Posts by wanderinggardener12

wanderingbadger44 said:Not this again. Just a few months back, you opened a similar thread with an almost identical opening, also focusing on a "first grader"—except back then, it was a high schooler belonging to a friend.

Are you just a troll, or is there a real person behind this who is working incredibly hard to undermine anyone offering actual guidance, all just to make sure you come out looking flawless and right in the eyes of those "enlightened" types?

The post regarding high schoolers dealt with my stepdaughter. The core issue remains unchanged. It’s essentially the same situation we see today: a girl who works, yet struggles with subjects where she isn't given a fair shot to demonstrate her knowledge or correct a poor grade because the workload is simply overwhelming. She's working, but she isn't seeing the results she deserves... along with all the other nuances I've touched upon (and things I haven't even mentioned yet).
I see the same pattern with my friend's child, who is just starting elementary school.
It seems to me that so many aspects of the grading system are poorly regulated, and children end up paying the price for it in both Elementary School and High School.
I have two daughters navigating this system: one is nearing the end of her degree, currently in her 10th semester at an Ivy League university, and I walked her through every single stage of that process; the other is a freshman in elementary school. I work in an elementary school myself, and for fifteen years, alongside my primary profession, I worked in extracurricular programs with kids ranging from first grade through the end of high school. I believe I have a legitimate grasp on the problems at hand.
I don't see why pointing out systemic flaws counts as undermining teachers or the system itself. Those who do their jobs well have no reason to feel frustrated; some will inevitably succeed, and others will make mistakes. But those who can sleep soundly at night knowing they may have permanently crushed a child's self-esteem over the course of three or four years? I see no reason to pull my punches with them.
My criticism isn't aimed at individuals, but at the system that permits this behavior and, in many cases, mandates it.
I am certainly not claiming to be perfect—I work as an English teacher in an elementary school, after all—but I have absolutely no desire to perform "perfection" here (if that were my goal, I would have much better venues for it). I am undoubtedly not a perfect teacher. However, that isn't the point at all: I am talking about how my stepdaughter, my friend's child, and countless other students suffer because of a fundamentally broken educational and developmental system.

Our American education system is riddled with flaws. What am I supposed to do if I am part of that very system? Should I just stay silent simply because I work within it? Am I expected to claim everything is wonderful? My protesting and my dissatisfaction with certain practices don't mean that I am performing my job flawlessly. On the contrary, I suspect that being "on the inside" allows me to see certain realities more clearly than those who lack my level of insight and information.

Yes, I'll say it again: I am critiquing the system, not the people. I fail to see what is wrong with that. Why does it bother you so much?

silvertinker6 said:That is a very small number of grades... the second semester has been going for two months already, but perhaps the teacher is moving a bit slowly??!!!
If a child enters first grade without knowing the alphabet or how to read, then this progress is good and exactly what it should be... frankly, most kids today start first grade already knowing the alphabet and some reading skills, often up to solid reading levels... so in those cases, everything is fine...
But then those children are at a disadvantage compared to these readers and letter-learners...
If the child is bright, they will catch up; I only suggest a little bit of practice at home... maybe pick up some novels or books that interest the child and spend half an hour reading and retelling stories with the parents...
Math is similar... just repeat a few problems they worked on to solidify the knowledge...

Good luck!

The point isn't really about what the grades are or how fast someone is progressing, but rather whether grading is even necessary in the first place, and what message it sends to the parent—and more importantly, to the child. I wouldn't want this discussion to devolve into a guide on how to prep a future kindergartner or how first graders advance. That’s not the crux of the matter.

What I'm interested in is how you think a typical child, one developing normally, feels when they have the weight of constant grading hanging over their necks.

And how does the parent feel? What happens if the child is making wonderful progress, yet from standardized tests they're pulling Cs and Ds, while there are no other markers of advancement, like verbal feedback?

I have a first grader myself. She couldn't care less about grades.

However, the kid I’m talking about is already starting to feel like they aren't doing well in school... And both my friend and her husband are frustrated by all of this... because they worry about the self-esteem of a child who is perfectly fine and making great strides.

How much weight do grades actually carry for a first grader? How many are even necessary? And more importantly, what kind of message are we sending to the child versus what we’re telling the parents?

Consider this scenario: a first grader is halfway through the second semester, and all they have to show for it in English Language Arts are two grades—a C in reading comprehension and a B in literature. The reason for the C? When asked which three stores Pale visited, the student answered "a toy store" and "two grocery stores," whereas the answer key expected "a bakery, a fruit stand, and a candy shop." Where is the evaluation of oral expression—the discussions about the books they read, their ability to articulate thoughts, their creativity, or their reading fluency? Where is the assessment of their handwriting, the heavy workload they complete, the development of fine motor skills through writing, or any meaningful verbal testing?

A friend of mine shared this specific situation with me. Her son started the year barely recognizing letters, struggling with phonics, but he has progressed to reading quite steadily; he reads slowly, but he reads independently, tackles literature, writes, understands everything he reads, and expresses himself well above his age level. He’s even independent when it comes to his homework. So, what is the underlying message being sent here? And what are the long-term implications if those C's and B's
What if this same child also has a single B on a math quiz?
That’s it. No other grades exist. His mother attended the parent-teacher conference, and now they are stuck in a dilemma: should they enroll him in extra tutoring after a grueling school day that runs from 8 AM to 5 PM, or should they just let things play out naturally?

I’ve known this little boy since the day he was born. In preschool, he could count to ten without a hitch, he draws beautifully, he’s organized, he’s inquisitive, performs science experiments at home, builds things, and explores the world around him...

I honestly don't know what to tell her.

She mentions that he hasn't really cared about grades until now, but now... she’s unsure whether she needs to confront him about them or simply allow him to develop without the unnecessary burden of academic pressure.

Susan James said:Probably
there are quite a few similarities.

I personally absolutely love the idea of getting rid of letter grades altogether. I’ve been chatting with some folks in the American education system, and they keep telling me that something like this would never fly here—that kids just wouldn't bother studying without them. It reminds me of how we recently stopped issuing mid-term report cards; in my opinion, that was mostly just for show. It feels like teachers still just round up grades whenever they want to keep things looking a certain way, essentially maintaining that same old grade pressure.
I won't say the whole comparison is totally pointless, but we really need to shift our mindset regarding why we actually learn in the first place...

I’m also a fan of the no-grade approach. I work in an Elementary School and I also have a child in an Elementary School. Grading is nothing but a burden, whether you're looking at it from the perspective of a teacher or a parent.
As an educator, I would always support being evaluated on my own performance through external assessments, rather than being forced to assign a numerical value to a child's immediate knowledge, skills, and such.
As a parent, I need feedback from teachers, but a raw grade tells me very little; a child might miss a question on a test despite having a deep grasp of the material and the ability to apply it effectively.
That said, there would eventually need to be some sort of placement system at the end of Elementary School, but certainly nothing in the form of a single high-stakes exam that dictates their entire future—that is far too much stress even for an adult. Perhaps three separate evaluations, where only the best result is kept, would be more reasonable. It should involve both oral and written components, focusing not just on rote memorization of facts, but on the development of skills, abilities, and fundamental character growth.

David Ross3 said:Even when I'm posting on here, I can't stand the idea of actually writing down my fears—like, laying my soul bare on paper or in some Word doc—because the last thing I want is someone stumbling upon it and reading my business. 🙄 🕺 Honestly, I’ve just got issues—mental health stuff coming at me from every angle.

Why? 🙂

In my previous post, I mentioned that you should try writing things out just for yourself. ("Answer yourself in written form.") It’s a way to actually become aware of certain patterns, which can serve as a starting point. When we only dwell on thoughts internally, those vital insights often slip through our fingers—especially when they sting, causing us to reflexively push them away. But if you commit them to paper, you have the luxury of revisiting them in a minute, an hour, tomorrow, or next week, allowing yourself to truly process them. Whatever you write can be tucked away or locked up where no one else will ever see it.
The second issue is whether you even want to engage in self-work right now, if you aren't ready for that struggle. And honestly, that’s fine too. You can just accept that things are difficult. It sounds like a paradox, but once you stop fighting the reality of how hard it is, it somehow becomes easier to bear.
I wasn't suggesting psychoanalysis or some deep, grueling excavation of the psyche; I was merely suggesting a small glimpse into your own desires. If you can't face it alone, seek out a professional, and since you seem reluctant to expose yourself for the time being, perhaps a behavioral therapist or a Gestalt psychologist would be a more suitable fit for your needs.

David Ross3 said:I'm right there with you on this. Honestly, I know there's something stuck inside me too—the worst part is, I don't even have a clue what it is. 🤔🤦

If you’re looking for a way to actually succeed, why not set a goal that is entirely within your own control? Pick something that doesn't rely on luck, the economy, or anyone else's whims—something that rests solely on your own grit, but isn't so trivial that it feels meaningless. Once you've hit those marks once, twice, or three times, you start building that internal feedback loop, that quiet confidence that you can actually finish what you start. Only then should you move on to those larger, more complex goals that depend on navigating the outside world and dealing with other people...
Do you have any inkling of what such a task might look like?
In America, unfortunately, the struggle for meaningful work and basic survival is a heavy burden, even for those who possess plenty of drive and self-assurance. Don't let that crush your spirit. Try getting involved with a local non-profit, sign up for some volunteer work, or look into international service projects if you can. Find a hobby—something that won't pay the bills but will provide a sense of mastery and peace. At the end of the day, the world is vast, and there is space for you out there. What is it you truly want? Try writing it down. (And please, don't waste time listing what you *don't* want.) Then, map out the "how." There are no limits to what your ideas or desires can be.

rowdypanther12 said:Which association are we talking about? Is it a local PTA from that school or neighborhood, or is there a broader group where parents from other schools can get involved too?

Honestly, any school with a spare classroom could pull this off. Of course, it’s a much harder sell for those overcrowded schools running double shifts all day. Typically, parents step up and form a non-profit organization. They gather signatures from everyone interested and then submit a formal request to the property owner—in a place like Washington, D.C., that would be City Hall—asking for free use of the space. Then, at the association's request, the school board provides their blessing, essentially agreeing that the space can be used by the school's own students, and that official consent is attached to the application sent to City Hall.
The association then hires a teacher on a contract basis. (A Freelancer can't be an official school employee, otherwise, you run into those messy conflicts of interest, don't you?)
Parents sign enrollment contracts directly with the group, and they just stick to the standard meal plans provided by the school. Everything else is just a matter of negotiating terms with the association or the freelancer.
I hope this clears things up for you or anyone else looking for answers.

urbanorca8 said:I actually dig how they set up free English tutoring over in Mexico.
http://www.juznevesti.com/Drushtvo/B...leskog.sr.html

It really is commendable. We see similar initiatives here in the States every now and then, though within our actual school system, there is a permanent fixture for learning support known as remedial classes. The thing about these sessions is that attendance is entirely voluntary; no one can force a student to show up if they have no interest in being there. Consequently, most students don't bother showing up unless an exam is looming on the horizon. It really falls on the parents to push their children, to sit them down and negotiate a commitment to attend regularly if they are struggling with a particular subject. In my experience, the kids who typically show up for extra help are those who were out sick when a specific unit was covered. Those who truly need the help because they simply cannot grasp the material—despite having been present for the regular lessons—are the ones you rarely see. Then, of course, there are the cases where a child refuses to follow along in class, won't touch their homework, and won't study, yet they expect me to just pour everything into their heads during remedial sessions as if it were effortless.
I’m dealing with a situation this year with a seventh-grade group where five students failed their exams. Even though I'm not officially assigned to lead the remedial sessions for seventh graders—my extra hours are dedicated to fifth graders and specialized instruction for the seventh grade—I offered to meet with them once they had at least mastered the basics. I told them to reach out once they understood things like subjects, attributes, and adverbial modifiers, because I can't teach those concepts *for* them if they refuse to listen or participate; I can only clarify what they find confusing once they've put in the work. So far, only one student has taken me up on the offer, and after working together for two hours, he managed to pull a solid B.

Then you have the children whose parents have been paying for expensive private language academies for years, only for the kid to come home with a dismal D or a C in foreign language class. Some of those parents are understandably bitter, wondering how such a massive investment yielded such poor results. The answer is simple: a private academy offers no guarantees if the child has no desire to learn and instead just sits there idling through the hours. There is no mechanism to ensure progress if the will isn't there. That reality applies to every classroom, whether public or private.
At the end of the day, there has to be some semblance of willpower.

neonsailor26 said:Personally, I’d handle my own finances—I’m more than capable of pulling it off! I genuinely love learning and I’ve always been a hard worker... I'm certainly not lacking in the brainpower department. Plus, there are so many scholarship foundations out there specifically designed to support students, so I wouldn't be facing an impossible uphill battle. I also don't spend much time out at bars or coffee shops—maybe once a month tops—so I wouldn't be hemorrhaging cash on social outings either. And since I’d likely qualify for federal student aid, that would provide such a massive cushion for everything else...

As for the second part, no, there isn't a school like that in my town. In fact, there aren't any colleges in my area at all.

What exactly happens when you go out for coffee? Is she going to tie you to a radiator the next time you leave? What will happen if you actually decide to follow your own path? If you truly have legitimate reasons to move out on your own, then you should do it. Just try not to hurt her with your tone or say things you can't take back; let her know that you love her and appreciate everything she has done for you, but explain that you are moving forward, stating your reasons calmly and with affection. Regardless of what she says or how she reacts, try to maintain a steady composure and show some empathy for her fears and the pain of you leaving—especially if this might be forever.
As for your claim about being able to handle the finances, that sounds fine in theory, provided it's actually true. I don't know where you live or where you plan to study, but don't delude yourself into thinking scholarships just fall from the sky. My daughter maintained a 3.9 GPA during her first and second years of college in the States, and even she didn't qualify for certain merit-based grants. But if you can manage it, good for you. You need to account for groceries, three meals a day, toiletries, laundry supplies, cleaning products, textbooks, various registration fees, lab fees, and perhaps the occasional night out...
It seems more likely to me that you simply don't want to rely on your mother's apron strings anymore.

granitetiger102 said:Hey

I don't even know where to start—my life has been a total mental wreck for as long as I can remember. I'm 28 and honestly, nothing has ever gone right. I find myself thinking about ending it almost every single day. I look at everyone else and just *know* they’ve got it way better than me. I'm constantly on edge, but the biggest hit is that I can't land a decent job because I never finished high school. Every employer I've talked to has passed on me, so I'm broke, I can't go out, I can't do anything. I've even ghosted a few girls lately—not because I wasn't interested, but because I'm terrified of what happens when they realize the truth: that I've got no diploma and zero cash in my pocket 🤷 it's a brutal spot to be in. It's not like I'm lazy! I've taken whatever odd jobs were thrown my way, but without that high school diploma, I can't get anything steady 🤷 so everything I pull in is basically peanuts 🙂 I want to enroll in night school to get my GED, but it's too expensive, and my parents can't exactly bail me out... maybe if a friend could lend me the cash to get through it.

Bottom line, my mental state is trashed. All my relatives are killing it—driving luxury cars, landing huge corporate roles, the whole nine yards

I didn't mention why I dropped out of high school earlier, but some stuff went down back then—it was another hellish chapter of my life, but I won't get into the weeds right now.

I've lost hope of finding enough work to pay for classes. If I put myself in an employer's shoes, I get it—why would I hire someone without a diploma when there's a line of people who actually finished school?!

I even tried using a connection to get a foot in the door, and even that flopped

I was pulling some shifts at a warehouse earlier this summer, but now I can't even find something like that.

I feel like I'm on the edge, like I'm dead inside. Nothing brings me joy anymore. I'm just sinking deeper every day, and I've lost weight just from constant stressing -.-

A lot of my acquaintances and even Fred's crowd have no idea I didn't finish school. I'm too ashamed to tell them 🤷 and some of my family doesn't know either.

I just want to live a normal life for once—go out every weekend, have money for drinks, buy a car someday, maybe travel a bit, and see the bright side instead of always being stuck in the negative.

This past Saturday was rough too, so around 2 AM I headed to a bar, grabbed a few beers, and some girl was flirting and pinching me—for a second, I actually felt better. But the moment I got home and woke up the next day, reality hit: no job, no nothing. I spiraled right back into a depression. It feels like I'm never going to make it, and I'm running out of strength and hope to change things.

If anyone has advice, or knows someone without a diploma who's actually making it work, please let me know! I'm planning to sign up for night school in October if I can scrape together the cash by then.

The worst part is knowing my best years have just been wasted on stress and misery 😢

Your plan to enroll in night school is a solid one. I looked into the costs myself. It isn't cheap, but they do offer payment plans. At a local community college, for example, the annual tuition is around $2333, payable in four installments, with the first one being $833.

Maybe someone in your circle can help you out. There might also be student loans available. You could check with the local unemployment office to see what's available, or you could head down to the social services center to ask if there are any programs for subsidized education.

Jobs are scarce right now, but perhaps you could pick up some freelance or odd jobs to scrape together enough for school? Do you have a driver's license? If there aren't any official listings out there—like my own line of work, for instance—maybe you could take the initiative and hunt them down yourself: check in with local contractors, look for openings at a warehouse, a Home Depot, an auto detail shop, or even some agricultural work... just show up and ask in person. We're entering the season when people are stocking up on firewood; maybe you could lend a hand there. Or perhaps a moving company might need extra muscle...

From what I gather, you’re living with your parents, which means your housing and food are covered. To fund your education, you'll likely need to work for about three months, plus another month for everything else.
When you have a worthy goal—and yours certainly is—any job becomes bearable, even if it isn't exactly your dream work.

While you're mapping out how to execute this plan, try to remember that you actually have quite a lot going for you. You have family, a roof over your head, and the essentials that so many people struggle to find, all because you're healthy and, clearly, the girls in your life care about you 🙂, not to mention the fact that you still have ambitions and desires.

Perhaps you also need a hobby, some kind of pressure valve to let off steam.

You're only 28. Your whole life is stretching out ahead of you, and nothing is truly lost. I wouldn't go around advising everyone to move abroad, but there's more opportunity out there than what we see here at home. So, if you find yourself needing to head somewhere else for a while... why not?

Reach out to your friends, more intensely than ever before. Be honest with them and ask for advice, for company, or even for concrete help in finding work, whether it's steady or just temporary. As a stranger, I can tell you to take any job, even physical labor. If I knew you personally, I might hesitate to suggest such things... but if your friends know you're looking for anything at all, they might be able to point you in the right direction. They might not think to offer you anything if they don't realize you're searching.

One more thing. Don't feel ashamed about not having finished high school. While most people follow that path, if you stumbled or simply didn't have the luck, your genuine desire to fix that will earn you respect from any decent person.

Good luck.

I truly struggle to grasp why we can't simply take a blueprint from a system that actually works—take the Finnish model, for instance—and tailor it to fit our own domestic needs, rather than constantly insisting on reinventing the wheel. Is it just pure vanity, a sense of misplaced arrogance, or perhaps just a desperate need for someone to secure a kickback on a new curriculum or a revamped institutional framework?

hiddenpanther3 said:Venus, I would appreciate it if you refrained from posting in this thread further—it seems we have fundamentally different views of one another, and I get the impression you are simply looking to be hurtful.

Just to clarify for those of you offering support: my primary goal is to address this obsession. People aren't the issue—they are entirely irrelevant to me, and I have no desire to change that dynamic. I am quite comfortable as I am. I simply want to fix this for my own sake—to stop straining my eyes and perhaps lose a little weight...
I realize this might seem trivial to some, but walking away from the computer to eat elsewhere isn't as easy as it sounds. For me, this feels like a physical hunger; I cannot bring myself to eat anywhere else. I have tried, repeatedly, to the point of exhaustion, but nothing works. It likely sounds ridiculous to anyone who hasn't experienced it firsthand...
However, I am certain that anyone dealing with a similar struggle understands exactly what is at stake and how difficult it is to break free. If anyone reading this recognizes themselves in my words, I would truly value a conversation. To be honest, depression, relationships, or social circles aren't nearly as significant an issue as this compulsion.
It is easy for outsiders to judge and suggest simple fixes, like "just sit at the dining table instead." That is no different than telling an addict to quit drugs or a smoker to put down the cigarettes. I know because I smoke myself—and this may, in fact, be even more difficult...

If you were twenty-five and dating a seventeen-year-old, I might not have much to say, but at thirty-six... Have you truly considered the consequences for HER, for the youth she is losing? She might claim she’s happy, or she might be impressed by the attention of someone who is supposed to be mature, but the responsibility rested on YOU. Even if you entered into such a relationship, the burden was yours to end it out of love for her, if what you say about loving her is true. If she is a minor around sixteen or seventeen, I wouldn't call it pedophilia, but if she is younger...

But regarding your questions about overeating and the computer: you are acting with full premeditation the moment you purchase those quantities.
This is clearly a form of addiction. Stop going straight home after work. Go for a walk, give yourself a task outside the house, or strictly limit your screen time to three or four hours a day. Treat yourself to a bag of snacks or a pound of various fruits. If you don't keep them in the house, you won't graze.

Regardless of the specifics, you need to find a way to feel fulfilled and content. Life is far too short. You need a roadmap. What is it that you actually want?

If you cannot construct that roadmap on your own, you are going to need help, whether that comes from a friend or a professional.

Carol Anderson8 said:Alright, so I’ve basically scrolled through almost every single page in this thread, so now I’m throwing my own question into the ring to see how everyone would handle a specific situation. I’d love to hear all perspectives—especially from any professors or teachers hanging out on this forum.

Here’s the deal: my kid is in 6th grade. She isn't some straight-A genius, but she’s holding steady with solid Bs. At the start of school, she had a massive struggle with focus and concentration, but thank God, that’s actually improved over the years.
I’m not some drill sergeant pushing for perfect grades or anything like that. All I want is for her to give it her best shot. She’s killing it in certain subjects—like history and geography—but then she hits a wall with others, specifically math and English.
But here’s the kicker—as we all know, when it comes to getting into any high school, the grades that actually count for admissions are English, math, and that third core subject, and those are exactly the areas where she’s struggling the most. (And just to be clear: I'm not talking about some elite prep academy, just any decent high school, like a medical vocational program which is what she actually wants to do).

When she’s doing math at home, she works totally independently. She gets the concepts—she can connect the dots and follow the logic. But man, she makes these ridiculous, "facepalm" mistakes. Like, she’ll write a minus sign instead of a plus, or completely forget a set of parentheses. And obviously, the whole answer ends up being wrong because of it. If I point out a slip-up—like, "Hey, check if you copied that right"—she catches it immediately and solves it perfectly.
But on actual tests? It’s the same stupid mistakes every single time. It kills me because she’s sitting there with a D in math even though she genuinely understands the material and knows how to apply it. It’s not lack of knowledge; it’s just pure, unadulterated sloppiness. I’m wondering if anyone has any ideas on how I can help her get past this?

On top of that, she’s got a D in English. She just doesn't have a handle on grammar or literature, which are the absolute foundations for a good grade. She pulls As and Bs in spelling, reading assignments, and essays, but when it comes to the final grade, none of that matters if the grammar and lit components are a mess. It’s gotten to the point where I’m literally re-learning grammar myself just so I can explain things to her. I know the American English curriculum is packed, but honestly, one sentence in a notebook under the heading "personal pronoun" that says, "She asked him about the problem," isn't nearly enough for a kid to grasp how pronouns actually work.
Does anyone have advice on how to tackle this with her? Where can I find decent practice materials?
I’ve found a ton of worksheets online, but unfortunately, none of them come with an answer key, so I’m stuck having to study the material myself, solve everything, and then try to teach it to her.

Is anyone else dealing with something similar?

I am an upper-level English teacher. Based on what you've described, I suggest you look into starting the process for an individualized approach to her education as soon as possible. If you secure an appropriate educational plan, the girl will officially be granted the opportunity—and her teachers will be required—to facilitate her learning through special classroom accommodations. She will still be expected to master the same curriculum as every other student, and ultimately, her transcript won't even show that she had an individualized approach. Beyond making things easier for her, it will reduce her stress during testing and smooth the way for high school admissions (this year, for students in this situation, admission was direct via a recommendation from the Vocational Guidance Office at the Department of Labor). I want to emphasize that I am NOT suggesting a modified curriculum, but rather an individualized approach. This process is usually initiated by the school or a school physician. If you want to discuss this further, send me a private message.

Please don't let my suggestion frighten you. She won't be labeled or stigmatized in any way. If you have a meaningful conversation with her about it, you'll likely end up with a much calmer, happier child—at least when it comes to her schooling.

Best of luck.

Nicholas King said:I suspect most parents either already possess those skills themselves or, frankly, it's a bit too late in their lives to start acquiring them by making their kid's school projects...

What people call "posters" aren't actually posters at all; they are just a chaotic mess of cutouts or, if you’re lucky, some independently written paragraphs glued onto a large sheet of paper. I imagine professional graphic designers and fine artists would probably clutch their heads in exasperation if they saw them.

When it comes to those oversized displays used in classrooms, I struggle to see much value in them unless the students are creating them during class time—ideally working in pairs or small groups after they've actually processed the material and done some preliminary work (like studying, digging through extra resources suggested by the teacher, or collaborating with an art instructor on visual layouts...).

For the more diligent and capable students, it offers a chance to dive deeper into a subject; for those who are notoriously hard to motivate, it might spark some engagement; for the slackers, perhaps some knowledge will finally stick through collaborative effort; and for everyone, it serves as a lesson in teamwork (and for some, a chance to practice leadership and coordination).
In the end, everyone gets a brief reprieve from the usual repetitive methods, they have a bit of fun, they might actually learn something, and most kids genuinely enjoy the process of creating something alongside their peers.

But of course, it's foolish to pass judgment on it. I only hope this kind of thing is becoming less common.

As for the "posters" being churned out at home, I agree with you that it's often too late for many parents to suddenly become experts—you can tell just by looking at the walls in certain schools. I don't know how one is supposed to grade such a thing, but I certainly know what I would say to a parent who ends up doing their child's homework, and I'd have plenty to say to a teacher assigning such pointless busywork.

Surely we aren't seeing this even in first grade?!

fadedtrucker8 said:Most kids find it boring because they walk into first grade already knowing how to read, write, and do basic math..🤷

Third grade, however, seems to present a genuine challenge. 😉

Is this an actual challenge for you, or just for some third grader?

fadedtrucker8 said:You're acting like it’s some kind of high-stakes crisis... honestly, this is child's play. I guess about 90% of them end up with honors... and then God help us when they actually hit the real world. Of course, all the parents will be beaming with pride. Hahaha 🤣

It feels to me like you're already looking back from third grade, which is why you think first grade is such a "piece of cake." Anyone who actually grew up knows that for a six-year-old, starting first grade is just as massive an undertaking as a high school senior facing graduation at eighteen.

David Anderson49 said:The example I used comes straight from an official school textbook... or rather, a workbook. In every single one of those problems, you're expected to write out the calculation or equation first, and then provide the written answer.

I have a first-grade textbook sitting here right now. At the end of every lesson unit, there are these application problems.
For instance, if Jack London has six pencils and Gita has seventeen, how many pencils does Jack London need to take so that he ends up with the same amount as Gita?
The requirement is to set up the equation and then provide the solution.
Then, at the very back of the book, there's a section for "Math Brain Teasers"—which, according to the teacher's manual, are intended for gifted students. You'll find all sorts of things in there, ranging from logic puzzles that don't involve math at all to actual mathematical problems where you aren't explicitly told to set up an equation. They aren't graded, of course—they shouldn't be—but I suspect they're quite engaging for a lot of kids.

What entertaining little exercises. I’m practically itching to test these out with my own little girl (who's about five and a half). It’s all about practical application, isn't it? After all, what’s the point of any of this if they don't understand how to share strawberries, or whatever else they happen to be enjoying with a friend?

I assume we aren't actually looking for complex equations here. Just hand them some buttons, some beans, maybe some nails or candies along with two dolls and ten minutes of free time. I am convinced that any child of average ability could solve these types of problems, provided they have enough motivation, naturally.

The most endearing tasks are the ones that bypass math entirely in favor of pure logic. For instance, how much older will someone be in five years 🙂?

I remember a kid—a friend of my oldest daughter back in the day—who, at just four years old, could unerringly tell you exactly how many wheels a truck or a semi-trailer had, even if he was only seeing it from the side. He’d answer with total certainty. Yet, if you asked him what 6 times 2 was, he wouldn't have the slightest clue.

Then there was the case of a boy who was stuck in the eighth grade. He struggled with the basics whenever a problem became abstract; the multiplication table was such a nightmare for him that he’d practically break into a sweat trying to figure out 7 times 8. But, interestingly enough, he was an absolute pro at converting dollars to euros (his parents ran a local grocery store where he helped out from time to time).

As for grading in general, I find it largely unnecessary, particularly during those first three grades (and honestly, even later on).
In first grade, I truly believe it can do more harm than good for a child. A single letter grade simply cannot capture the nuances of a child's progress. There are so many other ways to express growth that are far more meaningful.
Well done, you drew that quite nicely. Just add some wheels and then your car might actually drive. (I wonder, what grade would that earn?)
Yes, you answered correctly; March is essentially still a winter month—most of its days fall under winter, even if spring starts creeping in during the second half. (And what grade would that get you?)

fadedviper65 said:@Paul Miller8

I’m planning on attending Stuyvesant High School.😉
So far, I’ve competed in math, computer science, physics, and English. This year, I’m also heading into German, history, geography, and potentially biology and tech.🙂
I was called up for the regional level in computer science, physics, and English. I would have gone for math too, but since it was my first competition of the year, I just couldn't find my focus—especially since it was my first time competing in math.
I’d definitely enter the chemistry competition if I had a mentor, but my teacher isn't interested in leading any extra chemistry sessions. According to school regulations, she's only required to host one extra credit hour, and she decided to dedicate hers to biology.🙄 She claims it would be against the rules for her to teach me chemistry during her biology session, fearing she'd run into serious trouble if an inspector happened to drop by during that specific period.(🤣). Even though she says I'm the best chemistry student she's ever taught, she's adamant about not taking on any extra hours that aren't officially compensated.🙄

I can certainly empathize with your situation; you deserve better, as all students do, but you are directing your grievances toward the wrong person. Your teacher isn't at fault for refusing to work beyond her mandated contract hours. You should take this up with the Secretary of Education and demand that they compensate your teacher for any additional labor. Why on earth should she work for free? If someone wants to volunteer, they will likely choose their own activities and the specific people they wish to serve; perhaps they might volunteer to deliver meals to the elderly or the infirm. But is that what you or your parents are doing? Or perhaps you engage in other volunteer work for the benefit of those in need, which, naturally, is done without compensation.

Paul Miller8 said:Hi everyone! Since this decision hits home for me, I thought I’d weigh in with my perspective. Right now, I’m sitting at a straight-A average—from first grade all the way through. I tend to stand out, both in my classroom and among my entire grade level. My goal is to get into a top-tier STEM high school, and honestly, I fully expect to make the cut. In my view, students like me should have a distinct advantage over those who didn't maintain perfect marks in fifth or sixth grade; if they missed those marks, it simply means they haven't fully mastered the material yet. On top of academics, I’ve got points from playing handball at the state level, and I might even pick up some extra credit this year through science fairs or English competitions. I see a lot of heated arguments here regarding "equality." Forgive me if I'm being blunt, but a kid who is barely scraping by and I are technically under the same set of rules. If he chooses not to take advantage of certain opportunities, that’s his call, and it shouldn't be the government's problem to balance the budget because of it. What kind of reward would that actually be for me? To work my tail off for years, only to end up in the exact same position as someone who couldn't be bothered to try? To me, that isn't equality. As for the vocational students—two guys in my class are incredibly sharp. They’ve really got that spark, you know? Their report cards don't look like mine, but if they put their minds to it, I truly believe hitting a straight-A average is well within their reach. Both are heading toward technical schools; one plans on going to a university, the other doesn't. At no point have I looked down on them as a future honors student, nor do I consider them any less valuable. I believe even a student who is just passing is just as worthy of respect. However, I am going to prove my value in one arena, while he will prove his in another. That is exactly what I worked for—and it’s why others (or lack thereof) didn't succeed. We can become whatever we set our minds to, but it requires effort. And effort? That has nothing to do with equality. A truly great student will demonstrate that through almost any admissions system. At the end of the day, some sort of standardized entrance process has to exist.

I am genuinely stunned by the mindset of an eighth grader! Both your reasoning and your way of expressing yourself (not to mention your literacy) are remarkable.
I find myself wondering where children like you disappear to during their later schooling and how they eventually become entirely mediocre. I truly hope this educational system doesn't stifle you the way it has many others, and that by the time you are twenty-five or thirty, you can still articulate your thoughts clearly, precisely, and with substance.
I also wonder what today's politicians were thinking when they were fifteen, and if they were actually thinking at all.