Dealing with lactose intolerance

dustypilot2 said:when your own neck is on the line...

Since we're talking about heads 😉, Lulu, you even realize that hair dye is carcinogenic? 😁

dustypilot2 said:I'm gonna give the rice milk a shot—if it sucks, then whatever... life goes on.

btw, has anyone actually tried it? Does it taste anything like real milk, or is it just bland like soy milk?

Honestly, coffee with rice milk tastes way better than the soy stuff... hands down. I've tried both, and I could totally get used to the rice milk if it weren't such a rip-off price-wise. It’s not like dairy bothers me or anything, but rice milk is just... really nice. Give it a go, you won't regret it...

dustypilot2 said:I'd much rather eat like a damn Turk and live like an American—clean shaven and carefree... honestly, I wouldn't give a single damn!''😁

But what's actually wrong with that mindset? Honestly... those people living in total religious, orthorexic paranoia—the kind you described—they're gonna die anyway. And let's be real, the odds of someone eating "perfectly healthy" living way longer are super slim. Even then, they'll probably just end up fighting cancer down the road, while the guy who eats like a typical American just takes a sudden hit from a heart attack. I'll leave it to you to decide which of those two paths is actually better...

Out of all these alternatives, oat milk is probably your best bet, though I wouldn't dream of using it in coffee—it tastes absolutely revolting there. You’re much better off sticking with cream; oat milk specifically just ends up separating and curdling in your cup.

But then again, hello? Milk is unhealthy, yet we're all sitting here drinking coffee??

I honestly can't stand this, so I'm editing my comment rather than cluttering the thread with another post. >, seriously, how much milk are you actually pouring into your coffee? You can't honestly believe that tiny daily amount is going to wreck your health. Unless you have some sort of religious 😬 reason for avoiding dairy, there really isn't any cause for concern.

To be fair, I should probably point out that these various grain-based milks aren't actually substitutes for dairy, neither when it comes to flavor nor nutritional profile; much like how tofu wasn't originally intended to replace meat, they are simply entirely different categories of food. Besides, these plant milks—which tend to be quite overpriced—can easily be made right in your own kitchen if you actually have the patience to bother with it.

Betty Bennett10 said:Wait, hold up—milk is bad for you, but coffee is totally fine??

Look, man, you're starting a thread about someone being lactose intolerant... it’s unhealthy FOR HIM because it’s an actual medical thing—like, he's literally missing an enzyme. It’s a deficiency, not a choice. And then you get those religious types jumping in later with their own takes...

Yes, I’m well aware of what lactose intolerance entails; I was simply responding to dustypilot2's post.

It’s possible that even John Ruiz4 wouldn't be negatively affected by such a negligible amount of milk—just enough to splash into a cup of coffee—though I suppose it really depends on how sensitive his system is to lactose. There are plenty of people living with the intolerance who can still manage things like yogurt without much trouble, my own mother being a prime example.

Not all soy milk is created equal, if you can even call it that. Most of the plain stuff tastes like nothing at all, but if you grab the version fortified with calcium, it’s actually decent—honestly, way better than those watery rice or oat alternatives. You should track down some Provamel with added calcium next time you're at a Whole Foods. 👍

dustypilot2 said:That’s just the truth... I mean, where on earth are you getting your information from, driftinggull13? Did your cat sit you down for a lecture on nutrition or something?...
😁

I was just reading through the reasoning for why we shouldn't be drinking milk, and it basically boils down to the idea that it's meant for infants, not grown adults... which honestly makes sense when you stop and think about it. I mean, if you really look at the biological reality here, humans are pretty much the only animals on this entire planet that continue to consume milk well after they've reached maturity... so, yeah, there's definitely some truth to the claim that it isn't exactly ideal for us once we're all grown up...

And there it is... the classic "I read somewhere once" approach. Honestly, if you’d just put in a tiny bit of actual effort to look up some legitimate literature—or even just scrolled through the old threads on this topic instead of jumping to conclusions—you wouldn't be asking such basic questions in the first place. I really don't get why people refuse to actually study physiology or nutritional biochemistry, choosing instead to swallow whatever garbage they find online or flip through those mindless, pseudo-scientific wellness magazines... it's just exhausting...
Look, milk is just fundamentally healthy because the nutritional profile is so perfectly balanced—you’ve got your proteins, fats, minerals, vitamins, and all that good stuff... honestly, that's really all kids even need to thrive. Is that part making sense to you? I mean, if you look at the facts, there isn't any other single food out there that hits those exact ratios quite like this does, so in my book, it's easily the best thing you can put on a plate...
Look, adults don't just sit around drinking milk, you know? It’s basic biology... I mean, an adult cat isn't exactly nursing from its mother while she's in heat or whatever, so why would they suddenly want it? You could try offering some milk to an adult cat if you really wanted to see what happens, but honestly, you'll probably just find out they aren't interested at all...
Oh, please... "bon ton"? What part of my last post was supposedly offensive? Honestly, I don't get it. The lady this was even aimed at already got a massive dose of reality, but she’s still clinging to those same tired beliefs despite being hit with nothing but hard facts... because, you know how it goes, facts only matter when they fit perfectly into her little ideological bubble, and the second anything contradicts her worldview, you just have to keep repeating yourself across a hundred different threads... it's exhausting...
Does this even make sense to anyone else?????? Good grief, I mean, seriously... how on earth are animals supposed to be drinking milk when they aren't even in their lactation period??????
Look, you really have to focus on the actual nutritional value here, rather than getting all caught up in the social implications or how it fits into some lifestyle trend... because honestly, if you aren't looking at what's actually going into your body, none of that other stuff even matters...😉

driftinggull13 said:Here we go again. The classic "I read somewhere" approach... honestly, if you’d just put in a little extra effort to dig through actual medical journals or even just scroll through some old threads on this topic, you wouldn't have to ask about basic physiology... but hey, here we are. It’s funny how people skip over the actual biochemistry of nutrition just to obsess over whatever nonsense they find on random websites or those tacky, low-rent wellness magazines... turns out studying science is harder than clicking a link...

Why is it outdated? Well, because we just know so much more now than we used to... It’s become pretty clear that a lot of what we once slapped a "healthy" label on isn't actually good for us at all... turns out everything changes...

Milk is just pure fuel because it’s got that perfect balance... you know, proteins, fats, minerals, vitamins, all that good stuff. Honestly, kids shouldn't need anything else...
Does that part make sense? I mean, you just won't find any other food with a profile like that... basically, it's the gold standard...

Mladun doesn't touch pasteurized milk! What is your deal...? Besides, in almost every case, animals just drink milk from other animals of their own kind anyway...

Adult cats don't just sit around drinking milk... I mean, an adult cat isn't exactly nursing from its mom while she's lactating, right? It just doesn't happen. You should try offering some milk to an adult cat and see if they even touch it... or if they just turn their nose up at you...

What exactly are we trying to prove here? If that’s the case, then we're basically blaming the person for the fact that a cat decides to lap up some pasteurized milk... which feels a bit much. I mean, have you ever actually looked at what cats eat? Most of that standard kibble stuff is packed with grains anyway. And honestly, I've seen a cat grazing on wheat before... just out there in the yard...

Does this even make sense? Like, is this actually okay? Good grief... I mean, how on earth are animals supposed to drink milk when they aren't even lactating anymore? It just doesn't add up...
You’ve gotta look at the nutritional value, not the social status of what you're eating...😉

I’d say they just don't drink it because there’s no real need for it... if it were actually necessary, animals would have always been providing milk—evolution would have taken care of that part by now...

driftinggull13 said:There it is. The classic "I read somewhere" approach. If you’d actually put in some effort to look at actual literature—or even just dig through old threads on this topic—you wouldn't be asking questions about physiology. It's because people don't bother reading actual nutrition biochemistry and instead swallow whatever garbage they find on random websites or those clueless "wellness" magazines.
Milk is healthy because of its balanced profile of proteins, fats, minerals, vitamins, etc., which is exactly what kids need. Get it? No other food has a composition quite like it; basically, it's the ultimate food.
Adults don't drink milk because they don't have access to it anymore. An adult cat doesn't nurse from its mother once she's out of lactation. Try giving an adult cat milk and see if they even touch it.
Etiquette??? What part of my last post was offensive? The person I was talking to got a whole dose of data, but she's sticking to her guns despite all the facts presented. Facts are facts when they fit someone's ideological matrix, but the second they don't, you have to repeat them across a hundred different threads.
It "doesn't make sense" that it isn't good?????? Good grief, how can animals drink milk when they don't have it outside of lactation periods??????
You have to look at nutritional value, not social context.😉

Mr. Read, while you're busy reading physiology, maybe try picking up some pathology too so you stop talking such obvious crap.

Finally explain why someone with a genetic lactose deficiency would touch a food they're intolerant to. Why wouldn't they just stick to dairy products where bacteria have already converted the lactose into lactic acid (like yogurt or kefir)? If they want ice cream, there's fruit sorbet.

As for cats, you clearly still have that cliché stuck in your head that cats drink milk and love catching mice.
Lactase levels in adult cats drop to about 10% compared to kittens, so milk is basically just fuel for bacteria and a one-way ticket to diarrhea (it's osmotically active, messes with their flora, causes gas, etc.).
Plus, the phosphorus concentration in cow's milk is three times higher, which is terrible for their kidneys...

It would be interesting to look at the historical side of why certain groups of people can't handle unfermented milk.

When it comes to the nutritional value of milk, it completely falls apart for that specific group of people.
Because of ignorance like this, battles have been lost in wars. Luckily, they didn't lose the war, because they eventually realized what actually mattered during the American Civil War.

northernskipper41 said:Look, Mr. Read, maybe if you actually bothered to read some physiology—and I mean real, actual science—instead of just skimming the surface, you wouldn't be lecturing me on stuff that's common knowledge...

I mean, seriously, why would anyone with a genetic lactose intolerance even touch a product that triggers them? Why wouldn't they just stick to fermented dairy where bacteria have already converted the lactose into lactic acid—you know, like yogurt or kefir? And if someone’s craving ice cream, there’s plenty of fruit-based options out there...

And as for cats, you clearly still have those old-school tropes stuck in your head about how cats just love drinking milk and hunting mice...
The lactase levels in adult cats drop to about 10% compared to kittens, so giving them milk is basically just feeding a petri dish for bacteria and begging for diarrhea—it's osmotically active, it messes with their gut flora, causes gas, all that...
Plus, the phosphorus concentration in cow's milk is three times higher, which isn't exactly doing their kidneys any favors either...

It would actually be pretty interesting to dig into the historical reasons why certain groups of people can't handle unfermented milk in the first place...

When it comes to the nutritional value of milk, it completely falls apart for that specific demographic...
Because of ignorance like this, battles were lost in history, though thankfully wars weren't lost because people eventually figured things out during the American Civil War...

If this stuff were "well known," I wouldn't be sitting here typing it all out, would I? Maybe try reading the thread a little more carefully... where exactly did I claim that milk is healthy for people who are lactose intolerant? Those folks aren't the benchmark for measuring the nutritional value of milk. And what's with this whole thing about cats losing lactase activity? My cat handles it perfectly fine, and it’s not just my cat...
Stop lecturing me about genetics or whatever medical condition you think you're an expert on and just talk about the nutritional value of milk compared to other foods. That's the only way to judge quality, not by looking at people it actually harms due to biological malfunctions. Is my point clear enough for you now?
If you want to compare food quality, then look at the composition, the variety, and the balance of nutrients within them, and then go ahead—find me one single food that even comes close to the quality of milk.

So Max, part of the milk was skimmed, big deal. So what? It has slightly less fat, so what?
What cereal are you even talking about? Please, go ahead, put some cereal in front of a cat and let me see if it eats it. That's a different story when companies hide stuff behind artificial flavors. Milk gets eaten plain and simple, and it's not just cats...
Come on, geniuses, which food item has a nutritional profile similar to milk?
Let me say it one more time for the people in the back: the nutritional value of a food has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not people are lactose intolerant.

Betty Bennett10 said:Yeah, yeah, I get what lactose intolerance is. I was just reacting to what dustypilot2 posted.

Maybe even John Ruiz4 wouldn't feel a thing from that tiny splash of milk in his coffee, but who knows? Depends on how sensitive he actually is. A lot of people with lactose issues can still handle stuff like yogurt (my mom, for example).

True, I eat yogurt all the time and it doesn't mess with me at all. But only Vindijin brands don't have that milk sugar in them—some other yogurts definitely do.🙂

driftinggull13 said:Alright geniuses, let's hear it... what other food out there actually matches the nutritional profile of milk?
Just to clear things up for the stubborn crowd here: nutritional value has absolutely nothing to do with people who happen to be lactose intolerant.

Look, fresh milk straight from a cow or a goat is packed with nutrients. But that homogenized, watered-down, pasteurized stuff you grab at a grocery store like Kroger? That's basically junk. It's got almost no nutritional value left... you really can't call a product like that "healthy."

Look, driftinggull13, you're talking about people with lactose intolerance like they're somehow broken, which pretty much shows how little you actually know about this...

Between 30 and 50 million Americans deal with lactose intolerance. It hits certain ethnic and racial groups way harder than others. For instance, as many as 75 percent of All African Americans and American Indians and 90 percent of Asian Americans are affected. Meanwhile, the condition is least Common among persons of northern European descent.

driftinggull13 said:If this stuff was common knowledge, I wouldn't be wasting my breath writing about it here. Read the thread more carefully—where did I ever say milk is healthy for people with lactose intolerance? Those folks aren't the benchmark for how nutritious milk actually is. Besides, what's the deal with cats losing their lactase activity? My cat handles it just fine at home without any issues, and so does mine.
Stop lecturing me on genetics or whatever medical nonsense and talk about the nutritional value of milk compared to other foods. That’s the only way to measure quality, not by looking at people who can't digest it because of some biological glitch. You get what I'm saying now?
If you want to compare food quality, look at the composition, the variety, and the balance of nutrients. Go ahead, find me one single thing that matches the quality of milk.

So Max defended the skim milk part, big deal. So what if there's a little less fat? What's the harm?
Give me an example of a grain, please. Put some grain in front of a cat and let's see if they'll eat it. And don't even get me started on how they hide flavors in those things. Cats drink milk straight up, no additives needed, and it's not just my cat.
Come on, geniuses, which food actually has nutritional values close to milk?
Let me repeat it for the slow learners: a food's nutritional value has nothing to do with whether or not certain people are lactose intolerant.

Go back and read your very first post in this thread.

I specifically commented on the makeup of milk. Even old Hippocrates claimed it was the most perfect food. The reality is that for intolerant people, all that sugar makes it lose any real nutritional worth.
Milk has about 3.3% protein, 3.9% milk fat, and roughly 4.7% lactose (which means 47g of lactose per liter—just think about how much that can feed the bacteria in the gut).
That said, there are dairy products that are nutritionally superior (higher dry matter content) and don't contain that problematic sugar.

When diarrhea hits, the body stops producing lactase altogether if it's already struggling (so you diet).

It's not just people with genetic issues in that group; we're talking about entire populations whose ancestors were strictly farmers... (which is why they came up with yogurt, cheese, and all that. Look at it sideways—there are plenty of African Americans in that category, just like there are people from certain European backgrounds).

As for grains and cats...
Cats are obligate carnivores, plain and simple.
The biological value of grain protein is a disaster (around 35), whereas for ruminants, it's closer to 70.
If rice has 7% protein but a biological value of only 35, that's basically like having 2.5% protein if a 150lb human needed to meet their requirements (about 60g of protein daily). They'd have to eat like 6 pounds of rice a day. Impossible. It's 79% carbs—pure energy export.

I'm saying this for the good of the cats.

People have these wrong ideas that lead them to give cats cow's milk. Cats love milk, regardless of whether they can handle the lactose or not. If they get diarrhea later, they won't even connect it to the milk they drank (and honestly, neither do some people when they really think about it).
It's well known that people who eat more bread (including those scavenging through trash) produce more amylase in their saliva over time as the body adapts. The same applies to cats and milk.

But we need to look at this from a nutritional standpoint, like driftinggull13 wants.
Analysis of cow's milk shows that the calcium-to-phosphorus ratio and the lactose levels are too high, while the energy, protein, and fat are too low to support a growing kitten.
You could add an egg yolk to cow's milk to enrich it and bump the protein and fat up to an acceptable level. (Egg whites, despite having most of the protein, shouldn't be added because cats don't like them, plus they contain avidin, which binds biotin and makes it unusable).
By the time we're done crunching the numbers, you've still got calcium levels sitting at 4x too high and phosphorus at 2x too high compared to what a cat actually needs.

Any sane person can see that feeding cats cow's milk long-term is just plain wrong—it’s unhealthy. Given their protein requirements, the only way milk even makes sense is if you're using it as a substitute for water (which they won't chug by the gallon, and even if they did, they wouldn't last long), and honestly, you'd have to dilute it with equal parts water anyway—not just because of the lactose, but because of those minerals.

Now that we've finally settled on how "perfect" milk is as a food source (shout out to Hippocrates and everyone up through the 7th century), go ahead and drink your precious milk. Just give the cat some meat or buy actual cat food.

driftinggull13 said:Where did I ever say milk was healthy for people who are lactose intolerant?

People who can't handle lactose shouldn't be the benchmark for how nutritious milk actually is.

Stop lecturing everyone on genetics or other medical issues and just talk about the nutritional value of milk compared to other foods.
That’s the only way to judge quality, instead of focusing on people for whom it causes issues due to biological makeup.

You were the first one to jump in here and start preaching to lactose-intolerant folks about how milk is all that's good for them.

Go ahead, try explaining to an Eskimo that chocolate is a nutritional powerhouse.
All you'll do is kill him because he lacks the sugar processing for it.

So, according to you, Eskimos are just biologically flawed?😕 🙄 ,
If you ask me, they and their ancestors never even needed that enzyme—their diet is basically 50% fat.

dustypilot2 said:True... I mean, where's this idea coming from, driftinggull13? Did your cat tell you milk is healthy?
😁

I read the same thing regarding why we shouldn't drink milk—apparently, it's meant for infants, not grown animals. In reality, humans are pretty much the ONLY animals that keep drinking milk after they've matured... so, I guess there's some logic to the idea that it isn't good...

Anyway, I tried that soy milk, hoping I wouldn't have to give up my coffee with milk.🙂 But honestly? It was GROSS. I ended up just tossing it. It’s not even about adjusting to a new taste; I just don't get why anyone calls it a substitute when it doesn't even taste remotely like milk. I mean, seriously??
It was a total disappointment.

I might try rice milk next, and if that sucks too, well, screw it.

By the way, has anyone tried almond milk? Does it actually taste like milk, or is it just bland like the soy stuff?

I think rice milk is great.

So, I’m just sitting here reading through everything and waiting for someone to actually drop a real, solid suggestion for John Ruiz4, but despite all these self-proclaimed "experts" hanging out on this forum, there isn't a single useful word to be found... 😉

I mean, look, any kind of food allergy or pollen sensitivity—or really any weird reaction your body has—it all starts from the inside, right? It’s usually some kind of deficiency caused directly by what you're eating, but unfortunately, people just don't know enough about that stuff yet... 😢

What’s actually worked—and I've seen this firsthand with plenty of folks dealing with all sorts of allergies—is focusing on "cellular nutrition." Honestly, I truly believe that's the key to fixing things for John Ruiz4 too.. 🙂

👋

It’s purely genetic—evolutionary stuff, really. There’s no point overthinking it; you just gotta skip the lactose

maybe she’s got some Attila the Hun in her bloodline