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Hangover vs. Workout: Does it actually work? in Hobbies & Leisure · Feb 20, 2014

Eric Murphy2 said:Has anyone ever actually tried this? Is it even a good idea, or is it dangerous for your health? I went a little too hard on the drinks last night, and I have a workout scheduled today (mostly cardio), so I’m wondering if anyone has advice on what to watch out for. I drank quite a bit, though I don't feel terrible—can you actually sweat out alcohol, or is that risky since hangovers are basically just dehydration? For context, I'm in pretty good shape overall.

A light session at about 50-60% intensity for maybe 30 to 45 minutes is probably your best bet. It should help the body process things through sweating, urination, and increased respiration. Just make sure you stay incredibly hydrated both before and during the session. Wear something breathable so your body can "breathe," and please, avoid any complex movements that require heavy coordination; your central nervous system is likely still a bit scrambled from the alcohol.

I'd suggest doing a 10-minute warmup, followed by about 20 minutes of some light circuit training, and then finishing with 10 to 15 minutes of steady-state aerobic work on a treadmill, elliptical, or bike just to get a good sweat going. That should do the trick. If you have access to some electrolytes, mix them into your water and sip them before, during, and after the workout.

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 22, 2014

All this bickering you guys are doing is actually helping people on this forum (sarcasm intended, obviously). Instead of offering some actual, concrete advice to the guy who asked the question, you’re all acting like elementary schoolers comparing sizes. Please, just get it through your heads: there is NO SINGLE BEST METHOD. Everyone has their own philosophy based on certain principles and perspectives. My philosophy centers on stretching and strengthening, while you all have yours—and that's fine. Doing something tangible is always better than endless philosophizing; while you're all busy arguing over which way is best, the guy will be out there fixing his posture using my method :P

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 16, 2014

And here is a more detailed article: Check out this article from T-Nation about fixing that hunched-over posture: http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_training_article/how_to_fix_that_hunchback

The author of this article is Mike Robertson.

Mike received his masters degree in Sports Biomechanics AT Ball State University. Mike received his masters degree in Sports Biomechanics at Ball State University. Mike received his masters degree in Sports Biomechanics AT Ball State University. During his time there, he was heavily involved in varsity strength and conditioning as well as research within the human performance lab. On top of that, Robertson is also an accomplished powerlifter, having competed at the national level and coached at the world level.

If this guy doesn't grasp body posture, then honestly, I don't know who does!

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 16, 2014

rustybadger42 said:Not quite.
Just because a muscle feels constantly tight doesn't mean it's actually weak.
That kind of muscle is just stiff.
You won't get anywhere by trying to force it—it’ll just snap right back to being stiff after a little while.
And that’s exactly why that famous old mantra—"stretch, strengthen, repeat"—just doesn't deliver those kind of lasting, enviable results. 😉

I actually just finished chatting with a rather well-known physical therapist; I’m lucky enough that we work in the same building. 🙂

First off, I have to say you're spot on regarding this part: "A constantly and persistently stretched muscle doesn't mean it's actually weak."

His take was that while the back muscles might be overstretched, they don't necessarily have to be weak. It's more that the muscles on the front side feel stronger, which is why you need to stretch them while strengthening the back muscles to restore balance and bring the body back into proper posture.

However, I think you're mistaken when you say, "you won't get anywhere trying to strengthen it because after a little while, it’ll just snap right back to that same rigid state."

It won't happen if you train consistently using the right principles and actually fix your posture.

He explained it like this:

When dealing with postural issues caused by poor habits (like sitting too much, for instance), you end up with excessive tone and shortening in the muscles on the front of the body (those are the ones I mentioned earlier that need stretching). At the same time, you definitely need to strengthen the muscles in the back. But according to him, the most critical thing—aside from that stretching and strengthening—is developing the core. The biggest reason for poor posture is often that the core isn't functioning correctly (and by core, I mean the pelvic, abdominal, and lower back muscles).

To put it simply, he summarized it this way:

1) Postural issues stem from muscle imbalances.
2) You need to get the core functioning properly again.
3) You must stretch and strengthen the specific muscles I listed in my first post.
4) The ratio of front-to-back training should roughly be 1:3.

So, if you really think I'm wrong, don't just lecture me on the philosophy of it—tell me exactly what you think the actual solution is.

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 15, 2014

rustybadger42;48378330 said:
Richard Cook2 said:Please, just pick up any book regarding the correction of functional postural issues. You don't even need a book—just head over to Google Scholar and search for exercises for kyphosis or lordosis... ugh, I honestly can't be bothered anymore...

Besides, how exactly would you "influence" the CNS? Would you stick an electrode into someone's brain and start poking around? There's a reason the nervous system utilizes afferent and efferent pathways; it functions on a stimulus-response loop. Think about a stroke survivor who can no longer walk: they have to relearn how to walk. They do this by working with the periphery—using their limbs—to essentially "teach" the CNS how to execute a movement it once knew perfectly well.

It isn't the first time I've heard this. 😁 We are talking about healthy people with postural issues, yet you're lecturing me about people in a vegetative state. At this rate, we might as well just resort to lobotomies. 😵

But please, do go ahead and continue promoting yourself and your little website. 😉

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 15, 2014

Nicole Ross said:If you're right, then my bad—I apologize for wasting your precious time. You’d probably be much better off spending it reading up on neurology, how the brain actually functions, or the development of motor skills during growth. You might actually pick up something useful that way.

Cheers

I read those books ages ago, friend; honestly, I'm surprised you've even heard of them given your level of expertise 😉 Anyway, enjoy yourself

p.s. I won't be looking back at your posts anymore, so save yourself the trouble and don't bother writing to me—well, feel free to write, but don't expect a reply xD

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 15, 2014

Nicole Ross said:Question

Does the CNS control our hands and legs, or do our hands and legs control the CNS?

It’s probably the latter, right?

Which means—get this—the CNS actually changes through movement. The desire for movement comes from consciousness, and if you change the stimulus, you change the movement itself. This shift happens in the conscious part of the brain because that's where we learn new movements and new motor combinations. And, importantly, there aren't reflexes in that specific part of the brain.
So, if a body gets stuck in a hunched-over posture, it basically means the CNS has developed "wrong" proprioception regarding how it holds itself.
And you can actually fix that by changing that proprioception—effectively correcting the CNS commands via different stimuli. By doing that, you alter the feedback loop of the sensorimotor circuit. It’s a way to change posture in a fast, easy, and painless way, which in turn fixes the issues caused by suboptimal posture. Most people don't even realize they're hunched over because, to them, that's just their "normal" state—they only feel the consequences when they hold it too long.

Have you ever seen cases where a child's motor skills and range of motion are altered by placing electrodes in the brain, or is there another way to achieve that?

Sure, you could try to fix posture through strengthening and stretching, but that takes forever—plus, the margin for error is huge. There's a very real chance you'll just end up stuck in a constantly tense, hyper-toned body as you get older.

Please, let's not get too philosophical here xD

Of course you manage movements via the CNS, but please tell me: how are you going to stimulate the CNS without movement?

Besides, the entire concept of training (especially strength and conditioning) is about stimulating the CNS with various exercises.
When you lift a weight, you're adapting the CNS to send signals to the muscles; the heavier the weight, the more motor units are recruited. That's at least the fundamental postulate of training.

In this scenario, the goal of training is to balance out the muscles that distort body posture. If something is weak and overstretched—like the back in someone with kyphosis—then those back muscles need strengthening (though I'll just say "the back" for the sake of simplicity rather than specifying certain muscles), and you certainly wouldn't want to strengthen the chest, which would only pull the shoulders further forward and add even more imbalance to the existing problem!

The pectoral muscle originates from the sternum and ribs and attaches to the front of the shoulder (the humerus); the more you strengthen it, the more it pulls that attachment point toward the origin. To "reverse" this process, you have to stretch the chest and strengthen the opposing muscles that pull the shoulders back (rhomboids, middle and lower trapezius, posterior deltoid, rotator cuff) to return the shoulder to balance.

Since it seems you aren't exactly an expert in theoretical knowledge and might be a bit lazy or stubborn, maybe do a little digging online. Just go to a gym and look at the "buff" guys and their profile posture. They are all hunched forward with internal shoulder rotation because they mostly train "mirror muscles"—the ones they see in the mirror—like the chest (bench pressing countless sets at least twice a week, shoulder presses, dips, push-ups, etc.), biceps, and anterior deltoids. Meanwhile, the back gets neglected, not to mention the legs. Scientific research has established an imbalance between the anterior and posterior shoulder in the general population, and that imbalance is 3-6 times higher in those who train. Not to mention that maybe 1 out of 100 people in a gym actually stretches.😁

Just look at how kinesiology rehabilitation for kyphosis, lordosis, or scoliosis looks in a clinic with professionals. I'm certainly not rambling about this for no reason; I studied this in kinesiology therapy, researched it independently, and the people teaching us were experienced therapists and doctors. We practically had to sing "stretch, strengthen, repeat" because they hammered it into our heads so much xD

My question is:

Is it actually possible to be this stubborn nowadays? We live in an era where you're just a few clicks away from watching videos of doctors and therapists demonstrating how to resolve these issues and what they recommend to the general public (hint: YouTube). It’s equally effortless to dig up scientific studies (hint: Google Scholar), or you could simply head down to your local library and grab a textbook on kinesitherapy and postural rehabilitation.

The worst part isn't even that you're claiming otherwise or that we're stuck here bickering; the real issue is that the person who originally came here looking for help is going to walk away feeling confused and won't take any action at all. It would have been much better to offer that person some concrete advice instead of focusing on my posts. But I suppose that's just the standard for these forums—people don't seem to know how to actually help, yet they are experts at "finding flaws" in someone who genuinely wants to provide assistance. My advice to you is this: if you truly believe you have the expertise, then focus on advising the individual and ignore my contributions entirely. Not because I think I'm the smartest person in the room or that I have all the answers, but simply because you certainly aren't going to change my mind by arguing with me. 😉

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 14, 2014

rustybadger42;48370658 said:
Richard Cook2 said:Look, guys, I’m going to ask this once: please, do yourselves a favor and actually look up the information on your own before coming here to pester me. I really don't want to deal with people spamming this thread with basic questions they could have answered in five minutes with a quick search. It makes it impossible for anyone else to actually find the specific info they came here looking for.

If you want to understand how stretching actually teaches the central nervous system to lower muscle tone, you really need to dig into the physiology of Golgi tendon organs and muscle spindles located within your muscles and tendons. It’s also worth looking into how reflexes play a role in that process. You shouldn't have any trouble finding some solid resources online if you just search for something like "stretching and flexibility physiology."

"If someone is presenting with Kyphosis, it simply means their anterior muscle tone is far too high." Honestly, that's a bit of a fallacy—there isn't really a "front" or a "back" when you're looking at the body as a single, integrated system.
It’s defined that precisely because the body isn't just some flat, two-dimensional object. The muscles I mentioned are essentially shortened or tight, and they're pulling everything out of alignment.
The body leans forward because the muscles I mentioned earlier have become overstretched and weakened on the opposite side, leaving them without any functional tension.
The concept of "forces" used to align the body—well, if you want to truly grasp what I’m getting at here, you really ought to have a more solid grasp of human anatomy. It isn't just about moving parts around; it's about understanding how those internal tensions actually interact.
I’ve been spending quite a bit of time lately diving deep into the mechanics of muscle function—specifically looking at origin points, insertion points, and the underlying physiology that governs how they actually move. It's one thing to know which muscle you're working, but it's a whole different ballgame when you start analyzing the actual physics of the contraction and how those attachment points dictate the entire range of motion.

The principle is actually quite straightforward: if you're tight or stiff, you need to stretch. If you're loose or weak, you need to strengthen. Honestly, I feel like this is the kind of thing they should be teaching clearly back in elementary school science class. xD

The idea that a problem rooted in the Central Nervous System can be fixed by focusing solely on the periphery just doesn't hold water. The CNS and the periphery are inextricably linked—it’s an interconnected web, much like everything else in the human body. How exactly do you think a muscle contraction even occurs? It starts with the CNS sending signals down through the spinal cord. You can't address one side of the equation while ignoring the other.
which stimulate the muscles through the nervous system. Of course, to truly grasp that, one would need a deep understanding of muscle contraction physiology—concepts like actin, myosin, Z-discs, and all that good stuff...

In short: please don't pester me or confuse someone who is just looking for a little help!

Please, just pick up any book regarding the correction of functional postural issues. You don't even need a book—just head over to Google Scholar and search for exercises for kyphosis or lordosis... ugh, I honestly can't be bothered anymore...

Besides, how exactly would you "influence" the CNS? Would you stick an electrode into someone's brain and start poking around? There's a reason the nervous system utilizes afferent and efferent pathways; it functions on a stimulus-response loop. Think about a stroke survivor who can no longer walk: they have to relearn how to walk. They do this by working with the periphery—using their limbs—to essentially "teach" the CNS how to execute a movement it once knew perfectly well.

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 14, 2014

Arthur Williams said:Exercise and running have been huge lifesavers for me—though I still catch myself slouching quite a bit, especially when I'm sitting at my desk—but I've become way more mindful of it lately and try to correct it. Honestly, it’s just so much easier to maintain good posture if I get a workout and some stretching in first thing in the morning.

That makes perfect sense. It’s because those weaker muscles have been activated during your workout, allowing them to maintain tone for several hours afterward. To keep that benefit long-term, you really need to stimulate those stretched muscles daily to sustain that tone, while also making sure to stretch out any muscles that are overactive so they can finally relax.

😉

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 14, 2014

Nicole Ross said:So, how exactly does stretching teach the CNS to dial back the muscle tone?
If someone’s dealing with Kyphosis, it means their anterior tone is cranked way too high—but here’s the kicker: the nervous system thinks this is perfectly "normal." I mean, if it didn't think this was the baseline, wouldn't the anterior tension be lower, allowing them to actually stand up straight?
But if the CNS has already decided this state is "normal," why on earth would it bother changing?
How is it even possible for the definition of "normal" to shift so drastically just from sitting around all day? And why does the front of their body hurt so much when they try to stretch backward to straighten out?
Think about it—if the current length of those anterior muscles is now considered "normal," wouldn't strengthening them actually pull the front side even tighter? Wouldn't that just signal the CNS to tighten things up even more to maintain that "normal" status quo?
The result? You end up with an even tighter front side and an even tighter back side, which just kills whatever rotational mobility they had left—which is probably already pretty pathetic to begin with.

Do you honestly think the CNS can be retrained through the pain caused by stretching? And if that were the case, why aren't little kids constantly stretching to lengthen their anterior side and strengthen their posterior side just so they can eventually stand up and walk?

jaks;48361699 said:
Richard Cook2 said:So, how exactly do you propose we fix muscle imbalances then? Just by magic? If a muscle is weak or overstretched because the central nervous system is inhibiting it, you actually have to strengthen it—you have to "teach" the brain to send signals back to those muscles so they can regain tone. It works the opposite way for muscles that are chronically tight; you need to stretch them to teach the CNS to dial down that tension. This is pretty much Kinesiology 101, so please, let's keep the unsolicited advice to a minimum while we're trying to help this guy out. Unless, of course, you have some actual scientific data or a solid explanation to back up your claim!

Look, guys, I’m going to ask this once: please, do yourselves a favor and actually look up the information on your own before coming here to pester me. I really don't want to deal with people spamming this thread with basic questions they could have answered in five minutes with a quick search. It makes it impossible for anyone else to actually find the specific info they came here looking for.

If you want to understand how stretching actually teaches the central nervous system to lower muscle tone, you really need to dig into the physiology of Golgi tendon organs and muscle spindles located within your muscles and tendons. It’s also worth looking into how reflexes play a role in that process. You shouldn't have any trouble finding some solid resources online if you just search for something like "stretching and flexibility physiology."

"If someone is presenting with Kyphosis, it simply means their anterior muscle tone is far too high." Honestly, that's a bit of a fallacy—there isn't really a "front" or a "back" when you're looking at the body as a single, integrated system.
It’s defined that precisely because the body isn't just some flat, two-dimensional object. The muscles I mentioned are essentially shortened or tight, and they're pulling everything out of alignment.
The body leans forward because the muscles I mentioned earlier have become overstretched and weakened on the opposite side, leaving them without any functional tension.
The concept of "forces" used to align the body—well, if you want to truly grasp what I’m getting at here, you really ought to have a more solid grasp of human anatomy. It isn't just about moving parts around; it's about understanding how those internal tensions actually interact.
I’ve been spending quite a bit of time lately diving deep into the mechanics of muscle function—specifically looking at origin points, insertion points, and the underlying physiology that governs how they actually move. It's one thing to know which muscle you're working, but it's a whole different ballgame when you start analyzing the actual physics of the contraction and how those attachment points dictate the entire range of motion.

The principle is actually quite straightforward: if you're tight or stiff, you need to stretch. If you're loose or weak, you need to strengthen. Honestly, I feel like this is the kind of thing they should be teaching clearly back in elementary school science class. xD

The idea that a problem rooted in the Central Nervous System can be fixed by focusing solely on the periphery just doesn't hold water. The CNS and the periphery are inextricably linked—it’s an interconnected web, much like everything else in the human body. How exactly do you think a muscle contraction even occurs? It starts with the CNS sending signals down through the spinal cord. You can't address one side of the equation while ignoring the other.
which stimulate the muscles through the nervous system. Of course, to truly grasp that, one would need a deep understanding of muscle contraction physiology—concepts like actin, myosin, Z-discs, and all that good stuff...

In short: please don't pester me or confuse someone who is just looking for a little help!

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 14, 2014

rustybadger42 said:Stretching and strengthening something that’s already tight and stiff—it's just going to make things worse

So, how exactly do you propose we fix muscle imbalances then? Just by magic? If a muscle is weak or overstretched because the central nervous system is inhibiting it, you actually have to strengthen it—you have to "teach" the brain to send signals back to those muscles so they can regain tone. It works the opposite way for muscles that are chronically tight; you need to stretch them to teach the CNS to dial down that tension. This is pretty much Kinesiology 101, so please, let's keep the unsolicited advice to a minimum while we're trying to help this guy out. Unless, of course, you have some actual scientific data or a solid explanation to back up your claim!

How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture? in Health · Jan 13, 2014

Jeffrey Campbell97 said:I’ve been wrestling with this issue of Kyphosis for quite a while now... I have some extra weight I really need to drop, and since my job is strictly desk-bound, the slouching is starting to become a genuine concern for me.

My goal is to finally fix my posture—to just naturally hold myself upright all the time—but I always seem to find myself curling forward again... and even when I do manage to sit up straight, I start feeling these nagging little aches because my body just isn't used to being in that position.

Does anyone have any advice on how to tackle this slouching and actually get my back straight again?

Stretch:
chest
anterior deltoid
upper trapezius
sternocleidomastoid
lumbar spine
hip flexors (like the psoas or rectus femoris)
adductors

Strengthen:

posterior deltoid
lower and middle trapezius
rhomboids
rotator cuff
core muscles
glutes
hamstrings
neck flexors

The thing is, sitting all day has disrupted your entire kinetic chain. It’s an incredibly common issue these days; honestly, almost every client I work with presents with some version of this problem. The only real variable is usually the severity of the postural distortion.

The key is to warm up, then stretch out those tight muscles, strengthen the weak ones, and then stretch the tight ones again. Ideally, you should follow this principle every single day. I've bolded the exercises related to lower body distortions, while the non-bolded ones target the upper body. You could alternate, doing the upper body one day and the lower body the next. However, you really need to do both because they are interconnected; one directly influences the other. In your case, the prolonged sitting likely caused your hip flexors to tighten first, which pulled your pelvis forward, leading to a functional lordosis, which then triggered a functional scoliosis.

Of course, it would be wise to consult with a professional (someone reputable) or a trainer who specializes in corrective exercise (just be careful to avoid the charlatans).😉

If you search Google or YouTube, you'll find plenty of specific strengthening and stretching routines under these terms:
Upper cross syndrome
Lower cross syndrome

Good luck.😉

Beginner workout advice needed in Hobbies & Leisure · Jan 11, 2014

Elizabeth Palmer2 said:Honestly, I wasn't quite sure how to phrase what I was looking for, nor did I find a suitable "beginner" topic here.
If one actually exists, perhaps a moderator could merge this into 🙂

So, let me try to explain my curiosity.
I am wondering what you all would prioritize—or rather, recommend—for someone who isn't currently active at all to jumpstart their fitness journey, specifically regarding activities that require going to a gym. It seems obvious that anyone wanting to get moving could just start with something like brisk walking or some home workouts.

Usually, people have a specific goal in mind, which dictates their choice. But again, I'm a bit lost on how everything works... I'm not entirely sure what joining a gym actually entails when I don't know how to precisely 🤷 achieve my goals.
For instance, something I'm curious about—does everyone in a gym get consulted by a manager or a trainer?

Why might one choose yoga, Pilates, total body fitness, Zumba, or weightlifting instead?
Specifically, what do I get out of each option, and how can I judge which one would be the best "fit" for me? 😁
Since they all fall under physical activity, and I want to both start and maintain consistency (though I'm still undecided on the discipline), 🤷
I have certain ideas about what I'd like to accomplish, I just haven't figured out which type of exercise will get me there.🤷

Well, take a look at yourself in the mirror from the front and the side, step on a scale, and decide exactly what your goals are—then post them here. It would also help to include your age, height, and weight so we can get a general idea of where you're starting from.

Whether your goal is to build muscle mass, lose body fat, or a combination of both, you definitely need to incorporate some form of strength training as your primary focus. To start off, your body will respond well to bodyweight exercises, but eventually, you'll need external resistance—just for the sake of ease of learning, I’d suggest weights and a gym setting.

I would personally recommend doing 1–2 interval sessions and 1–2 cardio sessions per week, regardless of whether you want to burn fat or simply improve your overall fitness levels.

Yoga and Pilates are excellent choices (provided you work with competent, professional instructors) for developing that mind-body connection. They will also help build strength and flexibility.

As for "total body fitness," honestly, I'm not sure what that even means; it sounds like a flashy marketing term used to repackage something very basic.😁

With Zumba, you'll mostly be working on your endurance, your leg and glute muscles, and your cardiovascular health. I'd recommend that as a supplement to a strength routine (if you prefer group classes, maybe pair yoga/Pilates with Zumba, or the gym with Zumba).

The gym is a fantastic option because it gives you the most direct control over exactly what you want to change, and the fundamentals aren't too hard to pick up. You can learn enough in a year of training to build a solid foundation of knowledge. I actually work in a gym, and I see people making absolute disasters of their form every single day. I would truly recommend finding a trainer who can perform a basic assessment over 3 to 5 sessions—someone to check your current physical state, identify any imbalances, create a tailored plan based on that assessment, show you the correct movements, teach you how to progressively increase your weights, and offer nutritional advice so you can see results as quickly as possible.

When it comes to gym culture and the quality of trainers, everything really boils down to which facility you choose to join. Some gyms will go out of their way to help you, while others might offer just enough assistance to fulfill their job description. Then, you have those places where the staff won't lift a finger; they’ll likely just point you toward a machine because that's the path of least resistance. Personally, I try to assist everyone on my shift as much as humanly possible, but given the various responsibilities we handle at the club, it isn't always feasible to give someone 100% of my focus—not compared to what happens during a private training session. It’s difficult, for instance, to properly teach someone the mechanics of a squat, a deadlift, or a bent-over row if you're working solo and there's a line forming at the front desk. One person needs help adjusting a setting, another is asking about a spot in the parking lot, a third wants the sauna temperature adjusted, and then someone else inevitably asks you to change the playlist on the speakers, haha. That is precisely why I suggested booking a trainer for a few sessions; that way, you actually have their undivided attention. 😉

Before you make any final decisions, you should definitely consider these points:
1) Define your specific fitness goals as clearly as possible
2) Be realistic about how much time you can actually commit to training

😉

Obesity and exercise in Hobbies & Leisure · Oct 7, 2013

urbanwalker72 said:I don't think you can really lay the blame on the coaches here. It’s more of a systemic issue—people in this country just don't have a culture of regular, preventative medical checkups. We’re the kind of society where we'll religiously take a car in for its mandatory state inspection to make sure every bolt is tightened, but when it comes to our own health? We just shrug our shoulders and figure it'll be fine. It’s like we prioritize the maintenance schedule on a Ford over our own vitals. 😁 )

It seems everyone is chasing that overnight success story—everyone wants a total body transformation by next week. But nobody actually wants to put in the systematic work. Nobody wants to shell out the money for a real trainer to go in and fix years of terrible posture and slouching at a desk.

Well, you certainly could. But let’s be honest—there are no guarantees in this life. You only have to look at those elite professional athletes; even with all their training and nutrition, you see them collapsing on the field every month due to sudden cardiac issues. It just goes to show that nothing is truly certain.

What kind of medical tests are we even talking about here? An EKG? What kind of diagnostic is that supposed to be? Honestly, anything an EKG can show, even a layman could spot without the machine. I’d bet my bottom dollar you haven't even had a single client come in for a cardiac ultrasound. I'm willing to wager not one of them.

You make a valid point there, and I think you're spot on. If your medical checkup comes back clean and everything looks good on paper, then whether you started out heavy or lean doesn't really change the fundamentals. You can essentially apply the exact same training regimen regardless of where your starting weight was.

I had two clients come in for cardiac ultrasounds recently. One was a lady just doing some routine health screenings on her own accord, and the other was one of my trainees. I have to say, that client is exactly the kind of person you want in your corner—honestly, if everyone were like him, my job would be a breeze! He truly values his health. Before we even thought about starting our training sessions, he made sure everything was cleared by his doctor for two very specific reasons: first, to ensure there were absolutely no contraindications to exercise, and second, to get a baseline on his vitals, like cholesterol, LDL levels, and blood sugar. It’s that level of foresight that makes all the difference.

Of course, there are no guarantees in this business, but I look at it this way: if I demand full medical clearance and all relevant health history from my clients, and then secure their explicit consent to train at their own risk—provided they’ve had a chance to review my training programs and specific methodologies—then my conscience is clear. At that point, I feel I have fully discharged my duty as a trainer to protect my clients' well-being. 🙂

It’s entirely possible for something catastrophic to happen to someone who is perfectly healthy—let alone someone who isn't even overweight. Honestly, life doesn't care about your fitness level. It can strike while you're just climbing a flight of stairs, mowing the lawn, or... well, during intimacy. Life is unpredictable like that. xD

I’ve always been one to prioritize doing things my way. To be honest, I’m a firm believer in never pushing past the 90% mark. In my own training sessions, I rarely ever go to total failure; I just don't think it's necessary for recreational athletes to hit that wall to see real progress. Whether we're talking about strength work, endurance, or metabolic conditioning, there's plenty of room to grow without completely redlining your system. 🙂

I truly believe I possess a solid foundation of knowledge and a sound professional philosophy. I go to great lengths to implement safety protocols, yet even with all those precautions, I can’t help but feel I might be overthinking things when dealing with high-risk clients. When I observe other trainers—not all of them, mind you, but many—they seem far more relaxed. They take risks, working with clients who have underlying health issues without even bothering to check a heart rate monitor or similar vitals. There was one particular day that left me feeling incredibly uneasy, almost as if I were personally responsible for a potential catastrophe. A young guy walked in for his shift wanting to learn how to deadlift. Since I couldn't take him on myself at that moment, I handed him off to a colleague, giving him clear instructions on what the client was looking to achieve. My colleague assured me it wouldn't be an issue. Fifteen minutes later, I returned to find the client mid-set during his break. He told me the trainer had already walked him through it. I said, "That’s great, let me just take a look." As soon as he started pulling that weight, my heart sank. His back was arched like a crescent moon. I thought to myself, *Maybe he's just doing it wrong, but surely my colleague showed him the right way.* Then, the arch got even worse. I felt paralyzed; I didn't want to undermine my colleague in front of the client, so I just called him over to "double-check" the form. It was an awkward situation, and I eventually pulled my colleague aside privately to explain my concerns. Unfortunately, you run into these types of "trainers" in this industry. The reality is, that guy now has three times as many personal training clients as I do because he presents a much more "impressive," high-energy image. It’s frustrating, but I suppose that’s just the state of the business.

Obesity and exercise in Hobbies & Leisure · Oct 7, 2013

urbanwalker72 said:Without pointing fingers at anyone in particular, let me ask this: honestly, how many of you—whether you’re personal trainers, gym coaches, or whatever you call yourselves in practice—actually take the time to assess whether a client is even physically healthy enough to be training in the first place?

Do coaches even send anyone to a doctor first? If I had to guess, they’d say not a single soul has ever handed a trainer a set of medical results just to prove they have a doctor's clearance stating everything is fine.

Furthermore, I’d venture to say that at least 90% of the population is struggling with postural issues. It seems to me that most adults working desk jobs in places like Chicago or New York—anyone over the age of 30—deal with almost pathological immobility. You see it everywhere: stiffness, lack of flexibility, pelvic tilts, and just about every other postural misalignment imaginable.

I find myself speculating once again: absolutely none of them bother with corrective exercises before they start jumping straight into heavy bench presses and bicep curls. Heaven forbid someone like that attempts a deadlift or a back squat; thankfully, those aren't nearly as trendy as the other movements found in most local fitness centers.

And that actually aligns perfectly with the idea that people carrying extra weight can still benefit from interval training. It’s logically consistent with everything else we've discussed above. If there is no oversight or regulation involved, then nothing is being managed at all—nobody is being held accountable for anything.

That’s just how things work around here.

Unfortunately, you're right; very few coaches actually follow all of these principles, but I certainly don't claim to be one of them. Of course, I don't know everything—I’m not ashamed to admit that—but when it comes to things like scoliosis, lordosis, kyphosis, pelvic tilts, or even X-patterns, I feel quite confident in my ability to approach and correct those issues. If I encounter something I don't understand, or if a structural deformity is so severe that I wouldn't dare touch it, I will refuse to train that client, no matter how much they insist.

Regarding interval training, I honestly think you might be working with some misconceptions here. Let me pose a specific question to clear things up: why on earth wouldn't someone perform interval training if they were previously overweight but have since received medical clearance? If the individual has stabilized their blood pressure within a normal range, shows no underlying cardiac issues, and—even though their resting heart rate is elevated—is under constant, professional heart monitoring during the session, what exactly is the objection?

Look, I know she’s been dealing with some health issues lately, but honestly, every single metric tells me she’s more than ready for the physical workload. I’ve been closely monitoring her heart rate during training sessions, keeping a sharp eye out for any subtle signs of fatigue, and we’re talking constantly about this. My main goal is helping her learn how to actually listen to what her body is telling her before she pushes too far.
Of course, this isn't that high-intensity interval training where you’re pushing 80-100% of your max heart rate. I'm talking about something more like a light circuit—maybe two or three minutes of a gentle stroll, followed by 30 seconds of an exercise to bump the pulse up to the 65-75% range, then back to walking until the heart rate settles, repeating that for maybe 15 to 20 minutes. What could possibly go wrong there? I won't pretend to be perfect; I don't follow the protocol to the letter every single time. For instance, she showed up to our session once having just finished a cup of coffee (seriously!?) and her resting heart rate was already sitting about 20 beats higher than it should have been. Naturally, I didn't push her through any of the actual drills I had planned; we just kept things incredibly mellow and spent most of the time just chatting away.

Obesity and exercise in Hobbies & Leisure · Oct 7, 2013

Please don't be angry with me, but I truly believe that if someone refuses to take a firm stand on a subject, it’s usually because they either lack deep knowledge or they're simply afraid of being proven wrong. Sometimes, playing it safe is the better route, but I’m just not built that way. I prefer to hold onto the conviction that I am doing the absolute best possible for my clients; even a 5% difference matters immensely to me. Consequently, I can't bring myself to walk up to a client and say, "Well, there are many ways to approach this; we'll try one thing, it might work, it might not, who knows?" Beyond looking insecure and incompetent, I certainly wouldn't be providing any motivation.

First off, I’m not sure if you’ve been following this discussion since the beginning (it was actually migrated from another thread), so it’s hard to judge your perspective. I never claimed that the methods I advocate for are the *only* correct ones or the sole path to success. I was simply comparing HIIT versus steady-state cardio without adding any extra context! It’s exactly like two car enthusiasts arguing over whether a Ferrari or a Volkswagen Golf is superior. If you strip away all the variables, of course everyone is going to say the Ferrari is better—the aesthetics, the power, the build quality, you name it (though I don't know much about cars, haha). The issue here arose because people started adding context like, "That's not for beginners," or "That's not for overweight clients," and so on. That is the equivalent of me saying a Ferrari is better, and having someone respond, "Actually, it isn't, because I don't have paved roads where I live, so a Golf is better!"

Everyone is entitled to their own philosophy, and I'm sure those paths will lead them somewhere, but the real question is which philosophy proves to be more economical and efficient. My personal opinion is that interval training is superior to steady-state cardio in almost every regard—BUT I am not suggesting that cardio should be stripped from a program entirely. If a client trains four times a week, I obviously won't prescribe intervals for every single session; instead, I’ll structure it as cardio, intervals, cardio, intervals, or perhaps cardio, intervals, Tabata, followed by a cardio/interval mix. However, I certainly won't push steady-state cardio beyond 20 minutes.

Now, regarding the argument that research studies aren't law and textbooks aren't gospel... I agree, they aren't absolute laws. But they are currently the best evidence we have regarding what happens to the human body during exercise. Honestly, I personally find more value in a book written by a top-tier trainer with over 20 years of experience and thousands of clients. If they have successfully applied certain principles to thousands of people, then those principles clearly work.

Dear Victor, I agree with you that there are unfortunately some very poor trainers out there. However, there are also terrible dentists, police officers, or bakers. When you happen to encounter a bad professional, you don't stop using those services altogether; you simply seek out someone of higher quality. It's the same with trainers. I'm sorry to see you generalizing and immediately judging the entire profession. These things we are bickering about are mere details and matters of philosophy. No matter how much we foam at the mouth here, I suspect we all get a little satisfaction from writing these posts, because at the very least, it keeps our brains working and thinking.

Regarding your situation with the instructor, I don't necessarily agree that she *must* know everything, but I do agree she should have stated that she couldn't adapt to your specific problem and that you were proceeding at your own risk. I often have people come to me with ten different doctor's reports, expecting me to tell them exactly what they can and cannot do. That is where I draw the line. Quite frankly, I admit when I don't know something, because I refuse to gamble with someone's health. Many times I have said, "I don't know, I'm not sure, please seek a second opinion," or offered to help them find one. So, I can guarantee you that not all trainers are the same. 🙂

I have worked with three overweight clients, and all of them had to provide written medical clearance before we started. I specifically requested EKGs, blood work, and other diagnostics (like blood pressure readings) because I have no desire to injure anyone and ruin my reputation.

Obesity and exercise in Hobbies & Leisure · Oct 7, 2013

Carol Ortiz9 said:For instance, I’m of the opinion that even people dealing with obesity vary significantly, so we really ought to adopt some form of individualized approach here.

To illustrate, it isn't quite the same situation when someone weighing 185 lbs heads to the gym versus someone weighing 300 lbs.
The former might still be able to go for a run, but the latter absolutely shouldn't try that.

Perhaps I have completely missed the point of what you two were debating, but I believe one should first assess an individual's capabilities—perhaps through some sort of endurance test, if you will—and, of course, review their medical records (ha, as if anyone actually does that!).

Take this, for example: at the local fitness center I visit, I saw a woman weighing about 265 lbs attempting an advanced step aerobics class.

To me, that just makes no sense whatsoever.

Of course everything is individual; there is simply no arguing that point.🙂 One must always tailor workouts to the specific abilities and characteristics of the person. Naturally, we wouldn't "force" an obese individual to run, but there are a million other ways for them to perform interval training—one just needs to understand the principles and exercise a bit of imagination.😉

Mind you, even two women weighing 265 lbs aren't necessarily the same. For example, consider someone who has carried that weight since puberty versus someone who was 175 lbs and suddenly gained 125 lbs in a single year. Neither scenario is particularly healthy, but the person who has lived with that weight since her teens has somewhat acclimated her musculoskeletal system (muscles, tendons, ligaments, bones) to that "load." Consequently, it is possible she won't face significant joint issues while doing aerobics (I won't delve into other potential health complications here), depending on her age and height.🙂

It always comes down to the individual approach. That is precisely why I enjoy working with my clients—being able to talk with them, test their limits, and only then begin crafting a structured plan and program.🙂

Obesity and exercise in Hobbies & Leisure · Oct 7, 2013

slydriver52 said:Could you please list the names of the professors from KIF who told you that beginners should be doing interval training? Do you actually have any idea what beginners do when they walk into a local weightlifting club? Do you honestly believe they start out performing heavy cleans and snatches right away? Please, don't joke with me...
You are dealing with a serious profession, and it would be wise if you treated it with that level of respect. I truly wish you the best of luck in your career, because with this kind of mindset, you won't get very far.
I'm done here...

Of course you're "done" when you lack actual arguments and refuse to acknowledge the positive aspects of the research papers I've shared. xD

Thanks for the well wishes. 😉

Obesity and exercise in Hobbies & Leisure · Oct 6, 2013

slydriver52 As I was saying:
A pilot Study

Conclusions — Exercise intensity was an important Factor for improving aerobic capacity and reversing The risk factors of The metabolic syndrome Improving aerobic capacity and reversing the risk factors of the metabolic syndrome. Thes findings May have important implications for exercise training in rehabilitation programs and futur Studies. may Thes findings May have important implications for exercise training in rehabilitation programs and futur Studies Thes findings May have important implications for exercise training in rehabilitation programs and futur Studies.

Look, I’m going to be blunt here: you don't have the right to run experiments on people under risky conditions. Clients pay you to guide them safely toward their goals, not to turn them into lab rats. You aren't a research scientist, and you certainly aren't a medical doctor. If anything, these studies prove that we need much more extensive research in this field before we can draw definitive conclusions. Believe me, any licensed trainer who actually values their reputation and prioritizes client safety isn't going to take unnecessary gambles like this. It's not that an overweight individual is definitely going to suffer a catastrophe if they engage in high-intensity training, but the risk profile increases significantly. If something goes wrong, the liability falls squarely on you for failing to follow the fundamental principles of physical conditioning. You can't just skim a few isolated scientific papers and decide to start testing those results on your clients. To conduct actual testing, you need the proper credentials and institutional backing—specifically, a partnership with a major university kinesiology department that has access to specialized equipment and professional expertise. Even elite organizations like the LA Galaxy rely on those kinds of professional services. Their coaches have massive amounts of experience, yet even they wouldn't dream of improvising risky protocols on their own.
There are certainly individuals among them who let greed get the better of them, going to extreme lengths just to get ahead. Eventually, they end up being called out in the headlines, but that’s really a whole different conversation altogether.
My advice would be to stick to a proven, reliable approach when applying your training methods; once the right conditions present themselves, there really isn't any reason not to incorporate some interval work into the mix.

You really managed to cherry-pick that one single little detail out of that massive mountain of text and research I laid out for you! xD What about everything else? What about all those other points supporting interval training? And what about that specific study I mentioned involving participants with a BMI over 30? Look, I get where you’re coming from, and I won't say I disagree with you entirely, but the way you approached me really rubbed me the wrong way. It felt like you were implying that what I’m doing is actually dangerous or going to kill someone (LOL). In reality, I am simply following what I’ve gathered through my own learning—scientific studies, books by reputable experts and top-tier coaches, a bit of hands-on experience, and the guidance I received from my university professors and some truly high-quality trainers.

So, you're telling me that I'm the kind of person who takes five scientific abstracts—each accompanied by a link so I can dive into the full study—plus another five or six links from a highly respected coach, all backed by a mountain of literature used to extract those insights, only for you to swoop in with a single sentence and **bold** it? Well, that's your prerogative, I suppose. It seems to be your struggle, really; you just can't seem to grasp the broader picture. 🤷

To be fair, I have come across several studies that don't necessarily favor interval training across all the specific domains I mentioned earlier. However, I haven't found a single piece of research suggesting that interval training is actually inferior to steady-state cardio. Some studies indicate the results are roughly equal, but if you factor in the fact that interval sessions are significantly shorter, there is a clear advantage when it comes to time efficiency.

To say that interval training isn't for beginners is really no different than me claiming that deadlifts or squats aren't meant for beginners! You can't just make such broad generalizations like that. Much like how squats and deadlifts have countless variations and specific adaptations tailored to the individual, every single interval training session offers even more room for customization.

Obesity and exercise in Hobbies & Leisure · Oct 6, 2013

I. Training vs Continuous Moderate Exercise as a Treatment for The Metabolic syndrome methods and Results — Thirty-two

Methods and Results— Thirty-two metabolic syndrome patients (average age, 52.3±3.7 years; maximal oxygen uptake [V̇O2max], 34 mL • kg−1 • min−1) were randomly assigned to one of three groups: performing an equal volume of moderate continuous exercise (CME; 70% of peak heart rate) three times a week for 16 weeks, performing aerobic interval training (AIT; 90% of peak heart rate) three times a week for 16 weeks, or acting as a control group. Interestingly, V̇O2max saw a much higher increase following the AIT protocol compared to CME (35% versus 16%; P<0.01). This was also tied to a better reduction in the various risk factors making up metabolic syndrome (for the AIT group, the count dropped from 5.9 to 4.0; P<0.01; while the CME group went from 5.7 to 5.0; group difference, P<0.05). Furthermore, AIT outperformed CME in improving endothelial function (9% versus 5%; P<0.001), insulin signaling within both fat and skeletal muscle, muscle biogenesis, and excitation-contraction coupling, as well as in lowering blood glucose and fat production in adipose tissue. Both exercise programs were similarly effective at bringing down mean arterial blood pressure and reducing body weight (-2.3 kg for AIT and -3.6 kg for CME) and overall body fat.
Conclusions — Exercise intensity was an important Factor for improving aerobic capacity and reversing The risk factors of The metabolic syndrome
Source: http://circ.ahajournals.org/content/118/4/346.short

II. Effect of 2 Weeks of sprint Interval training on health-related outcomes in sedentary overweight

"The goal of this research was to see how extremely high-intensity sprint interval training (SIT) impacts metabolic and vascular risk factors in sedentary men who are overweight or obese."
Participants: Ten men (average age, 32.1 ± 8.7 years; BMI of 31.0 ± 3.7 kg
What they did: They performed 30-second Wingate anaerobic sprints on a cycle ergometer with electromagnetic braking, allowing for 4.5 minutes of recovery between each bout.
What improved: Maximal oxygen uptake, the insulin sensitivity index, and the resting fat oxidation rate (measured in a fasted state) all showed improvement. Additionally, resting carbohydrate oxidation in a fasted state was notably lower 24 hours after the intervention compared to the start, along with significant reductions in waist and hip measurements.
Conclusion: Just 2 weeks of SIT led to substantial improvements in several metabolic and vascular risk factors among sedentary, overweight or obese men.
Source: http://www.metabolismjournal.com/art...017-X/abstract
III. Aerobic interval training reduces cardiovascular risk factors more than a multitreatment approach in overweight adolescents

Objective: This study aimed to compare a multi-faceted approach (MTG) against aerobic interval training (AIT) regarding their impact on cardiovascular risk factors in overweight teenagers.
Results:
- Maximal oxygen uptake increased more significantly with AIT than with MTG.
- AIT provided better enhancement of endothelial function compared to MTG.
- AIT was more effective than MTG at reducing BMI and body fat percentage.
- AIT resulted in more favorable blood glucose and insulin regulation than the MTG approach.
Conclusion: The results of this pilot Study suggest that three months of high-intensity exercise sessions, conducted twice weekly, reduced several established cardiovascular risk factors in obese adolescents more effectively than a multi-treatment strategy.
Source: http://www.clinsci.org/cs/116/cs1160317.htm

IV. A Comparison of the Effects of Interval Training vs. Continuous Training on Weight Loss and Body Composition in Obese Pre-Menopausal Women

1. Maximal Oxygen Consumption

One notable takeaway from this study was that the high-intensity interval training group saw a significant boost in VO2max, whereas the group doing low-intensity steady-state exercise saw no change at all. In the HIIT group, a significant increase in VO2max was confirmed based on meeting two of three specific markers: a plateau in VO2, an RER above 1.1, or reaching the age-predicted maximum heart rate. The steady-state group simply didn't show those kinds of changes.

2. Weight/Body Composition

In the high-intensity interval training group, body fat percentage dropped from 45.5 ± 7.8% down to 43.5 ± 6.9% (p=0.07). While we can't technically call this statistically significant yet, there is definitely a visible trend toward significance. It’s quite possible that if we had a larger sample size, a longer timeframe for the study, or simply bumped up the training volume, we would see those numbers hit the threshold. On the flip side, the low-intensity steady state group didn't see any meaningful change at all (moving from 42.4 ± 5.2% to 42.9 ± 4.6%; NS).

Looking at the delta, the high-intensity interval training group saw a -4.4% shift in body fat, while the low-intensity steady state group actually drifted slightly upward by +1.2%.

3. Resting Metabolic Rate

For those in the high-intensity interval training group, the RMR climbed by 4.4%, moving from 1688 ± 373 kcal/day during pretesting to 1762 ± 376 when measured the morning following their sessions (p = 0.05). We also observed significant shifts when measuring resting VO2 per kilogram of body weight. These specific markers remained unchanged in the steady state group. However, much like the current study suggests, the data from Poehlman et al. indicates that if you want exercise to have an acute impact on RMR, you likely need to push the intensity above the 50% mark.

RECOMMENDATION
When evaluating Exercise as a method for weight management, it seems pretty clear that high intensity
interval training can trigger changes in fat mass and overall body composition that just don't happen with low-intensity work—especially if the training period is extended. Now, let's be realistic: most people, particularly those just starting out, aren't going to be able to maintain high intensity for very long stretches. That’s why I recommend interval training; it gives the participant those necessary windows to catch their breath between intense bursts. To keep that RMR elevated, this type of routine should probably be performed at least every other day. It also seems evident that adding some caloric restriction is vital if you want to see a drop in total body weight alongside fat loss. Adding resistance training might also assist in shedding fat while building out lean mass, though that is an area where we still need more robust research.

SOURCE (this should be the fifth article in order, please check the title): http://scholar.google.com/scholar?sta...=en&as_sdt=0,5

V. The effects of high-intensity intermittent exercise training on fat loss and fasting insulin levels of young women
Objective: To evaluate how a 15-week high-intensity intermittent exercise (HIIE) program impacts subcutaneous fat, trunk fat, and insulin resistance in young women.
Procedure: Participants were randomly split into three groups: HIIE (n=15), steady-state exercise (SSE; n=15), or a control group (CONT; n=15). Both the HIIE and SSE groups completed a 15-week exercise intervention.
Subjects: Forty-five women with an average BMI of 23.2±2.0 kg m−2 and an average age of 20.2±2.0 years.

Results:

Both exercise cohorts showed significant improvements (P
Conclusion:

Performing HIIE three times a week for 15 weeks, as opposed to the same frequency of SSE, was linked to significant reductions in total body fat, subcutaneous fat in the legs and trunk, and insulin resistance among young women.
SOURCE: http://www.nature.com/ijo/journal/v3.../0803781a.html

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