Angela Rogers2 said:hm. yeah. because they're—trash. I don't know exactly how old you were back in '91, but let's say a friend of mine had to head over to D.C. for a few months so he wouldn't get drafted; his parents' neighbors, who were actually pretty decent, high-profile people, treated them like they were some kind of radical insurgents just because the kid "went to the capital and blah blah blah." Another acquaintance started a spiritual career with the Jehovah's Witnesses in the early '90s; his family kicked him out because they were devout Catholics and he was a "cultist"... you can find so many examples where people start acting like animals because of deep-seated feelings like nationalism, religion, or political ideology. And the saddest part is, it has nothing to do with intellect or social class; the people driven by these (in my opinion, low) passions are often doctors and truck drivers alike.
If some super-alien shows up, well, if it's what you suggested, I won't have anything to complain about. Facts are facts. If we're small, pathetic, and miserable to them, then it's perfectly fine for them to treat us that way.
Agree to what, exactly? I don't follow.
It's not a matter of intelligence; it's about common sense, suggestibility, and using the frontal lobe of your brain.
Opinions don't really carry much weight, mostly because people are experts at lying to themselves and rationalizing their own nonsense. Actions are what actually tell the truth, so behavior is the only thing that really matters. It’s the only honest metric for a person's quality and the life they’re actually leading. As for that hypnotic state you see within a mob, I guess there are a few key traits. First, an individual inside a crowd gets this sense of overwhelming power, which basically gives them a free pass to surrender to impulses they’d normally keep under control—you know, the typical "us versus them" mentality, or those sweeping generalizations about certain groups of people being inferior or whatever. You can apply that same logic to religion or political ideologies, too. Second, there’s the contagion factor. Every single action and emotion creates a sort of collective orientation, often leading an individual to sacrifice their own interests just to serve the herd. That goes against basic human nature, or at least how most people act when they aren't being swept up. And then, of course, there's suggestibility. I suppose you could conclude that the majority is almost always intellectually inferior to the individual. I don't want to sound entirely negative, since humans are social creatures and we all belong to some kind of group, but given how these groups orient themselves, their characteristics can be incredibly destructive. No matter how many lofty moral ideals a mob claims to stand for, their actual behavior rarely lives up to the rhetoric.
So, I don't really get why everyone's getting so worked up about this. I mean, isn't it pretty obvious that anyone could see themselves in something like Narcissistic Personality Disorder or Borderline? Maybe you just aren't grasping what's being said here, or maybe you're just skimming the surface.
I keep saying this, but it isn't about what you say; it's about what you actually do. For instance, if you claim to be an atheist and don't care what some priest says, fine, I don't either. But the issue here is our country; the church still wields an authority it simply shouldn't have, and it shouldn't be exploiting its 24/7 direct line to God for its own interests, yet that's exactly what's happening.
It isn't even that radical—we aren't living in the 1800s—but it happens through small steps, like subtle sermons and whatnot. They plant an opinion in the head of the average person, who then just repeats it in some casual, bar-room logic. Tomorrow, they'll raise their kid under the guise of passive aggression disguised as God, karma, angels, or demons. And yeah, I guess I could say that disturbs me, to a certain extent, depending on how much I feel like participating in this society. I won't even get into what creationists and cults are up to, or what Islam does... religion definitely causes a lot of harm, but whatever someone cursed two hundred years ago doesn't change the facts today.
We've had two centuries of technological progress to end up sitting in front of computers talking to each other, but when it comes to how the average person actually behaves, very little has really changed.
I think I get what you're getting at with Orwell. And yeah, I've read him; Animal Farm actually stuck with me a bit more, but that's beside the point.
And of course, I'm aware of all that, and it's not a small thing. I used to write about religion—about how it limits the individual, intruding on privacy and freedom through various norms, regulations, and laws. You end up feeling sanctioned from every direction.
But on the flip side, criticism, discussion, and analysis of any social, political, or sociological event are allowed. That's how dogmatic, sweeping opinions and beliefs eventually fade away (slowly, but hopefully in the long run), which is good. In the long term, people shouldn't rely on the prestige of some ideology, religion, or social structure, but rather on what they can actually see happening right in front of them.
That's my somewhat optimistic take, anyway, though the masses remain a problematic bunch.
So, if 1984 actually happens, don't ask why.
And sorry for the long off-topic rant. 🙂
What would you actually do if your child became a sympathizer of a Nazi regime, for example? Don't get me wrong—I'm not trying to compare Jehovah's Witnesses to Nazis here. It's strictly about your own feelings and your stance. Could you truly love a son who was obsessed with Hitler? To make things even more interesting, let's say he isn't doing anything terrible. He isn't out there fighting people, stealing, or bullying anyone (and certainly nothing worse). He just hangs pictures of Hitler on his wall and talks about how he was a fantastic man with perfectly righteous views. 😬
How would you react?
Angela Rogers2 said:hm. yeah. because they're—trash. I don't know exactly how old you were back in '91, but let's say a friend of mine had to head over to D.C. for a few months so he wouldn't get drafted; his parents' neighbors, who were actually pretty decent, high-profile people, treated them like they were some kind of radical insurgents just because the kid "went to the capital and blah blah blah." Another acquaintance started a spiritual career with the Jehovah's Witnesses in the early '90s; his family kicked him out because they were devout Catholics and he was a "cultist"... you can find so many examples where people start acting like animals because of deep-seated feelings like nationalism, religion, or political ideology. And the saddest part is, it has nothing to do with intellect or social class; the people driven by these (in my opinion, low) passions are often doctors and truck drivers alike.
If some super-alien shows up, well, if it's what you suggested, I won't have anything to complain about. Facts are facts. If we're small, pathetic, and miserable to them, then it's perfectly fine for them to treat us that way.
Agree to what, exactly? I don't follow.
It's not a matter of intelligence; it's about common sense, suggestibility, and using the frontal lobe of your brain.
Opinions don't really carry much weight, mostly because people are experts at lying to themselves and rationalizing their own nonsense. Actions are what actually tell the truth, so behavior is the only thing that really matters. It’s the only honest metric for a person's quality and the life they’re actually leading. As for that hypnotic state you see within a mob, I guess there are a few key traits. First, an individual inside a crowd gets this sense of overwhelming power, which basically gives them a free pass to surrender to impulses they’d normally keep under control—you know, the typical "us versus them" mentality, or those sweeping generalizations about certain groups of people being inferior or whatever. You can apply that same logic to religion or political ideologies, too. Second, there’s the contagion factor. Every single action and emotion creates a sort of collective orientation, often leading an individual to sacrifice their own interests just to serve the herd. That goes against basic human nature, or at least how most people act when they aren't being swept up. And then, of course, there's suggestibility. I suppose you could conclude that the majority is almost always intellectually inferior to the individual. I don't want to sound entirely negative, since humans are social creatures and we all belong to some kind of group, but given how these groups orient themselves, their characteristics can be incredibly destructive. No matter how many lofty moral ideals a mob claims to stand for, their actual behavior rarely lives up to the rhetoric.
So, I don't really get why everyone's getting so worked up about this. I mean, isn't it pretty obvious that anyone could see themselves in something like Narcissistic Personality Disorder or Borderline? Maybe you just aren't grasping what's being said here, or maybe you're just skimming the surface.
I keep saying this, but it isn't about what you say; it's about what you actually do. For instance, if you claim to be an atheist and don't care what some priest says, fine, I don't either. But the issue here is our country; the church still wields an authority it simply shouldn't have, and it shouldn't be exploiting its 24/7 direct line to God for its own interests, yet that's exactly what's happening.
It isn't even that radical—we aren't living in the 1800s—but it happens through small steps, like subtle sermons and whatnot. They plant an opinion in the head of the average person, who then just repeats it in some casual, bar-room logic. Tomorrow, they'll raise their kid under the guise of passive aggression disguised as God, karma, angels, or demons. And yeah, I guess I could say that disturbs me, to a certain extent, depending on how much I feel like participating in this society. I won't even get into what creationists and cults are up to, or what Islam does... religion definitely causes a lot of harm, but whatever someone cursed two hundred years ago doesn't change the facts today.
We've had two centuries of technological progress to end up sitting in front of computers talking to each other, but when it comes to how the average person actually behaves, very little has really changed.
I think I get what you're getting at with Orwell. And yeah, I've read him; Animal Farm actually stuck with me a bit more, but that's beside the point.
And of course, I'm aware of all that, and it's not a small thing. I used to write about religion—about how it limits the individual, intruding on privacy and freedom through various norms, regulations, and laws. You end up feeling sanctioned from every direction.
But on the flip side, criticism, discussion, and analysis of any social, political, or sociological event are allowed. That's how dogmatic, sweeping opinions and beliefs eventually fade away (slowly, but hopefully in the long run), which is good. In the long term, people shouldn't rely on the prestige of some ideology, religion, or social structure, but rather on what they can actually see happening right in front of them.
That's my somewhat optimistic take, anyway, though the masses remain a problematic bunch.
So, if 1984 actually happens, don't ask why.
And sorry for the long off-topic rant. 🙂
I refuse to ever take that kind of stance—that "us versus them" mentality where one group is "elite" and the other is "scum." Honestly, that's probably because of the Nationalist Party. For me, it's not enough to just be part of an elite; I want the elite to be beneath me. 🤣
Angela Rogers2 said:hm. yeah. because they're—trash. I don't know exactly how old you were back in '91, but let's say a friend of mine had to head over to D.C. for a few months so he wouldn't get drafted; his parents' neighbors, who were actually pretty decent, high-profile people, treated them like they were some kind of radical insurgents just because the kid "went to the capital and blah blah blah." Another acquaintance started a spiritual career with the Jehovah's Witnesses in the early '90s; his family kicked him out because they were devout Catholics and he was a "cultist"... you can find so many examples where people start acting like animals because of deep-seated feelings like nationalism, religion, or political ideology. And the saddest part is, it has nothing to do with intellect or social class; the people driven by these (in my opinion, low) passions are often doctors and truck drivers alike.
If some super-alien shows up, well, if it's what you suggested, I won't have anything to complain about. Facts are facts. If we're small, pathetic, and miserable to them, then it's perfectly fine for them to treat us that way.
Agree to what, exactly? I don't follow.
It's not a matter of intelligence; it's about common sense, suggestibility, and using the frontal lobe of your brain.
Opinions don't really carry much weight, mostly because people are experts at lying to themselves and rationalizing their own nonsense. Actions are what actually tell the truth, so behavior is the only thing that really matters. It’s the only honest metric for a person's quality and the life they’re actually leading. As for that hypnotic state you see within a mob, I guess there are a few key traits. First, an individual inside a crowd gets this sense of overwhelming power, which basically gives them a free pass to surrender to impulses they’d normally keep under control—you know, the typical "us versus them" mentality, or those sweeping generalizations about certain groups of people being inferior or whatever. You can apply that same logic to religion or political ideologies, too. Second, there’s the contagion factor. Every single action and emotion creates a sort of collective orientation, often leading an individual to sacrifice their own interests just to serve the herd. That goes against basic human nature, or at least how most people act when they aren't being swept up. And then, of course, there's suggestibility. I suppose you could conclude that the majority is almost always intellectually inferior to the individual. I don't want to sound entirely negative, since humans are social creatures and we all belong to some kind of group, but given how these groups orient themselves, their characteristics can be incredibly destructive. No matter how many lofty moral ideals a mob claims to stand for, their actual behavior rarely lives up to the rhetoric.
So, I don't really get why everyone's getting so worked up about this. I mean, isn't it pretty obvious that anyone could see themselves in something like Narcissistic Personality Disorder or Borderline? Maybe you just aren't grasping what's being said here, or maybe you're just skimming the surface.
I keep saying this, but it isn't about what you say; it's about what you actually do. For instance, if you claim to be an atheist and don't care what some priest says, fine, I don't either. But the issue here is our country; the church still wields an authority it simply shouldn't have, and it shouldn't be exploiting its 24/7 direct line to God for its own interests, yet that's exactly what's happening.
It isn't even that radical—we aren't living in the 1800s—but it happens through small steps, like subtle sermons and whatnot. They plant an opinion in the head of the average person, who then just repeats it in some casual, bar-room logic. Tomorrow, they'll raise their kid under the guise of passive aggression disguised as God, karma, angels, or demons. And yeah, I guess I could say that disturbs me, to a certain extent, depending on how much I feel like participating in this society. I won't even get into what creationists and cults are up to, or what Islam does... religion definitely causes a lot of harm, but whatever someone cursed two hundred years ago doesn't change the facts today.
We've had two centuries of technological progress to end up sitting in front of computers talking to each other, but when it comes to how the average person actually behaves, very little has really changed.
I think I get what you're getting at with Orwell. And yeah, I've read him; Animal Farm actually stuck with me a bit more, but that's beside the point.
And of course, I'm aware of all that, and it's not a small thing. I used to write about religion—about how it limits the individual, intruding on privacy and freedom through various norms, regulations, and laws. You end up feeling sanctioned from every direction.
But on the flip side, criticism, discussion, and analysis of any social, political, or sociological event are allowed. That's how dogmatic, sweeping opinions and beliefs eventually fade away (slowly, but hopefully in the long run), which is good. In the long term, people shouldn't rely on the prestige of some ideology, religion, or social structure, but rather on what they can actually see happening right in front of them.
That's my somewhat optimistic take, anyway, though the masses remain a problematic bunch.
So, if 1984 actually happens, don't ask why.
And sorry for the long off-topic rant. 🙂
Can that also be applied to something like a Love Parade or massive pop/rock concerts? Like Woodstock, for example? Since we're discussing the psychology of large crowds and losing inhibitions...
Angela Rogers2 said:hm. yeah. because they're—trash. I don't know exactly how old you were back in '91, but let's say a friend of mine had to head over to D.C. for a few months so he wouldn't get drafted; his parents' neighbors, who were actually pretty decent, high-profile people, treated them like they were some kind of radical insurgents just because the kid "went to the capital and blah blah blah." Another acquaintance started a spiritual career with the Jehovah's Witnesses in the early '90s; his family kicked him out because they were devout Catholics and he was a "cultist"... you can find so many examples where people start acting like animals because of deep-seated feelings like nationalism, religion, or political ideology. And the saddest part is, it has nothing to do with intellect or social class; the people driven by these (in my opinion, low) passions are often doctors and truck drivers alike.
If some super-alien shows up, well, if it's what you suggested, I won't have anything to complain about. Facts are facts. If we're small, pathetic, and miserable to them, then it's perfectly fine for them to treat us that way.
Agree to what, exactly? I don't follow.
It's not a matter of intelligence; it's about common sense, suggestibility, and using the frontal lobe of your brain.
Opinions don't really carry much weight, mostly because people are experts at lying to themselves and rationalizing their own nonsense. Actions are what actually tell the truth, so behavior is the only thing that really matters. It’s the only honest metric for a person's quality and the life they’re actually leading. As for that hypnotic state you see within a mob, I guess there are a few key traits. First, an individual inside a crowd gets this sense of overwhelming power, which basically gives them a free pass to surrender to impulses they’d normally keep under control—you know, the typical "us versus them" mentality, or those sweeping generalizations about certain groups of people being inferior or whatever. You can apply that same logic to religion or political ideologies, too. Second, there’s the contagion factor. Every single action and emotion creates a sort of collective orientation, often leading an individual to sacrifice their own interests just to serve the herd. That goes against basic human nature, or at least how most people act when they aren't being swept up. And then, of course, there's suggestibility. I suppose you could conclude that the majority is almost always intellectually inferior to the individual. I don't want to sound entirely negative, since humans are social creatures and we all belong to some kind of group, but given how these groups orient themselves, their characteristics can be incredibly destructive. No matter how many lofty moral ideals a mob claims to stand for, their actual behavior rarely lives up to the rhetoric.
So, I don't really get why everyone's getting so worked up about this. I mean, isn't it pretty obvious that anyone could see themselves in something like Narcissistic Personality Disorder or Borderline? Maybe you just aren't grasping what's being said here, or maybe you're just skimming the surface.
I keep saying this, but it isn't about what you say; it's about what you actually do. For instance, if you claim to be an atheist and don't care what some priest says, fine, I don't either. But the issue here is our country; the church still wields an authority it simply shouldn't have, and it shouldn't be exploiting its 24/7 direct line to God for its own interests, yet that's exactly what's happening.
It isn't even that radical—we aren't living in the 1800s—but it happens through small steps, like subtle sermons and whatnot. They plant an opinion in the head of the average person, who then just repeats it in some casual, bar-room logic. Tomorrow, they'll raise their kid under the guise of passive aggression disguised as God, karma, angels, or demons. And yeah, I guess I could say that disturbs me, to a certain extent, depending on how much I feel like participating in this society. I won't even get into what creationists and cults are up to, or what Islam does... religion definitely causes a lot of harm, but whatever someone cursed two hundred years ago doesn't change the facts today.
We've had two centuries of technological progress to end up sitting in front of computers talking to each other, but when it comes to how the average person actually behaves, very little has really changed.
I think I get what you're getting at with Orwell. And yeah, I've read him; Animal Farm actually stuck with me a bit more, but that's beside the point.
And of course, I'm aware of all that, and it's not a small thing. I used to write about religion—about how it limits the individual, intruding on privacy and freedom through various norms, regulations, and laws. You end up feeling sanctioned from every direction.
But on the flip side, criticism, discussion, and analysis of any social, political, or sociological event are allowed. That's how dogmatic, sweeping opinions and beliefs eventually fade away (slowly, but hopefully in the long run), which is good. In the long term, people shouldn't rely on the prestige of some ideology, religion, or social structure, but rather on what they can actually see happening right in front of them.
That's my somewhat optimistic take, anyway, though the masses remain a problematic bunch.
So, if 1984 actually happens, don't ask why.
And sorry for the long off-topic rant. 🙂
I don't know a single person whose behavior is truly consistent. To be honest, I can't even say the same for myself. My own actions are incredibly inconsistent, and there are times when I feel completely irrational.
When it comes to intelligence and the inherent differences between people, you’re making a mistake if you think that observation is strictly objective. It’s an undeniable fact that some individuals are more intellectually advanced than others. But why dwell on that gap? Even if you consider yourself intellectually superior to your most primitive neighbor, the distance between you and him is still microscopic compared to the massive divide between him and the next smartest animal on Earth. So, why focus on our differences when we should be looking at our similarities?
Aren't you making the Same Type of mistake made by those who hate, despise, or look down on someone based solely on their nationality, religion, or skin color? You might argue that intelligence is far more significant than any of those factors—and you might even be right—but the logical analogy remains just as valid. To him, it matters more that one person lives on the left side of the Mississippi while the other lives on the right, rather than the simple fact that they are both human beings. To you, it matters more that one is an intellectual and the other is a bumpkin. 😬It’s not about that, really—it’s simply because they are both human beings.
"Quote:"
Angela Rogers2 said:hm. yeah. because they're—trash. I don't know exactly how old you were back in '91, but let's say a friend of mine had to head over to D.C. for a few months so he wouldn't get drafted; his parents' neighbors, who were actually pretty decent, high-profile people, treated them like they were some kind of radical insurgents just because the kid "went to the capital and blah blah blah." Another acquaintance started a spiritual career with the Jehovah's Witnesses in the early '90s; his family kicked him out because they were devout Catholics and he was a "cultist"... you can find so many examples where people start acting like animals because of deep-seated feelings like nationalism, religion, or political ideology. And the saddest part is, it has nothing to do with intellect or social class; the people driven by these (in my opinion, low) passions are often doctors and truck drivers alike.
If some super-alien shows up, well, if it's what you suggested, I won't have anything to complain about. Facts are facts. If we're small, pathetic, and miserable to them, then it's perfectly fine for them to treat us that way.
Agree to what, exactly? I don't follow.
It's not a matter of intelligence; it's about common sense, suggestibility, and using the frontal lobe of your brain.
Opinions don't really carry much weight, mostly because people are experts at lying to themselves and rationalizing their own nonsense. Actions are what actually tell the truth, so behavior is the only thing that really matters. It’s the only honest metric for a person's quality and the life they’re actually leading. As for that hypnotic state you see within a mob, I guess there are a few key traits. First, an individual inside a crowd gets this sense of overwhelming power, which basically gives them a free pass to surrender to impulses they’d normally keep under control—you know, the typical "us versus them" mentality, or those sweeping generalizations about certain groups of people being inferior or whatever. You can apply that same logic to religion or political ideologies, too. Second, there’s the contagion factor. Every single action and emotion creates a sort of collective orientation, often leading an individual to sacrifice their own interests just to serve the herd. That goes against basic human nature, or at least how most people act when they aren't being swept up. And then, of course, there's suggestibility. I suppose you could conclude that the majority is almost always intellectually inferior to the individual. I don't want to sound entirely negative, since humans are social creatures and we all belong to some kind of group, but given how these groups orient themselves, their characteristics can be incredibly destructive. No matter how many lofty moral ideals a mob claims to stand for, their actual behavior rarely lives up to the rhetoric.
So, I don't really get why everyone's getting so worked up about this. I mean, isn't it pretty obvious that anyone could see themselves in something like Narcissistic Personality Disorder or Borderline? Maybe you just aren't grasping what's being said here, or maybe you're just skimming the surface.
I keep saying this, but it isn't about what you say; it's about what you actually do. For instance, if you claim to be an atheist and don't care what some priest says, fine, I don't either. But the issue here is our country; the church still wields an authority it simply shouldn't have, and it shouldn't be exploiting its 24/7 direct line to God for its own interests, yet that's exactly what's happening.
It isn't even that radical—we aren't living in the 1800s—but it happens through small steps, like subtle sermons and whatnot. They plant an opinion in the head of the average person, who then just repeats it in some casual, bar-room logic. Tomorrow, they'll raise their kid under the guise of passive aggression disguised as God, karma, angels, or demons. And yeah, I guess I could say that disturbs me, to a certain extent, depending on how much I feel like participating in this society. I won't even get into what creationists and cults are up to, or what Islam does... religion definitely causes a lot of harm, but whatever someone cursed two hundred years ago doesn't change the facts today.
We've had two centuries of technological progress to end up sitting in front of computers talking to each other, but when it comes to how the average person actually behaves, very little has really changed.
I think I get what you're getting at with Orwell. And yeah, I've read him; Animal Farm actually stuck with me a bit more, but that's beside the point.
And of course, I'm aware of all that, and it's not a small thing. I used to write about religion—about how it limits the individual, intruding on privacy and freedom through various norms, regulations, and laws. You end up feeling sanctioned from every direction.
But on the flip side, criticism, discussion, and analysis of any social, political, or sociological event are allowed. That's how dogmatic, sweeping opinions and beliefs eventually fade away (slowly, but hopefully in the long run), which is good. In the long term, people shouldn't rely on the prestige of some ideology, religion, or social structure, but rather on what they can actually see happening right in front of them.
That's my somewhat optimistic take, anyway, though the masses remain a problematic bunch.
So, if 1984 actually happens, don't ask why.
And sorry for the long off-topic rant. 🙂
What kind of nonsense are you talking about? Here, take a look at this Wikipedia entry:
Narcissistic personality disorder is a complex issue that often gets misunderstood in casual conversation. While people frequently throw the term around to describe anyone acting selfishly, true NPD is a deep-seated psychological pattern involving a pervasive need for admiration and a profound lack of empathy. It’s more than just being "full of yourself"; it's a fundamental struggle with identity and how one relates to the world. Understanding the distinction between simple ego and a clinical disorder is crucial for anyone trying to navigate these difficult dynamics.
He carries himself with a massive sense of self-importance.
The second sign is often lost in a dream world, constantly chasing visions of limitless success, absolute power, or some kind of flawless, idealized love.
They truly believe they’re one of a kind—some sort of rare breed that only their own "special" circle could ever hope to understand.
4. demands far too much praise.
5. A deep sense of entitlement.
6. They'll step over anyone just to get what they want.
7. A total lack of empathy.
Number eight on the list is that tendency to live in a state of constant envy—or, just as frequently, the assumption that everyone else is looking at you with envy. It’s a bit of a cycle, isn't it? Whether they're coveting what someone else has or convinced that their own success has made them a target for jealousy, it creates this restless, defensive mindset.
9. Arrogance.
Antisocial personality disorder is a complex diagnosis that often gets misunderstood in casual conversation. It isn't just about being "rebellious" or having a bit of an attitude; it’s a deep-seated pattern of disregarding the rights of others and failing to conform to social norms. When we talk about this, we have to look past the Hollywood stereotypes and focus on the clinical reality of how these individuals interact with the world around them.
It’s basically when someone just refuses to play by the rules. They repeatedly engage in behavior that's clearly against the law, essentially showing a total disregard for social norms through actions that would get anyone else arrested on the spot.
Deceitfulness—whether it’s through constant lying, hiding behind fake identities, or running scams just to line your pockets or satisfy an ego—is a serious issue. It’s more than just being dishonest; it's about intentional manipulation for personal gain.
3. Impulsivity, or simply failing to look before you leap.
4. Irritability and aggression, specifically when it manifests through frequent physical altercations or assaults.
5. Reckless disregard for the safety of oneself or others.
It really comes down to a pattern of consistent irresponsibility—the kind that shows up when someone repeatedly fails to maintain a steady work ethic or simply refuses to honor their financial commitments.
7. A total lack of remorse. This shows up when someone is completely indifferent to the pain they've caused, or worse, they start making excuses for why hurting, mistreating, or stealing from someone else was actually justified.
Do you feel like none of this actually describes you? Personally, I can only see myself in maybe two or three points of the first one, and maybe three or four of the second. 🤷
"Quote:"
Angela Rogers2 said:hm. yeah. because they're—trash. I don't know exactly how old you were back in '91, but let's say a friend of mine had to head over to D.C. for a few months so he wouldn't get drafted; his parents' neighbors, who were actually pretty decent, high-profile people, treated them like they were some kind of radical insurgents just because the kid "went to the capital and blah blah blah." Another acquaintance started a spiritual career with the Jehovah's Witnesses in the early '90s; his family kicked him out because they were devout Catholics and he was a "cultist"... you can find so many examples where people start acting like animals because of deep-seated feelings like nationalism, religion, or political ideology. And the saddest part is, it has nothing to do with intellect or social class; the people driven by these (in my opinion, low) passions are often doctors and truck drivers alike.
If some super-alien shows up, well, if it's what you suggested, I won't have anything to complain about. Facts are facts. If we're small, pathetic, and miserable to them, then it's perfectly fine for them to treat us that way.
Agree to what, exactly? I don't follow.
It's not a matter of intelligence; it's about common sense, suggestibility, and using the frontal lobe of your brain.
Opinions don't really carry much weight, mostly because people are experts at lying to themselves and rationalizing their own nonsense. Actions are what actually tell the truth, so behavior is the only thing that really matters. It’s the only honest metric for a person's quality and the life they’re actually leading. As for that hypnotic state you see within a mob, I guess there are a few key traits. First, an individual inside a crowd gets this sense of overwhelming power, which basically gives them a free pass to surrender to impulses they’d normally keep under control—you know, the typical "us versus them" mentality, or those sweeping generalizations about certain groups of people being inferior or whatever. You can apply that same logic to religion or political ideologies, too. Second, there’s the contagion factor. Every single action and emotion creates a sort of collective orientation, often leading an individual to sacrifice their own interests just to serve the herd. That goes against basic human nature, or at least how most people act when they aren't being swept up. And then, of course, there's suggestibility. I suppose you could conclude that the majority is almost always intellectually inferior to the individual. I don't want to sound entirely negative, since humans are social creatures and we all belong to some kind of group, but given how these groups orient themselves, their characteristics can be incredibly destructive. No matter how many lofty moral ideals a mob claims to stand for, their actual behavior rarely lives up to the rhetoric.
So, I don't really get why everyone's getting so worked up about this. I mean, isn't it pretty obvious that anyone could see themselves in something like Narcissistic Personality Disorder or Borderline? Maybe you just aren't grasping what's being said here, or maybe you're just skimming the surface.
I keep saying this, but it isn't about what you say; it's about what you actually do. For instance, if you claim to be an atheist and don't care what some priest says, fine, I don't either. But the issue here is our country; the church still wields an authority it simply shouldn't have, and it shouldn't be exploiting its 24/7 direct line to God for its own interests, yet that's exactly what's happening.
It isn't even that radical—we aren't living in the 1800s—but it happens through small steps, like subtle sermons and whatnot. They plant an opinion in the head of the average person, who then just repeats it in some casual, bar-room logic. Tomorrow, they'll raise their kid under the guise of passive aggression disguised as God, karma, angels, or demons. And yeah, I guess I could say that disturbs me, to a certain extent, depending on how much I feel like participating in this society. I won't even get into what creationists and cults are up to, or what Islam does... religion definitely causes a lot of harm, but whatever someone cursed two hundred years ago doesn't change the facts today.
We've had two centuries of technological progress to end up sitting in front of computers talking to each other, but when it comes to how the average person actually behaves, very little has really changed.
I think I get what you're getting at with Orwell. And yeah, I've read him; Animal Farm actually stuck with me a bit more, but that's beside the point.
And of course, I'm aware of all that, and it's not a small thing. I used to write about religion—about how it limits the individual, intruding on privacy and freedom through various norms, regulations, and laws. You end up feeling sanctioned from every direction.
But on the flip side, criticism, discussion, and analysis of any social, political, or sociological event are allowed. That's how dogmatic, sweeping opinions and beliefs eventually fade away (slowly, but hopefully in the long run), which is good. In the long term, people shouldn't rely on the prestige of some ideology, religion, or social structure, but rather on what they can actually see happening right in front of them.
That's my somewhat optimistic take, anyway, though the masses remain a problematic bunch.
So, if 1984 actually happens, don't ask why.
And sorry for the long off-topic rant. 🙂
What exactly are they doing? And do you actually know how? Is this based on actual field research, or are you just taking someone else's word for it? Honestly, if you could point to specific sources to back up what you claim to know, that would be one thing. But I suspect you can’t quite do that—feel free to correct me if I'm wrong—you just "know," without being able to explain how. Here is my take: if I can't pinpoint exactly where a piece of information comes from, I don't consider it knowledge. Period. I need to know precisely what I am leaning on at any given moment. Who am I implicitly trusting just to keep this supposed "knowledge" standing? It matters, because in this day and age, it is incredibly easy to mistake a lie for the truth.
Furthermore, what kind of authority does the church actually hold? Personally, I don't see any at all. You claim that such authority doesn't belong to them, and honestly, I’d agree—if you could just tell me who that authority *does* belong to. Is it politicians? Psychiatrists? Wealthy merchants? Judges? Lawyers? Most of those people are capable of exerting a far more direct influence on my life than any religious institution ever could. Can you give me one practical example of what would actually be different in your life if this unearned clerical authority didn't exist?
"Quote:"
Angela Rogers2 Asks:
You take an average, mindless follower and plant a seed of opinion in their head. From there, they just run with it, fueled by that typical small-town, barroom logic. Before you know it, they’re raising their own kids under a heavy blanket of passive-aggression, disguised as God, karma, angels, or demons. To be honest, it disturbs me—at least to the extent that I still have to participate in this society. I won't even get started on the damage done by creationists, cults, or radical religious movements. Religion, quite frankly, does a massive amount of evil in this world. |
Let’s be honest: a lot of "evil" has been done under the wing of religion. I put "evil" in quotes because, frankly, I’m not even sure what defines it anymore. One thing that really bugs me about organized religion is how easily people label things as "evil," as if they're just discussing onions and water. If we throw that word around so carelessly, what’s even the point of using it? That part isn't up for debate. But look at the reality today—even in highly religious nations, you see things happening that most of the West moved past centuries ago.
If I were living in Baghdad, maybe all this would bother me. But since religion has zero impact on my day-to-day life, I honestly couldn't care less about the topic. What actually concerns me are situations like yours and Tanya's. It’s wild when someone gets so obsessed with religious debates that they fail to see how those institutions lost their grip on American society ages ago, leaving other structures to take the lead.
Angela Rogers2 said:hm. yeah. because they're—trash. I don't know exactly how old you were back in '91, but let's say a friend of mine had to head over to D.C. for a few months so he wouldn't get drafted; his parents' neighbors, who were actually pretty decent, high-profile people, treated them like they were some kind of radical insurgents just because the kid "went to the capital and blah blah blah." Another acquaintance started a spiritual career with the Jehovah's Witnesses in the early '90s; his family kicked him out because they were devout Catholics and he was a "cultist"... you can find so many examples where people start acting like animals because of deep-seated feelings like nationalism, religion, or political ideology. And the saddest part is, it has nothing to do with intellect or social class; the people driven by these (in my opinion, low) passions are often doctors and truck drivers alike.
If some super-alien shows up, well, if it's what you suggested, I won't have anything to complain about. Facts are facts. If we're small, pathetic, and miserable to them, then it's perfectly fine for them to treat us that way.
Agree to what, exactly? I don't follow.
It's not a matter of intelligence; it's about common sense, suggestibility, and using the frontal lobe of your brain.
Opinions don't really carry much weight, mostly because people are experts at lying to themselves and rationalizing their own nonsense. Actions are what actually tell the truth, so behavior is the only thing that really matters. It’s the only honest metric for a person's quality and the life they’re actually leading. As for that hypnotic state you see within a mob, I guess there are a few key traits. First, an individual inside a crowd gets this sense of overwhelming power, which basically gives them a free pass to surrender to impulses they’d normally keep under control—you know, the typical "us versus them" mentality, or those sweeping generalizations about certain groups of people being inferior or whatever. You can apply that same logic to religion or political ideologies, too. Second, there’s the contagion factor. Every single action and emotion creates a sort of collective orientation, often leading an individual to sacrifice their own interests just to serve the herd. That goes against basic human nature, or at least how most people act when they aren't being swept up. And then, of course, there's suggestibility. I suppose you could conclude that the majority is almost always intellectually inferior to the individual. I don't want to sound entirely negative, since humans are social creatures and we all belong to some kind of group, but given how these groups orient themselves, their characteristics can be incredibly destructive. No matter how many lofty moral ideals a mob claims to stand for, their actual behavior rarely lives up to the rhetoric.
So, I don't really get why everyone's getting so worked up about this. I mean, isn't it pretty obvious that anyone could see themselves in something like Narcissistic Personality Disorder or Borderline? Maybe you just aren't grasping what's being said here, or maybe you're just skimming the surface.
I keep saying this, but it isn't about what you say; it's about what you actually do. For instance, if you claim to be an atheist and don't care what some priest says, fine, I don't either. But the issue here is our country; the church still wields an authority it simply shouldn't have, and it shouldn't be exploiting its 24/7 direct line to God for its own interests, yet that's exactly what's happening.
It isn't even that radical—we aren't living in the 1800s—but it happens through small steps, like subtle sermons and whatnot. They plant an opinion in the head of the average person, who then just repeats it in some casual, bar-room logic. Tomorrow, they'll raise their kid under the guise of passive aggression disguised as God, karma, angels, or demons. And yeah, I guess I could say that disturbs me, to a certain extent, depending on how much I feel like participating in this society. I won't even get into what creationists and cults are up to, or what Islam does... religion definitely causes a lot of harm, but whatever someone cursed two hundred years ago doesn't change the facts today.
We've had two centuries of technological progress to end up sitting in front of computers talking to each other, but when it comes to how the average person actually behaves, very little has really changed.
I think I get what you're getting at with Orwell. And yeah, I've read him; Animal Farm actually stuck with me a bit more, but that's beside the point.
And of course, I'm aware of all that, and it's not a small thing. I used to write about religion—about how it limits the individual, intruding on privacy and freedom through various norms, regulations, and laws. You end up feeling sanctioned from every direction.
But on the flip side, criticism, discussion, and analysis of any social, political, or sociological event are allowed. That's how dogmatic, sweeping opinions and beliefs eventually fade away (slowly, but hopefully in the long run), which is good. In the long term, people shouldn't rely on the prestige of some ideology, religion, or social structure, but rather on what they can actually see happening right in front of them.
That's my somewhat optimistic take, anyway, though the masses remain a problematic bunch.
So, if 1984 actually happens, don't ask why.
And sorry for the long off-topic rant. 🙂
See, I’m not quite that much of an optimist. Based on certain things I've seen, I feel like if today's religious structures were to disappear, new mechanisms would simply emerge to keep the masses in line. Take popular Hollywood teen dramas, for example. If you watch all the trending shows, you quickly learn what you can and cannot say or even think; you learn which behaviors are acceptable and which will push you to the fringes of society. It's a very effective way of socializing people.
Anyway, sorry for the long-winded tangent. We totally veered off track. Let me try to get back to the point: no, I don't believe psychology can do all that much to help with men-and-women relationships. 😁 Then again, since I haven't tested that theory personally, who knows? I might be wrong.
