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Online banking issues

Started by Maria Barnes · · 👁 4 views · 195 replies

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Participants Maria BarnesJack Harris3slycrane94Jamie Newman40placidjackal97Eric Newman65Jacob Wilson50restlesswolf4stormylynx14Chris Ruiz10brisknomad6AMichael Booth562Jason Wells4Gary Lee53Raymond Reyes5coastalfalcon99shadowhawk22Chloe Wells29Jessica Nguyen85boldcyclist18hiddencrane18Scott Morris20Benjamin Rodriguez2 …
Maria Barnes Maria Barnes Active MemberOP
105 messages
joined Dec 2005
#1 ·
What’s your take on online banking? I’ve been using Bank of America for over a year now and honestly, I’m satisfied. It was highly recommended, and frankly, it's a relief not having to drag myself down to the local IRS office anymore. I use a USB smart card reader—way better than those serial port connections you should steer clear of if they try to sell them to you.

Since we're an internet-based company, online banking finally lets me work from just about anywhere. We use NordVPN at the office and stay in constant contact regarding $0.00 all our business, so everything gets done via phone and web. Regardless, we still show up to the office just to hang out.
Jack Harris3 Jack Harris3 Regular
451 messages
joined Dec 2002
#2 ·
I’ll be honest, I don't really believe in such a thing as 100% data security.
Even though my bank keeps nudging me to switch everything over to online banking, I just can't bring myself to pull the trigger... I still don't quite have the nerve for it. 😢
slycrane94 slycrane94 Active Member
58 messages
joined Dec 2002
#3 ·
I use the same setup, though I have a card with one-time codes from NordVPN. It feels secure enough for me. Besides, I don't have enough cash for it to even matter much. 😁

As for practicality, it just irritates me when they charge you a fee just to do their own job for them. 😢

When it comes to actual security, though, I’m way more worried about my credit card.
Jamie Newman40 Jamie Newman40 Member
26 messages
joined Oct 2005
#4 ·
Maria Barnes, could you walk me through how the connection to the bank actually works? You mentioned using a USB smart card reader and a serial port, which definitely piqued my curiosity. I’m having a little trouble grasping whether you need any specific hardware for this.

I’m also curious about what your options are—what kind of actions can you actually perform once you've established that link with the bank?

slycrane94, by the way, do they actually charge fees for online banking?
Maria Barnes Maria Barnes Active MemberOP
105 messages
joined Dec 2005
#5 ·
Jamie Newman40 said:Maria Barnes, can you explain how the bank connection actually works? You mentioned a USB smart card reader and a serial port, which caught my attention. I don't get why you need any special hardware. Hardware? Please. Everyone talks about specs like they actually mean something. You think a faster processor fixes a garbage user experience? It doesn't. You can throw the most expensive components at a problem, but if the software is bloated, you're just buying an overpriced paperweight. Is anyone actually looking at long-term reliability, or are we all just chasing benchmarks?.

I plug a smartcard reader into my laptop's USB port—there’s also a serial port version available—slide the card in, and head over to... Comcast. So, I go to the Bank of America site—the first one here to actually get internet banking right—I punch in my four-digit PIN, and boom. I’m looking at my business account dashboard. Everything is right there: transaction history, incoming and outgoing transfers, bill pay, printing receipts... you name it. The smartcard acts as the ID. Simple, right?

I used to go with the hardware token—you know, that little device that spits out encrypted digits? Total pain in the neck. You have to manually type those long strings of numbers every single time you make a transaction. Who has time for that? A smartcard is way more streamlined; all you need is a PIN. That said, if you stick with the token, you can probably handle payments right from your BlackBerry.
slycrane94 slycrane94 Active Member
58 messages
joined Dec 2002
#6 ·
They charge 😢. Around here, banks have always been predatory, but since you don't really have an alternative—they're all cut from the same cloth—you just deal with it.

And they can pretty much do whatever they want.
  • Checking account stuff
  • Wire transfers and payments (not international, if I recall correctly)
  • Everything related to loans (except the massive ones like mortgages)
  • Stock trading
  • Mutual fund trading
  • Retirement accounts (the private ones, not government programs)
  • Opening accounts and getting cards


I think that covers it. (Not that there's much else worth doing at a bank anyway 🙂 )
placidjackal97 placidjackal97 Active Member
135 messages
joined May 2003
#7 ·
Jack Harris3 said:I don't buy into the idea of "absolute" data security.
Even though my bank is constantly nudging me to switch to online banking, I still haven't quite found the nerve to do it. 😢

I'm not sure which bank you're using, Jack—I'm with Chase, and I can honestly say I can count my trips to a physical branch on one hand.

Everything I do is online.

The upside? I can order a pair of shoes at midnight on a holiday and settle the bill instantly.

So far, I haven't run into a single downside. 😁
placidjackal97 placidjackal97 Active Member
135 messages
joined May 2003
#8 ·
Online banking here is totally free, and I can handle everything myself—buying stocks, swapping currencies, making deposits or withdrawals... you name it.

For transfers, I just need a one-time passcode for each transaction. The bank gives you a free list of about a hundred codes, and once you get down to the last twenty, they automatically mail you a new set.

I honestly can't believe some places actually charge for this stuff.

Honestly, they should be paying me—I’m basically doing their employees' jobs for them, and frankly, I'm much faster at it.😁
Eric Newman65 Eric Newman65 Member
28 messages
joined May 2003
#9 ·
I've been using this token for over a year now... I guess I've saved a ton of money just on transaction fees (I usually just handle things every couple of months since there aren't any interest charges, and the fee ends up being about $0.50 if I combine two accounts into one for smaller amounts).
And honestly, one time when I realized I was about to hit an overdraft (it was a Saturday night and everywhere else was closed), a friend stepped in and used her token to help out..😉 I haven't really had any bad experiences either. It’s pretty handy to track all my deposits and withdrawals too, so I'm always on top of my transactions and can see my balance right away..😉
The monthly fee for the token is $2.75. My only real worry is maybe what might happen if I accidentally type in a wrong account number..
Jamie Newman40 Jamie Newman40 Member
26 messages
joined Oct 2005
#10 ·
Maria Barnes said:I plug a smartcard reader into my laptop's USB port (there are even serial port versions available), pop my card into the reader, head over to the Microsoft website (Microsoft was actually the first major player here to roll out online banking), punch in my four-digit PIN, and boom—I'm looking at my business account dashboard. It’s got everything: transaction history, incoming and outgoing transfers, bill pay, printing receipts... you name it. The smartcard essentially acts as your digital ID.

Thanks for the breakdown. That doesn't sound like a bad setup, though I guess my one gripe would be the hassle; you have to carry both the reader and the physical card just to check your numbers. Is that level of security really a necessity?

Now, I'm not saying extra precautions aren't important—far from it. I'm just wondering if these measures would be quite so extreme if our legal system operated a bit differently. And you might ask, what does the legal system have to do with this? Let me clarify: If you are granted access to your bank account, then by extension, there is always a way for someone else to attempt to seize that data illegally. If they actually succeed, how much protection does the state, the bank, or the law actually provide you in the aftermath?

I don't want to dwell too long on the philosophy of it, so let me tell you how we handle things here in the US. You don't typically need any extra hardware beyond an internet connection, your username, and a password. Some banks set things up where they issue a specific PIN during registration, which you then combine with other private sequences known only to you. Of course, you can change that PIN to whatever combination feels most secure to you.

Personally, with all the banks where I hold accounts, I can log in from virtually any computer with an internet connection, provided I'm using a compatible browser. Once I'm logged in, I can perform almost every task I could do sitting inside a physical branch, with the obvious exception of withdrawing actual cash (printing money isn't part of the package!). 😁

In fact, banks actually encourage people to use online services as much as possible because it reduces foot traffic in the branches. You get a confirmation for every single transaction that you can print out, and they all show up on your monthly statement anyway. Is it complicated? Not at all!

It’s much easier for me to pay my phone bill or my mortgage online. I don't even bother with postage stamps for bills or writing out physical checks anymore; I just do it all while sitting comfortably in my office chair. And no, there aren't usually fees for these transactions, unless you're doing something like a balance transfer from one credit card to another (which usually incurs a percentage fee). My bank doesn't charge me a dime for paying bills online. As far as I know, most banks push this as a totally free service.

placidjackal97, would you mind walking me through how buying stocks through a bank actually works?

If anyone has more questions, please, fire away. I'm happy to clarify anything I can.
Jacob Wilson50 Jacob Wilson50 Active Member
103 messages
joined Sep 2016
#11 ·
I can't believe they actually charge for that.

They really do charge
but honestly, if I just grab a standard money order to pay my rent and head over to the local bank or a FedEx Office, they hit me with a $4 fee😲 just for handling that single bill. Sometimes the invoice is actually less than $4, yet I still end up shelling out the full $4 just for all that "paperwork" at the counter.
I pay about $20 a year for this service (not exactly pocket change), and then I get everything
that slycrane94 listed.
Man, I handle all my stock trading online through my bank app.
I've got a brokerage account set up where I just hit "buy," pick the ticker, decide how many shares I want at what price, and boom—they pull the cash once the stock hits my target price.
It’s incredibly easy (aside from the fact that they still slap me with a $10 transaction fee here and there).
Maria Barnes Maria Barnes Active MemberOP
105 messages
joined Dec 2005
#12 ·
placidjackal97 said:Online banking is free here... I can't believe anyone actually charges for it.

In the US, you’ve got monthly fees to deal with, plus every single transaction costs you a buck or two. Even at Wells Fargo, setting up online banking for businesses is $67, not to mention the cost of a smartcard reader.

It makes zero sense to charge for this. Banks should be incentivizing people to move online. Why? Because they wouldn't need to rent massive office spaces or hire armies of tellers if everyone just used their phones.
slycrane94 slycrane94 Active Member
58 messages
joined Dec 2002
#13 ·
It’s the same monthly subscription model here. It's free for me since I'm a student, but otherwise, it runs about... $67So then you just do whatever you want and charge whatever you feel like?

The logic regarding stocks that Jacob Wilson50 laid out still holds up. It’s a pricey way to play it, though—it isn't the bank itself taking the cut, but rather the administrators running the whole show. Is anyone actually surprised?

It works just like any other computer, and it’s a hell of a lot more secure than relying on a basic PIN. Not that anyone actually cares about that sort of thing.

Eric Newman65
I don't know how things work here in the States, but over at my bank... It’s just not allowed. The law says they can just fix the transaction if they spot an error—though how exactly they catch those mistakes is anyone's guess. At the end of the day, you’re the one who has to settle things with whoever received the funds by mistake. Personally, I always double-check the recipient name after entering the account number; seeing the company name pop up makes it a lot harder to miss a typo.
Jack Harris3 Jack Harris3 Regular
451 messages
joined Dec 2002
#14 ·
placidjackal97 said:I don't know who you're siding with, Jack Harris3...

I was just thinking about how some people always find ways to skirt the rules... you know, those little side hustles that aren't exactly above board... it makes you wonder where the line really is between being smart and just being shady... anyway, I'm just rambling now... 😁
I'm just sitting here staring... honestly, I can't help but admire that card Maria Barnes is carrying. It's really something else... 😁
From what I can gather, all I’d really need is the software, the password, and hopefully that list you end up getting...
Wait, do I already have this software? It seems like all my service providers offer some kind of Banking access, but I haven't actually gone through the steps to install it yet...
One of these days, I'll probably end up just giving in too... I fought against the whole "shutting down the PC" thing for five years straight, but honestly? Now I don't even bother turning it off anymore... 😁
Sometimes I really regret it... those days when I just can't bring myself to head downtown, so the bills just sit there on the kitchen table while the late notices start piling up... 🙄
If we're talking about what’s actually practical, faster, and cheaper... then yeah, absolutely.
Especially my bank... they're right at the top of the list when it comes to charging ridiculous fees for basically nothing...
Jamie Newman40 Jamie Newman40 Member
26 messages
joined Oct 2005
#15 ·
Jacob Wilson50 said:Man, I handle my stocks through online portals and my bank too.

I just checked a moment ago, and while the bank I use does allow stock purchases, they don't support "real time" trading. Since I operate as a day trader, that's a total dealbreaker for me, so I stick with my dedicated broker who specializes specifically in that field.

Maria Barnes said:It’s obviously illogical for them to charge fees; they really should be incentivizing people to move toward digital banking, since it saves them from having to maintain physical branches and staff teller windows.

That's exactly right. About ten years ago, I was paying $0.40 for every single check printed, plus a $4 monthly fee just for statements. Of course, things evolved over time. I actually switched banks when I moved, and the one I've been with for the last five years has steadily improved its terms. Now, I have no limits on printing checks, zero monthly service fees, and free online banking. They even encourage customers to use ATMs for deposits by adding a $2 bonus to the deposited amount per transaction... Since my wife works for this bank, we get a few extra perks as well, though that's a bit off-topic.

One thing is certain: banks have to offer something compelling if they want to win you over—or rather, win your money. You'll only make the switch if they provide something better or more cost-effective than your current institution. Maria Barnes is currently paying for an adapter, and I wouldn't be surprised if the next bank to offer similar services does it for less. Eventually, someone will show up offering it for free or even providing a sign-up bonus just to get you to migrate your accounts...

slycrane94 said:And using it with a computer is much more secure than just relying on a standard PIN. (I wouldn't be a fan of the alternative).

I agree to an extent. Those adapters certainly provide a sense of security. And everything is fine as long as that sense of security remains just that—a feeling—and the technology itself doesn't fail. Investing in specialized security tools is a good idea, but it comes at a price. In the event of a break-in or fraud, the cost of those high-end security measures might end up being far higher than the actual insurance coverage on the funds held in the banks.

I'm not saying the technology is bad, just that it feels redundant. I suspect American banks have considered implementing such devices, but the math probably didn't add up for them... Given that all deposits in the US are insured by the FDIC up to $250k, there isn't much practical reason for such extreme precautionary measures. If I find myself holding more cash than that, I'd simply distribute it across several different accounts so it couldn't be lost all at once.
Eric Newman65 Eric Newman65 Member
28 messages
joined May 2003
#16 ·
When it comes to theft,
the only thing getting stolen is my paycheck, and honestly, it's not even that much to begin with.
Is there some kind of thief out there who would accidentally leave money in my account?😉
Jamie Newman40 Jamie Newman40 Member
26 messages
joined Oct 2005
#17 ·
True, there are those who don't just drain everything out at once; they leave a little bit behind... just enough to keep the account from being closed entirely... 😁
placidjackal97 placidjackal97 Active Member
135 messages
joined May 2003
#18 ·
I’m just sitting here admiring the kind of card Maria Barnes is running.

😁

I didn't actually have to install any software myself.

Sometimes I slack off because I can't be bothered to head downtown—so the bills just sit there on the table and the late notices start piling up.

😕 Didn't you mention you lived right in the middle of the city?
slycrane94 slycrane94 Active Member
58 messages
joined Dec 2002
#19 ·
I’m not saying the tech is bad, just that it's redundant. I’m sure big banks like Wells Fargo have looked into deploying this kind of hardware, but the math probably didn't add up. Since all deposits in the US are FDIC-insured up to $250k, why bother with these extra precautions? If I had more than that, I’d just spread the cash across different accounts so there's nothing left to lose.

Sure, but how are you actually going to prove someone swiped your funds if they logged in using your own PIN?? It might work on paper, but I highly doubt it’s that easy in the real world.
Jack Harris3 Jack Harris3 Regular
451 messages
joined Dec 2002
#20 ·
Winona said:😕 Wait, didn't you mention earlier that you were living right in the heart of downtown...?

Yeah, but you aren't going to get that from home... 😁
Man, this just reminded me of something... I guess I'll actually get around to doing it tomorrow... 😁
Honestly, I think switching over to online banking might actually be the move for me... It could really solve some of the headaches I've been having lately. Maybe I’ll finally just pull the trigger and make the switch...
I wonder how much longer I can hold out before they finally pull the plug on my internet connection... 😁

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