Thoughts on capitalism...

Mr. Spiker said:goldengull3, you really ought to head back to school and brush up on the fundamentals of Marxism.

Look, if Americans actually wanted to mandate maternity leave, social security, or universal healthcare, they would have done it by now. They simply don't want to. They operate under a different paradigm entirely. In the States, political victories are won through economic liberalism. If someone were to float those kinds of mandates over in Europe, they’d lose their seat in a heartbeat. It's as simple as that.

Annatar said:A man without debt is like a serf who finally broke free and gave the middle finger to his former lord.

Being debt-free just makes you a tenant with a car bought in cash. It doesn't change the fact that you're still a servant to the grind just to cover basic living expenses. What you’re describing isn't true financial independence; it's just having enough control over your schedule to avoid immediate desperation. I don't even count being self-employed as freedom—you aren't serving a boss, you're just serving the whims of the market, which is essentially the same thing. Real financial independence is a long road. Usually, it requires exploiting others to get there, which, according to your moral code—where you wouldn't wish on anyone what you won't do yourself—is off the table.

talia said:Look, you haven't worked in this field. I have friends in IT who refuse to work overtime, but here’s the REALITY: while it isn't illegal, companies have way too much leeway to exploit people by expecting unpaid overtime. It’s just how they do it if they want to.
Listen, I laid it out clearly. Everyone else is playing it safe, staying quiet, and doing what they're told. What exactly are you going to build on your own?
Are you really the only one refusing overtime, especially when your company is going through mass layoffs?
Find another job?
She already tried that.
What would you actually do if you were stuck in a company like that?

Just a few thoughts on this... It happens. I'm sure plenty of people deal with this at some point. Especially in smaller firms or during a crisis or panic. So, what's the move? First, ask about their culture and overtime policy directly during the job interview. If you're already in, grit your teeth for a few days. You can always lean on personal commitments as an excuse. Try to negotiate some compensation—maybe trade those extra hours for a couple of days off later. Ultimately, if they push too hard, look for a different role within the company or jump ship entirely. Regardless, keep up appearances. Act like you're a hard worker and say you'll step up when needed, even if you're secretly planning your exit strategy. You have to be tactical... 😁

talia said:We had the chance to adopt the Swedish model—which I truly believe belongs in the 21st century—but instead, we pivoted toward the American way, a relic from the 19th.

We have certainly borrowed elements from the Swedes or the Germans. Just look at the sheer number of retirees who are essentially just technologically obsolete. In the States, people like that would be forced to find new work or simply starve. If you ask me, the American approach is quite social, even if it's incredibly expensive.

Annatar said:Swiss people don't buy, but it's just because they think they'll get hit with massive taxes. It's nonsense, but they haven't realized that yet. They have the cash to buy, otherwise.

True. You pay the tax, but you can deduct mortgage interest from your taxable income (which any Swiss person should know by now).

They generally don't have the money to buy, unless you're talking about old condos. Near my place, the cheapest house is around $600k; head slightly further up the hill and you're looking at $1 million. That’s the neighborhood I moved to because I couldn't afford the prime locations. To save up for a *down payment*, my wife and I worked for several years and lived quite frugally. To save the full amount, both would have to work and live poorly (mind you, that means no kids) for several years—meaning we'd spend our best years basically living in poverty. All that just to avoid 3% interest? No thanks. My neighbors think the same way.

talia said:Look, you haven't lived it. I have buddies in tech who don't pull overtime, but here’s the REALITY: while it might not be technically illegal, it is absolutely common practice in IT to work unpaid overtime. It gives companies way too much wiggle room to exploit their people if they feel like being jerks.
Listen, I laid it out clearly—everyone's playing it safe, nobody wants to rock the boat, and what exactly are you going to build on your own anyway?
Are you really the only one refusing overtime? Especially when your company is busy handing out mass layoffs?
Find another job?
That's exactly what she tried to do.
What would you even do if you were stuck in a company like that?

I don't know about Canada... but in the European Union, there's the European Working Regulation that all employers have to follow or they're breaking the law. She also needs to check if she's the only one being forced into overtime while others aren't; she should look into whether there's a case for discrimination or some other kind of irregularity.

stormylynx14 said:Look, a guy with zero debt is basically just a renter driving a car he paid cash for. It doesn't mean he's free; he’s still a cog in the machine because he’s still grinding away just to cover basic survival costs. What you’re calling "financial independence" is really just having enough freedom to manage your own clock without the immediate pressure of hunting for cash. And don't get me started on being "self-employed"—in my book, you aren't serving a boss, you're just a slave to whatever the market demands at that moment, which is pretty much the same thing. Getting to actual financial independence is a massive climb, and honestly, the only way to truly get there is by exploiting other people—which, according to your little moral code where you wouldn't want anyone doing it to you, is totally off-limits.

That is total BS! If you actually have some ambition and a few working brain cells left in that skull of yours, you can stack some serious cash through perfectly legal, productive means. Pick any career path under the sun. Once that money starts flowing, we're not talking about a trickle; we're talking about freaking rivers.

Linda Morales said:That’s just wrong. If you have ambition and a few bright ideas, you can make serious money through perfectly legal and productive means. Pick any career. Once the cash starts flowing, it won't just trickle—it'll be a flood.

I’m not advocating for anything illegal or destructive. What exactly are you implying? Freelancing? Or owning the means of production (per Karl Marx)?

goldengull3 said:Look, if Americans actually wanted to mandate maternity leave, pension contributions, and universal healthcare, they’d just do it. They don't. It's that simple. Their whole system is built on economic liberalism—that's how you win elections over there. If anyone tried proposing that kind of stuff in Europe, they'd be voted out of office instantly. Period.

I honestly don't know how you can believe a word of what you're writing.

Jason Wells4 said:I honestly don't understand how you can believe the things you write.

Well, be my guest. Move to the USA, get your citizenship, start a social-democratic party, and give it your best shot. It would be such a revolutionary shift that people would certainly hear you before the elections. You’d basically be trying to import Swedish-style capitalism to the States.

But you'd still end up as a political nobody. It’s quite simple—people there believe they have the right to decide whether or not they pay into certain systems, rather than being forced into mandatory state funds by the government. That goes for Americans, and frankly, it applies to just about anyone with an independent streak.🙂 Similarly, if you tried to propose an American-style system in Europe, you’d find yourself relegated to the political fringes once again.

Personally, I respect that stance in the USA. It’s just another societal model, much like any other. It might be a bit harsher, sure, but it fosters more entrepreneurship. It isn't my place to interfere with their collective will. If they wanted a welfare state, they would have implemented one, just as almost all of Europe has, or at least Canada. However, it isn't part of their mindset to let the state dictate those kinds of choices to them. In many ways, it's actually beneficial that these different models exist; in a globalized capitalist economy, a person can choose the specific framework that suits them best.

What you’re receiving from social services in America today is something you'll likely lose sooner rather than later. Socialist equality simply doesn't sit well with prosperous Americans. Right now, those who benefit have an edge—mostly thanks to old-school graft and corruption. But once the government actually gets its act together, things will get much tougher; high-quality healthcare and education services are going to start charging premium prices. And get this—it’ll be perfectly legal. That’s just how it goes. It’s inevitable. Brace yourself, my friend.🙂 .
Rent out an apartment for three months out of the year,😲 and you think you're really bragging about that? If people here had access to the Atlantic coast, those rentals would be booked twelve months a year. You realize how beautiful our scenery is, sure, but you clearly don't grasp how much economic potential is being left on the table. Toronto is just a city—there's nothing particularly exciting there—whereas the US is a powerhouse in tourism. Though, granted, for more than half the year in some places, it’s so freezing you can barely walk down the street.
Saving up Euros? I still have a decent nest egg tucked away in America. Why? Because there’s no tax on interest income. Over here, they’d snatch about 30% of it right off the top. Just think about where all that savings in the US actually comes from. I’m still renting out my property in America without paying a dime in taxes, but the question is: for how much longer?
The massive issue with Americans is that they aren't realistic—they think they're lounging on a beach when they're actually barely keeping their heads above water.

America is just such a fantastic country where everything runs on credit, and I guess the only real question left is when those foreign bankers are going to stop laughing at us behind our backs and start laughing right to our faces.
People have been buying apartments on 30-year mortgages, basically turning themselves into modern-day slaves—especially if (or more accurately, *when*) the Dollar loses its value one day.

The government keeps bleeding us dry with taxes, but look at this:
- they took out a massive loan for medicine about a year or two ago, like 600 million dollars, and they still haven't even started paying it back.
- now they owe a billion dollars for medical supplies, so pretty soon we won't even be able to afford stuff for the flu.
- meanwhile, you've got guys like Šuker claiming the budget is overflowing, and then two weeks later, he’s getting chewed out by farmers who didn't get their subsidies from last year, and he's whining about how there's no money left...
- and those subsidies? They've already been slashed by almost 50% compared to three or four years ago.
- that's why they brought back the sales tax for tourism.
- that's also why they dumped the funding for firefighters and preschools onto the cities, just because the federal government is spending too much.
- at the start of this year, the government actually took out a 2 billion dollar loan just to cover the first installment of an existing debt.

And now the Dollar has started fluctuating up to 10%, which means the Federal Reserve just doesn't have the strength to keep it within certain bounds anymore (which isn't really allowed if we're thinking about joining the European Union).

Gary Harris6 said:You rent out an apartment for three months out of the year😲 and you consider that a flex? If people here had the Gulf Coast, they’d be renting it out twelve months straight. You clearly appreciate the scenery, but you’re blind to the massive economic waste. Toronto is just a city—nothing much happens there—and the tourism industry is a joke compared to what we could have. Besides, for more than half the year, it's too cold to even walk down the street.

It is certainly worth noting. Before the budget airlines arrived about three years ago, filling an apartment was a struggle even when you had 45 days of occupancy. Now, the average sits at 60, and for those who actually know how to manage property, it hits 90.

That represents a growth of 30 to 100% in just three short years. To be blunt—if you want to actually see a return on investment after taking out a loan to build an apartment and paying off that debt through rentals—you really need 110 to 120 days of occupancy. That’s the level of success seen by folks along the coast in places like Florida.

But my point is about the trend—and trends can easily swing downward by double digits. You won't find that kind of momentum in Toronto; it's nearly impossible. However, when you see one year bringing in $1,000, the next $2,000, and the third $5,000 from rentals, the entire landscape shifts. America today isn't the same America it was yesterday or the day before. And it certainly won't be the same tomorrow.

Kyle Nelson2 said:America is such a fantastic place where everything is fueled by debt; it’s really just a matter of when those foreign bankers stop laughing behind our backs and start laughing right to our faces.
People have been signing away their lives on 30-year mortgages, essentially turning themselves into modern-day slaves—especially if (or rather, when) the Dollar loses its footing one day.

And what, people think there aren't mortgages for houses and cars in the West? As if everyone just walks in with stacks of cash? Besides, I find it hard to wrap my head around the idea that paying rent is somehow better than paying a mortgage. You're basically handing your monthly payment over to a landlord instead of building equity. It feels like throwing money straight into a fire. I tried renting once, and I wouldn't go back; it felt like watching my savings vanish into thin air. I don't see the issue with people choosing to own their homes rather than being perpetual renters.

As for the currency, the concern about devaluation isn't really hitting home because there is so much liquidity in the market. We've used the Dollar for ages, and we haven't seen the kind of runaway inflation people fear. If anything, it's quite the opposite.

Linda Morales said:That's just not true. If you have ambition and a few good ideas in your head, you can make decent money in a completely legal and constructive way. Pick any profession. Once the cash starts flowing, it doesn't just drip—it pours in like a river.

Kudos to 🙏 🙏 🙏. Since you're supposedly so wealthy, owning villas and houses all over the world, mind if I ask how old you are? How many kids have you raised or helped get on their feet? Based on your writing, you sound like someone who has zero clue about actual expenses, yet you're full of nonsense regarding wealth and easy money. Only people who are foolish or boastful talk like that without knowing anything.

If you're really that loaded, maybe you could sponsor a few people to help them get out of the States. Then, once they pay you back, you can just pick a few more friends to help.

The rest of us who would actually do this from the heart simply don't have what you claim to have: brains and massive wealth.

Doing something for society and yourself would be a great move; you might actually feel proud.

Back in my day, even though I struggled to put two kids through school in Africa... at $30 an hour, after ten years, I basically lost all that money to taxes.

Someone as "brilliant" as you, and yet you didn't even realize you could do something for ordinary, hardworking, struggling people.

Are you actually an honest, smart person? Prove it by showing us something positive. After all, what does all this wealth actually mean to you?

Good luck, and thanks in advance for helping people who will repay you honestly. Just think about how much better everyone on this forum will think of you.

😎

goldengull3 said:So what, there aren't any loans for houses or cars in the West? What, everyone just pays cash? I mean, paying rent instead of a mortgage is a fantastic move. Just hand all that money over to some landlord. I tried it once and, honestly, I wouldn't do it again. It felt like I was just burning cash. I don't see why people think buying a house is better than just renting.

Regarding the dollar, the issue is it getting too strong—it’s not losing value because there’s way too much cash floating around the market. We've been using this currency for over a decade now, and we haven't had inflation issues. If anything, it's the opposite.

Yeah, the real issue is when, say, a friend of mine who works at a bank tells me that if she takes out a loan, her monthly payment will be $0.93 for 30 years, even if she's making maybe 5-$2000k a month. The problem is having 40% of your paycheck swallowed by a mortgage for the next three decades...

As for the dollar, a strong dollar is a headache because it kills exports, and the Federal Reserve isn't exactly in a position to defend the currency if it starts devaluing. It's not that there's too much cash on the market; it's that there's not enough liquidity because everyone is busy taking out loans.
Inflation is like chickenpox to me... you can get over it easily enough, but the underlying mess remains...

The inflation rate and GDP growth percentages are just delusions used to convince us that everything is fine.

Kyle Nelson2 said:Yeah, the issue arises when, say, a friend of mine working at a major bank tells me that if she takes out a mortgage, her minimum monthly payment will be $0.93 for 30 years—assuming she’s pulling in maybe 5-$2000. The real problem is having 40% of your paycheck swallowed by debt for three decades...

It is far more sensible than paying rent $667 only to realize you have nothing to show for it after 30 years. Plus, calculating costs for a couple changes the math entirely. No one claimed this was easy or ideal. But even your friend wouldn't have had any chance of owning anything five years ago.

Beyond that, in a place like Houston, 31 miles a two-bedroom apartment near New York City might go for 35,000 €. And if we're looking at it by Western standards, 31 miles (or a ninety-minute train ride) isn't exactly a burden for a daily commute.

Kyle Nelson2 said:inflation rates and GDP growth percentages are just illusions used to convince us everything is fine.

The fact that life is better now than it used to be is evident in every grocery store. It's visible through a window, or in any sales statistic, from retail to tourism. Why is it so difficult to accept that Americans, on average, live better than they did before?

Kyle Nelson2 said:the real issue is when 40% of your paycheck disappears into a mortgage for the next 30 years...

Banks typically factor GDP growth and rising purchasing power into their lending models, assuming debt won't swallow 40% of your income anytime soon. Besides, here in the States, banks theoretically won't approve a loan if interest and principal exceed a third of your income. It protects the consumer from drowning in debt and protects the bank from being forced into a fire sale. In that regard, the interests of the lender and the borrower actually align.

Kyle Nelson2 said:Yeah—the issue arises when, say, a friend working at a bank tells you that if she takes out a mortgage, her monthly payment will be $0.93 for 30 years—assuming she’s making maybe 5-$$2000k a month. The real problem is having 40% of your paycheck swallowed by a loan for the next three decades...

True; it isn't easy to shell out that much every single month. But what’s the alternative? As much as it sucks, it’s still smarter to pay toward a mortgage than to throw money away on $0.83 rent or, worse, living with your parents.

What were your options 7 or 8 years ago? I know firsthand—I was practically turning the country upside down back then just trying to qualify for a loan. Getting approved was nearly impossible, and interest rates were significantly higher than they are today. The only saving grace was that housing prices were lower—but even then, good luck actually getting the loan.

@Kyle Nelson2,
Most Americans spend about 30-35% of their income on mortgage payments. In cities like New York, that hits the 35% mark easily. It’s tough everywhere, and I'm talking about average folks, not households pulling in over $100k per person.

When you talk about housing in the US, it really depends on which State you're in and where specifically... generally, you're looking at anything from $250K up to around $750K in places like New York, while salaries vary a bit by job. Food prices stay pretty much the same, unless you're out in the middle of nowhere.
roughly equal.

Sure, there are villas priced north of $1 million, but even our high earners can't touch those.

Though, I wouldn't be surprised if someone pops up here claiming they own five of them—you read all sorts of things on these forums.

But honestly, before long, we'll see plenty of people going Bankrupt because they simply can't keep up with the payments, regardless of how well things seem to be going in America.

Now, goldengull3 will probably chime in again with some "but back in America..." line, and they'd be right—"taking on more debt" is often framed as a sign of rising incomes. It makes me laugh.
I spent 23 years paying off loans, one after another. I know I did it because I couldn't afford to pay cash. Very few people actually have the luxury of buying a car or a house outright.

😎