Religion classes in school - Megathread

brisknomad13 said:Fair point—you can't really put religion in the same box as math or history. Sure, it’s technically on the school schedule, but it goes way deeper than that. Its whole purpose is about connecting people to the Lord—students, parents, teachers, and the whole church community all in one go.

It’s got this depth that’s way more powerful than any individual's attempt to toss aside the human spirit and its specific Christian search for meaning.

Obviously, history shows us that totalitarian systems will always try to force out whatever they don't like, but when it comes to faith, that’s a much tougher nut to crack. It's practically impossible because we're talking about an existential reality, not just some textbook curriculum.

(The critics who actually get this realize they're biting off way more than they can chew)

But honestly, that’s exactly my point.
It’s not just another standard class—you literally just said it can't be compared to them.
Yet, here we are, and it’s still being held in schools.
Even though there are plenty of kids who just tune out entirely.
They end up just hanging out in the hallways instead.

So, I think we just need to ask ourselves—why?

The whole debate really boils down to this one question: why is this happening in a school building instead of at the parish? Like, does it feel a little weird to you that it's scheduled right between History and PE, especially when you consider what its actual "functional goal" is supposed to be?

The only excuse we’ve heard so far is some nonsense about how "not all churches have laptops," which is wild to me—as if having a MacBook is somehow the deciding factor for whether a kid learns about faith or not.

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

I hit up this mass every Sunday where like 95% of the crowd are just kids making their First Communion. A ton of parents tag along too. It’s pretty funny since I live in a city that’s basically a liberal stronghold—we haven't seen a conservative leader in power here forever.

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

Church catechism has always been a thing, and religious ed finally made its way back into public schools after we moved past that fifty-year stretch of totalitarian rule. I don't really need to explain how democracy works here. Voters hand over their power to representatives in Congress, and then those folks pass laws on our behalf. Now that religious classes are back in the curriculum, they're being run by an elected government instead of some one-party political machine.

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

Just because someone blanks on a question doesn't mean they're clueless. It’s one thing to draw a blank in the moment; it’s not a whole personality trait or an actual argument. One instance means nothing.
You can't just take one guy's ignorance and apply it to everyone involved in religious studies classes.
Sure, it’s on parents and Sunday school teachers to pass down those values, but let's be real—what a kid actually picks up isn't just limited to what they're taught at home or in church.

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

And yeah, I already mentioned I explain Halloween to my kids.
At my local school with over 700 students, the priest doesn't even show up for the blessing of the bread or produce.
The kids and teachers just get together, snap some photos, eat cookies and pastries, and then the leftovers go to the food bank for the homeless.

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

In my liberal city, the churches are actually packed. You can't even find a seat during Easter services. So, I guess I'll just happily note that even the liberals are going to church. 🙂

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

Already answered this one.

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

http://www.nytimes.com/research-on-secularization/1475622/
According to the study, there aren't any indicators of secularization processes in America that would hit the younger population first, unlike what's been seen in places like Europe.
.....42 percent of students are pro-abortion ban...

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

Church doctrine isn't actually at odds with evolution, it just doesn't buy into things like spontaneous abiogenesis that some people push.
Science hasn't cracked the code yet, and the Church believes God set life on Earth in motion.
If that teacher is sticking to a hardline fundamentalist creationist take on Genesis, then he's totally ignoring actual Catholic teaching.

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

Religion class is open to anyone who wants to sign up, even if it's faith-based. When it gets into the confession and prayer stuff, they're basically just observers. Everyone has a choice.
Kids actually find it pretty interesting because it hits those deep, existential questions about why we're even here.

James Alvarez2 said:When was the last time you actually went to Mass for First Communicants?
How many parents actually showed up with their kids?...
What if they just moved religion class straight into the church? Imagine how much easier life would be...
When did the majority even decide on religious studies in schools...?
Persephone gave you a solid example—so what exactly is a midnight Mass?

A kid who learns their faith at home from their parents already knows what a dawn is...
Kids signed up for religion class... what happens if I don't enroll them? What'll Grandma Dawn say if I skip it? Honestly, whatever, let them go. I went when I was a kid and nothing bad happened... they don't even know. It's not like their morning prayer is some essential part of living a faithful life anyway...

You're bringing up Halloween and all those other weird traditions...
So you can't even explain to your kid why you guys don't celebrate it?
If you don't want it and you can't handle it, why on earth would you think anyone else wants kids sitting around waiting for a blessing over the bread...

If we go to church for a blessing at the start of the school year or to give thanks when things wrap up, why wouldn't we do the same for a loaf of bread?
Can I just have a harvest festival at school that doesn't involve some priest?

We claim to be over 80% Catholic, yet the churches are basically empty. Common sense? We're losing that bit by bit. Kids don't even know what a prayer looks like anymore... Confirmation is just an excuse for me to get an iPhone6+... And I only bother showing up to church when I'm getting married because I don't want my grandma judging me if I just go to the courthouse...
We want all the freedom in the world for ourselves, but the second someone else asks for it? Suddenly we're against it. We’ve basically turned into a bunch of gatekeepers... just like those stubborn folks over in the Midwest.

Still haven't heard a single believer say what would actually happen to religious ed if it moved back into the church... Not a peep about how many kids would even show up to class if that happened...

So you're claiming kids these days are all turning conservative? Where exactly are you seeing that? On your Facebook feed where you only follow people who agree with you?...
The upcoming lineup of youth leaders for the local parish programs here in Chicago... it’s gonna be a mess. You’ve basically got two groups. One side just blindly follows whatever their parents or teachers say without thinking for themselves. The other side? Their vocabulary is nothing but profanity, sports rants, and total political nonsense. It’s gonna be interesting watching this year unfold...

So I was talking about this religious studies teacher at my local elementary school—part of my parish, right? Anyway, he went totally ballistic on their Facebook page, picking fights with everyone because he just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that some of his own colleagues actually believe in evolution. He’s out here teaching that Eve came from Adam's rib, and he loses it if you don't buy into that. Like, seriously... you really want your kid learning from someone like that?

All this is just more reason to cut religion classes out of schools. And I'm not even talking about atheist arguments—those people can find plenty of reasons to complain on their own. I’m talking about the religious parents who actually want their kids in those classes because they grew up with them...
Alright, let's hear it. Lay out your arguments for those questions from earlier...
A football team isn't gonna win any championships if the entire fifth-grade class shows up to practice just to mess around... same thing goes for religion class. It’s impossible to get through the material if you've got a bunch of kids who couldn't care less about being there. And honestly? It doesn't matter what happens in the classroom if they aren't getting any support or foundation at home...

Edit: oh, please... explain how it’s somehow "fair" that you, as a Catholic, decide not to give money to "some feminist books," yet you think it's totally fine for an atheist, agnostic, Adventist, or Buddhist to have their tax dollars funneled straight into your church?

Look, when a believer pays taxes, they're funding organizations they might not even agree with. It works both ways.
That's just how democracy functions in most places. Maybe one day it'll change, who knows.
In some parts of Europe, they're already changing it.

Karen Richardson3 said:But honestly, that’s exactly my point.
It’s not just another standard class—you literally just said it can't be compared to them.
Yet, here we are, and it’s still being held in schools.
Even though there are plenty of kids who just tune out entirely.
They end up just hanging out in the hallways instead.

So, I think we just need to ask ourselves—why?

The whole debate really boils down to this one question: why is this happening in a school building instead of at the parish? Like, does it feel a little weird to you that it's scheduled right between History and PE, especially when you consider what its actual "functional goal" is supposed to be?

The only excuse we’ve heard so far is some nonsense about how "not all churches have laptops," which is wild to me—as if having a MacBook is somehow the deciding factor for whether a kid learns about faith or not.

School religion classes and parish catechesis have always been two totally different things.
Parish catechesis is all about that deep, spiritual connection—it’s where you actually live out the sacraments and grapple with faith on a real level. School religion classes are different; they're more about the long game, teaching the fundamentals through a mix of head knowledge, heart, and actual action.

Since Christianity is so baked into our history and what makes us who we are, I think people were right to back the politicians back in the nineties who wanted to bring religious studies back into the schools.

Karen Richardson3 said:But honestly, that’s exactly my point.
It’s not just another standard class—you literally just said it can't be compared to them.
Yet, here we are, and it’s still being held in schools.
Even though there are plenty of kids who just tune out entirely.
They end up just hanging out in the hallways instead.

So, I think we just need to ask ourselves—why?

The whole debate really boils down to this one question: why is this happening in a school building instead of at the parish? Like, does it feel a little weird to you that it's scheduled right between History and PE, especially when you consider what its actual "functional goal" is supposed to be?

The only excuse we’ve heard so far is some nonsense about how "not all churches have laptops," which is wild to me—as if having a MacBook is somehow the deciding factor for whether a kid learns about faith or not.

If a school decides to sandwich religion class right in the middle of the day, we need to do whatever it takes to stop that from happening.
If a kid isn't doing Sunday school, they shouldn't just sit around waiting. I'm with you on that.

brisknomad13 said:School religion classes and parish catechesis have always been two totally different things.
Parish catechesis is all about that deep, spiritual connection—it’s where you actually live out the sacraments and grapple with faith on a real level. School religion classes are different; they're more about the long game, teaching the fundamentals through a mix of head knowledge, heart, and actual action.

Since Christianity is so baked into our history and what makes us who we are, I think people were right to back the politicians back in the nineties who wanted to bring religious studies back into the schools.

If a school decides to sandwich religion class right in the middle of the day, we need to do whatever it takes to stop that from happening.
If a kid isn't doing Sunday school, they shouldn't just sit around waiting. I'm with you on that.

I’ll be honest, I’m not super familiar with how "parish catechesis" actually works (if I’m reading you right, is that just people gathering at the local church while getting ready for things like First Communion?), but you still haven't quite hit my point:

If we want religion class to be that comprehensive experience that touches on a student's intellect, emotions, and daily life, why can't that just happen within church facilities instead?

Quincy:

Since Christianity is so deeply woven into the fabric of our history and our American identity, I honestly believe it was the right move back in the nineties when people backed the political candidates who fought to get religious education back into the public school system.

But what's the catch?

Are you worried that if we just kept religion classes strictly within the church walls, it would somehow weaken our national identity?

Karen Richardson3 said:I’ll be honest, I’m not super familiar with how "parish catechesis" actually works (if I’m reading you right, is that just people gathering at the local church while getting ready for things like First Communion?), but you still haven't quite hit my point:

If we want religion class to be that comprehensive experience that touches on a student's intellect, emotions, and daily life, why can't that just happen within church facilities instead?

Quincy:

Since Christianity is so deeply woven into the fabric of our history and our American identity, I honestly believe it was the right move back in the nineties when people backed the political candidates who fought to get religious education back into the public school system.

But what's the catch?

Are you worried that if we just kept religion classes strictly within the church walls, it would somehow weaken our national identity?

It's because there just isn't enough room in the churches to fit all those kids. It's like asking why the Los Angeles Dodgers games aren't played in some tiny gym. 😁

Henry Cox78 said:It's because there just isn't enough room in the churches to fit all those kids. It's like asking why the Los Angeles Dodgers games aren't played in some tiny gym. 😁

Look, we haven't actually met online, so I can't really tell if you're being dead serious right now or if you're just messing with me.

And if we're going to bring up the Los Angeles Dodgers, the real question is how everyone manages to cram into the stadium on Sunday, yet suddenly there’s "not enough space" for practice sessions during the week?

Karen Richardson3 said:Look, we haven't actually met online, so I can't really tell if you're being dead serious right now or if you're just messing with me.

And if we're going to bring up the Los Angeles Dodgers, the real question is how everyone manages to cram into the stadium on Sunday, yet suddenly there’s "not enough space" for practice sessions during the week?

Demand for religious education is huge, but there just isn't enough room, so it makes more sense to go where the space actually exists. You seem really worked up about this whole religion thing. It’s not enough for you guys to just opt out yourselves; you think everyone else should quit too. That's just not gonna happen.

Henry Cox78 said:Demand for religious education is huge, but there just isn't enough room, so it makes more sense to go where the space actually exists. You seem really worked up about this whole religion thing. It’s not enough for you guys to just opt out yourselves; you think everyone else should quit too. That's just not gonna happen.

Look, we aren't forcing anyone to step down or anything. We're just saying people should go where they actually fit in.

Henry Cox78 said:Demand for religious education is huge, but there just isn't enough room, so it makes more sense to go where the space actually exists. You seem really worked up about this whole religion thing. It’s not enough for you guys to just opt out yourselves; you think everyone else should quit too. That's just not gonna happen.

Honestly, that argument about lack of space isn't nearly as convincing as your attempt to twist the logic from "religious studies belongs in church facilities" into "you're demanding that everyone else stop being believers."

It’s pretty interesting, though, how you actually admit that moving religious education strictly into church buildings would end up shrinking the number of "believers" in the long run.😉

Jason Ortiz5 said:Look, we aren't forcing anyone to step down or anything. We're just saying people should go where they actually fit in.

Religious studies belongs right where it should be—in the classroom.

Karen Richardson3 said:Honestly, that argument about lack of space isn't nearly as convincing as your attempt to twist the logic from "religious studies belongs in church facilities" into "you're demanding that everyone else stop being believers."

It’s pretty interesting, though, how you actually admit that moving religious education strictly into church buildings would end up shrinking the number of "believers" in the long run.😉

It’s pretty obvious to me that people like you who hate religious studies only care about one thing: driving down church attendance until faith dies out completely. It’s going to be a total disaster. You guys are just weak—if believers actually fought back and forced everyone into religion, you'd all be whining like cowards. You should be happy just picking your own worldview instead of being so incredibly bold as to try and shove it down everyone else's throats. Well, fat chance. We aren't living under communism anymore, and the era of being pushed around is officially over.

Henry Cox78 said:Religious studies belongs right where it should be—in the classroom.

It’s pretty obvious to me that people like you who hate religious studies only care about one thing: driving down church attendance until faith dies out completely. It’s going to be a total disaster. You guys are just weak—if believers actually fought back and forced everyone into religion, you'd all be whining like cowards. You should be happy just picking your own worldview instead of being so incredibly bold as to try and shove it down everyone else's throats. Well, fat chance. We aren't living under communism anymore, and the era of being pushed around is officially over.

And how exactly does reducing religious classes in schools lower the number of believers if they're just going to church anyway? 😁 You either believe or you don't, regardless of where you're sitting in a classroom or a pew.

Henry Cox78 said:Religious studies belongs right where it should be—in the classroom.

It’s pretty obvious to me that people like you who hate religious studies only care about one thing: driving down church attendance until faith dies out completely. It’s going to be a total disaster. You guys are just weak—if believers actually fought back and forced everyone into religion, you'd all be whining like cowards. You should be happy just picking your own worldview instead of being so incredibly bold as to try and shove it down everyone else's throats. Well, fat chance. We aren't living under communism anymore, and the era of being pushed around is officially over.

The era of oppression isn't over; it's just shifting depending on who's doing the pressing. Honestly, whether it's the left or the right doesn't matter much to me because, ideologically speaking, I sit somewhere in the middle. So, imagine this: even though I'm an atheist, I still consider myself someone with a really strong sense of national identity.

Anyway, I’m not against religious education as a concept itself—meaning, it never crosses my mind to ban anyone from being a believer, a queer, or a 35-year-old woman choosing to have a third abortion after already having two kids (though I definitely have opinions on every group mentioned here). My issue is specifically with keeping it in public schools.

What really gets to me are people like you, who equate opposing religious instruction in school buildings with threatening the very survival of Catholicism, and then immediately leap to talking about Communism.

If you're curious about what I think regarding Communism: I believe it was a deeply unfortunate period in our history, and we're still feeling the fallout today.
However, I don't view it as tragic because someone "banned" faith—and I put that in quotes, because everyone I knew went to church and participated in all the rites without any issues; we lived in the outskirts of Monterey. I see it as tragic because it crushed the middle class and left us ruled by the rural crowd.
We’re still feeling that rule by the rural population today, and it’s going to take decades to recover from the loss of the civic layer that ended up leaving the country.
But what truly scares me is the fact that the citizens are still fleeing the country while the rural types stay behind.

But getting back to the point:
That whole "there isn't enough space" excuse you're using is just shameful.
For you, or anyone else, to claim that, we would first have to reach a point where kids are flocking to parishes for religious instruction in such massive numbers that they can't even fit inside.

Only then could the Church ask the government to hand over school buildings for religious studies, simply because the needs of the American people are so vast that the Church can't meet them (at least until they build enough of their own facilities).

In that scenario, the state could provide the buildings for use outside of regular school hours.

But that hasn't happened. It was never actually established that there’s a shortage of space.

The way you're acting today is exactly how the party used to act back in the day. Once you realize that, IMO, you might actually become better people and more sincere believers.

I honestly don't get how they can claim there isn't enough room when the church is hosting religious education classes right in their own facilities, especially considering that's exactly where the kids need to be for their First Communion and Confirmation prep sessions.

Chloe Roberts2 said:I honestly don't get how they can claim there isn't enough room when the church is hosting religious education classes right in their own facilities, especially considering that's exactly where the kids need to be for their First Communion and Confirmation prep sessions.

Honestly, you just squeeze everyone in for a week. It’s not that deep!

And besides, finding teachers is a nightmare—everyone is already booked solid at the local K-12 schools.

Sorry, I’m not quite following you there.

Karen Richardson3 said:I’ll be honest, I’m not super familiar with how "parish catechesis" actually works (if I’m reading you right, is that just people gathering at the local church while getting ready for things like First Communion?), but you still haven't quite hit my point:

If we want religion class to be that comprehensive experience that touches on a student's intellect, emotions, and daily life, why can't that just happen within church facilities instead?

Quincy:

Since Christianity is so deeply woven into the fabric of our history and our American identity, I honestly believe it was the right move back in the nineties when people backed the political candidates who fought to get religious education back into the public school system.

But what's the catch?

Are you worried that if we just kept religion classes strictly within the church walls, it would somehow weaken our national identity?

I've said it all, but apparently, people just skip over the answers.

The Elementary and Secondary Education Act says in Article 4:
Article 4.
(1) The goals of education in school institutions are:
1. to ensure a systematic way of teaching students, encouraging and improving their intellectual, physical, aesthetic, social, moral, and spiritual development in accordance with their abilities and inclinations,
2. to develop students' awareness of national belonging, preserving historical-cultural heritage, and national identity....(cut)

Like you can see, educational goals are broad, but the part that actually matters here is the bolded bit.
That’s where the Catholic Church stepped in, offering the kind of upbringing they promote (universal and faith-based values) and letting kids get an education "in accordance with their abilities and inclinations"—for the parents who actually want that. By the way, over 80% of people in the last census identified as Catholic, and since schools aren't neutral bystanders but actual formative institutions, having Catholic instruction has legal, universal, and moral ground to exist as a subject.

Bringing religion back into schools wasn't some dictatorship move; it happened because the political party that won the American elections put it there. That option was chosen by the citizens of the US. Then came the Vatican Treaty, and the Constitution has a clause protecting freedom of religion.

It was a historic chance for the people to decide the quality of education for their own kids.
I mean, who else gets to decide how kids are raised if not the people—the majority?
I don't have anything against Protagoras or brisknomad13 making up their own curriculum, or some feminist group doing the same. If they meet the criteria for an elective, sure, let the kids whose parents want it take the class.

So, religion returned to the classroom after decades, allowing for that "moral and spiritual development based on inclinations and abilities," plus education on national identity (though that happens in other classes too). It all lines up with the Law, the Constitution, and the Vatican Treaty.

If a minority finds that annoying, there's not much they can do right now.
If the majority is unhappy, they can go through the proper channels to change the legal framework.

As for funding or how many hours are assigned to it, if this model isn't cutting it, then that's something that needs to be worked on.

Chloe Roberts2 said:Sorry, I’m not quite following you there.

It’s funny how it works. During the week when K-12 schools are in session—and all those teachers are basically getting their government paychecks to handle church business—there’s plenty of room at the church. But then the weekend rolls around and suddenly everyone decides they need to cram into the pews at once.

brisknomad13 said:I've said it all, but apparently, people just skip over the answers.

The Elementary and Secondary Education Act says in Article 4:
Article 4.
(1) The goals of education in school institutions are:
1. to ensure a systematic way of teaching students, encouraging and improving their intellectual, physical, aesthetic, social, moral, and spiritual development in accordance with their abilities and inclinations,
2. to develop students' awareness of national belonging, preserving historical-cultural heritage, and national identity....(cut)

Like you can see, educational goals are broad, but the part that actually matters here is the bolded bit.
That’s where the Catholic Church stepped in, offering the kind of upbringing they promote (universal and faith-based values) and letting kids get an education "in accordance with their abilities and inclinations"—for the parents who actually want that. By the way, over 80% of people in the last census identified as Catholic, and since schools aren't neutral bystanders but actual formative institutions, having Catholic instruction has legal, universal, and moral ground to exist as a subject.

Bringing religion back into schools wasn't some dictatorship move; it happened because the political party that won the American elections put it there. That option was chosen by the citizens of the US. Then came the Vatican Treaty, and the Constitution has a clause protecting freedom of religion.

It was a historic chance for the people to decide the quality of education for their own kids.
I mean, who else gets to decide how kids are raised if not the people—the majority?
I don't have anything against Protagoras or brisknomad13 making up their own curriculum, or some feminist group doing the same. If they meet the criteria for an elective, sure, let the kids whose parents want it take the class.

So, religion returned to the classroom after decades, allowing for that "moral and spiritual development based on inclinations and abilities," plus education on national identity (though that happens in other classes too). It all lines up with the Law, the Constitution, and the Vatican Treaty.

If a minority finds that annoying, there's not much they can do right now.
If the majority is unhappy, they can go through the proper channels to change the legal framework.

As for funding or how many hours are assigned to it, if this model isn't cutting it, then that's something that needs to be worked on.

Are you being serious right now? Just the other day, there was talk about introducing something like "World Religions" in elementary schools as an alternative to religious ed. You should have seen the Church and all its followers; they absolutely lost their minds just hearing the idea mentioned...

Jason Ortiz5 said:Are you being serious right now? Just the other day, there was talk about introducing something like "World Religions" in elementary schools as an alternative to religious ed. You should have seen the Church and all its followers; they absolutely lost their minds just hearing the idea mentioned...

As far as I'm concerned, go ahead and bring in religious culture. I don't care.
I already know where I'm sending my kids—somewhere they actually get to experience faith and community, not somewhere they just memorize facts about different religions. You can find all that info just by surfing the web.

The school is essentially morphing into a religious training ground.
It’s the 21st century.
Oof.

I honestly don't get why churches, mosques, or temples aren't enough for people of faith. If they aren't content with their own houses of worship, isn't the goal just to force their beliefs on everyone else?