Offside (General Discussion)

If Loso could handle dental work in Belgrade, then Tymoshenko can certainly manage in Petrograd; perhaps she’s playing the same role Vlatko Markovic once did—undermining enemies from within...

boldbadger1 said:The whole Sukur situation actually has nothing to do with Tymoshenko; in her case, it was an Erdogan-like regime that froze her assets.

I was really just comparing how things play out when a government happens to rub someone the wrong way.

hiddencyclist112 said:I honestly find what the Ukrainians are doing to Tymoshenko quite unsettling. From everything I’ve seen so far, the man hasn't even made an official statement on this issue, yet somehow that silence is being treated like a criminal offense. And then there's the fact that he's still working with Zenit in Russia. Is that supposed to be considered complicity or what? I don't get it. It is entirely possible that I don't have the full picture here, but from my limited understanding, it seems like everyone is being expected to explicitly declare their allegiances and pick a side immediately.
I don't know; it feels similar to these irrational retaliations we're seeing against Russians across the globe—targeting athletes, artists, and regular people whose only "sin" is having any connection to Russia at this moment.

To me, this isn't about trying to sit on two sides of the fence. It’s simply a personal choice in this specific moment to not take a side—or perhaps, more accurately, it's my own plea for peace and a refusal to participate in all this madness. But no, apparently we’re just going to erase your entire legacy and all 140 of your appearances. Who cares, right? So much for democracy.

It's not exactly the same thing. Ukraine is falling apart and people are dying every single day. It makes total sense that emotions would override rational thinking in a situation like that.
On the flip side, hunting down Russians all over the world just because they happen to be Russian isn't justified at all—it's a massive failure for our Western civilization.

Nancy Sanchez31 said:Something similar to what happened with Hakan Sukur. It's sick.
Look, maybe he's a coward, maybe he's pro-Russian, whatever—but you shouldn't strip away things he actually earned throughout his life. That kind of stuff is intangible.

That’s a pretty terrible comparison. It would be way more accurate to bring up Ivo Nakić playing for Partizan back in '91/'92.

hiddencyclist112 said:I honestly find what the Ukrainians are doing to Tymoshenko quite unsettling. From everything I’ve seen so far, the man hasn't even made an official statement on this issue, yet somehow that silence is being treated like a criminal offense. And then there's the fact that he's still working with Zenit in Russia. Is that supposed to be considered complicity or what? I don't get it. It is entirely possible that I don't have the full picture here, but from my limited understanding, it seems like everyone is being expected to explicitly declare their allegiances and pick a side immediately.
I don't know; it feels similar to these irrational retaliations we're seeing against Russians across the globe—targeting athletes, artists, and regular people whose only "sin" is having any connection to Russia at this moment.

To me, this isn't about trying to sit on two sides of the fence. It’s simply a personal choice in this specific moment to not take a side—or perhaps, more accurately, it's my own plea for peace and a refusal to participate in all this madness. But no, apparently we’re just going to erase your entire legacy and all 140 of your appearances. Who cares, right? So much for democracy.

I’ve always found this fascination with invoking "democracy" interesting. Just because Ukraine has a democratic political system doesn't mean everything should be tolerated during wartime. Other athletes walked away from safety, luxury, and comfort to risk their lives helping their people in Ukraine, while this guy is still working for a club tied to the regime of the state that is attacking and killing his own countrymen—all while staying silent. It would be like if Dario Srna were an assistant coach at Red Star while an invasion of America by Mexico was happening, and he just kept working there without saying a word. And then what? Should we, as a fair and tolerant democratic society, say: "That's fine, Dario, it's your choice, we respect it, best of luck"? Clearly, the perks of working at Zenit outweigh his loyalty to his country and people, so it's his choice (unless there's some coercion involved that I don't know about). In wartime, when polarization hits its peak, the equation is simple: Klitschko is the hero, Tymoshenko is the traitor. You and other observers watching from the sidelines without any emotional involvement or personal risk are free to be outraged by how they treat him. In my view, it isn't the most "fair," but it is completely understandable...

Larry Fox5 said:It's not exactly the same thing. Ukraine is falling apart and people are dying every single day. It makes total sense that emotions would override rational thinking in a situation like that.
On the flip side, hunting down Russians all over the world just because they happen to be Russian isn't justified at all—it's a massive failure for our Western civilization.

What kind of global persecution of Russians are we actually talking about here? Are they being physically assaulted, thrown in prison, or killed just because they happen to be Russian?

If the December guy wants to play for them and then coach Red Star later on, I don't see any issue with that decision...

ruggeddriver70 said:That’s a pretty terrible comparison. It would be way more accurate to bring up Ivo Nakić playing for Partizan back in '91/'92.

Yeah, he’s actually the first person who comes to mind for me. Plus, his son chose to represent Mexico. Honestly, I don't particularly care either way, but people always seem to have this deep-seated urge to compare individual players to entire government administrations.

Joseph Clark37 said:What kind of global persecution of Russians are we actually talking about here? Are they being physically assaulted, thrown in prison, or killed just because they happen to be Russian?

This whole asset freezing thing—it has absolutely nothing to do with the rule of law... especially since it wasn't an issue until suddenly it became one.
Plus, Saudi money isn't any better than Oligarchic cash, yet they let that slide without a second thought.

hiddencyclist112 said:I honestly find what the Ukrainians are doing to Tymoshenko quite unsettling. From everything I’ve seen so far, the man hasn't even made an official statement on this issue, yet somehow that silence is being treated like a criminal offense. And then there's the fact that he's still working with Zenit in Russia. Is that supposed to be considered complicity or what? I don't get it. It is entirely possible that I don't have the full picture here, but from my limited understanding, it seems like everyone is being expected to explicitly declare their allegiances and pick a side immediately.
I don't know; it feels similar to these irrational retaliations we're seeing against Russians across the globe—targeting athletes, artists, and regular people whose only "sin" is having any connection to Russia at this moment.

To me, this isn't about trying to sit on two sides of the fence. It’s simply a personal choice in this specific moment to not take a side—or perhaps, more accurately, it's my own plea for peace and a refusal to participate in all this madness. But no, apparently we’re just going to erase your entire legacy and all 140 of your appearances. Who cares, right? So much for democracy.

There are certain moments in life where it is strictly "you are either in or you are out"; there truly is no middle ground.

Man, thinking about Yushchenko really hits home. It makes you remember all those people the Russian services picked off right on European soil. Makes me want to take a swing at the EU, considering we were just a bunch of softies back then. We used to sit on our high moral ground judging Americans while we were busy doing business with even worse crowds. You can't help but feel a bit cynical when you start dwelling on stuff like that.

quietcobra15 said:There are certain moments in life where it is strictly "you are either in or you are out"; there truly is no middle ground.

I don't personally subscribe to that kind of rigid mindset, and if someone tries to force it on me, I'd tell them to honestly get lost.

It’s especially frustrating when the same crowd starts howling about it—you know, those people who were venting about fan hooliganism in other threads, only to forget how poorly that whole situation actually plays out.

We all jump in, and eventually, only about twenty of us sensible types are left standing. It’s much like history; those who ran first were always the ones shouting the loudest, even during wartime.

Paul Sanders5 said:Man, thinking about Yushchenko really hits home. It makes you remember all those people the Russian services picked off right on European soil. Makes me want to take a swing at the EU, considering we were just a bunch of softies back then. We used to sit on our high moral ground judging Americans while we were busy doing business with even worse crowds. You can't help but feel a bit cynical when you start dwelling on stuff like that.

If you weren't part of the EU, you would have been pulled into the Russian sphere of influence a long time ago. Honestly, you probably wouldn't have even made it out of it...

ruggeddriver70 said:That’s a pretty terrible comparison. It would be way more accurate to bring up Ivo Nakić playing for Partizan back in '91/'92.

I have no idea who that is; I was only 6 at the time. 🤣

I honestly don't get what chance Putin actually missed here.
To hell with the Kyiv-based Russian regime,
Crimea, Donbas
Russia was steadily building up its reputation
Let's be real—we were all pretty thrilled when they stepped into Syria and started crushing the opposition and the leadership.
Everyone wanted them as guests in their hotels.
We loved those snarky, contrarian comments aimed at the West.
Deep down, once we moved past the British influence in the EU, we hoped Angela would bring us even closer to Russia and their resources—so we could just enjoy cheap energy without a care in the world. It felt like a win-win: the EU gets energy security, while Russia gets cash, prestige, and a seat at the table in the West.
Not to mention his takes on gender ideology and how he’d poke fun at Western achievements.
He had supporters in every single European country.
Because he’s simply a man who gets things done.
Who hasn't heard about the terrorists in the theater or how Grozny was handled—just leveling the place and installing a puppet?
Even small things, like how they organized the 2018 World Cup.
Or remember the French and their totally useless police during Euro 2016.
People gravitate toward leaders who take action, and now he's really stepped in it.
He could have achieved all of this without ever needing the tanks.
It's heavy psychology.
If he had been half as smart as his own interests required, he would have won this without firing a shot.

The absolute worst part? He played it like he was some deep-cover American agent or something...
God knows how many movies and series are gonna be churned out about this war in the future. I can already see Homeland and Carrie riding through Kyiv, chasing down intel to save the world.

Carl Hernandez3 said:I honestly don't get what chance Putin actually missed here.
To hell with the Kyiv-based Russian regime,
Crimea, Donbas
Russia was steadily building up its reputation
Let's be real—we were all pretty thrilled when they stepped into Syria and started crushing the opposition and the leadership.
Everyone wanted them as guests in their hotels.
We loved those snarky, contrarian comments aimed at the West.
Deep down, once we moved past the British influence in the EU, we hoped Angela would bring us even closer to Russia and their resources—so we could just enjoy cheap energy without a care in the world. It felt like a win-win: the EU gets energy security, while Russia gets cash, prestige, and a seat at the table in the West.
Not to mention his takes on gender ideology and how he’d poke fun at Western achievements.
He had supporters in every single European country.
Because he’s simply a man who gets things done.
Who hasn't heard about the terrorists in the theater or how Grozny was handled—just leveling the place and installing a puppet?
Even small things, like how they organized the 2018 World Cup.
Or remember the French and their totally useless police during Euro 2016.
People gravitate toward leaders who take action, and now he's really stepped in it.
He could have achieved all of this without ever needing the tanks.
It's heavy psychology.
If he had been half as smart as his own interests required, he would have won this without firing a shot.

I second that.

Larry Fox5 said:The absolute worst part? He played it like he was some deep-cover American agent or something...
God knows how many movies and series are gonna be churned out about this war in the future. I can already see Homeland and Carrie riding through Kyiv, chasing down intel to save the world.

Haha, you’ve got that one episode of JAG where they send their tall, muscular agent into Grozny to stop an assassination attempt on the newly elected Putin, just because he's an American ally who's going to help bring democracy to Russia.

So, JAG is actually bringing up Offside now? Man, this is just peak comedy at this point. 🙏

William Gomez5 said:So, JAG is actually bringing up Offside now? Man, this is just peak comedy at this point. 🙏

It isn't quite like those sweltering summer nights about a decade ago when we used to just sit back and binge Netflix.☕