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Lost in space

Started by Raymond Martin25 · · 👁 7 views · 86 replies

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Participants Raymond Martin25Sandra Ross27quietpilot87wearyowl29Jonathan Reyes6silentpilot6Nicholas Booth4Taylor Campbell4Andrew Jackson83Jonathan Hernandez4mistybisonMorgan Bishop4Jacob Evans49shadowtrucker18Sean Cook2Terry Gray60Linda Gray76Donna Wood52Alexander Taylor48Joshua Green68Walter Grant33Megan Wood12redmarlin3casualharbor9 …
Jeremy Alvarez5 Jeremy Alvarez5 Active Member
165 messages
joined Aug 2010
#81 ·
dustypilot11 said:Don't know about you guys; I didn't deal with any of that trauma. Nobody ever punished me for getting lost, and I wasn't exactly wandering off as a kid. For me, it's just genetic (or so my mom claims). I totally bomb spatial intelligence tests. My other three scores are above average, but that fourth one? Yeah, it sucks. 😁

It's pretty interesting how much weight we give to what our moms think in these discussions. I guess a lot of people "love" their friends or parents by basically just echoing whatever they believe. It creates this weird tension because if you start questioning someone's take on a third party, it might not be the most polite thing to do. You end up seeing those later patterns, like kids growing up singing songs about how they want to be "just like Dad." It’s like this emotional mechanism kicks in and makes decisions for us before our brains even catch up. To actually try and see things differently, you'd first have to admit that your mom—and plenty of others—might actually be wrong. And let's be real, when people aren't right, they don't always love hearing it, and disagreeing often triggers some kind of defensive reaction.

Historically, certain military groups would take boys as young as seven to build their own elite units. Some of the older theories regarding early childhood consciousness suggest a specific way of treating them: just make sure they aren't crying, aren't hungry, and stay still. In some rural areas, infants were swaddled so tightly they could barely move a finger. Now, when you consider the shift from the womb—where everything is warm, there's constant food, the steady rhythm of a heartbeat, familiar voices, and the freedom to move through amniotic fluid—to being suddenly restricted and unable to move, it creates this sense of unease. They're stuck, they're scared, and they haven't even established a baseline for those familiar frequencies or sounds yet... Do you even remember any of that period from when you were an infant or a toddler?

I have a two-and-a-half-year-old daughter, for example. She’s already learned a million things, imitating everything she sees. There are things she’s allowed to do and things that are strictly off-limits—especially trying to run down a steep, slippery hill after she's already slipped once. Since I wouldn't let her, she just flopped onto the ground and threw a massive tantrum, probably because she's used to getting her way most of the time. It's the same with the beach; she wasn't allowed in the water whether it was summer or winter, long before she could even walk, but she wanted to go the second she was mobile because we've made bath time such a big deal at home. During those first few years of life, kids go through way more psycho-mental experiences than they can actually process—which means you can't really know, like most people can't, if you were being punished or how. You just can't be conscious of it. I find it hard to believe that a kid could wander off and somehow escape punishment; I doubt that happens with people who actually raise and watch their children, and honestly, it probably doesn't happen with wolves or lions or any other mammals either.

My takeaway is that because our parents might have had more intense experiences trying to manage kids attempting to wander or explore, they ended up carrying more trauma regarding how they handled infancy. Those traumas then echo through as a sort of emotional imposition on the next generation, which tends to be smaller and raised in environments where they have a bit more freedom to move. That’s why that "intuitive" clash with your earliest authority figure feels so heavy, even if the love for them hasn't faded one bit.
dustypilot11 dustypilot11 Member
33 messages
joined Nov 2010
#82 ·
Jeremy Alvarez5 said:It's pretty interesting how much weight we give to what our moms think in these discussions. I guess a lot of people "love" their friends or parents by basically just echoing whatever they believe. It creates this weird tension because if you start questioning someone's take on a third party, it might not be the most polite thing to do. You end up seeing those later patterns, like kids growing up singing songs about how they want to be "just like Dad." It’s like this emotional mechanism kicks in and makes decisions for us before our brains even catch up. To actually try and see things differently, you'd first have to admit that your mom—and plenty of others—might actually be wrong. And let's be real, when people aren't right, they don't always love hearing it, and disagreeing often triggers some kind of defensive reaction.

Historically, certain military groups would take boys as young as seven to build their own elite units. Some of the older theories regarding early childhood consciousness suggest a specific way of treating them: just make sure they aren't crying, aren't hungry, and stay still. In some rural areas, infants were swaddled so tightly they could barely move a finger. Now, when you consider the shift from the womb—where everything is warm, there's constant food, the steady rhythm of a heartbeat, familiar voices, and the freedom to move through amniotic fluid—to being suddenly restricted and unable to move, it creates this sense of unease. They're stuck, they're scared, and they haven't even established a baseline for those familiar frequencies or sounds yet... Do you even remember any of that period from when you were an infant or a toddler?

I have a two-and-a-half-year-old daughter, for example. She’s already learned a million things, imitating everything she sees. There are things she’s allowed to do and things that are strictly off-limits—especially trying to run down a steep, slippery hill after she's already slipped once. Since I wouldn't let her, she just flopped onto the ground and threw a massive tantrum, probably because she's used to getting her way most of the time. It's the same with the beach; she wasn't allowed in the water whether it was summer or winter, long before she could even walk, but she wanted to go the second she was mobile because we've made bath time such a big deal at home. During those first few years of life, kids go through way more psycho-mental experiences than they can actually process—which means you can't really know, like most people can't, if you were being punished or how. You just can't be conscious of it. I find it hard to believe that a kid could wander off and somehow escape punishment; I doubt that happens with people who actually raise and watch their children, and honestly, it probably doesn't happen with wolves or lions or any other mammals either.

My takeaway is that because our parents might have had more intense experiences trying to manage kids attempting to wander or explore, they ended up carrying more trauma regarding how they handled infancy. Those traumas then echo through as a sort of emotional imposition on the next generation, which tends to be smaller and raised in environments where they have a bit more freedom to move. That’s why that "intuitive" clash with your earliest authority figure feels so heavy, even if the love for them hasn't faded one bit.

Look, I read what you wrote, so do me a favor and actually read what I'm saying if you're gonna reply.
I am nowhere near mentioning my mom's opinion. Or whether she agrees with anything. All I said was that back in college, when I was wondering why I was struggling with stuff, my mom just said, "Well, I'm like that too." That's it.
Sure, adult behavior can stem from childhood, but some people are just born with certain traits.
It's not like I have some mental block holding me back; I just don't have the skill. Like how some people just can't do math, and I can.
I don't buy that you could wander off on your own without getting in trouble. Doesn't happen with good parents, and probably doesn't happen with wolves or lions or any other mammals either.

Maybe you just don't believe it, but that's how it was. 🤷
Times were different back then. I lived in a quiet suburb, hardly any traffic, and kids were just out running around everywhere.

Taylor Smith3 said:I am profoundly directionally challenged, and I don’t believe there is any cure for it. I could visit the exact same location a million times with someone else, yet if they are the one navigating, I simply stop looking at where we are going. If I were tasked with finding that same spot on my own, I would be utterly lost. It is somewhat embarrassing to admit, but I have three aunts living relatively close to one another, and even though I visited them constantly growing up, I wouldn't be able to find their neighborhood alone. I used to find this trait amusing, right up until the moment I started driving. Now, I use my car exclusively for quick trips around the suburbs or when I am accompanied by someone else. While I am actually quite a capable driver, I simply lack the nerve to drive into the heart of the city because I fear getting lost and causing some sort of traffic chaos. Whenever I have to head somewhere unfamiliar, I feel a genuine sense of nausea in my stomach. It offers a small amount of comfort to see how many other people struggle with this same issue, but nonetheless, it remains a persistent and growing source of anxiety for me lately.

Exactly.
Now I only use my car for quick trips around the neighborhood or when someone's driving with me. I'm a decent driver, but I just don't dare drive downtown because I'm terrified of getting lost and causing a massive wreck.

Yeah, not really. 😁
I'm getting out of here, period. I refuse to just sit around acting like a victim. At least I can tell myself there's definitely people doing worse than me 😁
Jeremy Alvarez5 Jeremy Alvarez5 Active Member
165 messages
joined Aug 2010
#83 ·
dustypilot11 said:Look, I read what you wrote, so do me a favor and actually read what I'm saying if you're gonna reply.
I am nowhere near mentioning my mom's opinion. Or whether she agrees with anything. All I said was that back in college, when I was wondering why I was struggling with stuff, my mom just said, "Well, I'm like that too." That's it.
Sure, adult behavior can stem from childhood, but some people are just born with certain traits.
It's not like I have some mental block holding me back; I just don't have the skill. Like how some people just can't do math, and I can.
I don't buy that you could wander off on your own without getting in trouble. Doesn't happen with good parents, and probably doesn't happen with wolves or lions or any other mammals either.

Maybe you just don't believe it, but that's how it was. 🤷
Times were different back then. I lived in a quiet suburb, hardly any traffic, and kids were just out running around everywhere.

Exactly.
Now I only use my car for quick trips around the neighborhood or when someone's driving with me. I'm a decent driver, but I just don't dare drive downtown because I'm terrified of getting lost and causing a massive wreck.

Yeah, not really. 😁
I'm getting out of here, period. I refuse to just sit around acting like a victim. At least I can tell myself there's definitely people doing worse than me 😁

Her whole stance basically implies—"I used to be just like that," so you and I are cut from the same cloth. And trying to prove her wrong just ends up tearing the connection apart.

Times weren't always like they are now; I grew up in a quiet suburb where there was hardly any traffic, and kids would just wander around outside.

I'm talking about those early moments when you were crawling or maybe eventually walking, but definitely not running yet.

I can always find comfort in knowing there are definitely people worse off than me.

Maybe that’s exactly what Mom was aiming for.

You can either lean on statements like that to feel better, or you can actually work on yourself. I guess it really just comes down to faith and the choice you make. Otherwise, you’re just fighting against your own "truth"—this idea built on a mountain of mistakes and proof that things can't change, including all the pain caused by staying stuck. Like someone once said; people tend to cling to their own suffering.

It’s not like I have a mental block or anything; it's more like the ability is there somewhere, but I just can't access it. I simply don't have those skills. It's like how some people just aren't wired for logic or math, whereas I am.

It’s kind of funny how this pattern stays the same whenever anyone suggests ways to help, regardless of whatever psychology textbook topic we're discussing. The only difference here is that you won't find any trained, offended authorities to lecture you, since I'm just suggesting you try doing it without the tablet. Those experts haven't even seen a path for developing frustration in this little issue yet because they haven't officially filed it under classification F-789cx-11 😍 ; the solution being 150 mg of peppermint-flavored metaminiandol. The hardest part is getting the ego to decide to head back to "school." And when it finally happens, it's usually out of pure, accumulated frustration rather than just one single event. So, at that point, there isn't just one simple fix anymore.
dustypilot11 dustypilot11 Member
33 messages
joined Nov 2010
#84 ·
Jeremy Alvarez5 said:Her whole stance basically implies—"I used to be just like that," so you and I are cut from the same cloth. And trying to prove her wrong just ends up tearing the connection apart.

Times weren't always like they are now; I grew up in a quiet suburb where there was hardly any traffic, and kids would just wander around outside.

I'm talking about those early moments when you were crawling or maybe eventually walking, but definitely not running yet.

I can always find comfort in knowing there are definitely people worse off than me.

Maybe that’s exactly what Mom was aiming for.

You can either lean on statements like that to feel better, or you can actually work on yourself. I guess it really just comes down to faith and the choice you make. Otherwise, you’re just fighting against your own "truth"—this idea built on a mountain of mistakes and proof that things can't change, including all the pain caused by staying stuck. Like someone once said; people tend to cling to their own suffering.

It’s not like I have a mental block or anything; it's more like the ability is there somewhere, but I just can't access it. I simply don't have those skills. It's like how some people just aren't wired for logic or math, whereas I am.

It’s kind of funny how this pattern stays the same whenever anyone suggests ways to help, regardless of whatever psychology textbook topic we're discussing. The only difference here is that you won't find any trained, offended authorities to lecture you, since I'm just suggesting you try doing it without the tablet. Those experts haven't even seen a path for developing frustration in this little issue yet because they haven't officially filed it under classification F-789cx-11 😍 ; the solution being 150 mg of peppermint-flavored metaminiandol. The hardest part is getting the ego to decide to head back to "school." And when it finally happens, it's usually out of pure, accumulated frustration rather than just one single event. So, at that point, there isn't just one simple fix anymore.

Oh, okay. So if a mom tells her kid—who literally shares 50% of her DNA—that they look or act alike, she's suddenly a manipulator causing deep psychological trauma? Yeah, makes total sense. Especially since I was already an adult by then. Real logical stuff. ☕
You can keep clinging to those empty excuses if you want, or you can actually work on yourself. It’s all down to faith and whether you actually decide to change. Otherwise, you're just fighting your own bullshit—ignoring a mountain of mistakes and proof that things can't be any other way, even after all the crap you've suffered because of it. Like someone once said: people honestly seem to love their own misery.

What am I supposed to work on? Like, I already said that being in the red doesn't stop me from heading out somewhere. If I was too chicken to go anywhere just because I might lose some cash, then maybe you'd actually have a point.

It’s funny how people react the exact same way whenever someone suggests helping out, no matter what kind of psychological mess you're dealing with. The only difference here is that you won't find any offended experts to lecture you—since I'm suggesting you try doing this without a tablet...

What are you even talking about?! What tablets?! Since when does anyone carry around a tablet just to use GPS these days? 😕
Jeremy Alvarez5 Jeremy Alvarez5 Active Member
165 messages
joined Aug 2010
#85 ·
dustypilot11 said:Oh, okay. So if a mom tells her kid—who literally shares 50% of her DNA—that they look or act alike, she's suddenly a manipulator causing deep psychological trauma? Yeah, makes total sense. Especially since I was already an adult by then. Real logical stuff. ☕
You can keep clinging to those empty excuses if you want, or you can actually work on yourself. It’s all down to faith and whether you actually decide to change. Otherwise, you're just fighting your own bullshit—ignoring a mountain of mistakes and proof that things can't be any other way, even after all the crap you've suffered because of it. Like someone once said: people honestly seem to love their own misery.

What am I supposed to work on? Like, I already said that being in the red doesn't stop me from heading out somewhere. If I was too chicken to go anywhere just because I might lose some cash, then maybe you'd actually have a point.

It’s funny how people react the exact same way whenever someone suggests helping out, no matter what kind of psychological mess you're dealing with. The only difference here is that you won't find any offended experts to lecture you—since I'm suggesting you try doing this without a tablet...

What are you even talking about?! What tablets?! Since when does anyone carry around a tablet just to use GPS these days? 😕

I guess comforting someone can just be a reflex. It doesn't necessarily have to be conscious manipulation or some kind of operant conditioning; it might just be responding to patterns we were raised with ourselves. Which means I'm not just fighting my mom's perspective, but maybe even my grandma's or great-grandma's too. 😁

What am I supposed to work on? Like I said, that "deficit" isn't stopping me from going places. If I was too afraid of losing out to ever actually leave, then maybe your point would hold water.

Then I guess the diagnosis would be agoraphobia. Or depression. Or whatever. Judging things by their extremes doesn't really work for me. I suppose the amount of energy you put into solving something depends on how much of a headache it actually is. If it's just a minor issue, you probably won't feel driven to go all out to fix it. You might just decide to dye your hair instead. My point is that when it comes to seeing possibilities for self-growth, there are spiritual paths that don't rely on standard psychology or clinical approaches. Certain abilities or limitations can be overcome through learning. Spirituality that focuses on states of consciousness can help transcend a problematic loop—that whole fear-mind-emotion cycle. That's what real self-work is about: being able to (re)learn yourself. For instance, some pro athletes spend more time on visualization than actual physical training. But yeah, there are plenty of ways to tackle any kind of issue.

What are you talking about?! What tablets?! Is there such a thing as a GPS tablet these days? 😕

Hold on, I meant skiing tablets. 👍 That part of the comment wasn't directed at you. 😛
Nathan Kelly5 Nathan Kelly5 Active Member
62 messages
joined Jun 2010
#86 ·
I don't quite get it... I mean, I honestly don't see what the issue is. It seems impossible to get lost on city streets; if you know where you're headed, you know where you're going, and if you don't, you just ask for directions or pull up a map on your phone. As for getting lost in a grocery store, I can't wrap my head around that either—you just look back at the entrance, find the registers, and figure out what else you need.

The only way I see that happening is if you're completely lost in thought and just wandering aimlessly (that happens to me when I'm "reading"—I'll get so immersed in a book that I realize I haven't actually processed the last two paragraphs). But even then, you just snap out of it and refocus.

Personally, I find it easiest to just mentally sketch out a map. That’s how I navigate; I always have a sense of direction, knowing exactly where the main avenues lie or which direction leads to the next state. When I visit a new city, I make sure to note the train station or where I parked my car (I'll even write it down if I have to), then I anchor that to a landmark like the town square. From there, you just expand the mental image—this is east of that, this is northeast, this is west, this is south, and this is right.
wearyowl29 wearyowl29 Regular
715 messages
joined Feb 2014
#87 ·
google1;29931608 said:
I honestly don't get it... I mean, I just don't see what the big deal is. Especially when you're out on the streets—how can someone actually get lost? If you know where you're headed, you know where you're headed! And if you don't? You just ask someone for directions or pull up a map on your phone and boom, you're good to go. Even in a grocery store, it makes no sense to me how you could lose your way. You saw where you walked in, you can see the checkout lanes, and you know what else is on your list, right?

Everyone perceives space and time differently. For some people, it takes a split second to get their bearings, but for others, they might need an hour and fifty different strangers passing by before it clicks...😁

The only thing that makes sense to me is if you're totally zoned out. Like, if you're so mentally preoccupied that you're walking on autopilot without even thinking about your destination. That happens to me all the time when I'm "reading"—I'll get so lost in a story that I'm still physically turning pages, but then I realize I have absolutely no clue what I just read in the last two paragraphs! But even then, you just snap out of it, refocus, and you're fine.


I remember once losing my sense of direction at a huge open-air market in Washington, D.C.... I was trying to take some photos, and it was driving me absolutely crazy!
But hey, I figured it out eventually.😉

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