Does religious belief play a decisive role in mental health therapy?

Jeremy Alvarez5 said:Alright, here we go. This thread is basically about the intersection of mental illness and religion—so half psychology, half theology. I guess I wonder if any actual scientists have ever dared to dig into whether specific types of mental disorders correlate with specific religions. Like, has anyone actually published data showing that a certain percentage of people with a particular condition belong to a certain faith?

It seems pretty clear that religion can be a really effective tool when helping people recover from addiction. You see it in those communities where they combine intense physical labor with prayer and deep religious conviction...

I’m honestly fascinated by this whole topic. I’d be super grateful for any thoughts you guys have, or even just some links or book recommendations if you know of anything good out there.

So, looking at Carl Gustav Jung, born in 1875, who went to boarding school in San Francisco, studied medicine, worked at a psychiatric hospital, taught at a university, and ran his own private practice. He had that whole complicated relationship with Sigmund Freud 🙂, developed his theories on personality, traveled around studying the traditions, history, and rituals of various tribes across Africa, the Americas, and India. He wrote about twenty books, including "Answer to job" [referring to the biblical figure, not a career job], and passed away in 1961. Interestingly, once he hit his 80s, he started working with a biographer who mentioned in her preface that he truly believed religious conviction plays a vital role in treating mental illness.

That leads me to my big question: if faith is so crucial for healing, could it also be a deciding factor in how these conditions develop in the first place?

Three, two, one... let's hear it!

PS

Since Jeremy Alvarez5 managed to kick off that discussion on suicide over in the philosophy section, which naturally flowed into spirituality and psychology, I was thinking it would be cool if this thread eventually made its way over there too. Ideally, I'd love to see this become a sort of grand tour through philosophy, religion, and spirituality—maybe even ending up in the history section down the road. Personally, I jump between all those subforums, but since some of the most interesting people I talk to here only tend to post where they feel most comfortable 🙂, maybe the mods could encourage them more? Maybe give them more space to speak up, share photos, or even memes and debates 😢. That way, I won't have to feel like a nuisance by reposting the same topic across every single board under different titles and trying to twist things to suit my own agenda, which—if I'm being honest—is something I tend to do. 🙂 Cheers to the hardworking moderators. 🙏 😍

feralhound55 said:It could be—just as it might not be essential for healing. I'm sure there are atheists out there who have managed mental health struggles their own way. Religion can certainly help if you find solace in it, but it isn't a requirement.

On the flip side, extreme religious fervor can definitely trigger psychological issues—there are plenty of ways that happens. Personally, I think anything accepted blindly, without any doubt or common sense, is harmful. And honestly, people prone to that kind of blind faith are often showing signs of instability right from the start.

There’s no way to measure "religiosity," so finding data that links specific faiths to certain illness rates seems pretty unreliable to me. You could attend Mass every single day and stay perfectly sane, or you could take one trip to India and come back completely unhinged. Everyone has their own limits.

I'd also point to things like "killing for God" or historical inquisitions—does being a criminal automatically make someone mentally ill?

feralhound55 said:It could be—just as it might not be essential for healing. I'm sure there are atheists out there who have managed mental health struggles their own way. Religion can certainly help if you find solace in it, but it isn't a requirement.

On the flip side, extreme religious fervor can definitely trigger psychological issues—there are plenty of ways that happens. Personally, I think anything accepted blindly, without any doubt or common sense, is harmful. And honestly, people prone to that kind of blind faith are often showing signs of instability right from the start.

There’s no way to measure "religiosity," so finding data that links specific faiths to certain illness rates seems pretty unreliable to me. You could attend Mass every single day and stay perfectly sane, or you could take one trip to India and come back completely unhinged. Everyone has their own limits.

I'd also point to things like "killing for God" or historical inquisitions—does being a criminal automatically make someone mentally ill?

Jeremy Alvarez5 said:Alright, here we go. This thread is basically about the intersection of mental illness and religion—so half psychology, half theology. I guess I wonder if any actual scientists have ever dared to dig into whether specific types of mental disorders correlate with specific religions. Like, has anyone actually published data showing that a certain percentage of people with a particular condition belong to a certain faith?

It seems pretty clear that religion can be a really effective tool when helping people recover from addiction. You see it in those communities where they combine intense physical labor with prayer and deep religious conviction...

I’m honestly fascinated by this whole topic. I’d be super grateful for any thoughts you guys have, or even just some links or book recommendations if you know of anything good out there.

So, looking at Carl Gustav Jung, born in 1875, who went to boarding school in San Francisco, studied medicine, worked at a psychiatric hospital, taught at a university, and ran his own private practice. He had that whole complicated relationship with Sigmund Freud 🙂, developed his theories on personality, traveled around studying the traditions, history, and rituals of various tribes across Africa, the Americas, and India. He wrote about twenty books, including "Answer to job" [referring to the biblical figure, not a career job], and passed away in 1961. Interestingly, once he hit his 80s, he started working with a biographer who mentioned in her preface that he truly believed religious conviction plays a vital role in treating mental illness.

That leads me to my big question: if faith is so crucial for healing, could it also be a deciding factor in how these conditions develop in the first place?

Three, two, one... let's hear it!

PS

Since Jeremy Alvarez5 managed to kick off that discussion on suicide over in the philosophy section, which naturally flowed into spirituality and psychology, I was thinking it would be cool if this thread eventually made its way over there too. Ideally, I'd love to see this become a sort of grand tour through philosophy, religion, and spirituality—maybe even ending up in the history section down the road. Personally, I jump between all those subforums, but since some of the most interesting people I talk to here only tend to post where they feel most comfortable 🙂, maybe the mods could encourage them more? Maybe give them more space to speak up, share photos, or even memes and debates 😢. That way, I won't have to feel like a nuisance by reposting the same topic across every single board under different titles and trying to twist things to suit my own agenda, which—if I'm being honest—is something I tend to do. 🙂 Cheers to the hardworking moderators. 🙏 😍

feralhound55 said:It could be—just as it might not be essential for healing. I'm sure there are atheists out there who have managed mental health struggles their own way. Religion can certainly help if you find solace in it, but it isn't a requirement.

On the flip side, extreme religious fervor can definitely trigger psychological issues—there are plenty of ways that happens. Personally, I think anything accepted blindly, without any doubt or common sense, is harmful. And honestly, people prone to that kind of blind faith are often showing signs of instability right from the start.

There’s no way to measure "religiosity," so finding data that links specific faiths to certain illness rates seems pretty unreliable to me. You could attend Mass every single day and stay perfectly sane, or you could take one trip to India and come back completely unhinged. Everyone has their own limits.

I'd also point to things like "killing for God" or historical inquisitions—does being a criminal automatically make someone mentally ill?

Gary James88 said:That’s a massive question to tackle. Even if someone actually tried to run a study like that, you'd have to ask what the point is. You'd face a mountain of pushback regarding how you'd even measure it or control for all the outside variables. It reminds me of those old controversial studies trying to compare national IQ levels—they got absolutely shredded for their methodology and the ethics behind them in the first place.

Carol Thompson said:I couldn't agree more. 👍 In fact, from what I understand, this is the exact perspective currently held by the scientific community and various mental health professionals.
A healthy relationship with faith can help someone navigate life's hardships, including mental illness. Psychotherapists are increasingly integrating a patient's faith into the therapeutic process (assuming, of course, that the patient is a believer).
On the flip side, unhealthy or pathological religiousness can actually fuel the development of an illness—if not cause it directly—and can certainly hinder recovery.
Atheists, naturally, can manage therapy just as effectively, provided they have a healthy worldview (as anyone else would).

So, religious belief isn't a prerequisite for therapy. It can be a tool, it can be a hindrance, or it can simply be absent... 😉

Not quite. There are metrics for religiosity—specifically regarding different dimensions, such as healthy versus pathological religiosity, as well as various types (extrinsic, intrinsic, or seeking religiosity)...
Certain types or dimensions of religiosity are indeed linked to specific personality traits, behaviors, biases, depression, and anxiety... there has been extensive research conducted on these very topics.

I don't believe a study that broad has ever been conducted. As someone else pointed out, due to various operational and methodological hurdles, a research topic that wide and generalized is essentially impossible to execute.
🤷

Jeremy Alvarez5 said:So, I was thinking about this earlier today—what exactly counts as pathological religiosity? It’s one of those things that’s kind of hard to pin down because it isn't always obvious, you know? Like, how do you even measure it without sounding like you're judging someone's personal faith? I guess if we're being real, it’s less about how much someone believes and more about how that belief starts to mess with their actual life. It’s when the whole thing stops being about spiritual comfort or finding meaning and starts turning into something... well, maybe a bit obsessive or even destructive. Maybe it shows up when someone starts pulling away from everything else—family, work, friends—just to focus on rituals or doctrines to an extreme degree. Or if they start making really irrational decisions based on these intense convictions that don't really line up with reality. It’s sort of like when a hobby becomes an addiction, but instead of it being about gaming or collecting stuff, it’s centered around religious practice. It’s a fine line, though. I mean, I think everyone has their own way of coping, right? But when that coping mechanism starts dictating every single move you make or causing genuine harm to yourself or the people around you, that’s probably where the "pathological" label starts to fit. It’s definitely a tricky subject to navigate without getting too deep into the weeds, but I guess that's just how it is. 😁I mean, are we talking about specific "religious" advice here? Like, could you maybe give me an example of what that looks like? I guess I'm also kind of wondering what exactly qualifies as "health" or having a "healthy worldview," but honestly, we can totally put that off for later if you want. No rush. 😍

Quincy:

I mean, looking at it this way, I guess religious belief isn't really a make-or-break factor when it comes to therapy. It’s kind of complicated, honestly. It could be used as a tool to help someone heal, it could potentially cause some friction or even do more harm than good, or—and maybe this is the most common path—it might not play a role in the process at all. It just depends on the situation, I suppose. 😉

So, I was thinking about what Jung said, and it kind of serves as a decent jumping-off point for this whole discussion. I mean, when you look at the world today, such a huge chunk of the population identifies with some kind of religion, and even those who don't, they're still pretty much shaped by the cultural leftovers that religious structures left behind. It’s like, if you trace civilization back through all those stages—from old-school totemism and mysticism to everything we deal with now—you realize how deeply intertwined the two are. I guess that's why I feel like we should actually take this topic seriously instead of just brushing it off. It makes me wonder, though... has there ever been an actual atheist society that really lasted? Like, one that was exclusively secular from the start? Maybe somewhere isolated, like a tiny island out in the Pacific Ocean? Just curious if anyone knows anything about that.

Quincy:

I mean, I think that's not quite right. There’s actually a way to measure religiosity—or rather, there are different ways to look at it. You have to consider the distinction between healthy spirituality and more pathological stuff, and then you've got all these different types like extrinsic, intrinsic, or even that searching kind of religiosity... I guess it's just more nuanced than that. So, I was thinking about this earlier, and it’s kind of wild how much certain types of religiousness—if you even want to call it that—seem to tie back to who we are as people. Like, there’s definitely a connection between how someone practices their faith and their actual personality traits, or maybe even how they handle things like anxiety or depression. It’s not just some random feeling either; I think there’s actually been a ton of research done on this stuff over the years. You see all these studies looking at how belief systems might overlap with specific behaviors or even deep-seated biases people carry around. It’s pretty heavy stuff when you really dig into it, I guess.

I mean, I guess it depends on what you’re actually looking for, right? Like, are we talking about a good spot for brunch in Chicago, or maybe a decent tech setup? I feel like everyone asks for recommendations without giving much to go on, haha. If you could give me even a tiny bit of context, I might be able to dig something up for you. Maybe?

Jeremy Alvarez5 said:So, I was thinking about this earlier today—what exactly counts as pathological religiosity? It’s one of those things that’s kind of hard to pin down because it isn't always obvious, you know? Like, how do you even measure it without sounding like you're judging someone's personal faith? I guess if we're being real, it’s less about how much someone believes and more about how that belief starts to mess with their actual life. It’s when the whole thing stops being about spiritual comfort or finding meaning and starts turning into something... well, maybe a bit obsessive or even destructive. Maybe it shows up when someone starts pulling away from everything else—family, work, friends—just to focus on rituals or doctrines to an extreme degree. Or if they start making really irrational decisions based on these intense convictions that don't really line up with reality. It’s sort of like when a hobby becomes an addiction, but instead of it being about gaming or collecting stuff, it’s centered around religious practice. It’s a fine line, though. I mean, I think everyone has their own way of coping, right? But when that coping mechanism starts dictating every single move you make or causing genuine harm to yourself or the people around you, that’s probably where the "pathological" label starts to fit. It’s definitely a tricky subject to navigate without getting too deep into the weeds, but I guess that's just how it is. 😁I mean, are we talking about specific "religious" advice here? Like, could you maybe give me an example of what that looks like? I guess I'm also kind of wondering what exactly qualifies as "health" or having a "healthy worldview," but honestly, we can totally put that off for later if you want. No rush. 😍

Quincy:

I mean, looking at it this way, I guess religious belief isn't really a make-or-break factor when it comes to therapy. It’s kind of complicated, honestly. It could be used as a tool to help someone heal, it could potentially cause some friction or even do more harm than good, or—and maybe this is the most common path—it might not play a role in the process at all. It just depends on the situation, I suppose. 😉

So, I was thinking about what Jung said, and it kind of serves as a decent jumping-off point for this whole discussion. I mean, when you look at the world today, such a huge chunk of the population identifies with some kind of religion, and even those who don't, they're still pretty much shaped by the cultural leftovers that religious structures left behind. It’s like, if you trace civilization back through all those stages—from old-school totemism and mysticism to everything we deal with now—you realize how deeply intertwined the two are. I guess that's why I feel like we should actually take this topic seriously instead of just brushing it off. It makes me wonder, though... has there ever been an actual atheist society that really lasted? Like, one that was exclusively secular from the start? Maybe somewhere isolated, like a tiny island out in the Pacific Ocean? Just curious if anyone knows anything about that.

Quincy:

I mean, I think that's not quite right. There’s actually a way to measure religiosity—or rather, there are different ways to look at it. You have to consider the distinction between healthy spirituality and more pathological stuff, and then you've got all these different types like extrinsic, intrinsic, or even that searching kind of religiosity... I guess it's just more nuanced than that. So, I was thinking about this earlier, and it’s kind of wild how much certain types of religiousness—if you even want to call it that—seem to tie back to who we are as people. Like, there’s definitely a connection between how someone practices their faith and their actual personality traits, or maybe even how they handle things like anxiety or depression. It’s not just some random feeling either; I think there’s actually been a ton of research done on this stuff over the years. You see all these studies looking at how belief systems might overlap with specific behaviors or even deep-seated biases people carry around. It’s pretty heavy stuff when you really dig into it, I guess.

I mean, I guess it depends on what you’re actually looking for, right? Like, are we talking about a good spot for brunch in Chicago, or maybe a decent tech setup? I feel like everyone asks for recommendations without giving much to go on, haha. If you could give me even a tiny bit of context, I might be able to dig something up for you. Maybe?

Jeremy Alvarez5 said:Alright, here we go. This thread is basically about the intersection of mental illness and religion—so half psychology, half theology. I guess I wonder if any actual scientists have ever dared to dig into whether specific types of mental disorders correlate with specific religions. Like, has anyone actually published data showing that a certain percentage of people with a particular condition belong to a certain faith?

It seems pretty clear that religion can be a really effective tool when helping people recover from addiction. You see it in those communities where they combine intense physical labor with prayer and deep religious conviction...

I’m honestly fascinated by this whole topic. I’d be super grateful for any thoughts you guys have, or even just some links or book recommendations if you know of anything good out there.

So, looking at Carl Gustav Jung, born in 1875, who went to boarding school in San Francisco, studied medicine, worked at a psychiatric hospital, taught at a university, and ran his own private practice. He had that whole complicated relationship with Sigmund Freud 🙂, developed his theories on personality, traveled around studying the traditions, history, and rituals of various tribes across Africa, the Americas, and India. He wrote about twenty books, including "Answer to job" [referring to the biblical figure, not a career job], and passed away in 1961. Interestingly, once he hit his 80s, he started working with a biographer who mentioned in her preface that he truly believed religious conviction plays a vital role in treating mental illness.

That leads me to my big question: if faith is so crucial for healing, could it also be a deciding factor in how these conditions develop in the first place?

Three, two, one... let's hear it!

PS

Since Jeremy Alvarez5 managed to kick off that discussion on suicide over in the philosophy section, which naturally flowed into spirituality and psychology, I was thinking it would be cool if this thread eventually made its way over there too. Ideally, I'd love to see this become a sort of grand tour through philosophy, religion, and spirituality—maybe even ending up in the history section down the road. Personally, I jump between all those subforums, but since some of the most interesting people I talk to here only tend to post where they feel most comfortable 🙂, maybe the mods could encourage them more? Maybe give them more space to speak up, share photos, or even memes and debates 😢. That way, I won't have to feel like a nuisance by reposting the same topic across every single board under different titles and trying to twist things to suit my own agenda, which—if I'm being honest—is something I tend to do. 🙂 Cheers to the hardworking moderators. 🙏 😍

Jeremy Alvarez5 said:Alright, here we go. This thread is basically about the intersection of mental illness and religion—so half psychology, half theology. I guess I wonder if any actual scientists have ever dared to dig into whether specific types of mental disorders correlate with specific religions. Like, has anyone actually published data showing that a certain percentage of people with a particular condition belong to a certain faith?

It seems pretty clear that religion can be a really effective tool when helping people recover from addiction. You see it in those communities where they combine intense physical labor with prayer and deep religious conviction...

I’m honestly fascinated by this whole topic. I’d be super grateful for any thoughts you guys have, or even just some links or book recommendations if you know of anything good out there.

So, looking at Carl Gustav Jung, born in 1875, who went to boarding school in San Francisco, studied medicine, worked at a psychiatric hospital, taught at a university, and ran his own private practice. He had that whole complicated relationship with Sigmund Freud 🙂, developed his theories on personality, traveled around studying the traditions, history, and rituals of various tribes across Africa, the Americas, and India. He wrote about twenty books, including "Answer to job" [referring to the biblical figure, not a career job], and passed away in 1961. Interestingly, once he hit his 80s, he started working with a biographer who mentioned in her preface that he truly believed religious conviction plays a vital role in treating mental illness.

That leads me to my big question: if faith is so crucial for healing, could it also be a deciding factor in how these conditions develop in the first place?

Three, two, one... let's hear it!

PS

Since Jeremy Alvarez5 managed to kick off that discussion on suicide over in the philosophy section, which naturally flowed into spirituality and psychology, I was thinking it would be cool if this thread eventually made its way over there too. Ideally, I'd love to see this become a sort of grand tour through philosophy, religion, and spirituality—maybe even ending up in the history section down the road. Personally, I jump between all those subforums, but since some of the most interesting people I talk to here only tend to post where they feel most comfortable 🙂, maybe the mods could encourage them more? Maybe give them more space to speak up, share photos, or even memes and debates 😢. That way, I won't have to feel like a nuisance by reposting the same topic across every single board under different titles and trying to twist things to suit my own agenda, which—if I'm being honest—is something I tend to do. 🙂 Cheers to the hardworking moderators. 🙏 😍

Ronald Rogers27 said:I’m actually interested in the exact opposite: the link between specific mental illnesses and specific religions when it comes to negative impacts—how religion might actually worsen or trigger certain psychological conditions...

For instance, look at Jihad. Specifically, the suicide bomber aspect. You can't call those people "normal." Is that just extreme religious indoctrination, or does it count as a genuine psychological distortion? 🤷

Ronald Rogers27

cosmictinker21 said:I won't get too bogged down in deep philosophy here; I'd rather just stick to the point.

From a purely medical standpoint, believers—regardless of their specific faith—tend to handle pain much better. This is especially true for those who aren't just following rituals out of habit, but whose faith is actually a practical part of their daily lives. That sense of hope provided by faith, combined with the idea that someone—God, a higher power, whatever you want to call it—actually cares about you and has your back, creates a sort of biological rebound effect in the brain. It triggers a fresh supply of serotonin and endorphins, which naturally boosts mood, acts as an anti-stress mechanism, lowers corticosteroid levels in the blood and brain, and smooths out those sharp adrenaline spikes. That’s the fundamental foundation for managing physical pain, not to mention the inevitable anxiety and fear that hit when someone is sick. There have been numerous studies conducted on large groups of subjects in oncology wards, intensive care units, and psychiatric clinics. Researchers measured the actual rises and falls of these specific hormones and neurotransmitters before and after prayer, or after talking with a chaplain, tracking everything from the initial diagnosis through the entire course of the illness... whether that leads to recovery or death.

So, strictly from a scientific perspective, the theory holds up.

Jeremy Alvarez5 said:I mean, that’s only if you’re looking at just one side of the coin. From what I understand, there are strict ethical guidelines that have to be followed during any scientific research, especially when kids are involved.

So, I was thinking... what if we flipped the whole research model on its head? Like, imagine running a study where you intentionally push patients or even children into an even more vulnerable state, just so you could introduce them to entirely different religious ideas or perspectives? It sounds wild, I know, but how much of a difference would that actually make? Personally, I suspect those people wouldn't have been saved by some new doctrine, but rather by simple empathy. If they were met with kindness from people who actually validated their existing beliefs, it might have changed everything. I guess if you just lean into what they already believe, you might stop their thoughts from spiraling toward something destructive—or maybe even prevent that total mental exhaustion where they just lose the energy to think at all. Maybe that's the key.

I mean, when you bring up that distinction between people who just follow the rules and those who actually have faith, maybe we’re looking at the ones who believed in all the wrong things. Like, they might have had faith, but only in the negative stuff—the worst-case scenarios. I guess that kind of mindset probably just fueled their fears during an illness, which honestly sounds like it would only make everything feel even worse.

So, I’m thinking maybe a priest or someone like that was the one who stepped in here. But honestly? I have this hunch that the exact same thing probably happened with the atheists—and I mean it was handled by other atheists too. They likely went in with that kind of genuine empathy, offering some sort of sense of hope for recovery or just finding a bit more purpose in life, you know? And if that's the case, it probably led to much better results for them, too. I guess.

I guess it wasn't even really about whether they were religious beforehand or anything like that. It felt more like a way to show genuine care—you know, just being there for someone, showing some real solidarity and empathy toward the person who's sick. I mean, let's be honest, people of faith tend to gravitate toward their own, right? Like, a priest is naturally going to lean toward whoever actually validates the whole sense of purpose behind his work and everything he sacrifices for it. Maybe that’s just how it works.

Like the examples he brought up... S. Freud In *Totem and Taboo*, you start seeing the other side of the coin—how certain beliefs can trigger this intense fear or even total panic, sometimes even driving people to the brink. It’s wild how much weight those convictions carry. And then you look at A. Alvarez’s study on the concept of a cruel God, and it just adds another layer to that whole mess. A. Alvarez I keep stumbling across these instances of suicide driven by religious beliefs while I'm digging through various biographies. It's heavy stuff, honestly. I guess when you look at how deeply people tie their entire identity to their faith, the psychological fallout can be pretty intense if things go sideways. Maybe it’s just part of the human condition, but seeing it written out in someone's life story really makes you stop and think. C. G. Jung Looking back, it seems like his father’s passing was preceded by these really intense, constant arguments between them over religious stuff. It makes you wonder, though—how do you actually pinpoint which specific parts of a religious system are causing the friction versus what’s actually providing support? Like, how do you tease apart the components that create negative vibes from the ones that offer genuine comfort? There are so many different factors at play in that whole dynamic, so I guess I'm just looking for some more concrete examples to wrap my head around it.

Keith Jones76 said:Belief, in a general sense, can act as a protective buffer for mental health, but it can also weigh heavily on the psyche and increase the likelihood of psychological issues. In some cases, it might even serve as a symptom of an existing condition. What actually matters is the substance of what one believes, rather than whether they follow a specific formal religion or any other organized creed. The same logic applies to atheists—claiming God doesn't exist is just another form of dogma.

cosmictinker21 said:I suppose I should probably add something here... though I'm not entirely sure if there's much left to say after everything that's been laid out... maybe just some small observations as they occur to me...
Let's just set aside that old coke addict and his weird obsession with his own cousin for a second—though I can already hear the inevitable jump at me for trying to mix a guy's messy personal life with his scientific contributions...🤣Back then, neurology, biochemistry, and pharmacology were barely scratching the surface compared to what we have now. Looking at those works through a modern lens—nearly 80 years after they were actually put together—it’s clear how much we’ve since discovered, recorded, and mastered. Those incredible books really just serve as early blueprints for the scientific theories and practices we rely on today... If you want to dive deeper, check out some of the older threads on this; kokain najts has a pretty solid handle on the subject.