Die-hard Ultras / Hardcore Supporters

What truth are we even talking about here? Give me a specific example.

@mark my words

Like I said—the whole concept of being a fan is way too tied up with that "ultra" mentality these days. Even here, you see people in the stands who are basically swallowed by it; though, granted, most aren't. You claim a supporter doesn't even need to know a single player on the Los Angeles Dodgers roster? Well, if someone has zero clue about the club, what makes them a fan? They’re just cheering for any random team like some programmed robot... besides that. I’m also convinced the college students who founded the NFL Ultras didn't say, "Let's go out and act like thugs on the street just so we can cause chaos wherever we go," or "Who cares what anyone thinks?" No—they did it because they loved the Los Angeles Dodgers; they wanted to cheer for their team wherever they played and elevate the entire experience by bringing the most loyal folks together. The goal wasn't street fighting or some hooligan scheme. I won't point fingers at those who live that lifestyle 24/7—unlike the ones who are less intense or just have a different vibe—because, as mentioned earlier, everyone is needed in the stands. We need the crew for the streets, for the flares, for the choreographies, the chanting, and setting the atmosphere... You say a person realizes early on how vital being an ultra is, but for me, the definition of the NFL Ultras isn't just "hardcore ultra"—it's a blend of everything I just laid out. A fan isn't necessarily an ultra. If those who *are* ultras immediately distance themselves from those who aren't, that's where the division starts, and what we actually need is unity... I just want people to stop screwing with each other and instead give it their all so we don't stagnate during shifts like this. Whether someone is for the changes or against them matters less now; they happened. We have to move forward, not sit silently in the stands laughing at the group's attempts to engage the rest of us... I'm fed up with this whole mess, but I hope I managed to explain at least a third of my thoughts clearly enough.

steelrider7 said:Just leave things alone. The US Dollar spoke the truth, plain and simple. Honestly, I couldn't care less; I’ll be right there in the stands regardless. But for those of you calling yourselves the Los Angeles Dodgers NFL Ultras? It’s pathetic. You don't give a damn about the fans traveling from out of state just to show up. Every time someone from the Midwest or the South walks through the stands, you look at them like they're a threat. You act like you'd kill them just because they happen to love the Dodgers as much as you do. It's exhausting.

Nature itself has an aversion to people like you. If you can't handle the atmosphere in the stands, then just skip this forum entirely. There's nothing for you to find here.

Christian Moore41 said:What truth? Give me an actual example.

Oh sure, I’ll just sit here and list every single person who gave me a dirty look... ridiculous. The reality is, most of these kids who don't even have the basic hallmarks of being actual NFL Ultras—they don't have ten or fifteen guys backing them up—yet they act like total idiots. You want a specific example? Last year in Indianapolis... this group of teenagers, maybe 15 or 20 of them, rolls up in a taxi straight from a Fox News segment. They show up decked out in scarves and jerseys like they’re heading to the theater or some Broadway show instead of a game. It’s pathetic. Like, what are you even wearing? How much did that taxi cost you? Did your parents actually drop you off at the stadium?...

coastalangler16 said:@mark my words

But if I may offer a different perspective, isn't there a tendency to conflate the very concept of being a fan with the specific ultra mentality? Even within our own stands, there are people who are deeply immersed in that lifestyle, though they certainly aren't the majority. You mentioned that a supporter shouldn't necessarily need to be able to name a single player on the Los Angeles Dodgers roster, but if someone has absolutely no connection to what happens with the club, can they truly call themselves a fan? Without that bond, isn't it just like cheering for any random team like some kind of programmed robot? Beyond that, I am quite convinced that when the students originally founded the NFL Ultras, their motivation wasn't to say, "Let's get rowdy just to cause chaos in the streets and show everyone how much we don't care about authority," was it? Rather, it was born out of a profound love for the Los Angeles Dodgers—to support the team wherever they play and to elevate the entire experience of being a supporter by bringing together the most loyal souls. The core purpose wasn't street skirmishes or an "ultra hooligan" blueprint. I won't point fingers at those who live that lifestyle twenty-four hours a day, as opposed to those who are less intense or simply follow a different path, because the stands actually require everyone. We need the group that handles the street presence, the pyrotechnics, the choreographies, and the atmosphere to keep the energy alive... you suggest that one feels early on whether they possess the ultra spirit, but for me, the definition of the NFL Ultras isn't strictly "hardcore ultra", but rather a fusion of everything I just described. A fan isn't inherently an ultra. If those who identify as ultras immediately distance themselves from those who don't, we create a rift, and what we truly need right now is unity... I just wish people would stop tearing each other down and instead give their all so we don't stagnate during times of such significant change. Whether anyone is for or against these shifts matters less than the fact that they are happening; we have to move forward rather than sitting in silence in the stands, mocking the efforts of those trying to engage the rest of us... I know I might sound like I'm rambling through a mess of thoughts, but I hope I've managed to explain at least a third of my reasoning clearly enough...

The first point you made hits the nail on the head regarding the issue. Every fan sitting in the North Stand thinks they are part of the NFL Ultras, but they aren't; they are simply Los Angeles Dodgers fans. Unfortunately, the events of the '90s are largely responsible for this shift, as that's where this narrative began, and it hasn't changed much today—where anyone who shows up to a game considers themselves part of the core group.

To truly be part of the NFL Ultras, you have to live that life 24/7, every single second, and beyond just supporting the Los Angeles Dodgers, you live for the group itself. It is exactly the "hardcore ultra" lifestyle you mentioned.
Once we finally draw a line in the sand and realize that we have maybe 500 true NFL Ultras, we can recognize that the other 3,000 passionate Los Angeles Dodgers fans can continue their support separately.

That second point is accurate, but then you aren't an ultra, period. You are just a fan.

p.s. It has felt a little slippery lately, seeing how everyone feels entitled to comment on these changes and push their own opinions. A little humility wouldn't go amiss.

George Castillo142 said:As if I’m going to sit here and write about who gave me a dirty look. The truth is, most people who don't carry any real NFL Ultras credentials act like complete idiots. Take last year in Indianapolis, for example. A group of kids, maybe 15 or 20, showed up in a taxi from Fox News territory. They were decked out in scarves and jerseys like they were heading to the theater instead of a game. What are you wearing? How much did that taxi cost? Did your parents drop you off?

😲 So you're saying they were just kids and he was messing with them? 🙂

You've got a point. They should have just laid down the law when they saw them. Hand them a couple of flares, tell them to meet under the stands after the game, and let them know we're coming for those fake fans. Maybe then they'd learn how to behave. ☕

George Castillo142 said:As if I’m going to sit here and write about who gave me a dirty look. Honestly? Most people out there don't even have standard NFL Ultras gear, yet they act like total idiots. Take last year in Indianapolis, for example. This group of kids, maybe 15 or 20, rolls up in a taxi straight from Fox News coverage. They show up decked out in scarves and jerseys like they're heading to the opera instead of a ballgame. It's ridiculous. What are you wearing? How much did that cab cost? Did your parents drop you off? Just pathetic...

Well, at least they didn't kill you with their eyes.

George Castillo142 said:Look, I’m not gonna sit here and complain about who's looking at who, but honestly, most people who don't even have standard NFL Ultras vibes act like total idiots. Like last year in Indianapolis, this group of kids—maybe 15 or 20—showed up with a taxi from Fox News and immediately got flagged. They were decked out in scarves and jerseys like they were heading to the theater instead of a game. Like, what are you wearing? How much was that cab ride? Did your parents even drop you off...

that's perfect... just let me know which crew was talking to them via DM... I'll reach out to those guys myself and make sure it doesn't happen again...👍

Man, this is exactly what I’m talking about... you really think this squad is going to keep grinding out these away games? We gotta stick together like die-hard NFL Ultras—if you aren't riding with us, then you're nothing to us. Just look at where they've ended up...

Tyler Scott8 said:In the first bolded point, there’s the issue. Every fan sitting in the north stands thinks they're part of the NFL Ultras—they aren't. They're just Dodgers fans. Unfortunately, the '90s are mostly to blame for this whole mess, since that's where the narrative started, and honestly, not much has changed today; everyone who shows up to a game suddenly claims they're an Ultra.

To actually be an NFL Ultra, you have to live it 24/7—every single damn second—meaning beyond just supporting the Dodgers, you live for the group. Like you said yourself: a hardcore ultra.
Once we finally draw a line in the sand and realize we have 500 Ultras here, while the other 3,000 die-hard Dodgers fans
can go their own way, we'll see.
The second bolded point is correct, but then you aren't an Ultra, period. You're just a fan.

See, you're drawing lines again—who is what, who isn't—and emphasizing that distance. That kind of attitude is exactly what pisses everyone else off and drives them away. You'll end up with 500 "real ones" left while the stands sit empty. While I largely agree with your sentiment, I don't think we need to fuel these debates by constantly pointing fingers. We need unity. It’s not like we’re going to take some spray paint to the north stand, draw a line, and say, "you guys are Ultras, you're not"... why do we need to insist that certain people aren't Ultras or are "just this" or "just that"? You live your life, but you share the stands with the Dodgers fans who are also always here when it counts, providing the numbers, the atmosphere, and the support for the club... because if 3,000 people show up to the stadium and you're busy counting how only 500 of them are "true" Ultras, you can imagine how uncomfortable it is for the rest to hear they're being looked down upon as "ordinary fans." Sure, you can keep doing it, but sometimes it's better to stay quiet for the greater good—to avoid ruining the positive vibe and the culture we spent so long building...

coastalangler16 said:Look, you’re doing that thing again where you draw lines between who belongs and who doesn't, basically creating this divide. Honestly, that kind of attitude can really piss people off, I think. It just pushes them away. You end up with maybe 500 "hardcore" fans showing up while the rest of the stadium stays empty. I mean, I mostly agree with what you're saying—I don't think we need to be constantly pointing out those divisions in debates. Like I said before, unity is what actually matters. We shouldn't be standing there at the stadium, drawing a line in the sand and telling people, "You guys over here are the real NFL Ultras, but you guys over there aren't." Why even bother saying "you aren't part of the group, you're just this or that"? Just live your life. You share the stands with people—people who, like those die-hard Los Angeles Dodgers fans, show up every single time they're needed, making up the crowd, bringing the energy, and cheering on their team. Because if 3,000 people show up to the ballpark, but you're sitting there thinking only 500 of them are "real," you can imagine how uncomfortable it feels for everyone else to hear someone being told they're just "casual fans" and not part of the inner circle. I mean, sure, you could stay that way, but sometimes it's better to just keep things quiet for the greater good, you know? Just so we don't ruin the positive vibe and the culture we've worked so hard to build over the years...

Spot on. You explained everything perfectly, I just don't know why this is so incredibly hard for some people to wrap their heads around!!!!

George Castillo142 said:Man, this is exactly what I'm talking about... you really think this crew is going to keep traveling for away games? Either the NFL Ultras are with us or they aren't. Look where that attitude got them...

🤣 If being mocked from the stands is what drives them, then nobody wins here.

Nobody was jumping them or screaming at them. If they can't handle a little bit of local banter when they show up in a town full of die-hard fans, what's the point? 🤷

George Castillo142 said:Man, this is exactly what I mean... do you really think this crew is going to keep traveling for away games? We need our NFL Ultras behind us, period. Look where their attitude has gotten them...

If they won't travel because of this, then why bother? Besides, the North Stand shouldn't be some place where high school kids feel like they're at a Taylor Swift concert! Our NFL Ultras should be striving to make sure the general public actually loves us.

You guys aren't getting the point here... these kids showed up as die-hard Los Angeles Dodgers fans, basically the next generation of NFL Ultras, and they got shut down primarily because they were decked out in Dodgers jerseys and sneakers. Are we really sure we’re sending the right message by doing this?

George Castillo142 said:You guys are missing the point. These kids showed up as Los Angeles Dodgers fans and potential future NFL Ultras, but they basically blew it because they were decked out in Dodgers jerseys and sneakers. Are we sure we're sending the right message here?...

go check my quote on your post from the last page

Frank Kim26 said:check out my vote on your post from the last page

Man, you clearly have no idea who this team actually is... judging by how much you sound like you're from Miami, but I won't see them at the next two or three away games, so we'll see...

George Castillo142 said:No clue which crew it is, probably from Miami based on how they talk, but I haven't caught them at the next two or three away games...

If you don't see them at the next few away games, they probably aren't regular supporters... but I'll personally make sure nothing like this happens again... gotta let those guys know it was just a one-time thing and that's not how the Raiders operate...

coastalangler16 said:You see, you’re drawing lines again regarding who belongs and who doesn't, constantly emphasizing that divide. That kind of approach can really rub people the wrong way, can't it? It risks alienating everyone else. If we keep this up, we'll end up with just 500 "true believers" present while the rest of the stands sit empty. While I mostly agree with your sentiment, I don't think there's any need to fuel those arguments or keep pointing out divisions; as I've said before, what we really need is unity. We shouldn't be standing on the north end of the stadium, drawing a line in the sand and telling people, "you guys over here are the Raiders, but you over there aren't"... why is it necessary to tell people they aren't part of the core group or label them as "just some other kind of fan"? You should just live your life, yet you share the stands with people who, as you put it, are the "die-hard Dodgers fans" who show up every single time they are needed, providing the numbers and the mass presence, cheering and building the atmosphere for their club... because if 3,000 people show up to the stadium, and you decide that only 500 of them are actually the Raiders, do you really think it feels good for the others to hear someone constantly lecturing them that they are merely "casual fans" rather than being part of the Raiders? I mean, sure, you could maintain that distinction, but perhaps some things should be left unsaid for the greater good, just to ensure we don't ruin the positive atmosphere and the culture that took so much time to build...

You mentioned that "...but at least for me, the definition of the Raiders isn't just hardcore ultras"

And my response was simply my own perspective—that the only true Raiders are the hardcore ultras, while everyone else is just a Dodgers fan.
On that point, we more or less reached an understanding. There is no need to create division or draw arbitrary lines, but it is essential to know who is actually leading the stands.

The issue isn't quite what you're suggesting when you say: "... because if 3,000 people show up to the stadium, and you decide that only 500 of them are actually the Raiders, do you really think it feels good for the others to hear someone constantly lecturing them that they are merely 'casual fans' rather than being part of the Raiders..."; rather, the reality is almost the exact opposite. Those 3,000 fans often try to push their influence where it doesn't belong; they refuse to cheer unless everything is perfectly catered to them, and they question why changes are made when things seem fine, ultimately resulting in the actual leaders of the group being sidelined. In essence, they haven't contributed anything to the collective effort beyond just showing up, yet they are the first ones ready to comment, gossip, and stir up unnecessary divisions. That is where the real problem lies. Let's call these people the "500 true believers"—if that helps clarify things, though I dislike using such a term and certainly don't advocate for it—and despite having different views on certain matters, they will eventually find common ground.

I'd take 500 real ones over...

We've seen this all before ☕

What's the big deal? If you think turning the Raiders into an ultra group is too much work, you're wrong. It would actually be way easier... the only real difference is deciding whether the Dodgers or the Raiders come first