Hoof at NYSE 08/03/07

analogharbor442 said:bpps

bpps doesn't belong in any conversation regarding music. Their recordings were never actually intended for listening... it isn't about the art; it’s strictly about politics 🙂

Alex Scott22 said:As far as I'm concerned... he could play 'for Eliza' with his pinky toe if he felt like it.

Honestly, playing 'for Eliza' with your anatomy isn't even about talent—it’s really more a matter of sheer persistence, grit, and perhaps a bit of mathematics...🙂>

hollowseal33 said:I mean, you should probably realize that intelligence isn't exactly the same thing as being smart—I guess. 🙂

I don't know—it feels kind of silly trying to make my takes on music sound all intellectual and stuff. 🙂

Alex Scott22 said:"Everything's fine because... I don't know... it just makes you happy." Basically—don't dig too deep and don't overthink things. I guess that mindset is healthier and closer to actual human nature, but it has this one massive flaw—you can't really build anything from it. It undermines any standard other than "I feel good." You aren't being tough on yourself. And besides... that kind of attitude just leaves you wide open to consumerism.

Could you clarify that a bit? Does it mean I’m not allowed to like Beyoncé? 😬

Anyway, regarding how much more modest people used to be—back then, everyone was practically naked, and today? Well, it's the same story. I don't really agree with that view, but we’ve probably been over this a thousand times already. It seems like you just can't fight nostalgia with logic—so, fine, have it your way. You guys were better. 😛

boldscout72 said:Playing 'for Eliza' with your junk isn't about talent—it’s pure grit, sacrifice, and some serious math. 🙂

Isn't playing 'for Eliza' with your junk a little bit indecent? 👍

gentlepuma20 said:Yeah, but it feels kind of stupid to try and make talking about music sound intellectual.🙂

Can you elaborate? Does that mean I'm not allowed to like Beyoncé?😬

By the way, regarding this whole "past generations were cooler" thing—I don't buy it. We've argued this a thousand times, and clearly, you can't fight nostalgia with logic. So fine, have it your way. You guys were better.😛

I get it, that argument is totally played out. This isn't even about nostalgia. It’s about right now. The people actually trying to build a scene, or who already have, are mostly from that older crowd. From Matt, Six, and Cornelius all the way down to DJ Hellsonik. In my own messy career, 90% of my work was dealing with promoters in their 30s. Most of them have checked out, leaving a massive void. I could look even further back to the late 80s when everything was exploding without the internet or government grants. Imagine trying to book an opening slot via fax and long-distance calls from a payphone... or doing research without Google. It's the same with bands, at least the ones I follow. I'm thinking about putting together a small garage rock/punk fest at Spunk in late March, and the only promising young band I could find in the US that fits the vibe is Bud Spencer. Just one. We are missing young bands that actually get the spirit. I wouldn't be complaining if there wasn't a thriving scene in places like Austria. Over there, the 18-to-23-year-olds are the ones organizing, playing, and showing up. Again, that's just my personal taste.

Beyoncé? I mean, sure... would you drop $150 on one of her CDs? Or fly to the US just to catch a show? Yeah, you like her, and that's fine, but you probably don't take her seriously.😳

Alex Scott22 said:the only actually promising young band I could think of to invite from the States—who really fits the vibe—is Bud Spencer.. just them.

uh, that's probably not gonna end well 😈

Beyoncé? I mean.. are you actually crazy enough to drop $130 on one of her CDs? Or fly all the way to the USA just for a concert? Like.. sure, you love her and that's fine, but maybe you don't take her seriously. I guess. 😳

obviously not. but I don't want to be so hard on myself that I stop enjoying some silly music every now and then.

gentlepuma20 said:uh, it won't end well 😈

Hold on... don't get me wrong. They're the only band I listen to with a punk r'n'r vibe.

gentlepuma20 said:obviously not. but I don't want to be so strict with myself that I miss out on enjoying some mindless music once in a while.

That's where we differ. Honestly, I envy you sometimes. As for the whole generational gap thing, most of the time, you know how it goes... I definitely click better with the younger crowd. Probably because they haven't been jaded yet.

Rock and roll is dead—so, what comes next? 😈

Nicholas Perez33 said:rock and roll is dead, now what? 😈

🙂

True. But only in our little post-war town.

Kevin Chavez3 said:(meaning they’re great in flashes—like when "Skin Deep" gets me in the mood to dance—but please, don't mistake my enthusiasm for genuine respect; and honestly, don't even get me started on having any shred of respect for those damn stranglers 😬)

Alright then, let's hear it... I am dying to hear your take on this whole "respect" thing and your supposedly logical justifications...

The reasoned explanation is simply that I find them incredibly obnoxious 🙂
...

I honestly don't think I'll ever wrap my head around why certain punk rockers are so incredibly worked up about the Stranglerse. Am I missing some fundamental subtext here? 🤔

Aha, those space invaders on the keys, some irritatingly decadent old man stroking girl vocals and mustaches 🙂

Are you just listing everything that could go wrong? 😬 Because if you are, your entire line of reasoning is fundamentally flawed. 😬

No, those three are metareasons for the point made earlier 😎
...

So, would that essentially mean you're trying to use their own reasoning against them as if it were already an established fact? If that's the case, we're looking at a circular logic loop where the argument is just validating itself 😬
Honestly, I don't even have the vocabulary to describe how redundant these big words are becoming 🙂 I think I'll go listen to some trance music instead

Emily Hernandez28 said:well, imho what we like in music might not be such a question of talent as much as style, just like with people.

Alex Scott22 said:So it turns out the criterion for good music is the talent behind it? 😕

Melodic articulation isn't created by talent, it's created by style. At least when we're talking about mainstream music. And if you have style, you have to be self-aware.

We'll have to agree to disagree. Talent is the most important thing for the person actually writing the music. Style is just the criterion you use to pick what you listen to. There's bad and good music in every single genre. I think we get each other.

Now, talking about an artist's style opens up a whole different story—honestly, a Pandora's box. You have performers who don't write their own songs and become successful simply because of their performance skills or their specific vibe and how they market themselves. Take a band like Green Day 😁—their music is basically a copy-paste job, but they have enough style to drive you crazy 😁. Then you have someone like Bob Dylan, whom most people can't stand, yet he's the best 😍 ever. Or Iron & Wine, who could probably get anyone to hand over their wallet on the street, yet he has a decent following. All of them have that "style" that you can't just judge with your ears alone.

If we're talking about style in terms of genre, or what pedals a guitarist uses, or whether a song is longer than three minutes, those are just fine details. A talented person is going to write great music whether they grew up on the Mississippi River or listening to the Ramones.

We were just discussing recently how today's music has detached itself from movements and ideologies and is sold purely as "music," which ties back to the second part of your post, Goran. This is all getting too deep and too broad... there's really no core topic here.

To band is the absolute essence of punk—they were totally unlikable 🙂
and they had Manzarek on keys right when the whole world was frantically fighting against the same 🙂
plus, they were old and frankly unattractive 🙂
later on, they became the most unpredictable group you could possibly imagine 🙂
and through every single phase, they managed to stumble upon some genuinely great songs 🙂
even if they didn't give a damn about making albums feel like coherent pieces of art—it was always just a matter of cramming everything they had onto two discs 🙂

analogharbor442 said:they had those Manzarek keys right when the whole world was collectively fighting against the same 🙂

But here’s the kicker: on that first album, it was just Manzarek handling the keys, which I love... but the stuff the Strangelings did? Absolutely terrible. 😕 That "Black and White" album is nothing short of a crime against music... 🙏

Don't go calling it "nice 'n' sleazy"—that's actually a beautiful vibe. Especially on a DVD, or say, at some festival where an old-school stripper puts on a full show to that track 🙏
. But honestly, I’ll never understand why people hate on them so much.