Posts by hollowtrucker

Here’s about 480 words on this topic—maybe when we all gather like this, we might gain a deeper understanding or catch some mistakes we missed before. Enjoy:

The soul is essentially a localized aspect of God, tucked right inside the heart of a living being. The spirit, on the other hand, is the formless aspect of God that acts as the connective tissue between all the infinite souls scattered throughout the universe.
Without the spirit, the soul would be blind—completely cut off from everything else out there.
And without the soul? Well, life would feel empty; people and all other living things would just be animated puppets moving through the motions.

Think of God, Spirit, and Soul as three different manifestations of the spiritual realm.

Depending on how you look at it—and honestly, different teachers or schools will give you their own specific definitions and ways of breaking them down—it usually just comes down to what the student is capable of grasping at the time.

Because of varying levels of study, it’s actually pretty common for people to swap these terms around; you'll often see someone mistake God for either the soul or the spirit.

From a strictly spiritual standpoint, though, these three are actually one and the same, even if they do have distinct differences.

Anyway, I'll do my best to lay it out:

The soul is what animates a living being.

The spirit is what animates the entire universe.

And all of this is made possible by God.

God is the master of both soul and spirit.

Now, we’ve established that breath equals spirit.

In other words, whoever dedicates their breath is experiencing a holy spirit.

Both the soul and the spirit have material counterparts in our world.
An analogy for the spirit might be the wind; meanwhile, the material reflections of the soul could be seen as our intelligence and the mind, for instance.
Without overthinking it too much,
the soul and spirit are two lower—though not material—attributes of the eternal God.

The soul is the essence of a human being. The spirit is the essence of the universe. God is the Essence itself.
Humans are constantly immersed in the spirit, yet we don't see it directly.
The soul is in constant communication with us, but we don't hear it clearly.
And God is constantly communicating with both the soul and the spirit, so none of it is visible to the naked eye.

Can God exist entirely on His own? Yes; and there isn't much we can do about that.
Could a soul survive even if the entire universe were destroyed? It could.
Could the spirit destroy the soul or overshadow God? No, it cannot.

God is the source; the soul is the ocean; the spirit is the current.


Even though the soul isn't a separate entity in its own right, there is an element of reality within it—a light of consciousness—that flows from the true ownership of being, which we experience as the "I am."

What is being suggested here is that while the soul is eternal, it cannot exist in total isolation. The soul manifests within the Spirit, and God manifests within both the Soul and the Spirit according to His own will.
God is that which does not depend on the Spirit or the Soul. But the soul is dependent on God.
The soul might even become independent of the Spirit, but the Spirit can never be independent of God.

To be a "being" is to be alive. Life is spirit. God is the single Living Being who is the Master and the Source of all life.

The Absolute has absolutely no "labels" or inherent forms of its own.

What this means is that it's incredibly difficult to perceive the Absolute on its own, because the Absolute doesn't possess the kind of characteristics or shapes you could simply point to with your finger.
However, the fact that labels and forms exist—and that we recognize them as such—is a clear expression of the Absolute's will. This shows us that even though forms aren't inherent to the Absolute, the Absolute is the very shape that exists within itself.

The soul says, "I am."
The spirit says, "I am That."
God says, "I am I."

Austin Hayes66 said:Western Egypt is the West. Central Tibet is the center.
Once again, you're mixing up "internet wisdom" with actual practice.

Austin Hayes66; regardless of how blunt you're being; I haven't mixed anything up—not even my own mustache!😉
But hey, you’re more than welcome to your own brand of confusion. Just to summarize my point:

If Western Egypt is the West and Central Tibet is the center; does that mean the Eastern USA is the East?

What exactly lies west of Egypt?

adriatic said:It isn't even about philosophy—it’s just bad (if "good" theology even exists 😕 ) theology

I'm inclined to agree; this is just old-school dogma regarding God.
It's the kind of thing that really gets under an atheist's skin.

adriatic said:Which leads to that famous nonsense:
"Man possesses an immortal soul"😁

Humans don't have immortal souls; rather, an immortal soul occasionally takes on the material form of a human being.
Most of these absurdities stem from people simply parroting what they've heard.

adriatic said:As A. Einstein once put it: Only stupidity is infinite.

Now, regarding Mr. Einstein—while he was certainly a charming figure, he’s responsible for a few things too. First off, contrary to what he probably intended, he gave people a perfect excuse to stop thinking for themselves. Plus, people have started using his name to justify their own views in a way I haven't seen with any other spiritual teacher—basically using him as a shield for pure dogmatism and fanaticism.

Austin Hayes66 said:East has understanding and the knowledge.
West has only dogma. ☕

Dear Austin Hayes66; I think you ought to be feeling a whole lot more than this.

Which "West" are we even talking about?

Are we calling the Western USA "the West," when we all know they’re actually located at the furthest edge of the East?

And does Europe—which is really just an extension of Asia—count as the West?

There’s really no point in discussing the East versus the West unless you take the center into account.

And that center... well, that's Egypt.

If you look at Mayan, Egyptian, and Tibetan esoteric schools as one massive, complementary system, you start to get a much deeper level of understanding.

(In this context, Mayan, Egyptian, and Tibetan are just arbitrary labels used to represent the West, the center, and the East)

grizli said:what difference does it make

So, if I'm reading you right, your final take on the question John posed is basically—there really isn't any difference.

Real discussion can only happen when people stop thinking, "I’m right and you’re wrong." If someone acts like a sage who possesses the absolute truth, then there’s no room left for actual dialogue.

Bowl of Sake, by Hazrat Inayat Khan

Grizli—look, regarding most of the stuff you and Lame Deer have been posting; I actually agree with you. But, I’d also argue that what I’m putting out here is just as valid.

The real questions—the ones that should actually be weighing on all of us here—ought to be framed like this:

How can we actually discern the difference between Spirit and Soul? What kind of tool or method exists to truly perceive one versus the other?

Can you walk us through that, Grizli?😉 👍

Grizli, I’m sorry you’re feeling more confused than ever.

grizli said:Look, you could call this energetic, etheric body your "soul"—but then the actual spirit would have to be something else entirely, like a being, an absolute, or the universe itself—I don't know.

spider jerusalem said:Bliss is just a dead end.

I wouldn't say that—not if you view bliss as something that builds upon itself, gaining depth and quality until it finally leads you toward
that realization of eternal consciousness—you know, that true state of being.

grizli said:but THAT doesn't mean it's actually a being😁
just because I say a COW can't kill me😉

Well, obviously not—and you can't really prove it, either, not just by talking about it.
But hey, if you can show me some immortal cow that somehow acts as the source of all abundance, life, and pure bliss, then I'll gladly admit you're right.
Have you ever heard anything about Disney?

grizli said:But then HOW can you be so sure it's a bull?

😉

grizli said:Everything you say is just an absolute claim...
when everything you're telling me is just based on assumptions..

I AM exactly what you're claiming—it's how I think, how I feel, and how I speak.😁

😘

grizli said:I just have to tell hollowtrucker that calling it "that"... well, there aren't even enough words in the dictionary for how vague that is...

Unnamable, unavoidable, and utterly without a name.
🙏
Nice one, grizli!
👍

Hey bears and deer—hope you all are doing wonderful.

Karen Sanchez19 said:Just relax, take a deep breath, let it out, and stop trying to wrap your head around God's silly little explanations—because God is ultimately inexplicable...

Thanks, Karen Sanchez19—I'm just breathing in and out that eternal spirit of divine beauty!🙂

Karen Sanchez19 said:Besides, what does it matter to you whether He is a being or not?

Not much at all, really.

Karen Sanchez19 said:Isn't the essence of a sculpture stone... stone as the substance rather than the shape? But look at this as a tiny little analogy...😁

Now, if we look at the bigger analogy: even though a sculpture is made of stone, its true essence is spiritual.
But that doesn't mean the stone itself is its spiritual form.
It's like how the soul is one expression of God and the spirit is another divine work; that doesn't mean God is defined by the form and essence of the soul or the spirit.

Jason Johnson4 said:"I AM" is the Absolute.

That's absolutely true when the Absolute claims it. And it's just as true for Him when I claim it right now.🙄

The soul says, "I am."
The spirit says, "I am That."
God says, "I Am Who I Am."

This isn't some academic philosophy debate; it's a mystical discourse. Honestly, anyone trying to argue with mysticism is probably just losing their mind.😍 🤣

Jason Johnson4 said:Ahu, isn't everything you write just some kind of (loser) philosophy?

Honestly, all of this is foundational. It’s about building the very axis of dreams through those foundations—not just some abstract philosophy.

Karen Sanchez19 said:One single being?
But what actually constitutes a "being"?

A being is simply anything that is alive. And life? Life is Spirit. God is that one living being—the Master, or the ultimate Source of Life.

Karen Sanchez19 said:The Absolute has no "labels" or inherent shapes of its own.

What I'm trying to get at is that it's incredibly difficult to perceive the Absolute on its own—since the Absolute doesn't possess distinct traits or shapes you could just point to with your finger.
However, the fact that labels and forms exist—or that we perceive them as such—is clearly the will of the Absolute. This gives us a clear insight: even if labels and shapes aren't inherent to it, the Absolute is the very essence of that form itself.😉

Jason Johnson4 said:If we assume that God is Essence itself, then there really can't be any other essences out there—whether we're talking about the essence of a human being, the universe, or anything else. It just wouldn't add up.

It’s honestly a waste of time when we let words get in the way and cloud everything up.

If you take the time to actually sit down and read through my posts—slowly, mind you—you'll see that there aren't any contradictions here. Everything stays consistent.

Jason Johnson4 said:Even if we don't view the soul as some sort of separate, isolated entity—and I don't think anyone really should—there is still this undeniable element of Reality tucked inside it. It’s that spark of conscious light that flows directly from the true Ownership, which is what we experience as that fundamental "I am" feeling.

What Sarma is getting at is that while the soul might be eternal, it can't really exist in total isolation. It’s more like the soul manifests through the Spirit—and then you have God manifesting through both the Soul and the Spirit, all according to His own will.
God is that which exists independently of both Spirit and Soul—whereas the Soul itself remains fundamentally dependent upon God.
The Soul can actually reach a point where it becomes independent from the Spirit—but the Spirit? It can never truly be independent from God.

Karen Sanchez19 said:The Absolute doesn't have any "labels" or specific forms of its own😁

It’s always easy to play philosopher, isn't it?
But if we're being real, the Absolute possesses its own absolute forms and absolute markers.

Karen Sanchez19 said:that wouldn't be one😁 nor would it be absolute

everything living has a beginning and an end😁

Can you see why this is so hard to wrap your head around?

Let's try looking at it this way:

God is the one absolute, living Being—without any beginning or end.

Karen Sanchez19 said:God doesn't have a self

But how can you be so sure? Where exactly have you seen any kind of "self" before?

Look, Karen Sanchez19—believe me when I say the hardest part of all this is grasping that God *does* have a self; that He is a living being—even if that existence is unconditional, indestructible, and transcends everything else.

Jason Johnson4 said:Can we even talk about this duo as two separate entities?

Honestly, you don't have to talk about it at all if you don't want to.

It reminds me of when a Japanese visitor comes to the West and simply says:
"...that which you call God, the Soul, or the Mind..."

There’s something so wonderful about simple people. That gentleman was Michio Kushi. He wasn't denying the Truth; he just chose to bypass those endless, circular debates altogether.

Jason Johnson4 said:Would a living being be part of the universe?

I'm intentionally leaning toward a specific way of looking at things—though I'm not really trying to represent any particular school of philosophy or religion.

A living being is essentially the embodiment of an immortal soul. That immortal soul then takes on various forms within this material (and mortal) universe.

It's interesting, though—hardly anyone would actually deny the existence of the spirit.

As far as we know:

Breath=Spirit=RUH=Pneuma=Anima

and I'll go ahead and add one more to that list—Sophia.

Jason Johnson4 said:If the soul animates a living being, and the spirit animates the universe, does the spirit also animate the living being (which is itself a part of the universe)? 😁

Thousands upon thousands of philosophers and saints spent millennia debating, analyzing, and trying to grasp these concepts. There's really no reason for me to try to outdo them or make them look bad.
The soul is the essence of the human; the spirit is the essence of the cosmos; God is the Essence itself.
Humans are constantly immersed in the spirit, yet we don't see it directly.
The soul is in constant communication with us, but we don't hear it clearly.
God is constantly communicating with both the soul and the spirit, so naturally, nobody sees it happening.

I'll say it again: materialists just aren't going to wrap their heads around this.

Can God exist entirely unto Himself? Yes; there's nothing we can do to argue otherwise.
Can the soul survive the total destruction of the universe? It can.
Can the spirit destroy the soul or overshadow God? No, it cannot.

God is the source; the soul is the ocean; the spirit is the current.
Since I tend to avoid technical jargon—and because there honestly aren't enough words (since words are just mental constructs) to fully describe the Truth—I rely on analogies. My apologies to anyone I might confuse or leave feeling like I've missed the mark.

Tyler Scott3 said:Well, I guess this is just what these kinds of fascinating discussions are for.

Does everyone else feel that sense of convergence starting to happen within this thread?
👍

Brenda Cook4 said:hey, please don't let the spiritual folks get upset with me here—I'm just searching just like everyone else... I'm simply sharing my own thoughts.

Honestly, if you're getting angry, you probably aren't much of a spiritual person anyway... Love The quote in Your sig ; BlueBird.🙂

"Believe those who are seeking the Truth; doubt those who claim they found it!"
(Andra Gido)