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Offside Chat Archives (2014-2021)

Started by Morgan Williams · · 👁 849 views · 18K replies

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Participants Morgan WilliamsRachel Cooper3Joseph Clark37Keith Patel81darkseal9neonfalcon16urbanhawk17Amanda Evans2bluebison47brightpilot6Patrick MartinJoseph Fisher3steelharbor9Robin Fox2Maria AndersonAnthony Jackson2Jason Newmanruggedjackal46Michelle Palmer6Jeffrey Edwards76Jason Campbell70Anthony Barrett37graniteangler31Dennis Evans6 …
brightpilot6 brightpilot6 Veteran
1.2K messages
joined Oct 2012
#5481 ·
I’ll simply say that if you absolutely require some specialized background knowledge just to grasp or experience a piece of art, then in my view, it belongs in Category B. This applies to everything, not just cinema. It’s the same logic I apply to "art" that functions exclusively for idiots—pieces that essentially insult one's intelligence by being mindless.

Category A art is the kind that strikes a chord whether it’s being viewed by a guy working construction on a roadside or a tenured professor at Harvard.

Essentially, those specific elements of an artwork that correspond to our existing knowledge or niche interests provide pleasure precisely because of that recognition. We gravitate toward stacked references, subtle homages, or when certain technical flourishes are pushed to the foreground, because noticing them makes us feel smarter, more cultured, and more enlightened than those who miss the cues. People love that feeling, of course, and they consciously or unconsciously link that sense of intellectual satisfaction to the quality of the work itself. But to prioritize those components over the overall impact of the piece—or to assume someone like Joe Smith would find value in them—is nothing more than intellectual posturing or professional blustering. Or snobbery; call it what you will. I’ll admit, I sometimes catch myself falling into this trap in other artistic fields closer to my own interests, where I notice technical subtleties, but I can usually recognize the impulse and shut it down.

It would be like me trying to explain to you that you can’t enjoy a painting because you didn't notice the exact brushstroke technique used. How many people actually know how to spot something like that? Is that specific brushwork, which a few connoisseurs will argue about endlessly, more important than the final result that gives a broad audience butterflies in their stomach? Or is a painting inherently flawed just because you haven't studied ten thousand others in your lifetime? To put it in sports terms, do we need to understand the exact physics of the ball or every single muscle contraction involved for us to appreciate a legendary volley from Lionel Messi during a match in London? Why should I have to master the mechanics of directing and editing just to find a movie compelling—aren't directing and editing simply the very tools the artist uses to move me?
neonfalcon16 neonfalcon16 Regular
287 messages
joined Apr 2013
#5482 ·
Matthew Young35 said:You’re actually hitting on something quite profound with the idea that directors often hit their creative peak during those early, hungry stages of their careers.
Take Steven Spielberg, for instance; if you ask me, his absolute masterpiece remains *Duel*.

Nah. It’s a bit too one-note. Tense, sure. Interesting? Yes. But that's it.
Matthew Anderson4 Matthew Anderson4 Regular
598 messages
joined Jun 2013
#5483 ·
brightpilot6 said:I’ll simply say that if you absolutely require some specialized background knowledge just to grasp or experience a piece of art, then in my view, it belongs in Category B. This applies to everything, not just cinema. It’s the same logic I apply to "art" that functions exclusively for idiots—pieces that essentially insult one's intelligence by being mindless.

Category A art is the kind that strikes a chord whether it’s being viewed by a guy working construction on a roadside or a tenured professor at Harvard.

Essentially, those specific elements of an artwork that correspond to our existing knowledge or niche interests provide pleasure precisely because of that recognition. We gravitate toward stacked references, subtle homages, or when certain technical flourishes are pushed to the foreground, because noticing them makes us feel smarter, more cultured, and more enlightened than those who miss the cues. People love that feeling, of course, and they consciously or unconsciously link that sense of intellectual satisfaction to the quality of the work itself. But to prioritize those components over the overall impact of the piece—or to assume someone like Joe Smith would find value in them—is nothing more than intellectual posturing or professional blustering. Or snobbery; call it what you will. I’ll admit, I sometimes catch myself falling into this trap in other artistic fields closer to my own interests, where I notice technical subtleties, but I can usually recognize the impulse and shut it down.

It would be like me trying to explain to you that you can’t enjoy a painting because you didn't notice the exact brushstroke technique used. How many people actually know how to spot something like that? Is that specific brushwork, which a few connoisseurs will argue about endlessly, more important than the final result that gives a broad audience butterflies in their stomach? Or is a painting inherently flawed just because you haven't studied ten thousand others in your lifetime? To put it in sports terms, do we need to understand the exact physics of the ball or every single muscle contraction involved for us to appreciate a legendary volley from Lionel Messi during a match in London? Why should I have to master the mechanics of directing and editing just to find a movie compelling—aren't directing and editing simply the very tools the artist uses to move me?

Look, I wasn't trying to say Perrie can't enjoy a movie. He just doesn't catch the direction, the lighting, or the script. If you don't notice those things—or haven't seen the classics—your take on a film's legacy or its place in history just doesn't carry weight. It's true for any art, really. My opinion on Matisse doesn't mean much either; sure, I've seen his work and liked it, but I don't know the first thing about painting. Same goes for me calling Messi the GOAT. I haven't even watched a single Pelé game. I might be right, but it's just an emotional hunch, not an actual argument based on the sport. If I happen to be right, I'm just lucky. Not exactly an expert.

Art shouldn't require a PhD just to feel it. It’s all about vibes and personal taste. Any piece of art—doesn't matter if you're a construction worker or a Harvard professor—should hit a nerve. If we're talking historical context or why a piece actually matters in the long run, sure, you need some background to place it properly. Like I said before. When I listen to someone like Leo DiCaprio talk about movies, I only expect him to know the technical stuff or the history if he's trying to rank the greatest directors ever or debate Oscar winners. I don't assume Leo can't enjoy a movie just because he doesn't know how they shot a specific frame.
Jessica Gonzalez Jessica Gonzalez Regular
769 messages
joined Mar 2012
#5484 ·
I guess measuring success solely by the bottom line has really hurt the film industry. It feels like it might do the same to sports after 150 years, too. I don't mean things will actually disappear, but maybe they'll just lose any sense of lasting quality. I don't see much sign of the trend changing, especially since the global market keeps demanding more quantity over everything else. We sit here on this forum arguing about specific teams or movies, while the owners are probably just focused on tapping into those massive markets in China and India to rake in billions of dollars.
Patrick Martin Patrick Martin Regular
702 messages
joined Aug 2015
#5485 ·
Man, just stop watching the garbage and the problem is solved. 🤷
I mean, look, it’s just human nature at this point. Everyone is constantly craving more, more content, more noise—it's just endless hungry mouths to feed. Exploitation has basically crawled its way into every single corner of existence.
And let’s be real, the internet completely flipped the script on everything.

People who actually have even a tiny bit of an eye for art? They’ll see the value right away. But those who don't? They can whine and spit all they want, trying to act like they're "contributing" to some big debate, but they aren't going anywhere. It’s honestly stupid to claim quality doesn't exist anymore.
The quality is there, sure, but there's just way more absolute trash out there now than there used to be. Way more.
Jessica Gonzalez Jessica Gonzalez Regular
769 messages
joined Mar 2012
#5486 ·
To veer slightly off-topic, I spent some time yesterday exploring that unfinished "University Hospital" complex over by the old outskirts of Chicago. From the highway or near the river embankments, it looks massive, but once you actually step inside, the scale is honestly hard to wrap your head around. I originally just planned to ride my bike past it, but then I noticed there was an access road, realized there were no fences, and found absolutely nobody there. Apparently, they use the south side for storage, but the place is so enormous that even a hundred security guards couldn't patrol it all. There's something really striking about how much nature has reclaimed the site and how quiet everything is. About 45% of the work was done when the project stalled, so most of the structures are up and just need finishing touches. Most buildings have windows installed too, which gives this eerie feeling that it was "almost" ready to go. They probably poured something like $160 million into it by today's standards, but I think the real waste is the space itself and the lost potential of the idea. I might try to get up to the roof next time since there are stairs, and I've heard the views are pretty great. If anyone wants to wander through a post-apocalyptic setting without watching some cheesy movie, I'd highly recommend spending an afternoon at this hospital. It’s probably the most interesting spot I've stumbled upon in years, and I've seen my fair share of famous landmarks.

I guess there's almost no chance this will ever be finished or repurposed—it's a lost cause. I heard it would take roughly $550 million just to fix it up and turn it into the functional medical center they originally envisioned. That kind of money just isn't sitting around, and even if an investor wanted to build a facility that size, they likely wouldn't bother patching up such a neglected mess; it's usually cheaper to start from scratch. I was reading online today about various failed projects around the world, and the story is always the same: pure megalomania. You see it everywhere, even in the most developed countries. Once that money is gone, it's gone. I'm just waiting for some politician to start campaigning on the promise of finally finishing the hospital sometime in the year 20xx. 😁
James Anderson5 James Anderson5 Regular
460 messages
joined Jan 2010
#5487 ·
Here’s a bit more detail on that abandoned hospital out in the suburbs

Anyway, obviously Dylan and Mozart don't belong in the same conversation. It’s like when I hear those hardcore rockers praising Jimmy Hendrix and Led Zeppelin to the heavens. Don't get me wrong, they're great to listen to, but comparing them to Mozart is like comparing junk food to a gourmet sundae...

Also, I’ve been watching Boardwalk Empire by Scorsese 👍. Has anyone else checked it out yet? Honestly, if Atlantic City during Prohibition and downtown Chicago don't run on the exact same principles...
Amanda Evans2 Amanda Evans2 Veteran
1.1K messages
joined Nov 2014
#5488 ·
It was a decent enough series, though I suppose I might have been holding my expectations just a bit too high. Marty certainly left his mark on the production, but let's be honest—he only really left a fingerprint or two...
Jessica Gonzalez Jessica Gonzalez Regular
769 messages
joined Mar 2012
#5489 ·
I’ve only watched the first season so far, which is kind of my rule of thumb now whenever I start a new series. It’s a fantastic show, though they did kill off quite a few characters early on, so I guess I wonder how they managed to keep filming after that. It’s basically your classic mob drama—definitely a must-watch if that’s your thing. 🤣
Noah Roberts46 Noah Roberts46 Regular
407 messages
joined Jun 2021
#5490 ·
James Anderson5 said:Here’s a bit more detail on that abandoned hospital out in the suburbs

Anyway, obviously Dylan and Mozart don't belong in the same conversation. It’s like when I hear those hardcore rockers praising Jimmy Hendrix and Led Zeppelin to the heavens. Don't get me wrong, they're great to listen to, but comparing them to Mozart is like comparing junk food to a gourmet sundae...

Also, I’ve been watching Boardwalk Empire by Scorsese 👍. Has anyone else checked it out yet? Honestly, if Atlantic City during Prohibition and downtown Chicago don't run on the exact same principles...

The first three seasons are top-tier, especially season three where Gyp Rosetti absolutely kills it. The last two were a massive letdown for me.
Amanda Evans2 Amanda Evans2 Veteran
1.1K messages
joined Nov 2014
#5491 ·
Honestly, Arnold Rothstein is easily the most formidable character in the entire series...
Noah Roberts46 Noah Roberts46 Regular
407 messages
joined Jun 2021
#5492 ·
It’s definitely one of the better ones out there, but honestly, the sheer number of incredible characters and actors is what really stands out. Even the guy playing Al Capone absolutely kills it—he’s just a phenomenal actor across the board. I can't even remember the last time a series managed to pull together such a powerhouse cast.
Jessica Gonzalez Jessica Gonzalez Regular
769 messages
joined Mar 2012
#5493 ·
I think that's the guy playing "Ze Germans" Tommy from "Get Hard and Go."

Noah Roberts46 Noah Roberts46 Regular
407 messages
joined Jun 2021
#5494 ·
That nasty skinhead in this movie: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0480025/

Personally, I thought it was a great film.
Robin Fox2 Robin Fox2 Regular
523 messages
joined Apr 2016
#5495 ·
https://www.facebook.com/wellness-and-mindfulness...type=1&theater

🤣 🤣 🤣
Eric Fox7 Eric Fox7 Regular
320 messages
joined Jul 2012
#5496 ·
Robin Fox2 said:https://www.facebook.com/wellness-and-mindfulness...type=1&theater

🤣 🤣 🤣

That one with the Mexican flag looks pretty good 🤣

Anyway—just posted that absolute banger of a video over on my profile:



🙏
Amanda Evans2 Amanda Evans2 Veteran
1.1K messages
joined Nov 2014
#5497 ·
By way of a recommendation, I’ve recently started watching this new series, Mr. Robot, and honestly... so far, it’s absolutely stunning...
Walter Grant5 Walter Grant5 Regular
459 messages
joined Oct 2012
#5498 ·
Jessica Gonzalez Jessica Gonzalez Regular
769 messages
joined Mar 2012
#5499 ·
Walter Grant5 said:http://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/aQnRMEK_460sv.mp4

this is gold

I don't want to spoil the fun, but maybe that isn't actually a person. It almost looks like a doll to me, especially since it was pulled away just as they were about to be fully in view.

image
James Anderson5 James Anderson5 Regular
460 messages
joined Jan 2010
#5500 ·
Jessica Gonzalez said:I think that's the guy playing "Ze Germans" Tommy from "Get Hard and Go."


I immediately thought of that old role too, once I saw him playing Al Capone...

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