Vlašić vs Kostelić

I think Vlašić is spot on about this year... for some people, it seems like their horizons barely stretch past the limits of a small town like Des Moines... ☕

analogowl122 said:-Michael Jordan only has one Olympic gold, no world championship medal, and he isn't even in the top 10 for NBA titles..

Come on, he's tied for 10th with Kareem, Cousy, and Pippen.

On topic: I think this whole debate is pointless because comparing stats between two different sports is just silly, especially when using that outdated approach HOO tries to use to sound objective.

Honestly, I find it pretty pathetic when you need everyone else to validate your achievements. You have your results, and in sports, results are everything. These awards handed out based on subjective criteria don't mean a thing. But hey, we all have our flaws, and the stuff regarding Vlašić and Kostelić is just broadcasted to millions just so people have an easier target to bash.

The debate over who holds the title is frankly pointless. In America, everyone is considered a master within their own specific domain—you simply cannot draw a fair comparison between two disciplines that are fundamentally different.
But honestly, don't kill me, I have no clue what Vlašić was thinking when he sent that letter. It’s almost as if the logic is: "Nobody likes me, I’m actually the greatest, Gips doesn't know anything, and track and field is the supreme sport in the entire universe." 🙂 🙂 Don't even get me started on those HOO awards.
Furthermore, my firm belief remains that Olympic medals carry a weight that nothing else can match—the Diamond League doesn't even come close.

frozentiger6 said:So, were you also kicking everyone out of the living room—or maybe even out of the house entirely—on Saturday and Sunday mornings just because your wife would ask, "Why are you getting so worked up, honey? Is there actually any money in this?"

No, it was more about watching her races, since I was rarely home on weekends anyway, stuck either at tournaments or grinding through college exams... and I suppose I had to shut the rest of the world out just to actually enjoy the footage, though life certainly wasn't easy back then...😁

analogowl122 said:I'm just skeptical when it comes to those "Greatest of All Time" debates. ☕
Especially when you're dealing with a concept as massive as all of sports combined.
I already gave an example of how pointless that can get.
But let's get specific:
Look, there's no debate here—Janica is our greatest athlete of all time.
As of 😁
Just imagine if Blanka (using her as an example) grabbed Olympic gold plus another medal. Add a few European and World Championship medals to that pile.
What would the tally look like?
-Olympic silver and Olympic gold (plus maybe one more)—you can't really go much higher than that.
But we already have:
-4 World Championship titles, plus silver and bronze (and probably others)
-1 European gold (likely others too)
-Mediterranean Games - gold
-And God knows how many World Cup wins, like the Golden / Diamond League, plus countless podium finishes in various World Cup races and meets.
The point is, Janica isn't even that far ahead. Blanka would only need that Olympic gold to start those ridiculous debates about who was better.
Personally, I think people should stay out of it.

This isn't actually about being the "greatest of all time." It's about the fact that Janica was so dominant across skiing disciplines—even accounting for the competition she faced in giant slalom—that it was genuinely impressive. That kind of dominance is rare in any sport.

Maybe Hildegard will argue this is just some collective American sentiment, but in the world of skiing, Janica was the lion among beasts. Sure, there are faster or stronger animals out there, but there’s only one queen.

The only way Blanka could even be compared to Janica is if she went out and won gold in the 100m sprint, the javelin throw, the 400m, and high jump combined.
Janica mastered every discipline. Aside from needing skis, poles, and boots, the events aren't even that similar, yet she was untouchable. You always got the feeling she’d win whenever she felt like it. And don't forget how brutal skiing is; you're hurtling down a mountain at the speed of a sports car. On some slopes, you'd practically need the Highway Patrol to pull you over for speeding. That alone shows how much work she put in to dominate like that... and if nothing else, it explains why her body was so spent by the end of her career.

Janica is one of a kind. No American athlete has ever annoyed me less than her; I always knew if she wanted to win, she would. If she didn't feel like it? Well, screw it, she'll try again next time.

Joško Vlašić isn't just some coach standing behind Blanka Vlašić; we operate as a tandem, and I honestly can't wrap my head around why he hasn't mentioned Marinović even once. Instead, he just keeps talking about himself.

Gips ☕

dustypanther6 said:Joško Vlašić isn't actually Blanka Vlašić's coach—we work as a team. I just don't get why he never mentions Marinović and always makes it all about himself.

How is that not clear to you? 🤷
It's because he's an egoist who can't stop talking himself up.

Huge props to Blanka and Ivica... truly impressive stuff from them both... 🙏

I’m firmly on Gips' side here. For years now, Joško has been searching for any excuse to tear others down just to boost his own ego. Honestly, Kostelić really shouldn't have let himself get provoked like that... it just makes them both look ridiculous...

I’m firmly in the camp of supporting Gips... to my mind, pulling off a win in a slalom during the World Cup is a much more significant achievement than winning at a Diamond League meet. In a slalom, you’re looking at 15 to 20 different skiers who all have the potential to take the top spot in any given race. But at a Diamond League meet? You’ve only got about 8 to 10 jumpers, maybe five of whom can clear 195, and really only three of them are true contenders for the win...
Using the total number of members in an athletics federation as a metric to prove how tough the competition is just feels completely irrelevant to me... If you look at someone like Ivica competing in places like Austria or Italy, they might have four or five solid rivals to contend with. But for Blanka, once you account for a few athletes from the former USSR, plus Friedrich, DiMartino, Green, Beitie, and maybe two or three American women, she doesn't really have anyone else to worry about. When you actually break it down, that narrows her entire field of competitors to maybe ten or fifteen people globally...
Ivica is stepping up to compete in five different events, while Blanka will be focusing on just one... To put it in perspective, competing in slalom and downhill skiing is a lot like taking on the javelin throw and the 5,000 meters in track and field...
Ivica has probably had both knees operated on as much as humanly possible by now, and his back seems to need constant repairs... As for Blanka, aside from that shin issue, I don't recall her facing any major health hurdles. Skiing is just such a Spartan sport; you're constantly out on the mountain, battling sub-zero temperatures and biting winds. In track and field, the biggest struggle is usually just dealing with a harder track surface or if it gets a bit chilly—you know, anytime the temperature drops below 68 degrees...

That’s just how I’m reading the whole situation, and that’s how I’m forming my opinion... though it certainly doesn't mean I'm right...

Maybe we can talk once Nikola Vlašić actually bags a Ballon d'Or ☕

frozentiger6 said:It’s not even about being the "greatest of all time," it’s just that Janica was so incredibly dominant across every single discipline—even if we admit she had more competition in giant slalom—that it's honestly breathtaking. You rarely see anything like that in any sport.

Maybe Hildegard will claim this is just the collective hype of Americans, but Janica was basically the lion among beasts in skiing. Sure, there are faster or stronger animals out there, but there’s only one queen...

Blanka could maybe compare herself to Janica if she could pull gold in the 100m, javelin, the 400m, plus high jump.
Janica was untouchable in every event. The only thing they share is needing skis, poles, and boots. She just made you feel like she could win whenever she actually felt like showing up. And considering how brutal skiing is—where your body is hurtling down a slope at the speed of a sports car—it's wild. On some of those runs, you'd practically need the Highway Patrol to pull you over for speeding. That alone shows what it took to dominate like that... not to mention what it did to her body by the end of her career.

Janica is one of a kind. No American athlete has ever annoyed me less than her; I always knew she could do it if she wanted to. If she didn't feel like it, well, screw it, she'll try again next time...

I think it should be obvious that Blanka, like almost every other track and field athlete, can't just compete in multiple different disciplines.
The physical requirements, the training, everything—it's just not the same.
Who knows how good Blanka would have been at middle-distance running or sprinting?
But you can't train for both high jump and sprinting, for example. Especially not if you want to be elite in both.
An athlete like that has never existed, and probably never will.
In track and field, you might excel in a couple of similar events, but even then, it's mostly just running. And even then, it's limited to things like sprints (100m, 200m), middle distance, or long distance, because the physical build and training overlap.
Take Bolt, for instance. He has ambitions for the 400m, but if he wants that, he has to give up the 100m. You can't train for everything. The workouts aren't the same. Even someone like Bolt isn't an exception. He might be great at the 400m, but he'll have to sacrifice something else.
And in alpine skiing, it's not exactly rare to see athletes winning medals in different disciplines.
Janica wasn't an outlier in that sense. Her uniqueness lies in her sheer level of achievement, not in the variety of her events.
If Blanka started winning medals in completely different disciplines, it would be a global miracle. Something the world has never seen before.

dustypanther6 said:Joško Vlašić isn't just Blanka Vlašić's coach—we’re actually working as a team, so I honestly don't get why he hasn't given Marinović any credit at all instead of just talking about himself.

Exactly.
Gips is basically the brains behind the operation for Vlašić.

Hellebaut, pentathlon (2008 World Cup gold), heptathlon

🍿

analogowl122 said:If Blanka actually started picking up medals in other events, we’d be looking at a total anomaly. Something the sporting world has truly never seen before.

Not since Jacki Joyner-Kersee.

You can't compare apples to oranges.
Track and field vs. skiing. High jump vs. slalom.

The common thread is that both Gips and Vlašić picked elite teams. They both lead squads backed by top-tier coaches and medical staff.

Janica has an incredible mindset—unmatched mental toughness and pure talent—which led her to those massive achievements.
Ivica is the ultimate grinder. He faces the toughest competition out there; men's skiing is basically a sport for superheroes.

Blanka has fantastic physical proportions and total dominance, but mentally, she isn't quite as steady as Janica or Ivica. She struggles with more self-doubt than she should. Because of that, Vlašić needs to find a great psychologist or perhaps an even better jumping coach than Marinović (maybe someone like a Ukrainian, a Russian, a Swedish woman, or an American man).

Both Joško and Gips made their fair share of mistakes and had lapses in judgment, but people tend to forget all that once they see the medals. One of the biggest blunders was wandering into the territory of pharmacology and doping, which cost both Janica and Blanka dearly.

All this bickering hurts both of them, and it really reveals people's true colors. The media loves the drama, while these two just end up dragging each other through the mud.

If we were in the US, this kind of behavior might be expected, but I fear this just shows petty personal interests and jealousy. That's just how we Americans are sometimes.

They are mega-ambitious fathers, excellent sports leaders, and great long-term planners, but they’re also eccentrics with some pretty intense psychological quirks.

Ryan Vaughn7 said:Never since Jacki Joyner-Kersee.

She’s really not an outlier here.
Her "main" thing is long jump, nothing else.
The heptathlon is just a bonus, even if it's her primary focus. There are plenty of other athletes who have one standout event and then happen to be decent at the heptathlon or decathlon...
But they were never truly elite in any of those seven or ten events outside of their specialty...

Ryan Vaughn7 said:Never since Jackie Joyner-Kersee.

You’re missing the point here. In track and field, you can mix sprints, long jump, and triple jump. You can pair long jump with shot put or hammer throw, or combine different types of middle and long-distance runs. The only guy who really pulled off the feat of dominating both the 1500 and the 5000—which is why he's one of the greatest ever—was that runner Spahn back in the 80s. Look, I'm not exactly out here defending Blanka, who isn't even in the same league as Jackie, but let's just stick to the actual facts.

dustyhawk4 said:They’re mega ambitious fathers, top-tier sports executives, incredible coaches, and brilliant long-term strategists—but they're also complete weirdos with serious psychopathology issues.

Honestly, they’d be gold mine material for some psychoanalysts.

analogowl122 said:It would be a total miracle if Blanka started picking up medals in other events. Something we've truly never seen before.

analogowl122 said:She isn't really an outlier here.
Her main thing is the long jump. Nothing else.
The heptathlon is more like a "bonus" for her, even if it's her primary focus. There are plenty of athletes who have one standout event but still perform well in the heptathlon or decathlon.
But they aren't world-class in any of those seven or ten disciplines except for their specialty.

🤣
Honestly, you're just grasping at straws now. 😉