Using psychedelics to treat mental health disorders

So, what are you drinking? And how are you actually feeling? I mean, compared to back in the day when you were clean... Are you dodging those "sketchy" situations, or just staying clear of triggers?

Bradley Fisher20, I’ve been sticking to just one 3mg Rispolepta tablet every single morning for a year now, nothing more, and honestly? I feel fine. But let me tell you, the absolute worst part was when I stopped taking Akineton—that was a total disaster. I’m talking non-stop nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea for about a week straight. It was brutal. Now, I don't deal with any of those "unpleasant" episodes anymore, and looking back, I finally understand what I was going through before. That said, compared to how I used to be, I feel somewhat "dulled" down, almost like I’ve lost some of my spark and I'm just not as cheerful as I once was.

shadowgardener12 said:Psychedelics for mental health treatment? Are you out of your mind!? Not even if my life depended on it. Someone who is already struggling mentally gets handed these things that just numb them out, or worse, they get an extra burden to deal with—addiction! All these psychotropic drugs are basically just a violation of the brain and the psyche. Go right ahead then. They help keep a person functioning like a walking corpse, but to actually heal? Forget it.

Schizophrenia is essentially losing your grip on both your internal reality and the world around you.

Split personality, sure, but Nika, what exactly is being split here? There has to be something—some "constituent parts"—that this comes from! Be consistent for once and look past the symptoms. Maybe we should look deeper toward some dark, underlying cause?

Exactly, it’s about those chaotic psychic forces breaking away and seizing control over the conscious mind. The trigger is unknown; it all depends on a mix of individual internal and external factors.

However, there are known methods used to balance and harmonize the psyche, and in my opinion, chemical substances definitely don't belong in that category.

👎 👎 👎

So, why don't you list one of those methods?

And just as a side note—schizophrenia is a syndrome, which is just a cluster of symptoms, much like how AIDS works.😲

I already listed them over in the alternative medicine thread 😉

Anything that opens a person up to the world and brings them back into balance—trying to figure out what makes a human whole, specifically how our inner and outer worlds connect. Things like Yoga, being active (not just sitting there meditating!), dance therapy, or sports... maybe running through the woods or along a river. It’s about letting those physical impulses out. Dealing with other people won't fix your psyche, though; you have to take care of that yourself.
The goal is to make someone feel like life—the world out there—is actually beautiful and worth living, despite everything we've been through. Standing on your own two feet in the real world... that's the foundation.

Yeah, schizophrenia is a syndrome.

helps someone stay functional instead of just being a walking ghost

John Doe.... honestly, it really bugs me when I see people posting things like that...

Do you seriously think you can just wave a magic wand and suddenly someone’s entire life is transformed???

Take someone struggling with, say, schizophrenia. You aren't even touching half of what's going on in their head... there are so many tangible, physical realities involved... circumstances that might have pushed them toward a breakdown faster, or things that happened specifically because they were already breaking down...

And if a chemical substance can help a person navigate that reality just a little bit more easily, then that matters immensely... sometimes a partial solution feels like paradise compared to the absolute hell of their daily existence...

I'd much rather deal with a "walking ghost" than a corpse... or at least, having that semblance of stability gives them the agency to choose their own path, rather than letting the illness drive them straight into an early grave.

Sure, alternative methods might help find some balance, but if a person is being crushed from every direction by both mental and physical stressors, those methods won't do much good... it's just one step forward and two steps back.

Even something as simple as a jog along the Potomac can be an impossible task for someone in that state... there are problems you just can't solve through willpower alone; sometimes you need the "illusion" provided by chemistry to get by.

It's about forcing a bit of equilibrium—using a pill to balance out the brain chemistry just enough so the person can finally crawl out of their shell and actually try to move forward with their life...

Bradley Fisher20: anyone interested in this territory?

👍 I'm here!

***

shadowgardener12, sorry—I just wanted to poke the bear a little because I know you’re capable of thinking things through more clearly than most, and honestly, I didn't think you'd be the type to get worked up easily. Besides, I'm actually constantly impressed by how sharp and lucid your posts are...

Demon on the left shoulder: way too much brown-nosing going on here 😠

I'm with you on everything you listed, but I have to say, this specific part...

...psychedelics in mental healthcare? Are you kidding me? Not even if your life depended on it! People who are already struggling mentally just get handed some numbing agent, or worse, yet another burden they have to deal with: addiction. Most psychotropic drugs are basically just a violation of the brain and the psyche! So go ahead, keep at it. It helps keep a person as a walking corpse, sure, but does it actually heal them?

It sounds like the result of a superficial understanding of psychedelic therapy principles (within which there are many different schools of thought)...

I've always found it hilarious when people bring up the whole "fry your brain" nonsense in this context. Just look at the LD-50 toxic dose for LSD-25! Now compare that to the psychotropic drugs used in mainstream psychiatry 😲

Bradley Fisher says: But there wasn't enough interest in commercializing it.

That's a total euphemism—just think about how much of a stir they caused back when Alpert (Ram Dass) and the late Timothy Leary were running their experiments... I think the core idea is right, but you're being way too polite about it...

There was success, though—Leary writes in his autobiography, "The Unknown Journey," about successes with inmates—hardened criminals—who, after a professional introduction to the inner world and psychedelic therapy, were weeping like babies. For the first time in their lives, they felt worthy... loved, not just by therapists and their own kind... but by the Divine itself.

I don't know the exact percentages of "cured" cases off the top of my head, but the numbers are significant—well over 60%...

We aren't talking about a "plug a pill in and everything will be fine" system here. You can use anything in any way you want. Of course, some of the methods you mentioned are also utilized—there were even two psychotherapists who went so far as to lie in bed with their patients during sessions (a unique experiment, to be sure) to help resolve repressed traumas.

The thing is... how many psychotherapists are actually capable of breaking down their own worldview enough to effectively use these methods?
How many of them truly understand the schizophrenic world from the inside?

And how do you treat schizophrenia when those people eventually have to return to a schizophrenic world?

In the next few days, I'll send over an excerpt from the book CHARACTER ANALYSIS by Wilhelm Reich, specifically the Chapter: the devil in the schizophrenic process—which, in my humble opinion, is one of the best diagnoses of schizophrenia ever written. The proponents of so-called anti-psychiatry, like Szasz and Laing, later built upon his work (often without even giving him credit—

offtopic: which is why I never liked that jerk Erich Fromm. He scooped up Reich's ideas—they even spent some time together in Berlin—without once mentioning his "crazy" mentor 😢 )

magic said:Man... what do you mean by "recovering" from schizophrenia?🙄 You can't just shake it off. People with milder cases can barely scrape by without constant therapy, and even then, it's a struggle.

I was actually pretty shaken up watching "A Beautiful Mind." It wasn't the movie itself that got to me—it was how eerily accurate they made the symptoms and the progression of the illness feel.

How can you be so sure your assumptions are even right? 🙄

Bradley Fisher20: because the surrounding environment just isn't giving enough feedback

man, just sit back and enjoy the ride

***
Nika:

from what I gather, you absolutely have to have someone guiding the "session." If you don't, there's a real risk of someone just losing their footing or totally drifting away from reality

one single session isn't going to cut it either—we're talking about a complete paradigm shift here. if you actually grasp it, it can be devastating; honestly, it could end up doing way more harm than good...

sorry for quoting this absolute mess of a thread... I only just spotted the topic, but my heroic-schizophrenic heart😁 simply couldn't resist

No123

I haven't had the chance to really dive deep into your post yet, but at a glance, it looks like it could be pretty fascinating...

until then...👍

Jason Johnson4 said:How can you be so sure your assumptions are actually right? 🙄

Well, they say once someone's crazy, they're always crazy... and I know that much about myself. 😁

It’s a bit like owning an old historic building that you spend your entire life trying to renovate. But here's the catch: you aren't allowed to touch the foundation because it's been designated a protected landmark—much like how you can't just rebuild a person from the ground up. So, you just keep adding on, reinforcing, and layering over the surface indefinitely...

...but then, when a major earthquake hits, the whole thing comes crashing down quite easily. And honestly, that’s exactly what happens to the psyche of someone like that.

Maybe that's a bit of a silly analogy, but to me, it feels pretty spot on.

A few things I’ve been chewing on lately

- People tend to toss the "paranoia" label around way too fast at the first sign of anything unusual—but honestly, how many people actually bother to follow the breadcrumbs of their logic? 😢

- Those living with schizophrenia see right through the masks we wear, and they get genuinely stung by even the slightest hint of phoniness. That’s why "normal" society tends to resent them so much.

If you’re a therapist looking to work with them, you have to be brutally honest—with yourself and with the patient. Period.

You have to make sure they know you SINCERELY UNDERSTAND them, even when they're literally threatening your life! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(You know what I mean—that kind of unconditional empathy.)

P.S. What if Wilhelm Reich was actually onto something regarding aliens and stars starting to lose their minds after he blasts them with his CLOUDBUSTER and hijacks their organic energy???

😕 🙄

Rea: It’s easy enough to tear those houses down... especially when they were built on sand and shaky ground to begin with... 😉

Jason Johnson4 said:Ree: It’s easy to tear those houses down... when they were built on sand and unstable ground to begin with...😉

It’s just like many of us, unfortunately... and I suppose that's really the crux of the matter...

Regarding what you mentioned about honesty—you hit the nail on the head. It's absolutely true. The problem is that even the most seasoned psychiatrists often lean too heavily on "the classics." They tend to view a patient as if they’re some textbook case study rather than making a genuine effort to actually understand them—to truly grasp how their specific mind works and how they perceive the world...

I’m actually heading to see a shrink myself quite soon, though I’m not holding my breath. To be honest, I expect he'll mostly just help me with prescriptions. As for his endless little lectures? I highly doubt there will be much benefit there, other than perhaps raising my blood pressure with those tired, stereotypical questions...

It's quite easy to spot that "I'm pretending to understand you" mask people wear when someone is actually listening to my sincere thoughts and conclusions, only to judge them based on a "textbook" definition and dismiss my perspective accordingly. It’s that mindset of, "Oh, he said this, so he must be like *that*..." People fail to realize that when I say "this," it isn't just a random thought; it's the result of years of intense self-reflection and analysis...
They don't see the distinction between "I am afraid" and "I can observe that I am experiencing fear"... they miss the difference between an excuse and the actual cause.

It's just... I constantly get flagged as being on the verge of a psychotic break. And look, on one hand, I recognize that I'm not exactly "normal," so maybe that's a fair assessment...

But then again... perhaps I'm simply a bit more intelligent and brutally honest with myself, which has led me to realize that I don't function within the standard parameters...

haha Wilhelm Reich and the orgonometer 😁 😁

Jason Johnson4, go ahead and poke the bear... I don't mind one bit! 😉, how’s life treating you? 😁

Look, I haven't dealt with schizophrenia firsthand, but I know my way around the human psyche. I understand what helps balance things out, and what just drags a person down...

Balance is everything here. It's a process that needs to start early. As for the meds? I wouldn't recommend them under any circumstances—not that they help with a complete break from reality. They don't cure those states; they just muffle them. In my experience, I've never seen anyone actually "cured" by a pill. What I *have* seen is people getting hooked, dealing with kidney failure, and hitting a wall where they can't make any real breakthroughs. Sure, a "miracle cure" might happen once in a blue moon, but then nobody really knows why it worked there when it fails everywhere else...

I support anything active that promotes balance—mental harmony, personality integration—things that actually address the root cause.

shadowgardener12... look, first things first, you gotta learn the difference between psychedelics and your standard psych meds. psychedelics work more on this homeopathic principle of positive feedback loops. and newsflash: there's zero addiction to them.

Jason Johnson4, glad you finally showed up. there's gonna be a ton of questions flying around here. I'm really digging this whole "total honesty" vibe you've got going on.

No123, I don't think you're crazy. You're just a little broken. It's what happens when you live in this messed up society.

Bradley Fisher20 said:shadowgardener12... you should probably start by distinguishing psychedelics from standard psych meds. Psychedelics work more on a homeopathic principle of positive feedback loops.

Oh yeah? And how exactly do psychedelics work? 😁 😁

what the hell 😁😁?

Come on, please... explain how psychedelics actually work, both psychologically and physiologically.

If we're talking about drugs, I have to tell you: they destabilize your personality. They suppress and warp—even more than just regular reality—your original impulses. They create this deep sadness in the psyche and just relentlessly drain your energy.

Sure, they might give you a "peak experience," which just fuels the illusion of gaining energy. But the actual loss is massive and far outweighs that, given those effects I mentioned. Plus, it increases your attachment to whatever random things surface from your subconscious without you ever truly understanding your primary impulses.

Bradley Fisher20 said:shadowgardener12... look, you should probably start by distinguishing psychedelics from your standard psychotropic drugs. Psychedelics work more on a homeopathic principle of positive feedback loops. Plus, there's no such thing as an addiction to them.

On a homeopathic principle???? 😕

Can you please explain what you mean by that?

Look, I'll be the first to admit this is all just heavy speculation. I've never actually made a career out of this stuff, so please... take everything I say with a massive grain of salt.

Talking about how psychedelics work on a physiological level is basically pointless. Like, what does it even mean when some receptor does something over here or there? It doesn't change the reality of it.

On a psychological level, though? I’d say they act almost homeopathically because they kick you right out of that shaky, unstable state. They force you out of the equilibrium, which—if you have the right guidance—actually lets you reach a real, steady mental balance. Honestly, I think Rea could get a massive boost from some proper therapy to realize everything isn't such a total disaster.

The bottom line is that your personality gets destabilized. And that is absolutely necessary. When you're treating mental health issues, you often have to smash those old, broken foundations that cause all the internal contradictions and bullshit in a person. You can't get there through yoga alone... you need a massive LEAP. And that's where psychedelics come in. They are freaking perfect for that. Seriously, PERFECT.

Because the whole "just forget about it" strategy? It's a joke. Just covering up the truth isn't enough, because that truth stays buried somewhere, just waiting. You have to reintegrate. Hope that makes sense... am I making sense here?

Bradley Fisher20 said:No123, I don't think you're crazy. You're just a little broken. It’s because of this messed-up society.

It’s not that I think I’m insane; it’s just that everything hit me all at once after the war. See, I served in combat during the conflicts in America and Canada. While the fighting was actually happening, everything felt fine—I had never dealt with mental health issues before. My main grievance back then was that I didn't get the rank I actually earned. When they first started handing out ranks in '92, I was stuck at a junior officer level, even though I was commanding an artillery rocket division! For a role like that, I should have been a Major or a Colonel, especially since I held an Electrical Engineering degree. What really burned me was seeing people with zero education jumping ahead of me in rank, only to go back and finish high school or college later—some of them even straight-up bought their credentials just to climb the ladder. When I was on active duty, the Department of Defense called me. They were looking for someone with my specific expertise to work in electronic warfare, specifically requesting a degreed Electrical Engineer. I jumped at the chance. I reached out to a Colonel in Indianapolis and filled out mountains of paperwork detailing my service history. Then, a Colonel from Washington, D.C. came down from Personnel to tell me that, as far as he was concerned, there wouldn't be any issues getting me the job. They discussed my salary, I signed non-disclosure agreements regarding our operations, and I felt like the job was practically mine while we waited for the bureaucracy to clear. Then, a few days later, that Colonel in Indianapolis calls me back. He tells me their board decided I was "too preoccupied with the war" and that they needed someone who could focus solely on the job without being distracted by past trauma. Are you kidding me? So, I went to a psychiatrist to talk about it, and after that, the guy writes that I have PTSD and then has the audacity to ask me for $6,000 to "expedite" my retirement paperwork! That was the breaking point for me. If I wasn't focused on the job, then who was? For God's sake, I commanded 317 men in combat; we only lost one kid at the very end of the conflict, and we had two minor injuries. I received commendations ranging from Brigade Commanders to the Chief of Staff of the US Army, and I was decorated twice by the President. And now, after all that, they tell me I'm unfit for a decent position in the military? That absolutely destroyed me. Honestly, how did schizophrenia even enter this conversation? How does schizophrenia actually manifest? What are the real causes?
E oh, I finally received the decision that I am qualified for an advisor position 😕 and now I'm just waiting on the placement. Currently, I'm on unemployment, and my records are sitting with the pension office.

Well, you don't just stumble upon it by chance; you're essentially born with this little "glitch," and how it evolves depends entirely on the kind of mental strain you put yourself through...

But hey, I'm not trying to lecture you or anything—just throwing some thoughts out there for the sake of conversation...

It’s possible that it stays dormant from birth and only activates later in life, but honestly, it could also be triggered by putting way too much pressure on your own psyche...