Pros and Cons of Sebastian Vettel

Sebastian Vettel: Pros and Cons

It’s been about three seasons since Sebastian Vettel joined the Formula 1 grid, so we finally have enough data to actually judge him.

1) There is no question that he can squeeze everything out of an inferior car; he handles them incredibly well. However, he just can't seem to find his rhythm when he's in a dominant machine. In that sense, he reminds me of Giancarlo Fisichella. Just think back to how the Italian drove those underpowered cars at Spa 1997, Spa 2009, Interlagos 1999, and Interlagos 2003—absolutely brilliant stuff. But when he had a top-tier car on those same tracks, like at Spa 2005 or Interlagos 2006, he wasn't nearly as impressive. It's clearly not a track issue, and it's definitely not the car, because let's face it, that 2006 Renault was leagues ahead of the Benetton from '99, both relatively and absolutely.

2) He started losing ground to some shady Australian veteran. On paper, the guy was born in 1974, but there's evidence suggesting he was actually born in 1969 and the documents were doctored so he could stay in junior categories longer. The FIA knows, but they've chosen to look the other way. Honestly, even FIFA looked the other way for Mirko Novosel. They know what's up, and besides, it isn't hurting anyone. Well, except maybe Sebastian Vettel—but in a different way. If he were officially 41, losing to a driver like that would sting even more.

3) On track, he struggles in head-to-head battles against more aggressive drivers in slower cars (look at how Lewis Hamilton overtook him in Los Angeles), which is a trait shared by drivers like Jarno Trulli, Timo Glock, and Heikki Kovalainen. Hmmmmm.

4) When he needs to overtake a slower car ahead of him, he tends to get soft and just gives up on the move (see Bahrain 2009 or Los Angeles 2009).

Bottom line: Sebastian Vettel sits somewhere around Nico Rosberg (who was more or less on par with Mark Webber when they were driving for Williams and Giancarlo Fisichella)—meaning he's a solid driver, nothing more. A future champion? I doubt it.

Discuss.

The Red Bull car this year is clearly superior. Sure, Mark Webber might pull ahead here and there, but looking at the big picture, Sebastian Vettel is just faster. Between the mechanical failures in the first race, the second, and even that disaster in Los Angeles, he’s dropped a massive amount of points. Honestly, he’s just as responsible for those technical glitches as Kimi Raikkonen was for his own back in the day. Plus, his race engineer and the rest of the crew on the pit wall didn't exactly help—they handed him some pretty questionable calls during the races.

Bradley Nelson2 said:He’s clearly the superior driver in this year's Red Bull. Sure, Webber might pull ahead occasionally, but looking at the big picture, Vettel is just faster than him. Between the engine failures in the first race, the second, and even that mess in the final race in Los Angeles, he lost a massive amount of points. Honestly, he’s just as responsible for his own bad luck as Kimi was for his. Plus, the race engineer and the rest of the crew on the pit wall made a few questionable calls during the races.

Superior?! Give me a break.😕😠🤣I saw how he looked like he was driving past a parked tractor when the black car blew right past him.

Wait, isn't there already a thread about that driver?

Another Monday, another pointless thread...

There’s a massive difference between being fast in short bursts and actually having the pace to close out a race. Sebastian Vettel is still young enough that you can let some things slide, but honestly, he’s starting to remind me more and more of Kimi Raikkonen—just this incredibly fast, talented driver who basically had a world championship handed to him on a silver platter, though he probably wouldn't have pulled it off under any normal circumstances... On the flip side, every legendary driver I’ve ever watched was a total wild card when they first hit the scene. Three seasons is still just the "growing pains" phase for most of these guys. That goes for both Sebastian Vettel and Lewis Hamilton too; they both make way more mistakes than the other elite drivers, but I don't really hold it against them given how young they are.

As for Mark Webber, I'll take it if he can just find some semblance of consistency, even if he doesn't strike me as one of those top-tier talents who suddenly becomes a hero once everyone else gives up on him—which makes it hard for people to admit his worth later, kind of like Jenson Button.

Michael Lee4 said:Another Monday, another pointless thread...

You have to give silvercobra68 credit for putting in the effort. 😁

The analysis itself isn't half bad, either. 🙏

Hold up, this thread already exists and stays pinned to the front page anyway. Why bother starting a whole new rant topic?

As for those "analyses"... they remind me of those town hall meetings where people just talk in circles and achieve absolutely nothing in the end.

Michael Lee4 said:Hold on, this thread already exists—it’s always on the front page. Why start a whole new flame war topic?

And as for these "analyses"... it reminds me of those open meetings where people just talk in circles and end up achieving absolutely nothing.

I know there’s an existing thread, but that one is just biasedly praising Sebastian Vettel. My thread, on the other hand, stays objective. Besides, mine is titled "Pros and Cons," while the current one is called "The New World Champion."

When it comes to talking in circles and getting zero results, that's a pretty common occurrence on internet forums.

silvercobra68 said:my other thread is actually objective

The people worshiping him in that other thread think they’re being objective too. 🤣

As for Sebastian Vettel, I’ll give you my take. I just don't like him. Not even looking at his driving, he just looks like a total mess—I can't put my finger on it, he's just not my kind of guy. But that’s beside the point. Driving-wise, he knows what he's doing, but the sheer stupidity he displays is fascinating. Like last season in Australia when he collided with Robert Kubica and then just sat there on the track shedding debris. Or this past Sunday, when his engineer spent half the race begging him to save his brakes and just finish the race, but nope, he keeps driving like his life depends on it. There have been plenty of fast drivers who leave their brains back at the hotel...

I honestly think you need a real brain for any kind of sport, including Formula 1. Take soccer, for example; I'm sure most of you have heard of Xavi from Los Angeles. The guy doesn't exactly have the physical build of a powerhouse athlete—he’s pretty small and isn't exactly a speedster—but he still plays for a top-tier club in Los Angeles. Why? Because he uses his head and manages to get the whole team moving. As Michael Lee4 mentioned, I think Sebastian Vettel is a really talented driver and I've always liked him, but I don't feel like he's really thinking through things lately. He could have completely messed everything up yesterday; he just got lucky because he spun out and managed to recover. I guess if he could just calm down a bit, start thinking more strategically, and maybe be a little more aggressive when overtaking, he might actually have a future.

I wouldn't go so far as to say Sebastian Vettel lacks brains. If anything, beyond being blistering fast on the track, he comes across as quite sharp and quick-witted during interviews. In my view, those moments where he acted foolishly earlier in his career were more about a young driver lacking self-control rather than any fundamental lack of intellect. I suppose you could ask his girlfriend for her take, though she’d probably find that question a bit too rushed... you know how it goes.😁

Joshua Newman2 said:I wouldn't say Hamilton isn't using his head. Aside from being insanely fast on the track, he seems pretty sharp and quick-witted during interviews. I think those dumb mistakes he made earlier were just a lack of discipline when he was younger, not a sign that he can't think.

Look, if you have someone constantly whispering in your ear telling you not to do something, and you go ahead and do it anyway, what's the issue?

Michael Lee4 said:Look, if you’ve got someone constantly whispering "don't do it" in your ear, but you just keep doing exactly what you want anyway, then where's the actual issue?

I mean, how is that any different from basically any kid up until they hit 25? No offense intended, really... Hamilton is still at that age where it’s totally normal to think you’re the smartest, fastest guy in the room and that everyone else is just holding you back. It’s that raw, natural selection thing—the same reason why certain reckless kids end up wrecking cars on the street or even on the track. In NASCAR, guys like that at least get a shot to survive long enough to eventually realize that actually listening to advice gets you way further than ignoring it...

The guy has pure speed and all the right ingredients to be an absolute legend, mostly because he’s pulling the same kind of reckless stunts that Prost, Senna, Schumacher, and Alonso used to pull back in the day... 😉 And plenty of others, obviously, who never quite made it past that phase. 😁 Honestly, I actually love that we have these ultra-fast, ultra-unreasonable personalities like him and Mercedes in the mix—guys who can take a win and then immediately blow it by being too hot-headed. That’s exactly what NASCAR has been missing since the Montoya days. Though, I really hope he doesn't end up stuck at Montoya's level... (again, disclaimer here, I was a huge fan of Montoya and always rooted for him when he was fighting against all those bland, soul-less drivers that took over the sport...)

Pros:

1. absolutely nails it when it rains
2. super solid during qualifying sessions

Cons:

1. his starts aren't always great—definitely needs some work there
2. struggles a bit in wheel-to-wheel action... I guess he just lacks that extra edge of aggression sometimes

Seb sometimes gets a little scrambled in the head, but honestly, that’s just part of growing up at his age 🙂
Webber is an absolute rock, and if he starts dropping points to him, we can kiss that new championship title goodbye.
He’s pulled off 4 out of 6 wins from pole, so even that stat isn't exactly helping his case. Aside from Monza, I can't really think of any other massive, standout victories, and people trying to label him the king of wet weather just because of that one race feels a bit forced to me. At the end of the day, he still has plenty of work to do to prove himself, but hey, luckily he’s got time on his side.

From a fan perspective, he’s trying way too hard to be funny by making jokes about the car names instead of just shutting up and driving. It doesn't matter if it's a Ford or a Chevy, what matters is that the car actually handles well.

Brian Reyes3 said:From a fan's perspective, he's just trying to be funny by making jokes about the car names instead of staying quiet and driving. It doesn't matter if it's Mar or Kate; what matters is that the car performs well.

I don't get it. Explain.

silvercobra68 said:Wait, what? Walk me through that.

Look, Hamilton actually names his cars;

Schumacher did the exact same thing this year, except he "had" to call his the Corrin—talk about a total clown!🤣

gentlebear47 said:Well, Hamilton gives his cars names;

Schumacher did the exact same thing this year, except his "had" to be called Corrin—talk about a joke!🤣

So what!? You think he’s some big shot now!? If he wants to be a celebrity, let him write his name on the wing or the engine cover, haha. But if Helmut gave him a little squeeze and a couple of slaps, we'd see him crawling right back to his corporate hole...

His single-lap pace is insane. He either crushes qualifying or completely falls apart🤣, and this weekend in Austin was definitely a disaster for him😂
That says it all, really—even during a miserable weekend, he still managed to grab P2 in qualifying and P3 in the race🤣

He’s lacking that edge lately, that aggression. But his logic is interesting; he was the villain for colliding with Robert Kubica because he wouldn't let him through, and now he's the villain again because he *did* let Lewis Hamilton through🤣

Ultimately, today's NASCAR just ruins him. It's full of these mediocre drivers snatching titles by driving cowardly, just dragging themselves home to a 4th or 5th place finish. He sees that, and unfortunately, he's started acting just like them—playing it safe and minimizing risk👎 Personally, I think it sucks. That aggressive spark is gone, replaced by pure math. And it's ironic, because losing the title last year was exactly due to a lack of that kind of calculation, so now he’s driving with that exact mindset this season. Sadly, that's the reality now. The champion isn't necessarily the fastest or the best driver in NASCAR anymore; it's just whoever is most consistent at collecting points😢

He’s clearly matured, mostly because he knows his crew is pretty green. He knows they’re going to screw something up every other race, whether it's the car or the strategy, so he's shifted into "points collector" mode😢

2008 - after the first 5 races - 0 points, ended the season with 8
2009 - after the first 5 races - 23 points, fought for 2nd until basically the end
2010 - after the first 5 races - 60 (24 points) - a small gap, but huge compared to the leader😁

Ferrari traditionally has a bunch of stupid DNFs in the first half of the season, only to absolutely dominate the second half. The competition should be panicking because nobody has pulled away from him yet, and you can bet he's only just getting started😉

His main rival is already 11 points behind him, the second guy is only 7 points ahead, and the one everyone actually fears is trailing by 38. All things considered, Ferrari is perfectly positioned to take the title🙂