Posts by hiddenrider66

So, here’s why we’re complaining.

favorite said:Just jumping in for a second. I arrived in Kyiv on business five days ago and I’ll be here for two weeks (representing a German IT firm). It’s a good thing I didn't rely on the info being posted here, because based on those threads, you’d think Nazi columns were marching through the streets and the people were starving in lines at half-empty shops, cooking over wood fires because there’s no gas. I have to admit, reading this thread actually worried my family quite a bit before I left.

Kyiv and the Ukrainians have honestly charmed me. The city is beautiful, and the people are incredibly calm. They really appreciate and like Americans. The city is full of all sorts of shops, and prices are a bit lower than back home. Traffic can be chaotic at times, but the local transit system is arguably better than what we have in Chicago.
The restaurants are beautifully done, and the local food is delicious. Our servers could probably learn a thing or two about politeness and professionalism from the Ukrainians.
I also walked through the famous Maidan, where a few tents still remain, and along the upper street, there are tires and barricades alongside flowers and candles for the fallen. There’s a ton of souvenirs for sale, but I didn't see any weapons anywhere. Just a few people sitting lazily around in worn-out camo uniforms. Yesterday, I passed by where some protests happened, and they didn't look even remotely fascist. I didn't see a hint of fascism anywhere, nor did anyone speak ill of Russians—just of Putin and the former president. My host, who was showing me around, Sergei, says he was born Russian right here and speaks Russian everywhere without anyone giving him a dirty look. He says he doesn't even know Ukrainian. He told me that this isn't a conflict between Russians and Ukrainians but rather something that grew out of a desire to replace an extremely corrupt government that has embedded itself into every layer of society. He also mentioned that the separatists in the east are largely funded by former President Yanukovych, and that his relatives in Luhansk don't actually support the separatists, but they're just afraid of losing their homes to squatters regardless of being Russian. He said they need a total purge of the old guard and that Russian propaganda is incredibly effective, leading many people (myself included, before arriving) to fall for stories about Nazis and ethnic issues in Ukraine. If I have time, I’ll write more, but I have to say most of you guys here are completely mistaken.

Greetings from sunny, park-filled Kyiv.

Something clearly isn't right when the picture presented to people coming here to read this topic is so distorted. Let me say it again—maybe that’s the goal for someone here?

For the admin.

Hawker said:Anyone who tries to compare these... Ukrainian criminals from the National Guard. Someone's out here disrespecting the National Guard and everything we went through during the Homeland War.

Here’s another interesting one for you.

Hawker said:That’s a completely wrong conclusion to draw. It shows a total lack of perception regarding how things actually stand on the ground.☕

The junta is currently in power in Ukraine. It’s got the exact same MO as... Milosevic.
Novorusija is fighting for its very survival, much like America.

Some people feel perfectly fine throwing around terms like "junta," calling National Guard members "criminals," or talking about "grounded pilots." Yet, the second someone uses the word "pro-Russian," suddenly everyone starts playing defense. Pick a lane.

The problem is that posts like this just keep bubbling up on this thread constantly. Honestly, maybe that’s exactly what some people are aiming for.

A little more recent history for you:

division said:Every new nation starts by breaking away from whatever came before it. In that sense, Ukraine only exists because the Bolsheviks and Lenin carved it out of Russia.

How am I even supposed to have a coherent conversation under these conditions?

@ wiredangler5 I see you actually put some effort into that response, and I respect it.
The whole Ukraine situation is incredibly messy and heavy, and if people want to debate it—well, there’s plenty to talk about. But honestly, every argument eventually boils down to just a few tired talking points:
1)- Hold on, winter is coming, they'll run out of gas, freeze, and end up crawling back to Russia; 2)- Oh look, they beat the Maidan protesters again, those guys were the real deal, and these idiots are just letting themselves get beaten up; 3)- America is the root of all evil.
The Moderators can't really do anything about this mess. That's why so many people have just given up and walked away. I'd probably do the same, so I only pop back in occasionally just to drop what I consider essential links regarding the whole story. That's how I'll keep handling it moving forward.
edit: regarding the emojis, there was a misunderstanding: one of the moderators banned me from using the word "pro-," so now I'm stuck wondering how to even write about users who take a pro-Russian or pro-Ukrainian stance. That's all.

Emily Patel64 said:@ wiredangler5, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but your personal bias clearly shapes the way you curate threads on this sub, and honestly, it colors the entire political tone here.
After lurking through this system for a few years now, I’ve become pretty certain about it. So, there—just thought I'd let you know.

And just for the record, those pro-Russia spammers were nothing more than a reaction to that nauseating pro-American... excuse me, pro-Ukraine propaganda that’s been flooding the place since this crisis kicked off.
It’s simple physics: action and reaction.

They fit right in, and they were moderated just as heavily, which explains why everyone except a handful of people eventually just walked away.🙂

Arthur Fowler83 said:Gentlemen, do you actually have any proof for what you're claiming? Verified intel from the ground? Video footage? Photos?

I won't speak for anyone else, but I've been tracking the situation in Ukraine for months now. If you look back, almost everything I've posted has been based on logic and evidence, and the vast majority of it turned out to be spot on.

My goal has always just been to figure out the truth about what's happening in Ukraine, and honestly, the truth is pretty ugly for the Kyiv-based government.

Look, this isn't some sports match between Russia and Ukraine. A lot of people here act like die-hard fans, seemingly oblivious to the fact that people are dying in Donbas every single day. It’s frankly disgusting to cheer for the Kyiv regime while their military is shelling civilians or hitting residential areas.

And let's drop the whole "attack on a sovereign nation" narrative. Ukraine was never truly sovereign, especially not during these last four months while they've been being run directly out of Brussels and Washington.

Ukraine is a textbook puppet state, and a puppet state isn't a sovereign one.

Admins, I'm asking nicely, just like my colleague said—change the thread title so it actually fits!
They're just pushing propaganda here too, now that they've kicked everyone else out.😲

How I finally figured out the admin:
People are staying active. Who exactly is complaining? There's nothing we can do about it on our end.
There are more of them out there. Who's to blame? Honestly, there isn't much we can do about it here.
The level of discussion here is pretty low. Even the pro-Ukraine crowd—by the way, is that even the right way to refer to them? 😕The posts here are starting to sound like mindless hooligan chants. There's nothing left for us to work with. It feels like out of all the Ukrainians around, only Practice is still actually contributing anything meaningful.
If they actually managed to trip any wires, we’d be absolutely drowning in complaints from all the pro-Russia crowd. 😕 Look at the reason above. Honestly, this thread would probably die out anyway, though I suspect it’s already dead to the public in its current state.
Just to sum things up—those hardcore pro-Ukraine types really ought to just walk away from this thread entirely. Maybe we should just start a new subforum under a different name with a different moderator. Someone who actually knows how to set some decent guidelines from day one so we can have an actual conversation for once. And where exactly would you find more people with diverse perspectives, given the current political climate? Besides, the "pro-Russia" crowd would still have their own dedicated thread, so there wouldn't be any reason to go rushing over to this other one anyway.

division said:So what are they waiting for? Was there an official draft? Why aren't they already over there? What are they still looking for at the Maidan?

Maybe they just don't feel like it? Are the fighters for New Russia not just clay pigeons like those cops sacrificed by Yanukovych?? What's the issue?? Haven't they realized there's no more fighting happening at the Maidan?

Go on then, kids, charge toward New Russia—see who gets a funeral service and who stays face down in the dirt!!!

There you go. A perfect example of the kind of posts we constantly deal with in this thread. I'd love to see how the admin would classify this one.

I’m not entirely sure if the separatists are busy kidnapping people and murdering 19-year-old girls at checkpoints—by the way, another woman was killed at a checkpoint just a few days ago—or if they're more focused on taking down Russian helicopters and jets, rolling through cities in tanks, and blowing up bridges and railways.

I’m in total agreement.
First off, hardly anyone is even posting anymore, except for those Practice voters in the poll for a "pro-European Ukraine." It’s all just people voting for a "pro-Russian Ukraine." That’s a plain fact you can verify pretty easily—just check the thread and see who’s actually participating.
They call dead Ukrainian pilots "grounded," and they constantly describe Ukraine as some kind of "miracle land"—a non-existent country (not that Putin hasn't said the same thing himself). Meanwhile, I'm being lectured about calling the forum users who voted for a "pro-Russian Ukraine" (whatever that's supposed to mean) pro-Russians.

Charles Fox10 said:You aren't actually making a point; you’re just fueling a fire over a thread that isn't even there anymore. That post was from yesterday, yet here you are, dragging it out through ten different replies and refusing to let it go.
And I'll say it again: that post everyone saw is gone. It doesn't exist.

Personally, I don't see any reason to start slapping "pro-Russia" labels on people. Honestly, I haven't seen anyone on this board get called a "pro-Ukraine" sympathizer once. There's really no need for that kind of labeling.

Then why do posts about aircraft still stick around? Do those suddenly make sense now?

Take a look at these poll results: "In this conflict, I side with..."
NATO, the EU, and pro-Western Ukraine: 87 (29.59%)
Russia and pro-Russian Ukraine: 139 (47.28%)
I'm staying neutral:

All these users who claim they want a "pro-Russian Ukraine"—at the end of the day, they voted for exactly that. They cheer for it, they stay loyal to that side, and they seem perfectly fine with seeing the country torn apart and the citizens freezing because they won't have Russian gas. If you don't believe me, just look at the thread history.

I’m not sure if I should even be replying here. If this is against the rules, just ban me, but you asked, so here goes. The whole thing about aircraft came up because someone wrote that "the planes are grounded, and the pilots are earthbound". I called that incredibly cynical. Then the debate shifted to which specific planes we were talking about and whether calling dead pilots "earthbound" was somehow okay. Now, all that's left is that one bit of talk about the planes.
As for the pro-Russia crowd, the poll didn't ask "pro-Russia Ukraine vs. pro-EU," did it? So, I don't see why you can't call the group rooting for Russia "pro-Russians"—or, if we're being picky, "pro-Ukrainians"? You really think that's on the same level as calling dead pilots "earthbound"?

There are still pro-Russian posts cluttering this thread, talking about those "grounded" Hawker pilots. You all wiped them out immediately.

AndrewX said:You missed a tiny detail—how after three days, they finally figured out it wasn't a Cessna 208 on a humanitarian mission, but actually a Beechcraft King Air?

AndrewX said:The Beechcraft King Air was shot down while providing artillery spotting, while the Boeing 747 was loaded up with troops and military gear. Both were legitimate military targets.

In Lugansk, the A-10 Warthot Quote did the dirty work.

AndrewX said:Since he won't answer, I will.🙂

Initially, the American Department of Defense claimed from the start that villains downed the Cessna 208 during a humanitarian mission (they weren't specific about which kind) and that both pilots died heroically because they tried to steer the plane away from populated areas to avoid casualties. They sang that tune for a few days, then suddenly, without any explanation, changed the story from a Cessna 208 to a Beechcraft King Air, which was on a slightly different mission—something confirmed by audio recordings from the crash (mentioning artillery fire).

As for the Boeing 747, it was packed with about seventy soldiers (plus crew, if you care), military equipment, and several armored vehicles—all being ferried to an airfield where bloody battles had been raging for days, a zone we all knew on this forum would be seeing missiles hitting anything that looked remotely like an aircraft.

They can play dumb all they want, but those were all legitimate military targets. That’s a far cry from the administrative building in Lugansk, which the American "heroes" leveled with a volley of unguided rockets, then conveniently blamed on a projectile fired by the rebels themselves—which probably just got sucked in by a hot AC compressor in some office.

A grand funeral for some locally made armored vehicles:
http://youtu.be/asgLzCqFFC4

🙂

Yesterday we were going down a rabbit hole discussing the situation in Ukraine, and one guy on the forum dropped this line about downed aircraft and dead pilots: "Their aviation problem is solved because the planes are grounded and the pilots are grounded too." Honestly, the cynicism just floored me. Calling dead people—actual pilots who lost their lives—just "grounded"... I found him completely repulsive. Turns out, I was the only one bothered by it. Everyone else seemed to think it was a clever little joke or some witty comeback. What do you all think? Is someone who talks like that actually "charismatic," or just a jerk?

I’m reaching out to the moderator of the Ukraine thread. Yesterday, hiddenrider66 posted about dead pilots—entire crews—and downed aircraft, including two transport helos (one during a supposed ceasefire) and a Boeing 747 with nine crew members. He basically said, "The aviation issue is settled—planes are grounded and pilots are grounded." Just a little euphemism there. Today, my post gets deleted, while everyone else's posts regarding this topic stay up. Here’s the thread:
Quote:
AndrewX says:
You missed a few details. After three days, they finally figured out it wasn't a Cessna 208 on a humanitarian mission, but a Beechcraft King Air.

Quote:
Hawker says:
He overlooked a lot in his rush to justify the civilian killings using those Su-25 Quote and Hind types.

I guess it just stings when a criminal flying those things ends up dead.

Quote:
AndrewX says:
Can't blame the pilots for following orders.

sukKi said:
🤣

People are dead. Is it really okay to call them "grounded"? Regardless of who they were, calling a full flight crew "grounded" feels like a bad joke.
Terrorists die too, but you don't see anyone on the pro-Ukraine side acting all high and mighty or calling them "grounded."
Meanwhile, a post from a user following the Practices had its red card pulled.

Practices said:
The Ukrainian president is explaining how Russia isn't supporting peace in Ukraine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lwjt6yioUhA

Maybe someone can explain what's actually going on here.

So, this is how everyone approaches the debate—we all supposedly agree that Rock is a terrible moderator. No, my friend, we don't agree on that at all. It’s actually just unclear why it isn't enough for the Russian sympathizers to completely dominate a thread with a four-to-one post ratio just because they’re trying every trick in the book to drive away anyone who thinks differently. Someone writes a post, and their response is basically, "Why don't you just leave already?" A person hasn't even done anything wrong, yet they get trashed. Then they're left wondering, "Why was my post deleted?" Back when there were polls, every single newcomer would constantly stir the pot over the voting, even though they were clearly being steered, and those newcomers ended up packing up and leaving even faster due to the insults and condescension. This obsession with dominance is considered sub-par, and I guess that's why Rock doesn't work for them. If it weren't for Rock, a few of us others would have cleared out of there ages ago, leaving nothing but Russians behind.
Anyway, I have an idea. On a lot of forums, there's a sort of chat area where you can talk about current events in a more relaxed atmosphere. We don't have that here. If people want to chat about their new avatars or maybe make some comparisons to Syria, they can't. If we could allow that under some collective heading like "Politics—What's New?"—not exactly that title, obviously, since we have poets here—maybe someone can come up with a better name. 🙂

Let's talk about clones—apparently, there are three of us pro-Ukraine types here: me, Collins, and Practice. Who’s cloning whom? I’m certainly nobody’s clone. If you think Collins and Practice are the same person, you’re getting close to your goal; instead of three of us, there are only two. I’ll just leave, and you can have your Collins-Practice duo to yourselves. It should be easy enough since he’s supposedly "cheap." Even if you manage to drive Rock away, won't things get a bit boring?
Blog—I’ve never allowed more than four posts per page, especially without links, because if I don't let people actually talk, it's just a blog. This is a forum.
I’ve never felt the need to say I don't care about someone's opinion or that someone is being annoying. Again, this is a forum, and aside from the moderators, we all have the same rights. If someone really gets on my nerves, I just use the ignore button. We aren't in kindergarten; there's no need for shouting matches. (And that doesn't include trying to hijack the forum by dropping 30 posts in a single day on the Ukraine thread without any links—that's blatant trolling).
Labeling an interlocutor is the absolute bottom of the barrel for me. People only do that when they're weak—when they can no longer offer a decent, human rebuttal, so they resort to calling things "stupid" or telling someone they "need a doctor" or a psychiatrist...
If we’re laughing at Psaki, I guess everyone else is fair game, right? Putin isn't an exception either.
Shall we move on?

Just an example here. I’m just sharing my take like everyone else does—not attacking anyone—yet you all jumped straight to labeling and attacking me. Why? Is this about me, or is it about the moderator, Rocky?
Seriously, am I not allowed to have an opinion here?
Aside from me, who else among the pro-Ukraine crowd—there are only three of us left on this thread, mind you—has actually said anything? Instead, you lot have turned this into a literal witch hunt (thanks, Rocky) in your little echo chamber.
Has anyone else supporting Ukraine actually called their opponent a small-minded brat or suggested they need therapy?
Anyway, I get it. Truth hurts, and clearly, you guys prefer a private club where you can vent about your personal biases without anyone disrupting the vibe. I'll head over to the Russia thread for a while so I don't get in your way. Best.
btw @Zachary Torres81/">@@Zachary Torres81 - if you hadn't posted those certain Kremlin-style Russian images—you know the ones—I wouldn't have posted those hits either. I only did it as a direct response to your post. Provocation breeds provocation.

Well, goldenowl73 is right; it’s just a fact. Some pro-Russia types treat this thread like a personal diary. For instance, just recently I counted 8 posts from one guy on one page and another 6 on the next, all without a single link—just his endless opinions. Blah. There are actual blogs for that. Plus, the same guy explicitly stated he doesn't care what I think, which basically confirms it's perfect blog material.
Another person keeps using the word "hunta." Given there's a legitimate government over there, that term has absolutely nothing to do with them.
Then you have people replying to each other like they're buddies on Facebook.
If myself and Practix didn't show up, the only pro-Ukraine person left would be Collins, whom you've all labeled as "ignorant" a hundred times over.
I have to admit, like many others, I once thought about staying away entirely. It feels like this thread could just as easily be renamed "Pro-Russia" or "Glory to Putin," or whatever else suits your mood.
Calling it anything else besides aggression is a stretch; that's the only way to describe the situation in this topic.
If you want to be left alone, fine, no problem. Just keep posting twisted Russian propaganda and inaccurate translations (like that nonsense about 9000 hryvnia in three months).
But
the thing that sticks with me is something I read somewhere stating this is actually the goal of Russian propaganda—to occupy every internet information niche and drive people away from forums through obnoxious behavior.
Well, I'm not backing down. See ya around. 🙂)))))))