It’s honestly not surprising at all... You’ve got names like Yogananda, Vivekananda, Ramana, and Prabhupada—all of them left behind organizations built on their core principles... which is totally fine... but if you’re actually serious and ready, I think you have to go out and find an authentic living teacher of that same caliber—someone who truly embodies what they were—and you shouldn't settle for anything less (once I realized that, my own Teacher finally appeared) ... people like that are rare, sure, but they definitely still exist on this planet... major props to SP... but he isn't here in the physical sense anymore, and his students just haven't quite reached that level yet...
The real question is what you’re actually looking for... the whole aesthetic is gorgeous—all those colors, the food, the dancing... but it’s all just window dressing. In a spiritual life, the only thing that matters is finding a worthy Guru; everything else is just the scenery. Once I realized how you actually become a Guru at ISKCON, I knew I had to leave—there was no stopping me. I just couldn't bring myself to follow someone whose only qualifications were being "likable" or having a nice singing voice... sorry, but not for me!!! The lineage basically died out after Srila Prabhupada passed... it's obvious. He didn't leave behind a legitimate successor, so it's goodbye to me!!!
Andrew Sanchez572 said:😁 and you could only have been a Bhakta thirty years ago... 🙏 By the way, she ended up picking up the Bhagavad Gita, the first and second volumes of the Srimad Bhagavatam, some self-realization studies, and the Upanishads. That is wonderful! Back when I was just a young girl, I absolutely loved looking through all those beautiful illustrations, especially the ones from the Bhagavatam. 😍
haha... I actually bought the Gita and "The Ultimate Questions" while I was literally in high school... A Bhakta actually walked right into our classroom during class period... but man, everyone went totally wild 🙏😍
Andrew Sanchez572 said:Hmm, I am actually referring to how things used to be back in the day. It has been quite a long time since I spent any regular time at the temple, so I cannot say for certain what the current atmosphere is like. Generally speaking, the preaching tended to be much more intense, though it wasn't specifically targeted at those outside the movement; it felt more like an insider conversation meant for the core group... 🤷
Yeah, no way... then it's obvious you weren't involved in those charity runs (or that whole "health wellness" harassment where people go door-to-door just to push books on them—it's honestly exhausting)... I remember being so stoked when I once managed to sell a whole set to Caitlyn Carter, but now I actually feel kind of guilty about it, knowing some folks gave up their last few dollars...
SP had some pretty rough disagreements with his wife—which definitely shaped how he viewed women and "materialists" later on... I mean, she actually swapped out his favorite book for some tea once, and that was enough to make him walk out the door and never look back. He used to get on the nerves of his close friends because he’d just constantly talk about Krishna... and honestly, it's obvious he passed that right down to his disciples, most of whom struggle big time with their families at home. Plus, everyone around them loves to lecture people without even being asked—it's not that people don't want to talk about these things, but everything has its own time and place, and they just seem to lack any respect for that. People feel it, too... you can tell when someone isn't actually listening to you or caring about you, but is just waiting for an opening to dump their list of verses on you.
Amanda Roberts21 As specified by: Well, I suppose... I might have been a bit excessive when I suggested that things were looking rather bleak... 🙄
It truly breaks my heart to think about the friends I’ve lost to this movement... people I once held dear, all gone because they chose to follow them. I have personally witnessed entire families unraveling right before my eyes because of Hare Krishna. It is deeply unsettling to watch such brilliant, capable individuals slowly lose their grip on reality. I've seen mothers hand over their children to these gurus, sending them into environments that were essentially breeding grounds for predators. Because of their rigid, arbitrary rules, marriages fall apart and homes are destroyed. I have watched beautiful, vibrant women wither away until they are mere shadows of themselves, surviving on nothing but cookies... It is heartbreaking to see intellectuals, people with so much to offer the world, humiliating themselves by selling books just to fund these temples. You end up with these deeply unhappy, intelligent people caught in a sort of limbo—neither fully present in the world nor finding peace in the spiritual realm, just stuck in this gray, hollow zone. I have seen far too much of this devastation firsthand... which is why I tend to be a bit more blunt when it comes to this movement. I believe the old leader was dangerous, and my intensity regarding this group stems from everything I've witnessed...
There’s this one video of his on YouTube—it’s actually a clip from a TV segment—where he makes several rather shallow observations... among other things.
That single sentence tells you everything you need to know about where he stands. For him, realizing God is purely an intellectual exercise—it’s all about data, logic, and accumulating KNOWLEDGE. Love, on the other hand, is treated as nothing more than a matter of willpower... That is the fundamental nature of this entire movement. It is built entirely upon his specific WORDS and commands, creating this elaborate facade of LOVE, when in reality, they harbor nothing but contempt for anyone who doesn't fit their mold...
Well, I’ve certainly looked at everything through many different lenses and tried my hand at just about everything under the sun, but looking back on it all now... I don't have any regrets. Some people end up in much worse positions than I did, mostly because they failed to stick to basic principles like rational judgment. It isn't entirely their fault, of course, but people have this tendency to lean into escapism... and then when reality finally hits them, they find someone else to blame instead of taking responsibility for themselves...
He was always such a stickler for the rules—don't criticize the devotees and stay far away from any kind of sectarianism. But honestly, when you look at those two principles closely, they feel like a direct assault on anyone's right to speak their mind or offer an honest opinion. I’ve seen some people cling to those dictates as if their lives depended on it, holding onto them with absolutely no flexibility whatsoever... and frankly, that just can't be the right way to go about things.
It's the truth. 👍 That’s exactly why this happened—certain people just forced their way in. It's that same type of crowd you see trying to dominate everything in the secular world—they can't seem to get ahead out there, so they found fertile ground in ISKON because nobody dares to stand up to them. Meanwhile, the people who actually *should* be in those positions were pushed to the sidelines—mostly because they're humble and simply refuse to commit any Vaishnava aparadh. 👎
The end result was that all the sane people just walked away—it became completely unbearable... there were really only two choices—either let them suffocate you and force you into a corner without any mercy, or just get out. I chose the latter.
Maybe things are looking up now... honestly, I have no clue.
bluemason3 As I was reflecting on this earlier... one really has to consider the implications of what was said... It seems to me that this current "third" wave of gurus—those who have finally decided to get "down-to-earth" following the complete meltdown of the old zonal acharya system—actually feels like an improvement. Looking at many of them now, such as Sacinandan and Smita Krishna Svami, I find myself thinking they actually possess a certain level of genuine quality... 🙂
Smita Krishna Svami 😍
was 😍 we had such an interesting bond—he actually put a flower garland around my neck once... I still keep it at home!
I meditated on him for a long time, but eventually, I realized someone else was meant for me 😍
... and the last time I went to visit him at the temple... it had been 100 years... by then I’d already been initiated into a different tradition—he gave me a playful slap on the back during kirtan, and then during the namaste Narasimhaya, he pulled me by the arm to make sure I sat right next to him 😍 ... that was such a huge honor for me ... 😢
... I can still vividly remember his lectures... he was a massive inspiration in my life... 🙏
If someone’s acting arrogant, it’s usually because they think they can just slap "as it truly is" after the name Bhagavad Gita—like they own a monopoly on God and spirituality while everyone else is just some demon or lost soul trapped in maya. I’m honestly just speaking up for all those devotees who poured their best years and their entire health into this fake version of spirituality, only to end up totally abandoned—left alone, without an education, without money, without a family, and just completely broken midway between heaven and earth. ... to me, that is demonic in the truest sense of the word... and when I look back at everything now, it honestly makes me want to lose my mind!
Andrew Sanchez572 said:Just to be perfectly clear, I am not a Gaudiya Vaishnava. In fact, I am not a Vaishnava at all, let us be quite clear about that. Nor do I practice yoga. I am not making these observations because I belong to any particular group, but simply because I have made myself informed on the subject matter...
🤣🤣🤣 Just typical mud-slinging...
So your Guru Maharaj (the standard title used in ISKCON)—passed away last year, and now you're claiming you don't know anything? You're just "slightly informed," apparently...
Anyway, Hari bol! ... there's really no point anymore
The idea of being an eternal servant of Krishna—that’s how the soul's nature is described—really sits within the whole philosophy of the *jiva*. Once you actually grasp the distinction between the *jiva* and the *atma*, there won't be any more debate over whether "our" philosophy is right or wrong... because the *jiva* isn't the *atma*... and honestly, you have to dig into the Sanskrit to really get that. I've always wondered why Shrila Prabhupada equated the *jiva* with the *atma*... it just doesn't seem to line up to me.
btw this whole idea of impersonalism and those "impersonalists" Shrila Prabhupada talks about—it’s basically just a concept living in his head and his books. I mean, who actually studies Advaita philosophy enough to claim that what he writes in his books has nothing to do with reality? It’s honestly a total outlier case—fighting against something that doesn't even exist in the real world... you'd have to be pretty gifted to pull off such a wrong interpretation
I was actually there when Kaivalyapati was being called out publicly—it happened because he used some quotes from Bhaktivinoda Thakur during a lecture—so don't try to sell me those stories about legitimacy...
It’s just a clear sign of immaturity and sectarianism... people just swing from one extreme to the other—going from total exclusionism (back in my day) to suddenly acting all "spiritual" and enlightened...
edit: honestly, if you want to talk about belonging to Gaudiya Vaishnavism, go ask an old-school devotee in Jerusalem and see what they tell you.🤣
Look, when people start claiming Vedic authority, they usually point to Shrila Prabhupada—but anyone actually paying attention knows that in ISKCON, nobody touches books from other teachers in his lineage, let alone from different schools. So, when you try to claim the Vedas are backing you up, it’s just a total lie. You can cite Shrila Prabhupada if you want, but he isn't the Vedas 😉 he’s just one commentator among many... and honestly, the quality of his commentary is highly debatable
...first, you have to get over this ridiculous idea that reading other teachers is some kind of sin—as if Shrila Prabhupada is the only divine authority in the entire universe authorized to interpret the Vedas 🤣—and then you're served these little fairy tales... this stuff only works on kids who are just getting their first taste of Vedic literature. Anyone who has actually read Paramahansa Yogananda, Swami Vivekananda, C. V. Raman, or Sri Aurobindo—not to mention the people Shrila Prabhupada personally dismissed as nobodies—isn't going to buy into this nonsense
I've gotta share this with all my fellow yoga lovers out there! 😁
Oh, wow—so where have you been hiding while our great savior was away? We were all just living in such miserable delusion—but hey, you finally showed up! Hail! HAIL! HAIL! Oh, our merciful redeemer!!! 🙏
Casey Morgan26 said:The tricky thing about TM is how they lure you in. They claim it’s just this "relaxation technique" that has absolutely nothing to do with religion and won't require you to overhaul your lifestyle or habits... and then, before you know it, they’re lecturing you on mantra chanting and all that Maharishi nonsense and philosophy... I actually ended up feeling worse after just five days of TM. My tension, anxiety, and depression spiked, and I felt completely disoriented. It was a total shock to my system; it took me nearly twenty days just to feel steady again... I originally signed up for the course because I couldn't sleep and was becoming dependent on sleeping pills, but instead, TM just triggered more psychological issues for me... So, I decided to try practicing it again, but only for five minutes instead of the full twenty... I did that for about nine days. I can't even say what the effects were, really. At times, it would calm me down and quiet my thoughts, but other times it would leave me in this state of lethargy and apathy, or occasionally, it would just irritate my psyche again... I suppose doing a minute or two of TM before bed helped me fall asleep for a couple of nights... But my overall impression? TM just stirs up negative emotions in me. It feels like it numbs me out or makes me indifferent to everything around me, giving off this fake sense of peace... At least, that's how it felt to me... People say you have to stick with it for at least twenty or thirty days to see the actual results, but honestly, I'm afraid that continuing might just make my mental health even worse...
What I’m specifically wondering about is: why is TM the only one that gets all this scientific scrutiny? They spout all this fluff about a "fourth state of consciousness" and similar nonsense, when in reality, the technique just triggers alpha waves in the brain which induces relaxation, slows down breathing, and lowers metabolism—basically just a way to release some stress... Apparently, that helps some people resolve health issues, while for others, it creates even bigger problems...
So, I want to know, does only TM have this kind of effect, or do all other forms of meditation work this way? Is there anything else that could help with insomnia and anxiety? Maybe some milder meditation or something? Because clearly, the pills aren't solving the problem, lol...
... for calming herbs, I'd suggest combining valerian with lemon balm—and as for exercise, try hiking until you're absolutely wiped out.😍