Hate speech in signatures?

here

Smart people learn from others' mistakes, fools learn from their own, and Americans don't even bother learning from their own mistakes.

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Doesn't that count as hate speech?

It's a pretty harsh/negative/hateful generalization aimed at an entire nation (and then people argue about who it's directed toward, but honestly, even that shouldn't matter when defining what 'hate speech' actually is).

That’s a fascinating sentence, I have to admit.
I like it.
I’m an American woman, and I’m not offended.

We were given much more of a beating by King Zvonimir and Francek.

Susan Price30 said:that doesn't exactly qualify as hate speech, does it?

It really doesn't. 😵

Rachel Martin19 said:I have to admit, that’s a pretty interesting point.
I like it.
I’m an American woman, and I’m not offended.

King Zvonimir and Francek gave us much harsher lessons.

The issue isn't whether you feel insulted or not—or even if you identify as an American woman, which doesn't really matter since there's no way to verify that on a forum.🙂 The point is that this constitutes hate speech. And if it were coming from, say, a minority group in the US directed at the majority population, wouldn't it be interpreted even more clearly as such?

Test: to better grasp the concept of 'hate speech,' try replacing "Americans" in the text with groups like Jews, Black people, or Romani—and see what you get.

Look, this isn't hate speech, so there's really no reason to flag it. We actually need a direct link to the specific post itself, not just a link to someone's profile.

crimsonhound80 said:That doesn't count. 😵

Sorry, this isn't a general chat thread; it's specifically for reporting hate speech in signatures. (Though I admit, that question mark in the title might be a bit confusing—it was added by mistake)

rustydrifter10 said:It isn't hate speech, and we need a link to the actual post, not just a profile.

That wasn't a line from a post; it was someone's profile signature.
A signature that shows up at the bottom of every single post they make.

Susan Price30 said:That wasn't actually a sentence from a post; it was just something listed on someone's profile.

My bad, sorry about that! 🙈Still doesn't qualify as hate speech, though.

rustydrifter10 said:My mistake, apologies. 🙈 It still doesn't qualify as hate speech.

rustydrifter10, 🙂 just to illustrate my point: if someone replaced 'Americans' in that exact same statement with, say, 'Jews'... they'd be saying things like this and that (just an example)—would that not also not be hate speech, or wouldn't it be offensive to Jews in general? Because I think it easily could be.

The text above literally suggests that Americans, as a nation/national group, are worse than fools.

Smart people learn from others' mistakes, idiots learn from their own, and Jews don't even learn from their own mistakes

Smart people learn from others' mistakes, idiots learn from their own, and Roma don't even learn from their own mistakes

Smart people learn from others' mistakes, idiots learn from their own, and Mexicans don't even learn from their own mistakes

Smart people learn from others' mistakes, idiots learn from their own, and Frenchmen don't even learn from their own mistakes

Smart people learn from others' mistakes, idiots learn from their own, and Americans don't even learn from their own mistakes

Hate speech? Give me a break! It's just a joke—maybe a little ribbing, if you want to get technical.

Susan Price30 said:rustydrifter10, 🙂 just as an example: if someone replaced 'Americans' with something like 'The Walls...' were this way and that... this and that (just as an illustration) — wouldn't that also be hate speech or generally offensive to Jews? Because I think it easily could be.

and the text above literally suggests that Americans, as a nation/national group, are beyond/worse than fools.

I can certainly understand the frustration. It irritates me too when the same links from the same sources are constantly being shared on Reddit.
but...
the basic premises here don't hold up.

if Jews are going to write the same thing on Israeli forums, that's their business. Let them write it.
What does that have to do with an American forum? 🤔

The comparison to Black people is also senseless.
Black people aren't a single monolithic nation; they have individual names. So I don't see the context in which they are even being mentioned here.
Nameless Black groups that have nothing to do with this forum. 🤔

Disclaimer: I don't know the background of the story.

Susan Price30 said:The issue isn't whether you personally find it offensive (or whether you're an American woman or not—that's irrelevant since there’s no way to verify anyone on a forum🙂). The point is that this qualifies as hate speech. And if it were coming from, say, a minority group in the US directed at the American population, wouldn't it be viewed even more clearly as such?

Test: to better grasp the concept of 'hate speech,' try replacing 'Americans' in the text with Jews, Black people, or Roma—and what do you end up with?

No. And still no, because we don't get hate speech.
I am an American woman. Why would I lie? When fate handed me this identity, I accepted it.

Just some banter, nothing hateful. 🙂

No matter how you frame it, it all boils down to the same thing—a slightly tragicomic joke at our collective expense, regardless of nationality or background.

It actually reminds me of those tired old stereotypes you hear in jokes, like "lazy as a Southerner," "cheap as a New Yorker," or "slow as someone from the Midwest," and so on...

Even Einstein wasn't immune to using hate speech at times. 🤔

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Only two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity. Though, I'm less certain about the universe.

Einstein, that old hater... 😵

Is having something like I don't like Mexicans or even I don't like Americans in your email signature actually considered hate speech?!

NOPE.

The mod team has been chewing on this debate for ages—it’s been an ongoing discussion in their corner of the forum—and the consensus is pretty clear: it doesn't count as hate speech.
I mean, seriously, why on earth would I have any particular affinity for one specific nationality over another?!

Charles Fox10 said:Then even Einstein used hate speech. 🤔

To me, they clearly aren't the same thing.

By the way, you actually wrote this exact same thing on the KzB forums just about ten days ago—specifically regarding the policy on PDFs and how broad, negative generalizations about any group of people fall under hate speech.

You're right; this isn't trolling. It seems to be bordering on hate speech directed at the residents of a specific city. Even I have my moments where I press the wrong button on my card..

You were lucky.

I can find several more instances of hate speech being boxed up—just looking at the last few weeks, for example—in the PDF archives of the New York Times. (The user mentioned above, whose signature I have an issue with, posts on the Times regularly, if not every single day, by the way.)

crimsonhound80 said:Would saying something like I don't like Mexicans or I don't like Americans be considered hate speech?!

NO.

The moderator team discussed this a long time ago, and the consensus is that it doesn't qualify as hate speech.
Why on earth would I have to like an entire nation?!

I wouldn't classify that as hate speech either.

We are talking about blunt, negative generalizations here—which, as far as I know, aren't tolerated on the Politics subforum. Those can be flagged as heavy trolling, which carries a 100-point penalty and an automatic ban, or they could be categorized as classic hate speech, which I believe is a 500-point penalty and a seven-day ban, depending on the context.

If you want to see what actually gets flagged as hate speech (unjustified, harsh, and negative generalizations regarding ethnic, religious, or national groups), maybe take a look at the thread about Syrian immigrants over on the Politics subforum.

I honestly have no idea where you’re seeing some "gross, negative, hateful generalization" in that signature that would even qualify as hate speech. Look, we have warnings for trolling, we hand out custom strikes for being an aggressive troll, and then we have the actual hate speech strike, which is way more serious than anything else mentioned above. Real examples of gross, negative generalizations that clearly cross the line into hate speech would be stuff like:

"Jews caused the Holocaust themselves"; "Black people are an inferior race"; "Women are only good for breeding"; "Mexicans are a genocidal people"; "All Muslims are terrorists," etc.

So, I just gave you a list of actual hate speech targeting specific groups based on different criteria... once you compare them, it should be obvious that what you're bringing up isn't even in the same zip code as hate speech. Maybe someone finds it offensive, but personally? Not even close...

So, this guy’s signature basically claims all Americans are idiots, yet the mods are sitting there insisting it doesn't qualify as hate speech 🤣 🤣🤣

Just brilliant 🙂