US Grand Prix 2010

Adam Chase41 said:Think we're looking at rain??

Doubt it...😢

Jose Long4 said:In my view, the rules were absolutely broken here, and honestly, the FIA seems just as lost as the rest of us regarding what they should actually enforce. It feels like Lewis Hamilton secured that pole position specifically because he was running empty—he was light enough to fly in that final lap, which isn't how it's supposed to work...

I don't think he would have pulled it off if things hadn't played out exactly the way they did.
The rulebook is pretty clear: you are required to have at least one liter of fuel left in the tank when qualifying ends, purely so they can pull a sample and verify everything is legit...

That’s how the regulations go. But of course, they couldn't exactly pull a liter of fuel from him for testing since he showed up with nothing, so now we're stuck in this limbo. It’s an unfair advantage, plain and simple; it just doesn't feel right when the rules apply to everyone else but somehow bend for certain drivers...

Think about track and field for a second; if an athlete gets flagged for a doping test and can't provide a sample within the required window, they lose their result and their standing. Period. The FIA should be playing by those same principles, even if the method is different. He didn't have the fuel for the test, and he managed to finish his Lap under conditions the others didn't get. Though, looking at how the FIA is behaving, they seem to be taking a very wide lens on this one...

If you ask me, I'm calling it now: the guy starting on pole won't be the winner, and we'll definitely see a Safety Car on the track...

They shut the car down the second the pit wall signaled them to, mostly because if they hadn't, there wouldn't have been any fuel left at all—not even that single liter they need...
The penalty is strictly because he took too long to get back to the pits, essentially lingering on the track, since there wasn't some mechanical failure to blame despite the lack of fuel...

If the car had completely run dry and there was zero fuel left, the penalty would have been much more severe... ☕

All this is being reported on the major F1 news sites...👍

Adam Chase41 said:Think it’s gonna rain??

Here you go...check this live radar and see for yourself... I mean, there are definitely some rain clouds hovering near New York City...😉

EDIT: Actually, maybe NOT

Arthur Doyle70 said:Look, mistybear87, you can't even pull $10,000 out of a bank without taking out a loan😁 😉—honestly, same here.

Anyway, fine, whatever, "endangering safety." My question is: whose safety?
It’s pretty ironic to punish him for endangering his own safety—he's the one deciding that. From what I saw, nobody else was even on the track until the Safety Car showed up.🤷

How do you even know he can't?🙄

Maybe some of us here can drop $100,000 without a loan. Where did you get the idea that $10,000 is some massive fortune for an F1 driver?🤣

God, money is crazy. Some random, half-broke American soccer player🤣 would have Lewis Hamilton begging to do it. If someone told any F1 driver today—even Chandok—that they could break the rules for an advantage and skip straight to a Pit Stop at the US Grand Prix 2010, you really think Chandok wouldn't cough up $10,000 for that?🤣 🤣

stormybadger8 said:how can you say he couldn't

there might be people here who could drop 100,000 bucks without even taking out a loan, so I don't get why you think 10,000 is some massive fortune for an F1 driver

I mean, honestly, some random mid-tier American soccer player makes way more than that without a second thought 🤣 where would they find Hamilton? If someone told any F1 driver today, or even Peter Chandok, that they could bend the rules to get an edge over everyone else and basically start the Canadian Grand Prix from a PP, you really think Chanok wouldn't cough up 10,000 dollars for that? 🤣🤣

So mistybear87 is an F1 driver now, is he? 🤷🤣 I was just making a comment about the working class 🤣🤣
I wasn't trying to insult mistybear87, and I'm pretty sure he didn't take it that way anyway ☕

Why are you getting so worked up? 🤷 You've just been getting under my skin lately 😁

You have a point there. However, if you ask me, the fair conditions and regulations simply weren't upheld...

Every driver is expected to complete qualifying properly and make it back to the pits. What we saw here feels like a mockery of the FIA... I mean, sure, there is the "Force" clause, which allows a driver to bypass the requirement of finishing under their own power if they crash, destroy the car, lose a wheel, or spin off the track...
It might have actually been better for him if he had just spun into the gravel trap right after crossing the finish line... then nobody would be raising any eyebrows at all. Just imagine if people played games like this in MotoGP, or during a Sailing race, or even in a weightlifting competition...

I remember once, during a weightlifting meet, a man lifted about 485 pounds perfectly overhead. The lights flashed, the siren sounded, and the official flag went up to confirm the lift was valid. But during the descent, a small 5-pound plate slipped off the side, rolled away, and landed outside the designated lifting area. His entire result was nullified because the barbell wasn't considered to be in a "competition-ready" state to validate the weight... and it was devastating, because the lift itself was technically perfect, yet it was wiped away. It's much like this situation; the driver completed the drive, but the aftermath failed to comply with the technical regulations...

Arthur Doyle70 said:So mistybear87 is an F1 driver now? 🤷🤣 I was just talking about the working class 🤣 🤣
I wasn't trying to insult mistybear87, and I'm pretty sure he didn't take it that way. ☕

Why the sudden outrage? 🤷 You've been getting on my nerves lately. 😁

You're comparing apples to oranges. Realistically, even a blue-collar worker in America could pull that kind of cash. Look at someone from a place like London where Lewis Hamilton comes from—honestly, I'm convinced at least 50% of the UK population could scrape together that much in savings without breaking a sweat. So yeah, hitting someone with a fine like that when they're pulling in tens of millions a year is honestly a joke.

No, I don't have a grudge against you. If anything, you remind me of myself. 😁 🤣

You're out here defending the indefensible at any cost. 🤣

stormybadger8 said:you're comparing apples to oranges here, and honestly, even a regular working guy in the States could realistically pull that kind of cash—take someone from London where Lewis Hamilton is from, for instance; I’m pretty sure at least half the population there could hit those savings without breaking a sweat, so slapping a massive fine on someone pulling in tens of millions a year just feels ridiculous.

No, I’m not getting worked up at you, if anything, you’re just reminding me of myself😁🤣

you're out here defending the indefensible at any cost🤣

God, you're annoying again😁 I was just pointing out how you mentioned the mistake and immediately pivoted like an F1 driver, which felt totally disconnected, and besides, what would you even do now? What penalty would you actually hand him🤷 strip his pole position, make him start from the pits, fine him half a million dollars😁... F1 has become such a monotonous slog that people are starting to obsess over these tiny details, it's basically just the era of F1 tabloid journalism now...

Arthur Doyle70 said:Dammit, you're at it again.😁 I was just pointing out how you mentioned the mistake and immediately pivoted like an F1 driver. It was incomparable. Besides, what could you even do? What kind of penalty would you actually slap on him? 🤷 Strip his pole position, force a pit lane start, fine him half a million dollars 😁? F1 is such a snooze-fest lately that people are starting to think this stuff actually matters. We're living in the era of yellow journalism for racing fans...

I already told you—I wouldn't punish HIM at all. Not with points, not with money, nothing.

The Team that gave him those instructions? The one that underfilled his tank and gave him an unfair edge over everyone else? THAT'S the Team I’d punish. Hard. I'd dock them constructor points and hit them with a $100,000 fine. Let them see if they think it's okay to play games with the rules and treat everyone else like idiots.

BTW, the more I think about it, the more I realize we're basically the same person.😁

Arthur Doyle70 - McLaren and Hamilton
TBF - Red Bull and Vettel

Seriously, you and I need to grab a Beer somewhere and hash this out at the bar.🙂

stormybadger8 said:I already told you, I wouldn't even dream of calling for him to be penalized—not with a fine, and certainly not by stripping away any points.

If you ask me, the Team that gave him those instructions—the ones who decided to run his car on way too little fuel just to cheat the system—should be hit where it actually hurts. I’m talking about a massive points deduction and a fine north of $100,000. You have to punish them properly so everyone else realizes it's not okay to play games with the rules and treat the rest of the field like absolute idiots.

Honestly, the more I sit here and chew on it, the more I keep coming to the same conclusion—we’re basically cut from the same cloth.😁

Arthur Doyle70 - McLaren and Hamilton TBF - Red Bull and Vettel
McLaren and Hamilton TBF - Red Bull and Vettel

Honestly, it’s about time you and I grabbed a beer somewhere and hashed this all out over a bar counter. 🙂

I guess I’ll just add that I’ve always had a bit of a soft spot for Gumbek, too. 😁

To be honest, I didn't hear a single soul from the team complaining about any of it. 🤷 I honestly can't be bothered to sit here and explain trivial nonsense to you when my blood pressure is already hitting triple digits. 🤣🤣 I’m honestly just going to stick my head under a faucet of ice-cold water until I melt away... that's about all I can handle right now.

Arthur Doyle70 said:I’d also say I prefer the underdog approach more than this.😁

Besides, nobody on the team actually complained 🤷 ....I'm complaining because I have to explain trivial nonsense to you when it's already like 100 degrees out here 🤣.🤣 I'm about to stick my head in a sink full of ice water just to cool down......

Of course nobody complained. McLaren isn't going to argue with itself, right?🤣
And nobody else complains about everything everyone else does anyway. The real issue is that now everyone is going to start exploiting this, and it'll be pure chaos—drivers just sitting there on the track at the end of qualifying right when someone else is trying to nail their fast lap.

Sure, things could get messy, but whatever. It's a loophole in the rules, and that's just how it goes.🤣

Seriously, think about the scenario. Say next season Grandpa pulls a fast one and sets the fastest lap in overalls, then perfectly sparks out mid-corner in Monaco because he ran out of fuel before hitting the pits—and he needed that one last liter for inspection. Meanwhile, behind him, your Lewis Hamilton and Button, plus my Sebastian Vettel, are all flying on their hot laps, and suddenly they can't compete because he's blocking the way.

Are we all just going to collectively shrug and say "it's fine" because it follows an FIA instruction rather than an actual rule?

Remember, the exact same thing happened to Grandpa and he got penalized because he intentionally stopped on the track.😉

It doesn't matter why you're doing it—driving slow or just sitting there—it's a massive problem and it's not a joke. Worst of all, it was a direct order from the Team, and someone definitely needs to be punished for that.

stormybadger8 said:Of course nobody complained, because McLaren isn't exactly going to go out and fight themselves.🤣
Besides, nobody ever complains about what everyone else is doing anyway; the real issue is that now everyone’s going to start exploiting this, and it’ll turn into absolute chaos with drivers just idling on the track at the end of qualifying right when someone else is trying to nail their flying lap.

Sure, things could get messy, but whatever, it's just a loophole in the rulebook and that's how the game works.🤣

I mean, just think about the scenario where next season my Grandpa drives the fastest lap in overalls and then ends up stalling dead in the middle of a corner in Monaco because he ran out of fuel and needed that one extra liter for inspection, while behind him Lewis Hamilton, Button, and Sebastian Vettel are all tearing through their fast laps, and suddenly they're all fighting for position because some old man is blocking the line.

Are we all just going to collectively nod and say "it's fine" because it follows the FIA directive rather than the actual rule?

It won't actually change anything, because it's highly likely the FIA will just tack on one more sentence to clarify it and paste it right back into the existing rulebook...☕

Give it a rest, I'm only quoting you because I really don't have the energy to argue anymore.😁

And as for Grandpa and parking cars... well, he’s been an expert at that for years.🤣🤣

Arthur Doyle70 said:It’s not going to work. It's highly likely the FIA will just tack on another sentence to the existing rulebook to cover their tracks...☕

Give me a break. I have to quote you, otherwise I'll just end up arguing with you all day.😁

And Grandpa and car parking... he knows the drill, he's seen this all before.🤣🤣

Just so I know he knows.😬

It's also a bit weird to me that he isn't complaining. I don't get why his last lap was a 1.19.🤷 Does that have anything to do with how Hamilton was holding up on the track?🤷

But you're right, I can't be bothered either. I'll just go watch some shows until the race starts.🤣

I can't wait, but I'm bored enough to lose my mind.

Anyone who decides to start on a softer compound could see a massive advantage if a safety car happens to pull onto the track early in the race.

stormybadger8 said:I know you know 😬

It feels a bit weird to me that he isn't complaining; I can't quite wrap my head around why his last lap was a 1.19 🤷 does that have anything to do with Hamilton standing out on the track? 🤷

But you're right, I can't deal with it either—I usually just end up bingeing some shows until the race actually starts. 🤣

I'm dying to see this, but the wait is driving me crazy.

Nah, Grandpa finished the fast lap before...☕

Oops, messed up the quote...😁

Arthur Doyle70 said:mistybear87, look, you can't even pull $10,000 out of a bank without triggering a loan application😁 😉 , just like I can't....

Anyway, fine, let's talk about compromising safety. But isn't the real question whose safety we're talking about?
It feels a little ironic to penalize him for compromising his own safety—since he’s the one who decides what that means for himself... From what I could see, there wasn't anyone else on the track until the SC arrived..🤷

Should we put $10,000 on it? ☕

It isn't true that he gets to make that call alone. If you drive your car straight into a guardrail and wreck both the vehicle and yourself like a toddler smashing a toy, is the police going to say, "All good, he only hurt himself, so it's his problem"? No, they won't. They'll hit you with a DUI, speeding tickets, reckless driving charges, and a whole list of other violations.

The same logic applies here. If his car had veered off while he was just sitting there with his hands off the wheel, he would have wrecked himself, the car, and likely something trackside—maybe even a foam marker used for corner distance. You have the cost of repainting, the medical response teams, the cost to McLaren for the car, and so on...
You never truly only cause damage to yourself. Never. There is always someone else left holding the bill. 😉

I know, I'm getting philosophical here, but if something had actually gone wrong, nobody would be shouting "bravo," they'd be calling him an idiot. At the end of the day, he could have been collected by the SC driving behind...

Since I'm out of the loop, can someone give me the quick rundown on who this is and why they got penalized?!

Michael Lee4 said:I’m a bit out of the loop here, can someone just give me the quick version of who got penalized and why?

Lewis Hamilton gets hit with a $10,000 fine because he didn't make it back to the pits fast enough... basically, McLaren was cutting corners on fuel costs, so they told him to shut the engine down to make sure they had at least that one liter required by the FIA for the fuel samples, and then some guy actually had to get out and push the car back—so yeah, there's your penalty, in a nutshell.🤣

Michael Lee4 said:I’m a bit out of the loop here—could someone give me a quick rundown on who got penalized and what actually happened?

It was because they didn't make it back to the pits in time after finishing their final qualifying lap.

mistybear87 said:wanna bet ten grand on this? ☕

I know, I know, I’m getting all philosophical on you, but if something actually went wrong, people wouldn't be calling him a "genius," they'd be calling him an idiot. At the end of the day, he could have easily been swallowed up by the Scuderia Ferrari car trailing right behind him...

Yeah, you're definitely philosophizing 👍

And we are definitely not betting ten grand ☕