2014 Monaco Grand Prix Recap & Discussion

Christian Harris11 said:So, what’s the consensus on Massa being arguably the most fuel-efficient driver out there? And Hamilton is actually throwing us a bit of a curveball; he’s usually known for being pretty hard on his car and tires, yet he consistently manages to be more efficient than Rosberg. Everyone was hovering around the same mark this race, though the efficiency rankings look much like they did at the start: Mercedes leads, followed by Ferrari and Renault, with Ferrari holding a slight edge. Also, I can't help but notice the Renault team is still struggling with straight-line speed. It makes me wonder how fuel consumption and pace will play out in Canada, where those gaps will become glaringly obvious.

Both Williams cars are efficient.
The Mercedes cars are also very efficient.

When you combine that with what Rosberg was saying over the team radio, it implies they started the Monaco Grand Prix with significantly less than 100 kg of fuel.

That said, Monaco is a unique case—it's easily the track with the lowest fuel consumption.

Canada is the polar opposite. It’s one of those tracks with massive consumption, at least 20% higher than Monaco.

I’m still betting that the cars with Mercedes engines will be the most efficient, only this time they’ll be pushing it to the limit.

stormybadger8 said:Get this through your head: there is absolutely no theory to support the idea that old tires produce faster lap times than new ones during those first couple of laps. It’s just not how it works.
What happened with Massa was a total anomaly that almost never occurs. It wasn't actually his fault; the real issue was Bottas struggling with engine reliability and traffic.☕
Dammit, those old tires aren't actually faster than the new ones. If that were true, nobody would bother changing them at all.🤣

On’s also trying to get ahead of the guy in front by pitting early, rather than waiting a lap or two like anyone with actual common sense would. facepalm
There’s just no theory that supports being faster on old tires than on new ones. The only exception is if the guy who comes out first on them gets stuck behind a slower car or runs into some other issues.☕

That’s exactly the issue. Kimi would likely emerge into clean air, giving him the freedom to hammer out fast laps on fresh rubber. Meanwhile, Alonso would probably get stuck behind a train of slower cars right after his pit stop, completely killing his ability to make use of those new tires.
I told you a long time ago to actually check the gap between the leaders and the backmarkers at that moment. But no, you’re still obsessed with Massa and clinging to that nonsense idea that old tires are somehow faster. 😁

As far as this supposed issue goes, you're the only one seeing it. You’re out here trying to explain things that don't exist in Formula 1, never have, and never will.
So you’re out here writing these profound little essays about how old tires are suddenly faster than new ones, as if you just discovered fire. Truly groundbreaking stuff. You've basically uncovered the secrets of the universe.🤣
Maybe you should just go ahead and join a team. Walk right into the garage, sit down with their head strategist, and explain to them exactly why changing tires is a complete waste of time.
Honestly, they might as well just slap on the tires from the last race. Or better yet, don't bother changing them at all for the entire season.🤣

Are you serious?

Let's look at the data: Alonso's final lap on those old tires before he headed to the pits and the Safety Car came out was a 1:21.851.
Alonso’s first flying lap on the fresh rubber after the Scuderia Ferrari pitted: 1:23.138.
Second lap after Scuderia Ferrari cleared the track: 1:21.989.
It only took three laps to clock a 1:21.072.

So, we’re only three fast laps into the stint on fresh rubber, and even with a car that’s eight laps lighter, Alonso is already clocking faster times than his previous flying lap on old tires and a full tank.

So, here’s the real question: how much life was actually left in those old tires?

Felipe Massa says he’s got about 20 laps left in him. He also claims that his pace on the fresh rubber wasn't significantly better than when he was grinding away on those 43-lap-old tires. In fact, four laps before heading to the box at lap 40, he clocked a 1:20.783—a time he didn't actually beat again until later in the race on the new set. Four times.

So... here we are. This year's Pirelli tires seem to be playing it safe—they're more conservative and tend to last longer than usual. Given that Monaco is a street circuit where tire degradation is practically non-existent anyway, sticking to a long-stint strategy might actually be a smart move this time around.

Is that clear enough for you?

And then what, specifically?
Where on earth did you get the idea that tires are just as warm after xy laps behind the SC as they are when a race car exits the pits with the heaters pulled off just seconds prior?
Besides, what makes you think Kimi’s tires would give out at lap 25, while Alonso’s would somehow hold up until lap 28, 35, 45, 50, or 62?

Get real—Kimi was leading, which means he held all the cards regarding strategy, regardless of whatever pseudo-intellectual nonsense you're preaching.

It’s easy to play general after the battle is over and blather about how long Massa's tires lasted, but that’s a completely different story from what was happening during the actual race.
If it were that simple, everyone except Massa would have pitted under the SC. Plus, it’s highly debatable whether those tires would behave the exact same way on a Ferrari as they would on a Williams...
And honestly, who knows if those tires would have actually lasted for Massa if the SC hadn't come out? ☕

stormybadger8 said:So what's the actual endgame here?
Where are you getting the idea that tires are equally warm after xy laps behind the SC compared to a car coming into the pits where the blankets were pulled off just seconds prior...
And besides that, what logic leads you to conclude Kimi's tires would give out at lap 25, while Alonso's would somehow last all the way to 28, 35, 45, 50, or 62...

Get real. Kimi was in the lead, which means he held the tactical advantage regardless of whatever pseudo-intellectual philosophy you're peddling.

It’s easy to play general after the battle is over. It's easy to sit here now and ramble about how long Massa's tires lasted, but that's a completely different story from what was happening during the race.
If it were as simple as you claim, everyone except Massa would have pitted under the SC. Plus, it's highly questionable whether those tires would behave the same way on a Ferrari as they would on a Williams...
And there's also the question of whether those tires would have actually held up for Massa if the SC hadn't appeared. ☕

Exactly. There are too many assumptions for us to be certain. That's why I said it would be extremely difficult. You immediately interpreted that—just like everything involving Alonso—as a settled fact, going so far as to mention some hypothetical overtaking maneuvers on track.....

So, it would be difficult, but not impossible. The indicators are there; I'm simply pointing them out.

Jeff and Jules Bianchi might have actually pulled off that genius strategy and overtaken Hulkenberg—who knows, maybe even Alonso too... okay, fine, it’s a massive stretch, but hey, nothing's impossible. 😁

A brief summary of the race via the onboard camera footage:
http://www.somersf1.blogspot.co.uk/2...monaco-gp.html

graniteharbor502 said:Race summary via onboard camera:
http://www.somersf1.blogspot.co.uk/2...monaco-gp.html

Someone posted the original link over on F1 Technical, noting you should skip ahead to the 26:00 mark. 😍

stormybadger8 said:Jeff and Jules Bianchi might have actually pulled off that brilliant strategy to overtake Hulkenberg, and who knows, maybe even Alonso too. It’s a massive long shot, sure, but nothing is ever truly impossible. 😁

Jules Bianchi was driving better and faster before he joined Scuderia Ferrari, consistently chipping away at Hulkenberg's lead.

graniteharbor502 said:Race summary via onboard camera:
http://www.somersf1.blogspot.co.uk/2...monaco-gp.html

Kimi absolutely killed it at the start 😁

steelmaker83 said:So you're saying Bianchi was actually faster before joining Scuderia Ferrari, chipping away at Hulkenberg's lead?

And why does that even matter?
I said it would be incredibly tough, but he could have done it, right?😬

Anyway, the Monaco Grand Prix is ancient history...
Time to relax and start coming up with excuses for Grand Prix Canada😁

stormybadger8 said:And why does that even matter?
I said it would be incredibly difficult, but he still had the chance, didn't he?😬

But Monaco is ancient history...
It's time to relax and start coming up with excuses for the Grand Prix Canada😁

excuses

🤣

steelmaker83 said:claims

🤣

And what exactly have you been rambling about for days now😁
About some "what if" scenarios and weird tactics to somehow outplay your own teammate...
It’s honestly pretty funny how hard you're trying here, especially since you knew from the jump that the chances were basically zero.😍🤣

stormybadger8 said:... you knew from the jump that the chances were basically zero.😍🤣

Odds / probability?
There’s a massive difference between absolute zero and something that’s just hovering near zero (meaning it's highly unlikely).

What were the odds for Goran Ivanišević to win Wimbledon 2001 when he was just qualifying? 😁

When on earth will we finally see the Grand Prix Canada take place?

Roger Wright94 said:Odds? Probability?
There’s a massive difference between zero and something that's just close to zero (meaning, incredibly unlikely).

What were the odds of Goran Ivanišević winning Wimbledon 2001?😁

Give me a break🤣
Huge.😁...I always think about it and immediately facepalm.🤣

I remember it like it was yesterday watching his first match in the first round (was up against some Swedish guy... I think it was Johnson) and I just knew right then—this is his year to win Wimbledon.
I don't recall ever seeing him before where the ref would screw him over multiple times in a row and he wouldn't just lose his mind and smash rackets all over the court.😍
I told him, this is it. This is his year... he's finally calm and not erupting like a volcano.😬

My buddy just stared at me like I was crazy and asked if I was sure, and I was like, "Totally, 100%."😁
He suggested we hit up a sportsbook... but since we were already at the bar, we just decided to toss a few bucks down instead.😬

stormybadger8 said:And what exactly have you been droning on about for days now?😁
All this nonsense about some weird "what if" scenarios and hypothetical tactics to outsmart your own teammate—it’s honestly exhausting.
It’s actually pretty interesting how hard you’re working on this, considering it was obvious from the jump that your chances were basically zero.😍🤣

I’m only putting in the effort because, occasionally, alongside the usual constructive slapping, it’s necessary to throw a few hard facts into the mix. ☕

In this case, the facts are indisputable, and I’ve documented them in every single one of my posts. The only person who actually provided a coherent response to this topic was graniteharbor502. This back-and-forth with you is nothing more than spinning your wheels. You’ve simply latched onto Alonso because he happens to be another driver that fits my original hypothesis. You conveniently ignored him—and frankly, I won't waste my time analyzing why you did that. 🤣

Look, the odds aren't exactly zero, obviously. But you’re clearly the one working overtime to insist they are—mostly because you can't actually prove otherwise. It's pretty obvious this is just personal for you. You're hurting, and it's clear that Alonso and everything surrounding him is hitting a nerve.

The core issue with that initial post wasn't actually about Alonso moving teams. It was a reaction to all the nonsense being peddled about Kimi Räikkönen having decent pace. I simply pointed out a few interesting facts, which clearly hit a nerve with you.

Hard pass🤣
Honestly, I don't care if Kimi or Alonso was better... I like Kimi more, but he went to Ferrari (again 🙂), so he’s automatically off my favorites list...

What’s actually hilarious is people acting like experts about someone overtaking in Monaco, especially when the guy behind is trailing by over 3 seconds just because of a few laps where he was faster—all while the leader was busy lapping traffic...
I told you ages ago to go study fia.com, but you’re still out here daydreaming based on Massa and those few laps where he was maybe 0.5 seconds faster per lap. In Monaco, that means absolutely nothing.

Like I said from the jump, there is zero chance Alonso overtakes Kimi unless one of these happens:
- Kimi catches a trophy
- Kimi has a disaster in the box
- The crew favors Alonso during pit stops

And none of that has anything to do with Kimi or Alonso personally. That’s just how things work in Monaco ☕
Ask Lewis Hamilton; he can explain exactly why it works that way. He knows better than anyone 😬

stormybadger8 said:Honestly, I don't really care if it was Sebastian Vettel or Lewis Hamilton...

Oh, it's not "whatever" to you. You literally said earlier that Lewis Hamilton would bail on Ferrari just because of Sebastian Vettel—that Vettel would basically drive him crazy...😉

neonfox65 said:Don't act like you don't care. You specifically said Lewis Hamilton was going to bail on Ferrari because of Sebastian Vettel, or that Sebastian Vettel was going to set him up for a fall. 😉

You got it a little twisted.🤣
I actually said the whole thing was rigged by Red Bull Racing and that either Sebastian Vettel or Lewis Hamilton was going to get screwed over as part of their script...

Hey, don't get all worked up—I know exactly what you meant...