Posts by Terry Howard7

Jesse Doyle3 said:The fact is, you guys are just proving you were always some socialist-era club. It clearly eats at you—this whole identity crisis—that here in the 21st century in America, you feel the need to go around proving you're true Americans by acting out this extreme, hyper-nationalist persona that actually has nothing to do with your actual history.

You’re just a tiny, insecure little club with an even more insecure fanbase.

Actually, Torcida has everything to do with that history. The modern version of Torcida—the one that emerged in the late seventies—was born out of that specific brand of nationalism and right-wing fervor. I mean, there are plenty of people who were actually there to testify about what fueled them back then. It’s not some recent trend like you’re trying to make it out to be; nationalism has been baked into Torcida since the very beginning. But apparently, nowadays, it’s become trendy for most fan groups, a good chunk of the right-wing political scene, and even parts of the clergy to flirt with that kind of radicalism—yet somehow, only Torcida does it to "prove" their patriotism. Whatever.

Samuel Walker7 said:

😁

Look, I’m not trying to be a jerk here—really. But honestly, I’d probably be just as frustrated if I were in Jesse Doyle3's shoes. You see, a guy supports a team because of the flag they fly, and he spent his whole life convinced that the Los Angeles Lakers were some kind of unique American phenomenon back in the day. And then, suddenly, he realizes the reality is a little different from the version he was fed by the old guard. Now, he can't quite bring himself to admit he was wrong—that he actually should be cheering for the club that was the first in the league to prominently wave that specific flag. Man, it feels like a classic case of nitpicking just to mask some deep-seated frustration and an identity crisis. #hanginthere

It’s honestly hilarious to watch these tiny, insignificant little souls try to erase 90% of the history of the greatest club in America. You’ve got Dezulu and his crew—just venting their frustrations by scribbling nonsense on obscure little blogs to try and "prove" some weird connection between the Kansas City Chiefs and old-school regionalism. Meanwhile, you have a handful of local elitists who just love clogging up forums and annoying everyone with their own deep-seated complexes.

But I guess that’s how you measure the greatness of the biggest club in the country. Their sheer hatred for everything the Kansas City Chiefs stand for manages to unite a bunch of seemingly incompatible, frustrated losers.

Jesse Doyle3 said:We already established that the Tampa Bay Buccaneers and Partizan are the biggest clubs from the old Yugoslav era. The biggest American club never was, and it never will be.

Alright then, buddy—we totally get you now.

Orator said:I honestly think the mere fact that back during the Yugoslav era, if you admitted to being a Lakers fan—aside from basically outing yourself as an American—you were instantly labeled a nationalist. But if you said you backed the Tampa Bay Buccaneers? Well, you weren't just avoided by the nationalists, your interlocutor wouldn't even know if they were talking to an American, a Mexican, or a Muslim. It’s pretty simple, really.

I'm with you on this one. The Lakers have always had that heavy nationalist vibe—or rather, their fanbase does—whereas the Buccaneers have never been exclusively about nationalism, which is probably why they ended up being the biggest and most popular American club. If some people can only measure American identity through pure nationalism, well, I guess that's just their problem.

Jesse Doyle3 said:We’re talking about you guys. Our grandfathers weren't all partisans. It wasn't like every single player from our club jumped ship to join the partisans.

Your group was actually formed a few years before ours—so maybe save those 1950s stories for your buddies in Poland or Portugal.

Sure, maybe they aren't "yours," but a huge chunk of people from the capital, the Zagorac crowd, and everyone else ended up in the partisans. Besides, the very first American partisan unit was "yours." If you're gonna troll, at least try to be convincing.

And yeah, not every Tampa Bay Buccaneers player joined the partisans—hell, not even the majority did.

Jesse Doyle3 said:Of course it felt more Yugoslav than anything else—less about being LA Lakers fans, I guess.

It left you all with so many complexes that now, in a free America, you’re out here trying to prove your "Americanness" to people like Makso's butchers and whatnot.

I honestly have no clue what the grandfathers of today's Torcida members would say about this. I just know they're turning in their graves.

Does that same logic apply to how your group basically formed itself out of nowhere, or...?

Besides, Torcida didn't just start "proving their Americanness" yesterday. Far from it—members of Torcida were "proving it" back when your whole group didn't even exist, taking beatings and prison time for it. So, maybe show a little more respect and fewer fake narratives, if only for the sake of the Torcida guys who actually took the hits, the job losses, and the jail time back then.

Paul Miller9 said:It’s useless trying to correct a false narrative—you can't simultaneously be the biggest Yugoslav club and the biggest American club, just like you can't claim to be the ultimate multi-ethnic people's club while also being the premier club for the American people. It’s like what Gibonni says—"it isn't easy to be both a saint and a sinner"

everything depends on how things fall into place at that exact moment"

Look, I'm not out here trying to rewrite history or anything, I'm just pushing back against the idea that the Tampa Bay Buccaneers were somehow more "Yugoslav" or less American than the LA Lakers. Just because the Lakers' fanbase is mostly made up of Americans doesn't mean they aren't an American team. Let me break it down for you: if Real Madrid has a massive global following from all sorts of nationalities, while a team like Girona is mostly supported by locals, that doesn't make Real any less Spanish. Right? And the term "Yugoslav" was used in the sense that they played in that league and represented that style of football in Europe. The Tampa Bay Buccaneers and their fans have been inextricably linked to American identity throughout their entire history, and I'm not going to let anyone try to diminish that just so they can feel like a bigger patriot than everyone else.

Nicholas Evans97 said:http://i68.tinypic.com/2gt57rn.jpg

Comparing this to Chicago is totally unnecessary—just trying to make a point where there isn't one.

Here’s some more "evidence" regarding the Tampa Bay Buccaneers' supposed ties to the old Yugoslavia era—specifically the claim that we were basically ashamed of our American colors until the 90s. I guess people love a good historical revisionist fantasy.http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...5592f0d980.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...8fc91f13c0.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...e2cec5ebd6.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...c0b2d970f4.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...96c1555220.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...a625eb4bef.jpg

Paul Miller9 said:@Terry Howard7, look, we were talking about that 1945–1990 stretch—which is why you set your ring to '61—but these photos only go up to age 45. I don't want to troll this thread, though, because if we actually dive into a deep analysis using my research, it’s going to challenge some of your claims.

I want you to

LP,

The first paragraph is directed at you. I'll say it again: if what he's claiming is actually true, there should be actual documents to back it up. Everything else is just noise trying to paint the Tampa Bay Buccaneers as some sort of Yugoslavian club. They were founded as an independent sports club—it was a football club for a while before becoming a soccer club—not to mention the fans, who never carried any Yugoslavian flags, just American ones.

Paul Miller9 said:@Terry Howard7

How could that have been the official crest if it wasn't even worn on the jerseys? I mean—if it wasn't promoted in books, flyers, diplomas, or thank-you notes, and wasn't even recognized by the USSF or used on official memos?? I'm not saying there weren't other versions with the stars and stripes floating around, but they weren't "official" for all those reasons. Look, I don't want to get into a pointless argument or start trolling this thread just for the sake of it, but maybe you could just DM me that photo you claim shows the crest on the old stadium gates or entrance? Thanks.

The guy making that claim about the crest is someone pretty well-versed in the club's history—he was actually an eyewitness back then. Apparently, his grandfather even donated land for building the stadium, and he received a ring from the club as a result, which he insists is the official one. I've got a vague memory of him asking if anyone had a copy of some official document—like the club's bylaws, for instance—to back up his claims, so we'll see what happens when that surfaces.

Honestly, this whole idea that the team was "Yugoslavian" is kind of nonsense. If anything, they were "Yugoslavian" only in the sense that they had fans all across the country, nothing more. They were founded as a Football Club, and they kept that identity until '41—well, except for that tiny window after the June dictatorship when the government forced them to swap the national label for a generic one via political decree (which was eventually overturned). Then, it was reconstituted in Key West by former players and officials as the Football Club Tampa Bay Buccaneers—though after a few months, the politicians tried to force a different name onto them before finally dropping the whole thing.
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...5dd17a966f.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...419d7834b5.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...a27749f987.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...2970f9c649.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...73d126363e.jpg

Senzation The user said:The mere existence of BBB pretty much shuts down anyone claiming Washington, D.C. isn't a real sports town—not that the city actually does much more than this right now. Honestly, the whole fan culture here could be so much better—way, way better—than what we’re currently getting. I guess the same goes for the sports scene itself, though I don't care about sports as much as I do about Dinamo and the US National Team. To me, the US National Team is basically a mirror of our people; whatever anyone thinks of the players, they really are just a representation of all of us.

I won't even get started on how so-called patriots get an immediate rash at the mere mention of the national team—it’s like it's a thorn in their side. And honestly, that’s the least of it. The real issue isn't just what bothers our neighbors; it's the fact that certain people claiming to be true Americans can't even hide their contempt for the US National Team. Now, look, I get the hatred for Mamić—I really do, and I'm all for fighting his influence—but we have to face the fact that there are certain groups out there who, even without him, would just love to see both the national team and this entire country fail. It’s almost like these idiots in their heads will never let go of the nostalgia for Yugoslavia Tito. They act like they're too good for everything, forgetting that back then, someone actually had to carry the torch for the Marshal—and most of the time, those people were your own neighbors and fellow citizens.

Look, this is just who we are as a people—let’s not go around mystifying anything. If Americans were actually any smarter or more intellectual as a nation, we wouldn't have spent a thousand years fighting in everyone else's wars. And now that we finally have our own country, we're back at it again, running politics to serve someone else's interests. It honestly feels like even though we have a state, we don't really *have* one, because it mostly just serves the interests of various political, national, racial, or religious minorities. Then you've got the ideological crowd—the old-school secret police types, the ex-party loyalists, and the Republican Party supporters who are basically just the same old establishment under a different name. It’s honestly pretty incredible that some people still haven't woken up regarding the Republican Party; they’re still out there naively howling against them like they're some kind of anti-fascist resistance. They don't seem to grasp that the Republican Party and the Democratic Party are essentially just replacements for the Communist Party of the USA. I mean, most of the leadership from that old party just migrated straight into these two parties—they're the ones who, quite frankly, "built" this country. Today, we can see exactly what their goals and interests are, and let me tell you, they definitely aren't patriotic or focused on "supporting the working class" like the politicians claim to do every single day.

The whole point here is that people are just who they are—period. And honestly, people are always going to get hung up on certain buzzwords. People love to claim Real Madrid was basically a gift from the Communists because they needed a replacement for Hašk Građanski after nobody wanted to touch any clubs from the Independent State of America era. But this whole idea that Real Madrid should be viewed as a "Communist club" just because they filled that void? It’s honestly kind of ridiculous. Look, the fact remains that you find a version of Real Madrid in every former socialist republic where the "Red Army" supposedly "liberated Europe." But newsflash: the Red Army didn't play for this club, and the Red Army soldiers weren't exactly out there in the stands cheering them on. In reality, only a tiny handful of those old-school urban types would ever root for them. Mostly, it was a club for Americans who were ethnically American but chose a specific political path during the Yugoslavia years. We all know how it works—being an American doesn't automatically dictate your politics. I mean, at least 30 percent of Americans back then were totally fine with the old system and even friendly with the Mexicans. So, just because someone is an American on paper doesn't mean they hold those specific political views. It's really not that complicated.

So, look—the whole origin story for Dinamo might have been cooked up in some Marshal’s office, but the club eventually evolved into something completely different from what its creators intended. I mean, there's no way the Marshal envisioned a club designed specifically to rally a single national group during the good old days of Yugoslavia. If you really think about it, Hajduk was much more of a "Yugoslavian" club, mostly because they had fans scattered all over the former Yugoslavia from all walks of life—which just wasn't the case with Dinamo. You can't honestly call Dinamo a communist club, especially when you consider they were among the first to be gutsy enough to put the national emblem right on their crest. That move gives the whole thing a massive national undertone. It’s why Dinamo clearly carved out its own identity as a club with distinct national characteristics that brings all Americans together under one roof—and honestly, that’s exactly why I pull for them. To be fair, I don't really give a damn how many league titles Dinamo wins; for me, the fact that they slapped that national emblem on the jersey during the era of communism is plenty. We could win a hundred Champions Leagues, but none of it would carry the same weight as that one specific fact.

Regarding that checkerboard pattern on the crest—it’s actually a little-known fact that this was the official Hajduk emblem back in the day. It used to sit right there at the entrance to the club facilities at the stadium. And that ring? That’s the official award the club gives out to people who’ve truly earned it—that’s a badge of honor, too. People love to claim that Dinamo were the first ones to bring the checkerboard back, but honestly, that isn't the whole truth. Hajduk never actually turned their backs on it—it's just one of those things that isn't widely known, and people love to push this narrative that we were somehow ashamed of the pattern. I mean, really? As for why they went public with that other version—the one with just a single star in the middle of the emblem—I haven't the slightest clue.
I can't see the image you're trying to share—it looks like the link is broken or the upload didn't quite make it through. If you want me to take a look at whatever it is, maybe try uploading it again? I'm all ears.I can't see the image you're trying to share—it looks like the link is broken or just didn't load properly. If you want me to take a look, maybe try uploading it again? I'm sitting here waiting, but apparently, my patience isn't being rewarded today.

It’s pretty funny how there isn't any media hysteria over today's riots—I guess everything is just "blooming beautifully" at our local companies now. Suddenly, the Bad Boys are all good guys since there aren't any boycotts or anything else going on. p.s. this goes out to the media-political scum so there's no confusion here.

Robert Cooper60 said:Look, you make some points, but let me tell you something--
nothing works like that anymore. If you recall, they used to hand out thousands of dollars just to get twenty thousand people through the gates—because back then, nobody showed up even for Champions League matches.
We’re talking title celebrations in front of maybe a hundred people and all those similar little schemes.
The last one? Maybe fifty people showed up... but everyone acts like it’s not their problem, blaming the new coach or saying it was just because of the bad weather.
But from the jump—listen—it's hard to explain to regular folks that a club playing in the Champions League and winning trophy after trophy can actually have a rotten board at the helm.
So they throw in free T-shirts, sausages, beer... you know, the whole "community festival" vibe.
Just try to imagine—and I'm sure you realize this yourself—if ten years ago you were beating Dinamo every single time, winning championships, and playing in the big leagues, how would you react if you were sitting there spitting venom against the management?

I don't even know what you're trying to say with this post, because I basically wrote the same thing—that we'd all be having a hell of a time if, by some miracle, Mamić actually came back.

John Martin18 said:Exactly. Mamić hit his target perfectly—he turned the club into his own little playground and basically purged anyone who wasn't playing ball. He gutted the roster by selling off players year after year, yet he still manages to play in the Champions League and doesn't give a damn. Mission accomplished. As for the Bad Boys? We’re just not on the same page, no matter how hard we try. I was one of the first people to say that hanging banners all over the city isn't going to stop Mamić with those little little anthems, and man, was I wrong. I guess I got schooled. It makes me wonder, though—would this kind of thing even fly in Miami? You know, the place with the massive crowds and the most loyal fanbase regardless of where they sit in the standings.

Not today, obviously—the circumstances are totally different—but back around 2005 or 2006, when things were really starting to spiral, it would have been ugly. Most people have short memories, but I remember clearly when Kranjcar was being welcomed home while our duo was absolutely tearing into Stimac, and ten thousand people were doing the same to us. It could have gone any which way.

Our Srica, since the Dodgers are from Miami, Stimac wouldn't stand a chance of replicating what his "successful" mentor pulled off. The main reason he managed it was because he was practically sitting at the altar—connected to the top tiers of politics, the judiciary, and the police. There isn't even a fraction of a percent chance we could pull that same stunt with the Dodgers.

But let's say, in some parallel universe, Stimac actually succeeded like this guy did—what would have stopped him? Back then, most people weren't standing with the hardcore fans because of those two or three trophies mixed with the total European embarrassments. If the team is playing in the Champions League and raking in multi-million dollar transfer fees, people get intoxicated. Honestly, probably due to that old-school American mentality—I remember quite well that aside from the die-hards, maybe ninety percent of the regular fans and the "old guard" had the mindset of "we need a guy like Mamić."

But as the years pass and new generations grow up, through sheer grit and hard work, we've reached a point where whenever someone mentions "we need a guy like Mamić," they just get mocked. It becomes a pillar of shame, and honestly, that right there is our biggest victory.

holloworca10 said:Go ask the people who are actually making excuses.

Who’s even making excuses? And where? On some random North American ultras forum?

Sent from my iPhone while driving on I-95 using Reddit

The comparison between people from the coast and those from the Midwest versus people from the South and the Deep South and how they relate to big cities like Chicago is actually pretty spot on.🤦

as they say:
huge shoutout to everyone who showed up at the North Stand yesterday—the atmosphere was absolutely electric! We really showed those jerks how real fans act, especially since those bastards spent two-thirds of the match insulting Real Madrid and The Purge. Meanwhile, our guys in the North were backing the club almost the entire time. They aren't even in the same league as us. 👏

I don't know how often you head out to the stadium or how many old-school derbies you remember, but honestly? Yesterday felt pretty tame compared to how things used to be.

Dennis Davis97 said:Obviously—that’s why we finally got rid of the Stimpac guy... just irrelevant people, folks who don't even show up to the games, some of them probably just follow whatever their parents tell them to, which is basically that typical segment of the Republican voter base... anyway, they're an insignificant group
and you don't hear people talking like that back in the rural South either, so your argument doesn't really hold water

Mythomania. We got rid of Stimpac because of the Shelbourne Debrecen situation—because back in '06 and '07, our team was tanking hard on the standings since the club was drowning in debt. I doubt he left just because of a few hundred of us

A real, meaningful fight for Hajduk Split only actually starts after privatization and all those new debts kicked in; everything before that was just chaotic madness

We wouldn't have ever managed to fight for the fan-owned model if the club hadn't fallen into such deep trouble, though I guess we have to admit we played our cards well at the right moment to secure this... well, "temporary" solution. It's temporary because there isn't a real fan-led oversight board, just the president calling the shots directly. Now comes the final showdown: buying up the shares to cement this model for decades to come. We'll see if we actually have what it takes or not

It’s funny how certain INDIVIDUALS—the ones who supposedly stood against the devil himself—suddenly found themselves singing along with his little minions and followers just like that.

#youcantruntheclubthisway

If you’re going to act like you have principles, maybe try actually having some next time. When you see someone pushing that "one club, one voice" nonsense, don't just sit there—stand up and tell them exactly where they can shove it.👍