down at school, leading the teacher to send him home or call my wife to come calm him down. We repeatedly pleaded with him to stop screaming at the children, explaining that we don't raise our son to yell like that. Eventually, it escalated to the point where the boy would leave for school crying every morning.
At the teacher's suggestion, the school sent him to a child psychologist. Psychology told us that everything was fine with the boy, but that he just needed to "toughen up."
I should mention that my son is incredibly outgoing with everyone—he'll chat with a cashier, a waitress, or anyone he meets for the first time—but he completely freezes up around this teacher (he even asked me, "Do you realize he won't talk to me?").
At the start of the second semester, the teacher lost his temper again and slapped a second grader, throwing him to the floor and kicking him. That little boy kept it to himself at home, but he told our son. We informed the parents, but their reaction was quite lukewarm.
I reported everything to the principal and the school counselor. The teacher denied everything. He pressured the students to say nothing happened. He even asked the entire class who had told their parents about it. My son, since we teach him to always tell the truth, spoke up, only to be called a liar and a "lowlife" by the teacher in front of the whole class!!!
The principal, the counselor, and a school specialist all arrived. They interviewed the students individually, and every single student confirmed the incident (it turned out there were other things, like being punched in the stomach and similar things).
However, the response was utterly useless... the principal essentially said, "Well, I've slapped a student once too—we're all human..."
I wasn't going to let this slide, so I threatened to report everything to the Department of Education and Child Protective Services. I demanded that they either remove the teacher or I would transfer my child to the main school (even though he’d have to commute, whereas this local school is only 150 yards from our house). The principal argued that changing environments wouldn't be good for the child, asked me to be patient until spring break, and promised she would handle it.
Just before the break, we were called into the school, presumably to see if we would stand our ground. I stated clearly that I do not want this teacher as my child's educator, though I agreed to wait until the end of the school year (as the principal pleaded with me).
Now, as the school year winds down, the teacher announced at a parent meeting that my son would receive mostly Bs across the board. He claimed, "Everything is between a B and an A, but this will motivate the student to work harder next year."
It isn't that I care about my son having straight As, but I feel this is fundamentally unfair to a child who worked hard all year. For instance, his art project is being selected for an exhibition, and he has straight As except for one C (because he didn't have a soft brush during a timed task).
I reached out to the principal again today—mostly because I'm trying to get some clarity regarding next school year—just so I can finally figure out where my child will be attending. She mentioned that she "has a few ideas in mind," though she noted she won't have any concrete information regarding the scheduling until July 10th.
I suppose I am looking for some perspective here—how should I approach this? Should I be taking any specific steps now, or would it perhaps be better to just wait?
Harold Reyes3 said:Jesus has absolutely nothing to do with organized churches or Christians; that’s just Pavlov’s paradise.🙄
It seems there is quite a bit happening with Christians at the moment—and I suppose the matter regarding Muslims will eventually be dealt with at the final judgment.
Rachel Taylor2 said:He’s your religious leader—I assume you're Catholic🙂
Not all Christians belong to the Roman Catholic Church.
Rachel Taylor2 said:Oh, please—tell that to the Pope.😁
What does the Pope have to do with me??!
Harold Reyes3 said:It’s most likely for security reasons. If they let everyone in, you'd inevitably have some jerk 🙄 trying to fly in, toss trash at Cabo, or try to set things on fire just to disrespect people. That would lead to chaos—people losing their heads and total mayhem breaking out. It's honestly better this way; that place is too sacred to have non-believers walking through it.
True Jews and Christians wouldn't even attend—given that worshiping idols is strictly forbidden.
Harold Reyes3 said:Using Hollywood movies as an argument for what "Jesus" looks like.
Well, from everything we know about Jesus, he had long curly hair and a beard.
And the claim about Christians being killed by Muslims almost every day.
Where is that happening? From what I understand regarding Islam, if a Muslim kills a Christian without any reason, by God's grace, they would certainly deserve hell after death.
Plus, you're forgetting what Muhammad said: anyone who kills a Christian or a person living in an Islamic state—where they pay taxes—won't enter paradise.
Basically, Christian lives are protected under Islam. Just look at how many Christians exist in the Islamic world! If Islam were truly a violent religion toward them, do you really think they’d still be there after more than fifteen hundred years?
In fact, I was watching a Western documentary the other night about Islamic history and stuff.
When Muslims took over Jerusalem, it actually turned out well for the Christian leaders. They could practice their faith, and they actually paid less in taxes to the Islamic state than they did to the Roman rulers before the Muslims arrived in Jerusalem.
Come on, why don't you explain to us what that cube actually represents (or who it represents) that people pilgrimage toward?
That cube is known as the first House of God. It was built by Abraham and his son Ishmael. That's why it's a holy site for Muslims.
It's just the direction people face during prayer; we aren't actually worshipping a stone.
Hajj is a religious duty for Muslims to visit these holy sites. It's also a way to prepare for Judgment Day. Standing on Arafat near Mecca is like a mini-simulation of Judgment Day itself—millions of people in one spot, everyone dressed exactly the same, whether they're kings or paupers. There is absolutely no difference between them.
It was actually painters during the Middle Ages who depicted Jesus that way. I think you’ve missed the mark again here.
Anything other than God—whom we are actually making a pilgrimage toward—is nothing more than an IDOL!!!
Harold Reyes3 said:So, you're basically questioning Jesus' statement that "it doesn't make sense to you."
Look, if I take what Jesus says about being allowed to drink alcohol at face value without using any common sense, I’m basically asking for trouble. If I decide that "Jesus says it's okay" means I can hop in my car wasted late at night, I’m going to end up in a massive wreck. One second I'm driving, the next—boom! I hit another car, kill an entire family, and take myself out with them in the crash. Use your head!
And all because Jesus gave me the green light to enjoy some alcohol! 👍 It just doesn't make any sense! There’s zero logic here.
So now you're suddenly quoting Paul to back up your point? That’s rich, especially since you were tearing him apart just a moment ago!
Even if we look at what Paul wrote, it only reinforces exactly what I'm saying!
If Jesus says we shouldn't scrap the laws, but Paul is out here giving the green light, then you’ve basically found the blueprint for how Christianity actually formed. It makes perfect sense why Christians don't follow Jesus's specific legal path—it's all about following the logic of the shift. Honestly, I don't see what the big deal is; if you follow Paul's reasoning, it’s perfectly logical.
You skillfully sidestepped any mention of the images and the killings of Christians.
What kind of pictures and murders are we talking about??
Who are you trying to fool by making pilgrimages and walking circles around a stone? You can't hide it—idolatry definitely has a place in Islam.
We wouldn't ever dream of doing that if God hadn't commanded it! He’s the one who told us exactly which way to face when we pray to Him. See, there's no issue here. A real problem only exists if someone tells you to bow down to a block of wood instead of God—now *that* would be idolatry.
Using Hollywood depictions of "Jesus" as an argument, and citing the near-daily killings of Christians by Muslims... it seems you have somewhat missed the point.
Why don't you tell us here what that die represents (or who it represents) that you all make pilgrimages to?
Harold Reyes3 said:Jesus clearly stated that it isn't what enters a person through their mouth that makes them unclean, but what comes out of their heart.
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The question is whether he actually said that, considering it clashes with logic. I find it hard to believe that God's people were illogical, because they were wise people.
By saying that, you're degrading Jesus's wisdom and knowledge. Personally, I’d consider myself smarter than Jesus in that situation if he allows things that ruin your life—like pork, alcohol, drugs, etc.—while I'm over here saying "no thanks" to save my life. In that case, everyone would be wiser than Jesus, which is just plain nonsense. He couldn't have said such a thing.
Because if evil doesn't enter through the mouth in the form of alcohol—where you can end up ruined by various things, committing murder, rape, abuse, causing car accidents, getting cancer, etc.—then if this evil doesn't enter through the mouth, 🙄there's simply no logic in what you're saying.
You mention wine (as in alcohol), but Jesus actually turned water into wine.
If Jesus really turned water into wine, that isn't proof that we should be drinking. For example, if he turned water into snake venom, does that mean we should drink it? 🙄
How could Jesus drink alcohol if it's harmful and causes you to lose your mind, especially for someone so close to God who guides people toward the right path? Would he walk around the streets of Jerusalem drunk? Could a man sent by God allow something that ruins and destroys our lives?
This is right here in the Bible:
Ephesians 5:18 Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery, but instead be filled with the Holy Spirit.
It makes no sense for Jesus to have been drinking wine and alcohol after this text, especially since we know Jesus strictly followed the old laws.
Or look at this:
Luke 1:15 For he will be great in the sight of the Lord. He will drink neither wine nor strong drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even before his birth..
The Bible is basically a collection of books written by people inspired by God over many centuries.
That’s just not accurate. The Bible actually contradicts everything you're saying right here—let me show you how.
Luke says the Bible was put together by listening to people’s stories and writing down whatever they heard. To him, it’s just a standard history book—one where things could easily get mixed up or contain mistakes.
A lot of people have already jumped in to write up reports on everything that’s been going down between us.
Just like they handed them down to us from the original fathers and the servants of the Word.
So, I’ve decided to do the same thing. I'm going to dig through everything from their very beginning, piece by piece, and lay it all out for you in order, my noble Theophilus!,
If most of the Bible doesn't sit right with you—and honestly, who are you to be the judge anyway?—then that’s your own issue to deal with.
It seems like you don't actually care for much in the Bible. Honestly, just take a look at how Jesus lived and what He taught, then compare that to your own actions—you'll see how much you truly love His word. Even when you were washing up before prayer, you were bowing face-down on the floor just like a Muslim or like Jesus himself. You've never done anything else! 🙄
You claim you follow Jesus's teachings, but honestly? It looks pretty ridiculous to me when you're bowing down and circling some hunk of stone. To my eyes, that’s just idolatry, plain and simple—just like worshiping statues or paintings.
We shouldn't be bowing down to a literal stone block. That rock is just a compass—a way to point us in the right direction when we pray to God. We aren't worshipping a piece of granite in Mecca; heaven forbid!
It’s all about staying unified. If we didn't have a clear direction to follow, everyone would just be doing their own thing and worshipping whatever they felt like. It would turn into total chaos among believers in no time!
It seems you are essentially questioning the words of Jesus—simply because they don't align with your own logic.
So, you’re actually invoking Paul—whom you were just tearing apart moments ago—to try and validate your point. Honestly, you might want to get your story straight and decide which parts of the Bible you actually accept and which you don't. You have no idea what my prayer life looks like or how I approach my time in prayer before God—you're really just grasping at straws here, I guess. You also conveniently sidestepped the issue of icons and the martyrdom of Christians, and frankly, your commentary on gambling feels a bit like saying "it doesn't matter if the ship sinks as long as the crew is happy." It's a bit dismissive, isn't it? And let's be real—you all still make pilgrimages to casinos and circle them like they're sacred sites; who are you trying to fool? If we're being honest, idolatry is very much present within Islam as well.
Harold Reyes3 said:It's clear you're a genuine person. You approach everything with such an open mind, and honestly, that's how everyone should act. People could really learn from your attitude.
Only when you approach things with an open heart, without any bias, and start thinking logically, do all the pieces fall into place and the truth become clearer.
honestly the idea that Christians decided not to listen to Jesus in favor of someone after him is an exaggeration to me
Look, I laid it out very simply above: what Jesus said versus what Paul said.
Jesus strictly forbade changing the law and said it must be followed. But then Paul, following Jesus's ascension, preaches about doing away with the law. That essentially creates a whole new religion. Once you start swapping out the rules, you've basically built a new faith with its own playbook.
All you have to do is look at Jesus's actions and words, then look at Christians today. There isn't a chance you'll find a Christian acting exactly like Jesus did. Now, look at Muslims—you'll see a massive amount of Jesus among them because they share the same roots and follow both Jesus and Muhammad. It makes sense that they'd align with those two great figures; in fact, in terms of appearance, Muslims actually look more like Jesus than many Christians do.
Jesus, according to the Christian movie version:
How Muslims dress today:
Jesus said: Love your enemies and bless those who curse you. Yet, hardly a day passes without hearing news from some part of the world where people are being killed in the name of Islam.
The point you made regarding the images is quite silly—that is nothing more than a Hollywood production and a mere vision. No one actually knows what Jesus looked like back then. Your argument carries zero weight.
Harold Reyes3 said:Look, Harold Reyes3 actually laid out some solid evidence for his claims, pulling directly from the Bible to back it all up. But when people start coming at him? It’s usually just a bunch of noise—lots of empty arguments without any actual proof or real substance to back them up.
As a Christian, I try my best to live out my faith—even if I don't always nail it! Honestly, I’m not going to lecture anyone about the Quran since I simply don't know enough about it to weigh in.
Look, I’m not just talking out of turn here. I’ve spent years pouring over the Bible—I know it inside and out. I spend my time weighing the Bible against the Quran, digging into the similarities, spotting the differences, and seeing how it all stacks up.
Aggressively spitting on someone else's faith or looking down on what they believe? That tells you everything you need to know about their character and their relationship with God.
Look, I’m not trying to spit on anyone's faith here. Believe whatever you want! I’m just laying out the evidence from the Bible to back up my point.
It’s honestly laughable. Even the birds in the trees know that most Christians are following Paul instead of Jesus. You try to tell them to actually follow Jesus, and they just get all defensive and offended! 🙄 And then they vote, "NO WAY!" They’re basically asking, "How can we just ditch the pork? What about circumcision and all those other rituals?" 🙄 Come on!
Of course it’s going to rub them the wrong way! When you drop the truth on people—even when it’s hard to swallow—you’re just going to get that "take it or leave it" reaction. It’s like giving someone a bitter pill; they might not like the taste, but it's the reality nonetheless.
Who is talking about what? You're focused on pork and circumcision. Jesus clearly stated that it is not what enters a man through his mouth that defiles him, but what comes out of his heart. You mention wine (as in alcohol), yet it was Jesus himself who turned water into wine. If spirituality were solely about food and drink, some Hindus might actually outpace us all (and there are quite a few of them, too).
The Bible is a book written by people under divine inspiration over many centuries. You either accept it or you don't. The fact that certain parts (most of it, actually) don't appeal to you—though I wonder, by what authority do you speak?—is your own issue.
You claim that you adhere to Jesus's teachings, but to me, seeing people bow and walk around a stone block seems somewhat ridiculous. In my view, that is just as much idolatry as bowing to statues or paintings.
Ethan Martinez6 said:Harold Reyes3, you’ve sure put a lot of thought into all this, and I guess maybe you probably know the Quran a whole lot better than I know the Bible... so I think I'll just go ahead and ask someone who might actually be more of an expert on the subject what they think about it, but anyway, thanks a ton for taking the time to type all that out.😉
What Harold Reyes3 wrote seems to be a bit of everything, I guess. The way he cites the Bible—which he doesn't actually know or even truly accept, except for the parts that happen to suit Muslims—is really just an indication of how arrogant certain worldviews can be; it's as if followers of one specific religion feel they must label anything that falls outside their own framework as a lie. As a Christian, I try my best to act according to my faith—though, unfortunately, I don't always succeed—and I make it a point not to lecture anyone regarding the Quran, simply because I don't know it well enough. Honestly, being aggressive or disparaging toward someone else's beliefs usually just reveals what kind of believer, or even what kind of person, someone truly is.
Harold Reyes3 said:You’re acting like someone who just cherry-picks specific verses to suit your own agenda. I say this because you aren't even aware of Psalm 22 or Isaiah 53—two massive pillars in the OT that describe a Messiah destined to suffer and die. You’re missing these fundamental parts of the Bible, yet you have the nerve to lecture Christians who live by these scriptures every single day for strength and purpose... especially regarding the death of Jesus, a topic where you clearly lack the basic biblical foundation.
It isn't about digging through the Bible; why should I have to hunt for proof when I can just cite the Bible and the Quran to back my points? I post my arguments here so you don't have to go digging through books just to call me out. 🙄
Let’s use some actual logic here. What does it even mean for Jesus to die for our sins?
What kind of "sins" are we talking about? We know there is no concept of original sin stemming from Adam and Eve, because Jesus says children go to heaven. That proves they are sinless—after all, how could anyone enter heaven carrying sin?
Second, since we’ve cleared up the whole original sin issue, what sins are left? It's obviously the things we do now and the things we'll do in the future. Why is the idea that Jesus carries our sins so dangerous? Because it creates a loophole. Someone might think, "Hey, if He died for my sins, I can do whatever I want as long as I believe." People could murder, rape, steal, or abuse, thinking Jesus will just shoulder the blame.
It’s totally illogical. Believe whatever you want, but to me, common sense aligns much better with what God says in the Quran. Take a good look at it—I think anyone using their head will see what
God says in the Quran:
15. Whoever follows the straight path does so for their own benefit, but whoever wanders astray does so to their own detriment. And no sinner shall bear the burden of another. And We never punish a nation until We have sent a messenger!
160. Whoever does a good deed will be rewarded tenfold, but whoever does an evil deed will only be punished according to its weight, and no injustice will be done to them.
I think anyone—whether Christian, Jew, Buddhist, or Hindu—would agree with what God is saying here.
And no sinner shall bear the burden of another.
To me, that’s just pure logic and common sense. You answer for your own actions, not someone else.
Biblical Christianity doesn't teach the concept of original sin. We haven't inherited sin itself, but rather a sinful nature—a tendency toward it. A small child isn't a sinner; they become a sinner as they grow up. Just as a child isn't held accountable by secular laws until a certain age, perhaps they aren't held accountable by God either. However, they carry the seed of a sinful nature within them—which, I suspect, becomes more apparent as they mature. They begin to rebel against parents, school, authority in general, and eventually, against God. I could elaborate on this further if you're interested.
Anyone who confesses Jesus as their Savior, repents, and relies on Jesus' sacrifice on the cross receives His righteousness. For God has said: "The wages of sin is death." Jesus didn't die for His own sins—since He had none—but for the sins of those who believe in Him (though, unfortunately, I think there are very few true Christians who truly accept Him). I am not referring to "nominal Christians" here. Anyone who accepts Him is born again—born from above, from God. Through this, they become God's children. God no longer views them through the lens of their imperfections, but through His Son, Jesus Christ. Thus, God sees them as clean. A true, born-again Christian wouldn't intentionally sin! They wouldn't just do whatever they please, committing murder, theft, or rape. Those "Christians" who behave that way are merely proving that they were never truly born again.
For example: Imagine you, Harold Reyes3, were adopted by the Queen of England and recognized as her son. You are still the same old Harold Reyes—but now, you are a prince. It no longer suits you to get drunk, or act out, or behave crudely... simply because you are a prince. That is, of course, a bit of a caricature, but I am trying to bring the concept closer to what I mean.
Harold Reyes3 said:Jeremiah chapter 8 is basically a massive takedown of the priests and fake prophets right before the Babylonian captivity hit. These verses aren't attacking the Bible itself—they’re calling out the charlatans who led the people astray. It’s all about that blatant hypocrisy: "How can you possibly claim..."
You wouldn't believe the stuff I've seen. I’ve spotted hundreds of contradictions where one verse says one thing and the next says the exact opposite about the same situation. It’s glaringly obvious that someone went in and tinkered with the Bible texts. And it isn't just my opinion—God actually tells us in the Quran that the "sons of Israel" messed with the holy books, twisting the words, altering them, and even adding things while claiming they were from God.
That’s exactly why He came and died on the cross—to take the weight of the world's sins upon Himself. Through His death, He stepped in to shoulder our flaws and, in exchange, handed us His own righteousness. It's the ultimate trade!
Even the text you just put together goes against everything written in the Bible!
You’re saying He came to take on all the world's sins, but honestly, that just doesn't add up to me. It feels totally illogical. If He's carrying those sins, then what about this whole "original sin" concept? If you follow Jesus' teachings, He made it clear that children go straight to heaven. So, how can they possibly carry some inherited stain from Adam and Eve? If that's not what you mean, then what exactly are you getting at?
So, let's say I truly believe Jesus died for my sins, right? Does that mean I have a free pass to go wild? If I decide to kill someone in the name of God, rape a woman, snatch a wallet, beat someone up in an alley, or get high out of my mind—and then some guy looks at me like I'm a total lunatic and asks, "What is wrong with you? Are you insane?"—do I just shrug and tell him, "Don't be like that, man. You know Jesus died for our sins"? 😉It doesn't matter what we do right now because He’s going to gather them all up for us anyway!
Just ask your heart if this feels right.
He took our flaws upon Himself through His death—those of us who believe in His sacrifice—and in exchange, He handed us His righteousness!
It’s wild how you all love to turn things into some mystical mystery, complicating everything for no reason.
The only way this makes sense is if He came specifically to grant us His righteousness—to judge based on God's law, defining right from wrong so we can follow it to reach heaven. There's no need for sacrifices or the idea of a half-naked Jesus on a cross. It’s honestly strange how much you enjoy the image of Jesus being humiliated, half-naked and bleeding on a cross just to carry away your sins.
In the Quran, God teaches us that everyone is responsible for their own actions. Jesus has nothing to do with your sins.
When the manuscripts were discovered at Qumran back in 1947, researchers compared those scrolls, which date back to before Christ, with the modern translations of the Old Testament. It turned out that these texts, despite being separated by over 2,000 years, match the current versions by more than 95%. The remaining five percent of differences are clearly just clerical errors made during the actual writing or transcription process. They don't undermine the content of the message in any way. For example: out of 166 words in Isaiah chapter 53, only 17 letters are actually in question. Ten of those letters are simply matters of spelling that don't change the meaning. Four letters represent minor stylistic shifts, like conjunctions. The other three involve the word "light," which was added in the 11th line and doesn't affect the overall sense. Furthermore, that word is supported by the Septuagint and the Great Isaiah Scroll found in the caves near the Dead Sea. So, in a passage of 166 words, there is only one word (three letters) that is questionable, and even that word doesn't alter the meaning of the entire fragment.
As for the New Testament, we can verify its authenticity through more than 25,000 existing manuscripts.
The Quran itself isn't really an authoritative source (at least not for Christians) to judge the Bible, especially when you consider when it was produced.
Regarding Jesus' sacrifice and resurrection, I believe you are absolutely unqualified to debate the topic, as you seem to misunderstand the very foundations of Christianity. I see that you are judging Christianity and its message based on the tenets of Roman Catholicism and their flawed understanding. Their theology has caused significant damage, because non-Christians end up judging all of Christianity based on one massive misconception.
Harold Reyes3 said:Stop beating around the bush! It’s funny how you Muslims always try to lecture us about the Bible, twisting things until you're blue in the face just to make it look false.
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The Bible itself basically calls itself out. Check this out:
Jeremiah 8:8 "They trust in their own wisdom and say, 'We have God's law!' But truly, the deceitful scribes have practiced deceit."
The reason neither Muhammad nor his followers understand God's word is because neither he nor you possess the Holy Spirit.
Oh, we understand it. Believe me, we understand it much better than you think. 👍
So you're trying to use logic, like...
And you're topping it all off with lies and half-truths.
These aren't lies at all—it's pure truth. I can prove everything I've said using the Bible itself. If I were feeding you lies, people would see right through them instantly. Lies never stay hidden for long. 😉
Both the Old Testament, starting from Genesis 3, and the New Testament state that Jesus must suffer.
Actually, they don't say that. They say the exact opposite.
"If someone commits a sin deserving death and is hanged on a tree, do not leave his body on the tree overnight; bury him that same day, for anyone who is hung on a tree is under God's curse." >
If they had actually crucified Jesus, he would be a false prophet according to this: "If someone commits a sin deserving death and is hanged on a tree..." We all know Jesus never sinned—that's what we Muslims believe, that he was free from all sin. Based on this text, it would imply Jesus is under God's curse, which is obviously far from the truth.
That is described in all four Gospels. Failing to see that in the Bible is either a sign of massive spiritual blindness or devilish disbelief.
Oh, I see it just fine. I see it very clearly.
Well, you choose which side you fall on.
You clearly have no clue who Jesus is, why he came, or where he is now.
God clearly defined Jesus' purpose: he came to lead the people of Israel back to the right path, to help them shun sin, and to follow him so they could be saved on Judgment Day.
All you guys do is stir the pot. It’s nothing but pure provocation. Honestly, it's just pathetic.
I’m not trying to pick a fight here. I’m just looking at the facts and using logic to dismantle these claims. Honestly, I could use the Bible alone to prove that Jesus never actually died or was crucified on a cross. If you can't see that, well, that’s a whole different conversation. 😉
Show me where in the Bible it says Judah died on the cross instead of Jesus. If you can actually pull that off, I’m converting to Islam right this second!
We need to look at this from every possible angle if we want to clear the air. For us Muslims, the Quran acts like a high-tech scanner or a built-in error detector for the Bible. It’s essentially the direct manual sent by God to correct misconceptions. We're here to give you Christian folks a heads-up: God isn't on board with calling Jesus God or His Son, and the whole Trinity concept just doesn't sit right with Him.
So, how would we actually know if someone else was crucified instead of Jesus?
God says in the Quran:
God says:
Even their own words give it away: “We killed the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, God's messenger!” It wasn't even about him being killed or nailed to a cross—it was all just a massive misunderstanding!The skeptics were basically just guessing at this point. They didn't have any real facts to lean on—just pure speculation. It’s a certainty, though: they definitely weren't the ones who killed him.The Quran.
This is the absolute key to cracking the problem!
He wasn't even killed or put on a cross! It’s already happened to them..
How did that work out? If we're just looking at the facts without jumping to any other conclusions, you could argue that some other guy ended up on the cross instead because he was a dead ringer for Jesus.
You’re going to get a detailed answer straight from the Gospel you Christians tend to ignore—the Gospel of Barnabas. Let's dive in and see exactly what it says about this situation!
Judah slips into the room ahead of everyone else, right where Jesus was just lifted up. Meanwhile, the disciples are all fast asleep. God worked such wonders that Judah was transformed in both speech and appearance to look just like Jesus. It was so convincing that we actually believed he was Jesus!He woke us up and immediately started asking where the boss was. We were totally blindsided! We just looked at him and said, "Wait, you're the one in charge here! Did you seriously forget about us already?"
A grin spreads across his face as he says, "Are you guys out of your minds? Don't you realize I'm Judas Iscariot!"
While he was still mid-sentence, the soldiers stormed in and grabbed Judah, because honestly, the guy looked just like Jesus.
We heard what Judah was saying, saw that massive crowd of soldiers, and honestly? We bolted like crazy.
So, John wakes up wrapped in linen, breaks free, and bolts! When the guards tried to grab him by those burial cloths, he just ditched them and ran for it. It’s like a movie scene! Honestly, God heard Jesus' prayer and pulled that one man out of the fire. Pure miracle!
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Here’s a look at that wild mystery surrounding the cross.
"My God, my God, why have you abandoned me?" That's what he cried out.
From the Gospel of Barnabas.
They dragged him up to Calvary—that hill where they typically hang criminals—and crucified him completely naked just to make sure he was as humiliated as possible.
Judah does nothing but shout: ""God, why have you abandoned me?", since a criminal got away while I die an innocent death?
Seriously, I'm telling you, Judas's voice and presence were such a dead ringer for Jesus that his own followers and believers were absolutely convinced he was him....
This Gospel is perfectly consistent. Compare that to the Bible, which is riddled with contradictions. Who are we supposed to trust—a Bible full of errors or the Gospel of Barnabas, which flows without any clashes?
The Bible itself is packed with inconsistencies regarding the crucifixion of Jesus—enough to make anyone second-guess everything.
So, who actually carried the cross? Was it Simon or Jesus himself?
"As they were coming out, they seized a man from Cyrene named Simon and forced him to carry the cross." Matthew 27
versus
"Jesus carried his own cross and went out to the place called Golgotha." John 19
And what about the wine they gave him? What was it mixed with?
"They offered him wine mixed with myrrh, but he did not take it." Mark 15
versus
"They offered him wine mixed with gall. He tasted it, but he wouldn't drink it."
What time was he crucified?
"At nine in the morning, they crucified him." Matthew 27
versus
"It was around three in the afternoon, during the preparation for the Passover, when he said to the Jews, 'Here is your king!'" John 18
"And they shouted, 'Crucify him! Crucify him!' Pilate asked, 'Shall I crucify your king?'" John 18
Who should we believe? The Bible we have today, which is full of mistakes even concerning the crucifixion, or the Gospel of Barnabas, which doesn't have these issues—especially since the Quran supports the Gospel of Barnabas too.
I think we've finally cleared up exactly how the crucifixion went down.
The entire eighth chapter of Jeremiah was written as a direct indictment against the priests and those false prophets who existed prior to the Babylonian captivity. These specific verses aren't an attack on the Bible itself—rather, they target the deceptive prophets and the leaders who were leading the people astray. It essentially asks, "How can you possibly claim..."
"We claim to be wise—that we possess the Law of Yahweh!" Honestly, it seems as though a deceptive scribe has twisted that truth into a lie. The wise will find themselves disgraced, terrified, and ultimately caught in their own trap. Look at them—they have utterly disregarded Yahweh's word. And their wisdom? I suppose one has to wonder—what good can it possibly do them now? (Jeremiah 8:8-9)
Yes, you are correct that Jesus never sinned—though one could certainly say the same for a select few others, I suppose—but that is precisely why He came and went to the cross: to take upon Himself the sins of the world. Through His death, He assumed our sinfulness—specifically for those who believe in His sacrifice—and in exchange, He granted us His righteousness. However, to those who lack the Holy Spirit, this whole concept seems like sheer foolishness, which is likely why they try so hard to deny His sacrifice by any means necessary.
Harold Reyes3 said:Mainly because He truly rose from the dead.
They didn't actually kill Jesus on the cross. They crucified Judah instead! God made him look just like Jesus because of his betrayal, so he was the one on the cross crying out, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" It makes zero sense for Jesus to say that.
Second, Jesus asked God to save him from death, and his prayer was answered. If his prayer was heard, how could he have died? That's how it's written in the Bible.
Third, when Jesus appeared later, he was physically there with his disciples. But Jesus says those who die become like angels—basically without a physical body. Since he was right there in the flesh with them, how could he have died on the cross??? The logic just isn't there.
Jesus and all of us will experience the resurrection after we die when Judgment Day arrives. At that point, God will reconstruct our bodies and return our souls. We’ll rise from our graves when Judgment Day hits because we’ll be standing before God. Think of death as a change of state. It's like a baby being born—it's a total shift. Or imagine twins in a womb; if one is born first, the other might seem "lost" to that world, but really, they are transitioning to a new existence. That's us moving from death into a new world where we exist as both body and soul.
If it weren't true, He wouldn't have proven He is God, and so many martyrs wouldn't have died for Him. The resurrection is the ultimate proof.
There are so many tangled threads and logical holes in that one little sentence that I'd need a whole day just to untangle them all.
So, the proof that He is God is that He died? A God who dies? 🙄
And you're ignoring everything else that points the other way. Let me ask you something:
"Can you even imagine a God who created the entire universe sitting in diapers while his mom wipes his butt just because he's too weak?" 🙄
I could list a ton of verses from the Bible right here that support your claim that Jesus is God.
You are really trying to twist things around! It is interesting how you Muslims always try to lecture others about the Bible, twisting it until you're blue in the face in an attempt to make the Bible seem false. The reason neither Muhammad nor his followers understand God's word is because neither he (Muhammad) nor any of you possess the Spirit of God.
You are attempting to apply logic, as if...
And then you garnish everything with lies and half-truths.
Furthermore, the Old Testament, starting from Genesis 3 onwards, and the New Testament both clearly state that Jesus must suffer. This is described in all four Gospels. Failing to see this in the Bible is either a sign of profound spiritual blindness or diabolical unbelief. I suppose you can decide which one applies to you.
You truly have no idea who Jesus is, why he came, or where he is now. All you can do is provoke, and nothing more. You are pitiable, truly.
Cite me a verse from the Bible where it says that Judah died on the cross instead of Jesus. If you can actually manage that, I will convert to Islam immediately.
Paul Kern12 said:1. Is it actually possible—or even allowed—for me to log in using a different username? (Right now I am Paul Kern12, but maybe I could switch to something like Paul Kern13?)
2. Would it be an issue if I used a new account, say Paul Kern13, while staying logged in as Paul Kern12 on my old computer—just to be safe, I guess?
Actually, I'm pulling everything back—I just remembered my password!!!
dustypuma5 said:Nothing much. Honestly, you should probably just forget about that account—because if an admin decides to change your password or email, you wouldn't really have any way to prove the account belongs to you. It would create a massive security loophole where someone could claim any logged-in account as their own. For instance, imagine you walk into a Starbucks, find someone still logged in on a laptop, and try to swap their email address to yours just to hijack the account.
The logic is fairly straightforward, I suppose—if you know the password, you can change the email by proving ownership via that password; if you don't know the password, you can trigger a reset to your email, which serves as proof that the account is yours.
However, if you lack access to both the password and the email, then you effectively have no way to prove the account is yours.
1. Is it possible (or am I allowed) to log in under a different username? (Right now I'm Paul Kern12, so maybe something like Paul Kern13?)
2. Would it be alright if I used a new name, say Paul Kern13, while staying logged in as Paul Kern12 on my old computer—just to be safe?
I’m running into a bit of a situation—I suppose you could say I’ve been a little clumsy with my tech setup at work lately, which has led me to this particular predicament. When I first registered for the forum, I completely lost track of which password I had actually set. Now, having switched both my service provider and my computer, I find myself unable to log in from this new machine. I keep getting a vBulletin prompt asking me to provide the original email address associated with my initial registration. Herein lies the issue: I managed to lose access to that specific email address—I accidentally changed it due to my own oversight—so I can't provide the very information they are requesting. What would be the best course of action here? (I am currently typing this out using my old computer and my previous email address.)