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Sanctions on Russia

Started by Richard Wilson4 · · 👁 37 views · 9.5K replies

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Participants Richard Wilson4velvetcyclist95Jeremy Peterson4silentsurfer3rowdytiger13Carol Newman2William Anderson5Carl Cookfrozencobra50Paul Patel95Michael Davis10Gary WilsonGregory Ramos3slyfox43dustywolf13Tyler Jones6Larry Walker24Ashley Ramirez4Paul Clark80Adam Lee13northernangler8Nancy Ruiz5James Chavez91neonheron9 …
Noah Diaz Noah Diaz Active Member
114 messages
joined Sep 2021
#9141 ·
Russia managed to bypass the oil price cap and energy sanctions almost immediately, though that was predictable from the jump. They already had a shadow fleet ready to go and plenty of buyers waiting in Asia.

I think even this latest article shows how much pressure is being put on India. They want everyone to believe these sanctions are actually working, but it's all just Russian propaganda.
crimsoncyclist71 crimsoncyclist71 Active Member
175 messages
joined Aug 2016
#9142 ·
Noah Diaz said:Russia managed to bypass the oil price cap and energy sanctions almost immediately, though that was predictable from the jump. They already had a shadow fleet ready to go and plenty of buyers waiting in Asia.

I think even this latest article shows how much pressure is being put on India. They want everyone to believe these sanctions are actually working, but it's all just Russian propaganda.

So, the sanctions are being bypassed, yet revenues are supposedly plummeting.
Something doesn't add up in your logic.
Morgan Wright5 Morgan Wright5 Active Member
79 messages
joined Mar 2022
#9143 ·
Noah Diaz said:Russia managed to bypass the oil price cap and energy sanctions almost immediately, though that was predictable from the jump. They already had a shadow fleet ready to go and plenty of buyers waiting in Asia.

I think even this latest article shows how much pressure is being put on India. They want everyone to believe these sanctions are actually working, but it's all just Russian propaganda.

Just for your information, you might want to take a look at whose tankers are actually hauling most of the Russian oil even today.
Nathan Thomas12 Nathan Thomas12 Regular
265 messages
joined Apr 2022
#9144 ·
Noah Diaz said:Russia managed to bypass the oil price cap and energy sanctions almost immediately, though that was predictable from the jump. They already had a shadow fleet ready to go and plenty of buyers waiting in Asia.

I think even this latest article shows how much pressure is being put on India. They want everyone to believe these sanctions are actually working, but it's all just Russian propaganda.

You just can't quit, can you? Now you're out here dropping TASS news like it's gospel.
https://tass.com/economy/1583177
Anthony Jones15 Anthony Jones15 Member
13 messages
joined Oct 2011
#9145 ·
The sanctions aren't working because oil is being smuggled via aging tankers straight into markets across Asia, India, and Africa. It’s a completely different game than the transparent, legal transfers happening in the wealthiest Western markets.

Sometimes I honestly can't wrap my head around what people are posting here. Like, do you actually think this stuff is supposed to impress us, or are you just trying to gloss over the reality of the situation? 🙂
Charles Mendoza2 Charles Mendoza2 Newcomer
4 messages
joined Mar 2022
#9146 ·
Europe froze solid this past winter.
The sanctions aren't working.
I just don't think we're ever going to wrap our heads around that reality.
wanderingmaker3 wanderingmaker3 Member
39 messages
joined Dec 2009
#9147 ·
Check out this link detailing how Russia uses Swiss, German, and Italian companies as middlemen to sneak in machinery essential for weapon manufacturing.

https://informnapalm.org/en/how-comp...oduce-weapons/
placidnomad87 placidnomad87 Active Member
51 messages
joined Dec 2018
#9148 ·
Where were all these heavy-duty sanctions back when the USSR invaded Finland in 1939, or when they moved against Sweden, Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania in 1940? They even forced Romania to hand over what is now Moldova.

I don't usually weigh in much on this thread, but I have to admit, the war in Ukraine is starting to get under my skin. It’s hard to look at them as a model for anyone else when the Ukrainian people deal with some of the highest levels of corruption you'll find anywhere in the world.

It's the same old story from the West—they barely even acknowledge the Holodomor, treating it like a mere footnote or something just for show before the war actually broke out.
analogbear5 analogbear5 Regular
571 messages
joined Aug 2019
#9149 ·
placidnomad87 said:Where were all these heavy-duty sanctions back when the USSR invaded Finland in 1939, or when they moved against Sweden, Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania in 1940? They even forced Romania to hand over what is now Moldova.

I don't usually weigh in much on this thread, but I have to admit, the war in Ukraine is starting to get under my skin. It’s hard to look at them as a model for anyone else when the Ukrainian people deal with some of the highest levels of corruption you'll find anywhere in the world.

It's the same old story from the West—they barely even acknowledge the Holodomor, treating it like a mere footnote or something just for show before the war actually broke out.

Same deal with Soviet imports and exports—basically nonexistent. Back then, Joseph Stalin was obsessed with autarky. He was terrified that Western capitalists would get a foothold in the Soviet economy.
Nathan Thomas12 Nathan Thomas12 Regular
265 messages
joined Apr 2022
#9150 ·
placidnomad87 said:Where were all these heavy-duty sanctions back when the USSR invaded Finland in 1939, or when they moved against Sweden, Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania in 1940? They even forced Romania to hand over what is now Moldova.

I don't usually weigh in much on this thread, but I have to admit, the war in Ukraine is starting to get under my skin. It’s hard to look at them as a model for anyone else when the Ukrainian people deal with some of the highest levels of corruption you'll find anywhere in the world.

It's the same old story from the West—they barely even acknowledge the Holodomor, treating it like a mere footnote or something just for show before the war actually broke out.

Look, I agree Ukraine was incredibly corrupt—basically just a carbon copy of Russian corruption under a Russian boot.
But they're leaning harder into Western influence now, and I wouldn't bet against them slowly adopting European Union regulations. You with me?
Think of it like comparing two different sides of the Mississippi River—say, a struggling industrial town versus its neighbor across the water. One side is totally stagnant, while the other is moving toward a different standard. That’s basically the difference between Russian and Western influence.
Nancy Gomez26 Nancy Gomez26 Regular
787 messages
joined Jan 2018
#9151 ·
analogbear5 said:Same deal with Soviet imports and exports—basically nonexistent. Back then, Joseph Stalin was obsessed with autarky. He was terrified that Western capitalists would get a foothold in the Soviet economy.

The Soviet Union was essentially operating under a form of economic isolation back then, a trend set in motion during the revolution. While the Bolsheviks pushed through sweeping nationalization, the real catalyst for their forced isolation from the West was the seizure of oil fields in Azerbaijan near the Caspian Sea. At that time, oil companies held massive sway over their respective governments—and they had assets elsewhere too. They couldn't just sit by and let nationalization happen without hitting back.
Later on, the Bolsheviks tried to frame this isolation as a mere reaction to Western fear of a "successful" new political system, and eventually, the West simply moved on from the episode. Of course, that era of isolation wasn't nearly as effective as what we see today; there was no unified, coordinated effort among all players. Information traveled much slower, and state oversight of corporations was significantly weaker than modern standards. Furthermore, the shift of global dominance from the United Kingdom to the USA was already underway, meaning the major powers weren't acting with a single, unified policy.
William Miller12 William Miller12 Member
22 messages
joined Aug 2022
#9152 ·
placidnomad87 said:Where were all these heavy-duty sanctions back when the USSR invaded Finland in 1939, or when they moved against Sweden, Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania in 1940? They even forced Romania to hand over what is now Moldova.

I don't usually weigh in much on this thread, but I have to admit, the war in Ukraine is starting to get under my skin. It’s hard to look at them as a model for anyone else when the Ukrainian people deal with some of the highest levels of corruption you'll find anywhere in the world.

It's the same old story from the West—they barely even acknowledge the Holodomor, treating it like a mere footnote or something just for show before the war actually broke out.

Is it really fair for us Americans to lecture anyone about corruption during wartime? We’ve seen our own share of nonsense. We had a premier sell off the national oil giant for a measly $5 million bribe. We had some "controversial entrepreneur" who got rich skimming humanitarian aid and then rode that wave straight into the mayor's office of a major city. Then there was that truck driver who made a fortune smuggling foreign currency, only to become a dairy tycoon living large in Switzerland. Even the party that basically built this country was convicted of systemic corruption, and they still haven't had the decency to apologize to the public.

And don't even get me started on the pension fund official currently dodging prison in Canada, or the mayor of the capital, or that former food mogul who held the entire economy hostage for two decades and now spends his time mocking the legal system—a system that's clearly too incompetent to actually bring him to justice.

Those are just the headline makers. It’s just the tip of the iceberg.

So, pointing fingers at corruption in Ukraine feels a bit like the pot calling the kettle black.

___
Noah Diaz Noah Diaz Active Member
114 messages
joined Sep 2021
#9153 ·
Nancy Gomez26 said:The Soviet Union was essentially operating under a form of economic isolation back then, a trend set in motion during the revolution. While the Bolsheviks pushed through sweeping nationalization, the real catalyst for their forced isolation from the West was the seizure of oil fields in Azerbaijan near the Caspian Sea. At that time, oil companies held massive sway over their respective governments—and they had assets elsewhere too. They couldn't just sit by and let nationalization happen without hitting back.
Later on, the Bolsheviks tried to frame this isolation as a mere reaction to Western fear of a "successful" new political system, and eventually, the West simply moved on from the episode. Of course, that era of isolation wasn't nearly as effective as what we see today; there was no unified, coordinated effort among all players. Information traveled much slower, and state oversight of corporations was significantly weaker than modern standards. Furthermore, the shift of global dominance from the United Kingdom to the USA was already underway, meaning the major powers weren't acting with a single, unified policy.

... as effectively as what we're seeing today!?

This isn't isolation. This is a joke—a total caricature of sanctions. You have fleets sitting right off the coast of the European Union calmly transferring Russian oil and shipping it off to Asia for about $70 a barrel.🤣
Christian Torres3 Christian Torres3 Regular
604 messages
joined Sep 2014
#9154 ·
Noah Diaz said:... as effectively as what we're seeing today!?

This isn't isolation. This is a joke—a total caricature of sanctions. You have fleets sitting right off the coast of the European Union calmly transferring Russian oil and shipping it off to Asia for about $70 a barrel.🤣

Keep dreaming.
Morgan Wright5 Morgan Wright5 Active Member
79 messages
joined Mar 2022
#9155 ·
Noah Diaz said:... as effectively as what we're seeing today!?

This isn't isolation. This is a joke—a total caricature of sanctions. You have fleets sitting right off the coast of the European Union calmly transferring Russian oil and shipping it off to Asia for about $70 a barrel.🤣

Oh, wonderful. So you can buy oil at a massive discount while you're stuck paying $70.
Jason Roberts2 Jason Roberts2 Member
24 messages
joined Jan 2021
#9156 ·
Sanctions are hitting us hard, and we're the ones footing the bill
Nathan Thomas12 Nathan Thomas12 Regular
265 messages
joined Apr 2022
#9157 ·
Noah Diaz said:... as effectively as what we're seeing today!?

This isn't isolation. This is a joke—a total caricature of sanctions. You have fleets sitting right off the coast of the European Union calmly transferring Russian oil and shipping it off to Asia for about $70 a barrel.🤣

Did you even bother reading that Associated Press article about oil prices?
Probably not, so let me spell it out for you: Ural is sitting at 50 USD.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/tass.co...my/1583177/amp

At the end of the day, you're just trolling and lying because I'm handing you actual Russian sources.
Noah Diaz Noah Diaz Active Member
114 messages
joined Sep 2021
#9158 ·
Morgan Wright5 said:Oh, wonderful. So you can buy oil at a massive discount while you're stuck paying $70.


These are genuine discounts, calculated against Brent using a specific formula.

Offers for ESPO that’s typically loaded at Kozmino port was close to $6.50 to $7 a barrel below ICE Brent on a delivered basis to China, while flagship Urals shipped from western ports was around $10 under the same benchmark, said traders.

Brent is currently sitting at $77.45.

Based on the formula mentioned above, Russia is selling:

ESPO: ~$70
URAL: ~$67
Thomas Stewart8 Thomas Stewart8 Member
36 messages
joined May 2012
#9159 ·
You forgot the smiley face!
Anthony Hill5 Anthony Hill5 Regular
379 messages
joined May 2024
#9160 ·
wanderingmaker3 said:Check out this link detailing how Russia uses Swiss, German, and Italian companies as middlemen to sneak in machinery essential for weapon manufacturing.

https://informnapalm.org/en/how-comp...oduce-weapons/

Have they not achieved total self-sufficiency by now? Or is the production of industrial machinery perhaps slightly more complex than merely planting wheat or crafting cheese?

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