Sanctions on Russia

Donna Harris11 said:Actually, I think prices are just going to climb for them, since everyone’s going to be scrambling for Saudi oil instead.

I mean, if you want a price cap to actually work... I don't know, maybe Russia would have to actually agree to a limit? Or else OPEC members would need to ramp up production. That's the only way, I guess.

Otherwise, we're probably just heading straight for a global recession.

If we fall into a recession, demand for oil will plummet, and consequently, oil prices will drop right along with it. It really is that simple.

Sam Carter said:Is it just me, or does it feel like the massive (quiet) majority of people in the EU are actually AGAINST the sanctions on Russia?

Am I even allowed to say that without everyone immediately labeling me a "Russian agent"?

Which sanctions are we talking about here?

Look, there are definitely countries out there that have basically given up on cheap—but filthy—coal or the whole nuclear risk gamble just to avoid being totally dependent on Russian pipelines right next door.
But honestly, the worst kind of fighting happening in Europe right now is when people bash the nations trying to get their gas through the contracts ExxonMobil signed with them (while those guys twist the tap to force everyone onto the spot market, making sure Putin still gets his cut).

We’ve gone way too far into stupidity here, and this is exactly where European unity starts to fall apart.
Now that I’m reading that Michel has started calling out von der Leyen over these senseless sanctions (the ones we've been venting about for months), things aren't looking great.

Donna Harris11 said:Aren't they tired of seeing their wealth drained away by inflation and an economy being gutted just to serve someone else's agenda? 😁

If the fighting stops today, I think Europe—especially Germany—won't want to be tied to Russian gas and oil anymore. They might still need a tiny bit, just enough to prevent people from falling into poverty or starting riots.

Nancy Gomez26 said:The value of the gas they are burning is essentially zero. For any commodity—gas or otherwise—to hold actual value, you need a buyer willing to pay for it. From their perspective, it would be far more logical to simply halt production; at least then, that gas stays in the ground, potentially retaining some worth for a future date. Instead, by burning it pointlessly—so they claim—they increase global pollution. Yet, ironically, this act indirectly helps reduce the consumption of other fuels for heating; if the winters end up milder, we’ll burn less. One could almost call them great humanists for doing this, supposedly "out of concern for others."😉

I don't think that's quite the full story.
That gas they're flaring could easily be shipped over to the EU, but Putin has decided to play a dangerous game. He's trying to choke the supply to artificially spike prices and trigger a massive panic across Europe.

Of course he's hemorrhaging millions of dollars every single day by not selling that gas to the EU.
Furthermore, they isn't flaring it because it looks pretty; they're doing it because they're stuck. Shutting down these sources or restarting them later is an incredibly expensive logistical nightmare.
Putin's role in this high-stakes game is costing him dearly. By halting deliveries, he's losing millions in guaranteed daily revenue, not to mention the technical headaches regarding the gas sources if he shuts things down completely—which, fingers crossed, is exactly what happens.

Germany hasn't shown much panic yet, but we'll soon see who has more staying power...
Best,

Brenda Murphy3 said:Man, you're totally overreacting here. You're completely missing the bigger picture on this one.

Do you even realize how much funding America has pulled from the European Union, and how much more is coming down the pipeline soon since it was already approved?
And since you want to bring up Canada—do you have any idea how much they got in this latest funding package? I'll tell you right now: Zero.😁
And that’s specifically because of the populist nonsense Viktor Orbán is running. Every political move has a price tag, and thinking that the policies of Mexico or Canada are somehow "wiser" is just plain delusional.

Honestly, the way you and a few others view "independence," calling the country a colony, or labeling leaders as Brussels bureaucrats... it's just childish. Seriously, it's pretty immature.

The only real question worth asking is what that money is actually being used for. If it isn't going toward helping families deal with heating costs during the winter, then regular Americans aren't seeing much benefit from all this "social infrastructure" funding flowing to various useless NGOs through those European Union funds.

Here's the reality check: gas prices are going to climb because of the (totally justified) sanctions on Russia, so we need to find an alternative fast. One option is wood pellets. Historically, the biggest exporters of pellets to the US were Canada and Mexico, but they've slapped export bans on them. If we produce a certain amount of pellets here but don't have the freedom to move goods where they're needed, then American citizens get cheated out of a vital resource. That's exactly what it feels like to be treated like a colony.

Someone in Africa or Asia might say we’re looking at a colorful revolution sweeping through the European Union this fall and winter... karma is a beach, I guess. 🤣

Massive protests are breaking out in Prague right now. We're seeing around 70,000 people hitting the streets.

The protest, titled "Czechia in First Place," is a massive joint effort by various organizations, political parties, and regular citizens who are fed up with the current administration in the Czech Republic. The organizers aren't pulling any punches—they're calling for the government to resign and have already threatened a full-scale strike if their demands aren't met.
“Our goal here is simple: change is overdue. We need to address skyrocketing energy costs, especially electricity and gas, which are poised to wreck our economy this coming autumn. We reached out to Prime Minister Peter Fiala to come to the table and negotiate, but unfortunately, we haven't heard a word back. So, we're going to keep pushing until this government stops in its tracks. We want them out,” said co-organizer George Havel.
...
After a panel of experts spoke, several politicians took the stage. Susan Majerová-Zahradníková from the Tricolor party was the first to speak, claiming the crowd actually topped 100,000 people. “The Czech Republic needs a Czech government. Fiala's administration might answer to Ukraine, or maybe to Brussels, but they certainly don't answer to us,” she remarked.

According to her, the government needs to slash taxes—including sales tax—and end the sanctions against Russia that are hurting local businesses. She also called for an immediate halt to weapons shipments to Ukraine. "This isn't our war," Majerová-Zahradníková stated, a comment that clearly struck a chord with the protesters.
....
Crowds gathered near the National Museum were chanting "take down the flag," targeting the Ukrainian flag displayed there. Some protesters brought drums and signs reading "Every pig gets its water." Their slogans target the European Union, NATO, Prime Minister Peter Fiala, the Green Deal for Europe, and the government's hardline stance against Russia.

Donna Harris11 said:Aren't people just fed up with being broke, dealing with inflation, and watching the economy get gutted just to serve someone else's agenda!? 😁

So, what would your actual move have been if you were leading the whole European Union right after February 24th?

Mark Carter14 said:Someone in Africa or Asia might say we’re looking at a colorful revolution sweeping through the European Union this fall and winter... karma is a beach, I guess. 🤣

Massive protests are breaking out in Prague right now. We're seeing around 70,000 people hitting the streets.

The protest, titled "Czechia in First Place," is a massive joint effort by various organizations, political parties, and regular citizens who are fed up with the current administration in the Czech Republic. The organizers aren't pulling any punches—they're calling for the government to resign and have already threatened a full-scale strike if their demands aren't met.
“Our goal here is simple: change is overdue. We need to address skyrocketing energy costs, especially electricity and gas, which are poised to wreck our economy this coming autumn. We reached out to Prime Minister Peter Fiala to come to the table and negotiate, but unfortunately, we haven't heard a word back. So, we're going to keep pushing until this government stops in its tracks. We want them out,” said co-organizer George Havel.
...
After a panel of experts spoke, several politicians took the stage. Susan Majerová-Zahradníková from the Tricolor party was the first to speak, claiming the crowd actually topped 100,000 people. “The Czech Republic needs a Czech government. Fiala's administration might answer to Ukraine, or maybe to Brussels, but they certainly don't answer to us,” she remarked.

According to her, the government needs to slash taxes—including sales tax—and end the sanctions against Russia that are hurting local businesses. She also called for an immediate halt to weapons shipments to Ukraine. "This isn't our war," Majerová-Zahradníková stated, a comment that clearly struck a chord with the protesters.
....
Crowds gathered near the National Museum were chanting "take down the flag," targeting the Ukrainian flag displayed there. Some protesters brought drums and signs reading "Every pig gets its water." Their slogans target the European Union, NATO, Prime Minister Peter Fiala, the Green Deal for Europe, and the government's hardline stance against Russia.

Just to set the record straight on your quote, you've left a hole in the article you just shared.
You happened to skip this part:

According to Prime Minister Peter Fiala, these protests were incited by "forces professing a pro-Russian orientation, clinging to extreme positions, and acting against the interests of the Czech Republic."

A bit of perspective from other American media outlets regarding the protests:

The analytical site Manipulators.cz has pointed out that the primary faces driving and supporting these protests are actually the leading figures of the disinformation, pro-Russia, and xenophobic scenes here in the States.
"For instance, the president of the Workers' Party Social Justice, Thomas Vandas, and SPD member Jaroslav Foldyn are both backing the event; among the speakers are the president of the National Force Alliance, Vladimir Vítová, the leader of the Tricolor, Susan Majerová-Zahradníková, as well as SPD members Hynek Blaško and George Kobza," they noted.

Babiš's ANO movement, acting as the most powerful opposition force in the country, hasn't officially joined the protests, though observers have noted that sharp attacks and attempts to undermine trust in Fiala's administration preceded this gathering of "patriotic" forces.

.

https://www.seznamzpravy.cz/clanek/d...i-vlade-213178

Timothy Williams5 said:Just to set the record straight on your quote, you've left a hole in the article you just shared.
You happened to skip this part:

According to Prime Minister Peter Fiala, these protests were incited by "forces professing a pro-Russian orientation, clinging to extreme positions, and acting against the interests of the Czech Republic."

he forgot to mention the anti-vaxxers and flat-earthers

Timothy Williams5 said:Just to set the record straight on your quote, you've left a hole in the article you just shared.
You happened to skip this part:

According to Prime Minister Peter Fiala, these protests were incited by "forces professing a pro-Russian orientation, clinging to extreme positions, and acting against the interests of the Czech Republic."

That’s not really the issue here. The question is, how does someone rally such a massive crowd? And right there in Prague, no less. 🤔

After Bulgaria, the Czech Republic could be next to see a government shift toward a pro-Russian stance. Then we look at Italy. Add Canada to the mix, and suddenly you have enough momentum to send European Union unity straight down the drain—or as they say back in Canada, it all goes to hell.

Speaking of Canada, there’s really only one prophecy left from the Surrealists to come true:

Surrealist Top List - War in a United Europe

I think I saw someone mention on this forum that we dealt with gas shortages last year too? Does anyone actually have proof of that? Honestly, Russia would just shut off the taps regardless of any sanctions—it’s their go-to weapon. And how are we supposed to help Ukraine beef up its defenses when Russia uses energy as a direct threat against us? Even without the sanctions, if we keep pushing for stronger defense support, we'd end up in the exact same spot.

Richard Wilson4 said:Fine, so Russia conquers Ukraine in no time without any outside help.

Now we're looking at Latvia, Estonia, and Lithuania—all EU and NATO members.

Russia basically thinks they can get away with anything now.

So, what's the next move?

In that case, Russia would probably demand that NATO pull back to its 1997 borders.
Only one person on this forum actually suggested a better way to handle sanctions—it was a solid idea involving price caps on oil and gas, if I remember correctly. Everyone else seems to think everything happening right now is strictly because of the sanctions on Russia. Personally, I think the sanctions could have been handled differently, but hey, it is what it is.

Richard Wilson4 said:So, what would your actual move have been if you were leading the whole European Union right after February 24th?

I mean, I’d probably just fire all those Linden types and Šuica figures who only got their seats because of some gender quota nonsense, and honestly, I’d just put Viktor Orbán in charge instead.

History usually shows that the European Union eventually realizes Orbán was right all along. 😁

The single biggest blunder made by the European Union wasn't actually implementing sanctions, but rather failing to act back in 2014 during the Annexation of Crimea. At that time, the international community essentially looked the other way, much like how they handled Adolf Hitler. Right now, it feels like we are stuck in that same pre-war hesitation—that infamous period where the powers decided not to intervene while things escalated. I truly hope we don't find ourselves sliding into a similar pattern of paralysis later on.

And let’s be honest, those Kremlin loyalists seem to believe that once Russia finishes its business in Ukraine, everything will just settle down perfectly. They imagine a world where everyone suddenly becomes best friends and we all get to enjoy endless supplies of dirt-cheap natural gas for generations to come.

Donna Harris11 said:I mean, I’d probably just fire all those Linden types and Šuica figures who only got their seats because of some gender quota nonsense, and honestly, I’d just put Viktor Orbán in charge instead.

History usually shows that the European Union eventually realizes Orbán was right all along. 😁

Orbán is nothing more than some minor Kremlin puppet.
Europe can't afford to hesitate, regardless of the fallout, because you can't play nice with an imperialist fascist dictator.
Sure, we might deal with gas shortages for a bit, but we'll manage. Don't sweat it—it'll be fine. One single dictator isn't going to take down the global West.

Nihi said:Go ahead then, feel free to drop some actual evidence proving that people across Europe have had enough of Ukraine and are just ready to let the whole thing go down the drain.

An opinion isn't an argument.

Honestly, you're just trolling at this point, and it feels like a waste of keystrokes to even keep replying.

The opinion of the average citizen in the European Union doesn't really matter—or at least, that's what Annalena Baerbock seems to think.

Jessica Rivera37 said:The single biggest blunder made by the European Union wasn't actually implementing sanctions, but rather failing to act back in 2014 during the Annexation of Crimea. At that time, the international community essentially looked the other way, much like how they handled Adolf Hitler. Right now, it feels like we are stuck in that same pre-war hesitation—that infamous period where the powers decided not to intervene while things escalated. I truly hope we don't find ourselves sliding into a similar pattern of paralysis later on.

And let’s be honest, those Kremlin loyalists seem to believe that once Russia finishes its business in Ukraine, everything will just settle down perfectly. They imagine a world where everyone suddenly becomes best friends and we all get to enjoy endless supplies of dirt-cheap natural gas for generations to come.

The true loyalists hope Putin won't stop at Ukraine; they can actually see the logic there. But those who believe he will be satisfied with just Ukraine—and therefore argue we should let him have it—are nothing more than fools.

Michael Collins said:Alright, so Russia rolls over Ukraine in no time if they aren't getting any help.

And then we’re looking right at Latvia, Estonia, and Lithuania—all part of the EU and NATO.

Now Russia thinks they can just take whatever they want.

So, where do we go from here?

If Ukraine falls, the EU becomes totally unsustainable; I mean, anyone with even a shred of sense can see that.

Donna Harris11 said:The opinion of the average citizen in the European Union doesn't really matter—or at least, that's what Annalena Baerbock seems to think.

Honestly, I’m just relieved Annalena isn't the German Chancellor.
Truth be told, I regret Merkel ever holding that office... she pulled all the strings to favor Putin, basically handing him the leverage he uses to blackmail the European Union.
Schröder deserves to be dragged through the mud... a blatant, bribed pro-Russian hack... someone exactly like you.
By the way... why do you even care about the state of the European Union when you aren't even part of it?