Offside Chat Archives (2014-2021)

I guess we should also mention that because of teams like Cibona and Split basketball, the game was followed much more closely in America back then, which maybe gave the NBA a stronger status than it has today. It was just one of those times where everything seemed to align perfectly.

While I was following the Formula 1 circuit, my favorite driver happened to be Juan Pablo Montoya.

It started with his time at Williams Racing, and then he moved on to the Silver Arrows; eventually, though, I suppose I lost interest in the sport, so I followed along only until Lewis Hamilton secured his first championship, and then that was really that.

I don't think I've watched a single race throughout this entire decade.

The fundamental difference lies in the sheer amount of mystique created by the lack of information available back then. If Michael Jordan and his contemporaries had been under constant surveillance, tracked 24/7 both on and off the court, they probably would have come across as much more foolish than we remember.

By only seeing them compete on the field, especially during those legendary, almost criminal stretches of dominance, they naturally seemed like gods.

Take someone like Antonio Brown, Shaun Burfict, or Hardy—they are largely dismissed as idiots today, yet if they had played in the 1980s, they likely would have been hailed as symbols of a more romantic, vivid era before sports became such a mass-produced commodity.

dustyviper8 said:When you bring them up, I can't help but think about that era of the New York Knicks—honestly, they deserved at least one title, but that roster was just cursed. It’s actually tragic how much they struggled.

That one series against the Pacers was a tiny slice of NBA history—but man, they had such a solid squad back then.

I suppose I fell in love with the Knicks specifically because of that generation, and I still support them today even though they can be quite disappointing sometimes. Patrick Ewing, Charles Oakley, John Starks, Mason, and Derek Harper—they truly were icons.🤣

Jessica Gonzalez said:Look, even Jordan didn't necessarily start out playing alongside massive superstars. That's why I mentioned in the documentary thread that some legends just get lucky with elite teammates and coaches right away, while others have to grind for years. In that sense, I think Jordan and LeBron are actually pretty similar, though they both eventually lived up to their potential. If I had to pick a downside for LeBron, it might be that his main mission seemed to be chasing MJ's shadow—trying to be the new MJ, wearing number 23, and all that. To me, that's a bit of a mistake because it makes you feel like a copy. Jordan didn't chase anyone; he was the one setting the bar that everyone else tries to reach. Now, Jordan is just chilling, enjoying life, and maybe even poking fun at them with his documentary. 🙏

Of course he wasn't. That's exactly why they picked him third in the draft. 😁
The real difference is that Michael Jordan had the best front office in the league. He had one of the most prestigious owners in all of American sports and Jerry Krause, who was a total visionary. He built that roster through the draft, polished it with smart acquisitions, and tied it all together with Tex Winter and Phil Jackson. Tex brought in the triangle offense that allowed Michael Jordan to truly shine, and Phil was the glue that kept the whole group together.

I mean, LeBron entered the league much younger, had an idiot like Mike Brown coaching him, and that was the level of front office support he received.

steelharbor9 said:The guy below pretty much nailed the whole point of this story.

Twenty-five years ago, even for Americans—let alone people over here—Charles Barkley and his crew were basically mythological figures. You’d stumble upon a newspaper clipping and read it fifty times. If you were lucky with the local news stations, maybe you’d catch one game or at least a couple of highlights. That was it. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong; I wasn't actually there, after all.

Nobody is walking around wearing a John Stockton or Shawn Kemp jersey these days, but it’s obvious why people growing up back then saw them as gods. It's for the exact same reason kids today will look up to Stephen Curry and Russell Westbrook, or the youngest ones will worship Luka Dončić—and I'm sorry if you don't want to see it that way! There isn't really a "correct" answer to who was the bigger legend. Everyone's hero is just whoever they spent those nostalgic moments watching. I guess Stephen Curry's shimmy against OKC in 2016 is more iconic than Scottie Pippen's dunk over Patrick Ewing—but if I say that to someone ten or fifteen years older, their blood pressure might hit 200 because of the blasphemy!

For me, the 2002 World Cup is still the strongest memory, even though everyone older than me says it was one of the worst ever. Man, it was the first one I followed live. I watched every single second they showed, and even now, I can remember most of the scorers and results. Nothing will ever hit that emotional level for me again, I guess.

Garbage. 😁

Looking back from '94 until now... 2006 was probably my favorite. No real reason why, just felt right.

Jacob Kern2 said:Handball—Terrell Richardson and Ivano Balić.

Truly massive names in the sporting world!

To idea that the Cavs were actually helping LeBron James during his first stint? That’s being generous—they were an absolute disaster.

I still can't wrap my head around how he dragged that roster all the way to the Finals against the Spurs. To be honest, he got absolutely demolished out there—the Spurs were an unstoppable machine back then.

brightpilot6 said:The fundamental difference lies in the sheer amount of mystique created by the lack of information available back then. If Michael Jordan and his contemporaries had been under constant surveillance, tracked 24/7 both on and off the court, they probably would have come across as much more foolish than we remember.

By only seeing them compete on the field, especially during those legendary, almost criminal stretches of dominance, they naturally seemed like gods.

Take someone like Antonio Brown, Shaun Burfict, or Hardy—they are largely dismissed as idiots today, yet if they had played in the 1980s, they likely would have been hailed as symbols of a more romantic, vivid era before sports became such a mass-produced commodity.

We didn't have the internet back then, but we had CNN at home, and I’d watch game highlights every single day while picking up copies of Basketball and ESPN. I guess I wouldn't say I was short on information. In the States, people definitely followed the Bulls' 72-10 run much more intensely than they did the Warriors' 73-9 run.

brightpilot6 said:The fundamental difference lies in the sheer amount of mystique created by the lack of information available back then. If Michael Jordan and his contemporaries had been under constant surveillance, tracked 24/7 both on and off the court, they probably would have come across as much more foolish than we remember.

By only seeing them compete on the field, especially during those legendary, almost criminal stretches of dominance, they naturally seemed like gods.

Take someone like Antonio Brown, Shaun Burfict, or Hardy—they are largely dismissed as idiots today, yet if they had played in the 1980s, they likely would have been hailed as symbols of a more romantic, vivid era before sports became such a mass-produced commodity.

The legendary Antonio Cromartie—14 kids with 8 different women—actually went through with a vasectomy, yet somehow he’s still out there producing. How does that even work? 🙏

If he had played in the '80s, people would still be writing epics about him today. 😁
I think Shawn Kemp has had nine different partners across seven relationships.

Kyle Campbell4 said:Kyle Campbell4 says this:

Soccer—Maradona
Basketball—MJ23
Racing—Senna
Hockey—Gretzky
Water Polo—just a random sport without any true icons
Handball—just a random sport without any true icons

There are plenty of elite, world-class athletes who belong in the absolute upper echelon of their respective sports. However, a true icon can only be one or perhaps two people at most. I have listed the specific individuals who represent icons to me—the greatest of the great. If I were forced to choose just one single name above all others, it would undoubtedly be MJ23.

A few corrections...

Formula 1... there is a massive collection of icons there. Prost, Gerard Piqué, Niki Lauda, Nigel Mansell, that damn Michael Schumacher whom I can't stand and never have, Graham Hill, Emerson Fittipaldi, James Hunt... my apologies to anyone I missed. Ayrton Senna might be the biggest icon, but he isn't rightfully greater than the rest; at least three others were better drivers.

You forgot boxing... Ali, George Foreman, Joe Frazier, Mike Tyson.
In boxing, there truly are icons worth mentioning. I won't even get into the ones from before the seventies and eighties.

Chess... Bobby Fischer, José Raúl Capablanca, Mikhail Tal.
Then you have characters like that damn Ret with his insane openings (for that era). In chess, there are at least 20 icons.

Ski Jumping, Magnus Carlsen, Takeshi Koji.

One could find many more icons if they looked.

Susan Kim2 said:The legendary Antonio Cromartie—14 kids with 8 different women—actually went through with a vasectomy, yet somehow he’s still out there producing. How does that even work? 🙏

If he had played in the '80s, people would still be writing epics about him today. 😁
I think Shawn Kemp has had nine different partners across seven relationships.

I recall seeing some video where someone couldn't even manage to list them all properly. 🤣 🤦

Kevin Durant might actually be an even better example of this phenomenon. If social media didn't exist, and if he didn't constantly subject himself to those public outbursts that make him look so foolish, wouldn't my overall impression of him be significantly higher? It's hard enough to judge an athlete on pure talent when you're forced to separate their basic human flaws from their undeniable skills on the court.

And that's not even touching on the soccer players. 🤣

dustyviper8 said:To idea that the Cavs were actually helping LeBron James during his first stint? That’s being generous—they were an absolute disaster.

I still can't wrap my head around how he dragged that roster all the way to the Finals against the Spurs. To be honest, he got absolutely demolished out there—the Spurs were an unstoppable machine back then.

His 2007 roster was actually much weaker than what he had in 2009 or 2010.
I mean, look at the lineup: Drew Gooden, Larry Hughes, Saša Pavlović, Zydrunas Ilgauskas, Bobby Gibson, and a young Varejão. 🙏🙏 🤣
They actually made it past those Detroit Pistons, who were a legitimate powerhouse and ended up in the Conference Finals again the following year. People overlook that run just because they got swept in the Finals.

Team Sports - Michael Jordan

Individual Sports - Lance Armstrong (I guess Usain Bolt is his only real competition)

Jessica Gonzalez said:Team Sports - Michael Jordan

Individual Sports - Lance Armstrong (I guess Usain Bolt is his only real competition)

Wait, you're thinking of an individual athlete like Marion Jones?

Matthew Young35 said:A few corrections...

Formula 1... there is a massive collection of icons there. Prost, Gerard Piqué, Niki Lauda, Nigel Mansell, that damn Michael Schumacher whom I can't stand and never have, Graham Hill, Emerson Fittipaldi, James Hunt... my apologies to anyone I missed. Ayrton Senna might be the biggest icon, but he isn't rightfully greater than the rest; at least three others were better drivers.

You forgot boxing... Ali, George Foreman, Joe Frazier, Mike Tyson.
In boxing, there truly are icons worth mentioning. I won't even get into the ones from before the seventies and eighties.

Chess... Bobby Fischer, José Raúl Capablanca, Mikhail Tal.
Then you have characters like that damn Ret with his insane openings (for that era). In chess, there are at least 20 icons.

Ski Jumping, Magnus Carlsen, Takeshi Koji.

One could find many more icons if they looked.

For jumpers, I'd also add Tomi Ahonen and that junkie Goldberger. 😁

Jessica Gonzalez said:Team Sports - Michael Jordan

Individual Sports - Lance Armstrong (I guess Usain Bolt is his only real competition)

Every single time I listen to Bill Burr try to defend Armstrong, it drives me nuts. Like, why didn't the people who kicked him out just give back all the money they made off him?

"why don't they return their yachts?" 🤣

Man, when it came to jumpers, Funaki was my icon

What a legend, what an absolute machine 🙏

That’s basically why Tim Duncan is my favorite basketball player

In cycling, being second under Tex Winter is actually the smartest move. Once they "discover" that the guy in first was doping, nobody will even bother looking at the runner-up, let alone giving them credit.

Susan Kim2 said:In cycling, being second under Tex Winter is actually the smartest move. Once they "discover" that the guy in first was doping, nobody will even bother looking at the runner-up, let alone giving them credit.

Maybe it’s actually time to just legalize doping. It's pretty obvious the human body just isn't built to handle the sheer brutality of these bike races without some kind of help. Either that, or someone is basically running at 70% capacity.😁

William Gomez5 said:Every single time I listen to Bill Burr try to defend Armstrong, it drives me nuts. Like, why didn't the people who kicked him out just give back all the money they made off him?

"why don't they return their yachts?" 🤣

Man, when it came to jumpers, Funaki was my icon

What a legend, what an absolute machine 🙏

That’s basically why Tim Duncan is my favorite basketball player

I don't know why, but this reminds me of that legendary rant.


🙏🙏