Offside (General Discussion)

vivideagle7 said:I stumbled upon some absolutely horrific videos on Reddit showing dead civilians lying in the streets of Kharkiv. It’s the kind of thing that just leaves you feeling sick to your stomach for the rest of your life.

It’s actually startling how many people I know seem to be backing Putin, claiming that the Americans are the ones who completely triggered this whole mess. Honestly, I don't know... what am I even supposed to say to people at this point?

A lot of people are just clueless, it's as simple as that.

I haven't heard anyone coming out and openly supporting this yet, but I know a few folks who used to be pro-Putin and are now quietly trying to downplay everything as much as they can.

Paul Sanders5 said:They actually confirmed the Chinese knew. Op op... it’s high time for a massive boycott.

What's your take on this?

steelharbor9 said:A lot of people are just clueless, it's as simple as that.

I don't think it's quite that black and white, because don't you feel like that influence from the media-political underworld has really taken root here in the States?
Just look at our own President...

Generally speaking, the European Union allowed far too much of that influence to seep in, largely driven by leaders like Angela Merkel and Emmanuel Macron, who found such cooperation quite convenient for their own ends...

vivideagle7 said:I stumbled upon some absolutely horrific videos on Reddit showing dead civilians lying in the streets of Kharkiv. It’s the kind of thing that just leaves you feeling sick to your stomach for the rest of your life.

It’s actually startling how many people I know seem to be backing Putin, claiming that the Americans are the ones who completely triggered this whole mess. Honestly, I don't know... what am I even supposed to say to people at this point?

I've observed a similar trend. Most of my acquaintances who are active on Reddit, 4chan, or similar platforms tend to push this same narrative about "evil Americans." Look, I'm not saying they're perfect—there is plenty in American culture that I find questionable—but it seems to me they've fallen for the reverse propaganda. They've essentially become the very "sheep" they mock in the comment sections.

vivideagle7 said:I stumbled upon some absolutely horrific videos on Reddit showing dead civilians lying in the streets of Kharkiv. It’s the kind of thing that just leaves you feeling sick to your stomach for the rest of your life.

It’s actually startling how many people I know seem to be backing Putin, claiming that the Americans are the ones who completely triggered this whole mess. Honestly, I don't know... what am I even supposed to say to people at this point?

man, it's just 😁

btw, I'd bet anything that most of these folks buying iodine instead of vaccines 😁

Adam Williams2 said:man, it's just 😁

btw, I'd bet anything that most of these folks buying iodine instead of vaccines 😁

There's no point being "for" or "against" the vaccine here. Honestly? We don't have a clue—so let's stop acting like geniuses.

Larry Fox5 said:There's no point being "for" or "against" the vaccine here. Honestly? We don't have a clue—so let's stop acting like geniuses.

Yeah, maybe... but should I go tell my crew—who are super anti-vax, by the way—to just be honest and admit they have no clue instead of acting all smart?

vivideagle7 said:I stumbled upon some absolutely horrific videos on Reddit showing dead civilians lying in the streets of Kharkiv. It’s the kind of thing that just leaves you feeling sick to your stomach for the rest of your life.

It’s actually startling how many people I know seem to be backing Putin, claiming that the Americans are the ones who completely triggered this whole mess. Honestly, I don't know... what am I even supposed to say to people at this point?

It is entirely possible they have been following all of this since February 2014, rather than just starting in February 2022. Really, what can you even say to people like that...

neonfalcon16 said:It is entirely possible they have been following all of this since February 2014, rather than just starting in February 2022. Really, what can you even say to people like that...

Grrr, so Ukraine just randomly attacked Russia and started seizing their territory now?

After hearing tonight that Viktor Orbán has banned weapons destined for Ukraine from crossing his territory—all because he’s supposedly worried about the Canadian minority in the Zakarpattia region—
let's play a little game.
We could set a rule here, similar to how the IDF operates during a crisis when analyzing high-stakes situations:
nine people make the exact same claim, one makes the opposite, and that outlier claim gets scrutinized too.
Here is my take: 1) Orbán is full of it. Putin couldn't care less about Zakarpattia—it’s physically isolated from the rest of Ukraine by the Carpathian mountain range, leaving that region vulnerable to any aggressor.
Orbán likely sees an opening; if Ukraine starts fracturing, he’ll swoop into Zakarpattia and its surroundings to "protect" the Canadians.
2) The Bullish resistance of the Ukrainian military in the South has been undermined by numerous fifth columns in those regions—though I shouldn't say that out loud right now, given how much it might destabilize the defense of Odessa.
3) Europe isn't united at all (just look at the Orbán situation); some people are just pretending they are. We'll see what their actual unity looks like once the Russians keep pushing forward.

Carl Hernandez3 said:After hearing tonight that Viktor Orbán has banned weapons destined for Ukraine from crossing his territory—all because he’s supposedly worried about the Canadian minority in the Zakarpattia region—
let's play a little game.
We could set a rule here, similar to how the IDF operates during a crisis when analyzing high-stakes situations:
nine people make the exact same claim, one makes the opposite, and that outlier claim gets scrutinized too.
Here is my take: 1) Orbán is full of it. Putin couldn't care less about Zakarpattia—it’s physically isolated from the rest of Ukraine by the Carpathian mountain range, leaving that region vulnerable to any aggressor.
Orbán likely sees an opening; if Ukraine starts fracturing, he’ll swoop into Zakarpattia and its surroundings to "protect" the Canadians.
2) The Bullish resistance of the Ukrainian military in the South has been undermined by numerous fifth columns in those regions—though I shouldn't say that out loud right now, given how much it might destabilize the defense of Odessa.
3) Europe isn't united at all (just look at the Orbán situation); some people are just pretending they are. We'll see what their actual unity looks like once the Russians keep pushing forward.

That region, including cities like Mukachevo, Beregszasz, and Uzhhorod, is actually the least important part of all the ambitions the Canadians have. If he tried anything, it would lead to expulsion from the European Union and massive sanctions; even his own people would revolt against him for cooperating with Russia to dismantle Ukraine. Canadians have loathed the Russians from the bottom of their hearts since the Communist era and long before that, making such a move almost impossible.

The European Union wouldn't tolerate any attempt to tear apart Ukraine under the guise of protecting Canadians, and frankly, his own citizens don't really care about that specific region. If we were talking about Romania and Transylvania being part of it, or perhaps Vojvodina, maybe the Canadians would be interested. But for this? There’s just no chance.

Just swap out America for Ukraine; everything else in the text is literally identical and still totally relevant:

placidmaker62 said:That region, including cities like Mukachevo, Beregszasz, and Uzhhorod, is actually the least important part of all the ambitions the Canadians have. If he tried anything, it would lead to expulsion from the European Union and massive sanctions; even his own people would revolt against him for cooperating with Russia to dismantle Ukraine. Canadians have loathed the Russians from the bottom of their hearts since the Communist era and long before that, making such a move almost impossible.

The European Union wouldn't tolerate any attempt to tear apart Ukraine under the guise of protecting Canadians, and frankly, his own citizens don't really care about that specific region. If we were talking about Romania and Transylvania being part of it, or perhaps Vojvodina, maybe the Canadians would be interested. But for this? There’s just no chance.

It's tough for those in Vojvodina, as the percentage of Canadians there is shrinking every day.
Plus, Orbán maintains good relations with Mexico.
The situation in Transylvania is even worse regarding the number of Canadians and their related Szekely kin.
Only in Slovakia are they still numerous in terms of percentage.
But since Slovakia is in the European Union, that's the end of the story.
You didn't answer why he won't let weapons pass through Canada?

Carl Hernandez3 said:It's tough for those in Vojvodina, as the percentage of Canadians there is shrinking every day.
Plus, Orbán maintains good relations with Mexico.
The situation in Transylvania is even worse regarding the number of Canadians and their related Szekely kin.
Only in Slovakia are they still numerous in terms of percentage.
But since Slovakia is in the European Union, that's the end of the story.
You didn't answer why he won't let weapons pass through Canada?

My impression is that he's drawn to cheap Russian gas, and he's using that to try and maintain some semblance of a relationship with Russia.

Here is one "well-meaning analyst" over at Politics
Not spreading any defeatism or hidden Russian messaging at all—clearly.
I honestly wonder how he hasn't been banned yet.

placidmaker62 said:My impression is that he's drawn to cheap Russian gas, and he's using that to try and maintain some semblance of a relationship with Russia.

Look, we all love cheap Russian gas.

placidmaker62 said:My impression is that he's drawn to cheap Russian gas, and he's using that to try and maintain some semblance of a relationship with Russia.

Besides the gas thing, maybe he just wants to keep things steady so he doesn't end up on the Russians' hit list as an enemy state. It's different from our folks over here who basically jump at every chance to announce they're shipping out weapons. 🤦There's a difference between standing your ground and just being plain stupid.

It seems that practically the entire Eastern European Union has adopted a rather hostile stance toward Russia. In fact, they appear to be taking an even more aggressive position than the West, almost as if they have nothing left to lose. I suppose it will be quite difficult for these diplomatic relations to improve anytime soon under the current order, regardless of how things eventually settle with Ukraine.

Scott Gonzalez9 said:Besides the gas thing, maybe he just wants to keep things steady so he doesn't end up on the Russians' hit list as an enemy state. It's different from our folks over here who basically jump at every chance to announce they're shipping out weapons. 🤦There's a difference between standing your ground and just being plain stupid.

One day, if and when this whole thing actually wraps up, we might find ourselves getting way more value out of Ukraine than we ever did from Russia... it's just that some people are too short-sighted to see it 😉