Posts by Jonathan Barnes5

Dennis Davis97 said:What can I even say to you when you clearly don't grasp how things actually unfolded? Just trust your own eyes; the reality of the situation is plain to see.
you guys have been wandering around the city so much lately without ever finding the backbone to actually step up and make a move. There isn't much left for me to say.

First off, you really don't seem to understand what you're talking about with these kinds of remarks. When things get heated, you just have to stand your ground—please, don't go there. Honestly, don't. Speculating about who would have fared better is nothing more than childish chatter found on some random internet forum.

As for your comments regarding strolling through Chicago and lacking any real courage, you've essentially made your point. It seems a significant portion of your group prefers to simply sit back and watch the crackdown happen.

It seems the group completely overlooked those who actually made the final call. Honestly, if everyone had just followed the advice coming out of Miami, we wouldn't be in this position; it’s hard enough to catch one's breath without being suffocated by everyone's sudden burst of moral superiority.
I have nothing but respect for what was achieved with Liverpool FC, but this constant lecturing from you all is starting to feel less like criticism and more like pure delusion.

Robert Cooper60 said:Don't take this the wrong way, but you seem to be missing the core context of my point while still feeling a strong urge to push back.

Fair enough, let’s look at it through a different lens. What would actually happen to the group if everyone from the Rose Bowl decided to stop showing up? It isn't like we're talking about a massive crowd, just a specific subset of people.
Since your initial point remains a bit unclear to me, perhaps you could clarify your perspective. I'm asking purely out of curiosity, with no intention of being confrontational.

analogheron19 said:Of course he’s talking nonsense, especially since he even botched the address.

I mentioned earlier that I wouldn't pry into the personal details of his registration... But if a statement about the rest of the situation is factually incorrect, shouldn't that be addressed?
Let’s be honest here; I wouldn't exactly be lining up to visit Pyre either, for some pretty obvious reasons. When you add the fact that you can't even get there without having to play-act like you're part of an elite Delta Force unit just to navigate the situation, it really brings us back to what the guy was saying. Sure, that’s just one piece of the puzzle, but it serves as a clear indicator that the entire club's management has devolved into the exact same mess. I say this with nothing but respect for everyone else who stepped up early on to try and push a proven, successful model.

analogheron19 said:Jack, take a breather; you’re just talking nonsense here.

Without getting into personal jabs, he's actually hitting the nail on the head regarding the harsh reality of the situation...

I honestly don't see what else there is to explain. For this group to truly matter against the backdrop of everything else, it has to take on the entire legal system, the judiciary, the executive branch, and various organized crime syndicates. It needs to endure real repression and hardship. It's like playing Ocean's 13 when operating across Europe—you have to navigate an incredible level of complexity just to get a foothold, much like how things can become easy targets in the Pyrenees. And all of this heavy lifting has to be done by the very same people.
Essentially, the group would need to fight battles on thirty-two different fronts just to earn a shred of respect, all while they're busy criticizing the state of affairs in Chicago and mocking the consequences of systemic repression.

William Kim said:🤣🤣

Maybe we should start a group chat.🙂

I’m struggling to follow your logic here... Are you generally in favor of heavy-handed crackdowns? Do you actually enjoy seeing blacklists, being frisked three times at security, or dealing with police cordons all over the stands?

It takes a certain level of audacity to compare what this group has endured over the years to anything else.
If anyone tries to bring things back to the baseline that the rest of the scene deals with, they just get met with sarcasm.

I don't quite get it; the Blackhawks fans are only truly legitimate when they are facing twice the repression of anyone else. Just because people aren't jumping for joy right now doesn't mean much. I'm not saying the situation with the Red Sox fans is perfect, but it feels like certain rules are being applied very selectively.

brightpilot6 said:One day, if the club finally manages to clean house for good, the Dynamo fandom will be much like how an Arab nation might feel if Israel were suddenly removed from the map.

It’s a strange cycle where the loyalists fighting the establishment find themselves at odds with those who aren't, yet somehow everyone ends up uniting against the hardcore ultras and then, eventually, against any casual supporter at all.

Drawing a parallel to the Levant makes sense, though perhaps because once things move from constructive debate into actual repression, only the most radical factions remain active while everyone else just pays lip service. It also holds water when you look at the timeline and see just how much everything has fallen apart over time.

Now we have an official statement to contend with. It’s perfectly fine if you don't want to support this under any circumstances, but let’s please skip the manufactured drama and those pathetic messages about "friends in the corner," because none of that is actually true.
The core identity of this group was essentially lost back at that last game at Wrigley Field; if it weren't for the various subgroups, there wouldn't even be a community left to speak of.
I realize many people will feel let down by this, but in a fundamental sense, none of us have truly felt the fallout from any of it. For the past few months, the situation has boiled down to a simple binary choice anyway. I’m sharing this as my own personal perspective—I have no intention of being condescending or acting as a mouthpiece for these decisions.

Drew Barnes4 said:Honestly, what else can one say? It’s quite simple... nobody truly believed there was even a glimmer of a chance that he would reconcile with those agents and end up sitting in the stands right alongside them. It is nothing short of pure corruption and betrayal, the absolute lowest form of conduct. I find their actions more reprehensible than any outside adversary, because there is simply no bottom to the depravity of domestic traitors. It hardly seems logical to suggest to the core group that they shouldn't make peace with the agents, primarily because everyone assumed the prevailing mindset made such a reconciliation fundamentally impossible.

Where are you even coming from with this? You have access to private messages here, and you have the association. If there is something you actually want to know, just ask. Right now, you're all spinning theories and making assumptions that are even more speculative than what you'd read in a tabloid.

It’s honestly disappointing how some people behave. For months, even years, there have been open invitations to come down to Fifth Avenue and speak your mind directly. You keep popping up here with these mindless comments instead of having the decency to show up in person and say what you actually believe where it matters most.
If we let ourselves be driven by nothing but spiteful comments like this one from the Bad Boys, then the whole movement could easily just fade away into nothingness.
I still seem to have this unfortunate habit of feeling the need to reply to everyone, though I truly hope the younger generation doesn't carry that same burden. You see people walking around wearing the group's gear or sporting bold tattoos—they all claim to have a story to tell, but it seems they only ever find their courage once they're sitting at a bar.

wearyraven25 said:When a significant portion of the crew—those who actually stood their ground against the leadership during those final decisions—walks away feeling defeated because they realize compromise was inevitable under the guise of "acting in the best interest of the kids," you know the end is truly near. At that point, the only people deserving of respect are the ones who stayed true to themselves until the bitter end, refusing to hide behind hollow slogans that most of them never even believed in to begin with.
Those looking for an excuse will always find one, but hiding behind the collective is one of the deepest flaws within large organizations; it’s the path of least resistance, or rather, the complete absence of any real conviction.

If you ask me, there are plenty of folks in this crowd who are just playing a part, much like someone pretending to be something they aren't just to fit in at a local fair.
It really doesn't matter what narrative you try to push; some people adopt a persona as a temporary mask, while others actually live by the values they claim to hold.

Besides, I don't recall seeing much moralizing from you back when everyone was out posing for photos in an empty Washington, D.C., right in the middle of all that crackdown. Now, suddenly, everyone is acting like a judge over these recent events. Reading through these posts, it seems the fans can be just as hypocritical as anyone else.

cosmicridge6 said:So, the Boys are claiming someone is lying about the group's status? Honestly, man, your "group" doesn't even exist. If you ever actually fought for anything, you abandoned the cause the moment things got difficult. You claim we aren't relevant, but what fight are you even talking about? You were chased away from the stadium, the group was shut down because people were targeting individuals, yet here you are making peace with the same people who caused all that trouble, trying to lecture us on relevance. Who are we supposed to feel inferior to? Your group isn't even in our league, and frankly, your club wouldn't even be standing if it weren't for Franklin D. Roosevelt and later Jerry Jones. You're truly delusional...

Since you're so deeply involved in all this, it's clear you've learned how to lie about these matters too..
I won't even argue with you because this is such a small town where everyone knows the truth; who are you to tell anyone they failed a test of courage..?

It’s like watching fans from New York City mock the warriors from Warsaw for being cowards just because they stepped out during a breakthrough..But please, carry on if it makes you feel better..
As a lifelong, die-hard supporter, I can say with absolute certainty that I have felt far more repression than you ever have..
The main thing is that you spent your time walking around Chicago taking photos while everyone laughed at you. It's an incredibly ultra mentality—mocking the very idea of repression.

Lawrence Mitchell2 said:Why even mention the Armada in the same breath as BBB or Torcida? San Francisco is far too small a city to ever sustain an organized group of that scale... In my experience, about 30% of the people there actually root for Hajduk...
It seems you all are fixated on them because of their recent dominance over you, while they seem driven by a deep-seated complex regarding Hajduk.

Mostar is half the size of San Francisco, yet they have more supporters for Dinamo and Hajduk, which makes the ultras much different in their mindset. I won't even get started on other aspects...
He wasn't comparing the groups themselves, but rather the underlying mentality.

Jack Jones11 said:It seems you’ve drifted back toward discussing details that aren't actually central to his question. He listed a few more prominent groups—mostly those that played a significant role in the movement over the last decade or two—but that isn't really the point.

If you truly understand the nuances of the situation, just say so and leave it at that. It would be much better to provide him with a direct answer to his specific inquiry.
I am quite certain he isn't the only one looking for clarity, regardless of how many times people try to twist his words or drown out his voice.

I don't spend a massive amount of time active on these forums, nor do I feel the need to defend anyone, but objectively speaking, the man isn't being provocative. If someone finds his questions unsettling, that is simply their own issue to deal with.

At this point, everyone already knows the history and who stood where. It is common knowledge even among casual observers, let alone for those of us who follow soccer closely; there really isn't much left to debate here.

He directed his criticism at the younger generation, most of whom haven't even been involved in this specific context. Honestly, I don't even know them personally because, like most of us posting here, I haven't stepped foot in a stadium in years. Yet, he’s suddenly handing out moral lectures. All I can do is respect what they've endured, seeing the conditions they had to exist in and the heavy-handed repression they faced outside the stadium walls. Their dedication during away games was something else entirely. One European trip they took carries more weight than ten of mine ever could.
Actually, looking back at everything being said now, perhaps that guy was right to speak up online, despite everything.

Jack Jones11 said:What kind of nonsense was he talking about? From where I’m sitting, he was just asking very straightforward questions. Whether those questions hit the mark or not, the guy actually managed to touch on several valid points.

Just a few days ago, everyone here was taking turns mocking someone else simply because they asked if there would be organized transport to the game. It was all "can I go to the store" or "where is the restroom," as if we've lived through a decade of perfectly organized, seamless stadium trips where everything was always ideal...

It's exactly as you described. He brings up a team from the tail end of the old league that split off into a different division over ten years ago. He mentions a group that only ever really existed on a single banner a decade back. He cites a crew that didn't even participate in the boycott, and then names a group that stopped showing up long before any of this started.

He basically threw out a bunch of random names and wandered off into various tangents within his argument.

Personally, I haven't mocked anyone, nor would I dream of making fun of a kid who actually has the passion to show up—something most of us consider a given these days. If you want to find people to criticize, look toward those who were actually being dismissive. For instance, here is someone else making jokes about the trip to Athens, even though anyone could have made that away game.

Noah Jones92 said:Claiming they’ve all tucked their tails between their legs? Honestly, Sinko, you're talking nonsense. If all those supposed heavyweights from the Washington, D.C. area actually surrendered, where would they be? Where are the D42 crews, the zCB groups, the Sepre folks, the NBG crowd, the glupan types, the Small Town, USA locals, the šarmer types, or the guys from the Suburban Neighborhood? All those groups you seem so obsessed with—they haven't backed down an inch.

You might want to take a breather... You've managed to pour out so much mental nonsense that it's become almost impossible to follow you.

Noah Jones92 said:Honestly, man, I just don't get the politics of it all. When I first posted a few years back about how the establishment would eventually tear this group apart—long before they even started messing around with those Niyazov types—I got absolutely roasted here. It felt like a total betrayal when, just six months later, everyone suddenly flipped their tune. But hey, what can you do? I’m just staying under the radar behind a screen name; I don't claim to have all the answers, and frankly, if you know, you know. That's just how it goes.

It really doesn't matter whether someone understands the underlying motives or not. What matters is that every single person seems to comment on every decision as if they were personally involved in the management twenty-four hours a day. It isn't right for someone who is actively boycotting to lecture the people who actually showed up at the stadium despite facing intense pressure. Those guys reached out and asked for support, yet almost nobody came through for them. Just as it's wrong to act irrational toward the supporters, it's equally problematic for those supporters to stay silent, because it makes them look just as hypocritical. In the end, many people who weren't even die-hard fans turned out to be quite hypocritical themselves.

Brian Martin78 said:What could someone like you possibly contribute?
There isn't much left to say to people who share your mindset.

It seems to me that it would be best if you stopped trying to dictate terms to others using someone else's influence, much like how one might try to steer a ship by pulling on someone else's ropes. In any disciplined organization, the kind of behavior you permit would result in an immediate, permanent expulsion, but here, it feels as though there are no boundaries. It seems everyone on this American forum can act like they own the place because there are simply no consequences for their actions.

What are you even talking about? Take a moment to collect yourself and actually process both what you’re saying and what you’re responding to. It is always the easiest thing in the world to throw threats around or act tough toward outsiders. Don't worry, it isn't like anyone else has been kicked out of the group for acting out. Honestly, it just makes us all look like hypocrites.

Let the group decide who stays and who goes; let them make that call. But please, stop playing internet police with the fans and stop making these ridiculous claims about being kicked out of the stands after everything that has transpired. Either establish a clear code of conduct for the stadium, or stop pretending some people are more equal than others.🙂

Prince is truly a wonderful man, though it was such a tragedy when he lost his daughter to illness back then. It’s a real shame for the show because, as a dedicated fan himself, his coverage of the locker room with the Philadelphia Eagles fans feels so much more authentic and high-quality than that British rubbish nobody even asked to see..
He stands out as one of the few journalists in America—if not the only one—who actually understands the essence of showbiz reporting. He wasn't just following someone else's script; he was carving out his own unique format..

They gave me a glowing recommendation regarding their culinary program... Since they’re relatively new to the scene, they really have to stick to the gold standard to make an impression,