Curfew restrictions: Is it legal to leave your house?

Rebecca Peterson94 said:Hmm... look, I'm getting this straight from a guy working for the Department of Homeland Security. He’s telling me there’s no such thing as a $30,000 fine written in the law—it's just people making stuff up and trying to scam you. Seriously, don't be naive.
The only way they can actually hit you with a fine is if you're caught forging a passport.

If that’s true, then Ladislav Bece, the Chief of the Osijek Police Department who told the media this, is basically spreading fake news and causing panic. In times like these, that's a straight-up crime that should be prosecuted automatically.

So, what is the Department of Justice doing? Where's the criminal complaint? Since when did we start tolerating this kind of blatant public alarmism, especially during a crisis like this pandemic?

AMERICA IN THE CORONA ERA

THE FIGHT AGAINST COVID-19 ISN'T SLACKING: We're hearing how those who break self-isolation orders and stay-at-home mandates will be punished
AUTHOR:
Krešimir Žabec, Nikola Patković, Vladimir Urukalo
PUBLISHED: 03.25.2020 at 09:54
...
- We're being lenient for now, but starting Wednesday, they're going full force. Anyone without a pass will get reported to the inspectors, and the first fine for violators will be around $10 – Ladislav Bece, Chief of the Osijek Police Department, told us yesterday.
...

Joseph Taylor11 said:Here is the conflicting info I've been seeing lately:
1. There's a $30,000 fine.$0.00
2. The fine ranges from $3,000 up to $30,000.$0.00
3. And now this: there is no fine at all, they "just send you back."

So, a couple of questions:
1. Has anyone here actually been caught without their papers? If so, what happened?
2. Does anyone have the actual facts or know exactly what the penalties are—or better yet, where they're officially posted?

A Colleague.
They just sent her right back. No penalties were handed out.

Larry Williams5 said:This is by design.
The younger demographic in major metropolitan areas is essentially being tasked with building herd immunity on their own backs—or rather, through their own lungs—just look at New York City. Meanwhile, folks living in smaller towns and rural municipalities are actually quite lucky; they're effectively under a near-total home quarantine, especially the elderly, since the youth won't be bringing the infection into their immediate circles.

Take Sweden, for example. In their larger cities, it isn't common for grandparents to live under the same roof as their grandkids, so they didn't shut down daycare centers or elementary schools as a way to let the younger population catch the virus. In rural areas, there is a much higher risk of infecting the elderly, who pose a massive challenge to the healthcare system because there simply aren't enough ventilators to go around. Therefore, implementing much stricter restrictions on rural areas actually makes perfect sense.

Whatever helps you sleep at night...
In our smaller towns, even when families live together, they usually stay somewhat separate—like the seniors on the ground floor and the kids upstairs or in an outbuilding. Plus, most of the young people here have their own apartments or houses because they could actually afford it, at least the folks living near Washington, D.C...
Since the young professionals mostly work in Washington, D.C., they pull in decent salaries, and real estate prices out here are a fraction of what they are in the capital.

But on the flip side, in Washington, D.C. and other major metros where property prices are absolutely insane, you’ve got grandmas, grandpas, seniors, kids, and toddlers all crammed into some 600-square-foot apartment...
And there are tons of places like that. It doesn't matter if it's a tiny studio or a slightly larger place; everyone is still packed in tight, and the chances of them not passing the virus around are basically zero...

By your logic, everyone over 60 in Washington, D.C.—and probably most people in their 30s and 40s too—is just gonna drop dead within a few months.

Jack Cook7 said:If that’s true, then Ladislav Bece, the Chief of the Osijek Police Department who told the media this, is basically spreading fake news and causing panic. In times like these, that's a straight-up crime that should be prosecuted automatically.

So, what is the Department of Justice doing? Where's the criminal complaint? Since when did we start tolerating this kind of blatant public alarmism, especially during a crisis like this pandemic?

AMERICA IN THE CORONA ERA

THE FIGHT AGAINST COVID-19 ISN'T SLACKING: We're hearing how those who break self-isolation orders and stay-at-home mandates will be punished
AUTHOR:
Krešimir Žabec, Nikola Patković, Vladimir Urukalo
PUBLISHED: 03.25.2020 at 09:54
...
- We're being lenient for now, but starting Wednesday, they're going full force. Anyone without a pass will get reported to the inspectors, and the first fine for violators will be around $10 – Ladislav Bece, Chief of the Osijek Police Department, told us yesterday.
...

I just did a quick Google search, and honestly, nobody else is saying this except for that one Chief.

Rebecca Peterson94 said:I just did a quick Google search, and honestly, nobody else is saying this except for that one Chief.

Not sure, but I'm pretty sure Božinović brought it up at a press conference. 🤔
That first one, where he mentioned the ban before it was even officially on the books.

stormybadger8 said:Not sure, but I'm pretty sure Božinović brought it up at a press conference. 🤔
That first one, where he mentioned the ban before it was even officially on the books.

I don't recall exactly, but I've got nothing but time, so I'll go dig through that press conference footage. 🙂
It's obvious they aren't listing the penalties; I know a few cases where people were just sent right back. Plus, I highly doubt people wouldn't be talking about someone getting a "congratulations" like that by now—and trust me, there are plenty of folks still heading over to the App.

Hold up a second. This guy starts off by talking about filing a report with the inspectors, and then mentions a fine... but what inspectors are we even talking about here? Health inspectors? Pressure vessel inspectors? Food safety? Veterinary? Mining? Tourism?

Anyone caught without a permit is going to face an inspection report, and the initial fine for violators will be around $10 – Ladislav Bace, head of the Osijek Police Department, told us yesterday.

Where is this actual order? Who even signed off on this?

Because if this rule doesn't actually exist, Ladislav Bace is out here spreading fake news and stirring the pot during some seriously intense times—and honestly, that’s enough to get someone fired or even facing criminal charges.

Honestly, you guys have seen so many disaster flicks in your time, but this one really seems to be cranking up the tension, doesn't it? 🍿

copperwolf16 said:I have been browsing through various municipal websites lately, and frankly, the situation is nothing short of surreal. The most absurd examples are those claiming to have "fully digitized" their permit issuance processes—except this supposed digitalization consists merely of filling out a Word document and emailing it over, only for them to send back a scanned, signed copy. It begs the question: where are you even supposed to print such a thing? Or does anyone actually know if a police officer will accept a digital document displayed on a smartphone?
Then there are the municipalities announcing they will issue permits for purchasing basic groceries, but with the caveat that they can only be used twice a week. How exactly does that work? Is the officer expected to maintain a running tally of your usage every time you shop?
Some of them have barely put any effort in at all, simply pasting two lines of text into a generic template.
There are even instances where the instructions are to simply call the local precinct chief on their landline or cell phone.

I remember laughing at sketches like this in the past, but it seems we have finally crossed the threshold into reality:

It all depends on the officer. For example, check this out—this guy wasn't allowed through because his permit was printed in black and white instead of color, and the officer wouldn't even look at it on a phone:

Honestly, whoever decided that movement restrictions should be tied directly to city and municipal borders... well, they clearly aren't the sharpest tools in the shed. I mean, if the actual goal is to limit how much people are circling around the country, then one could just look at the boundaries of major metropolitan areas—which, let’s be honest, don't necessarily have to align with state lines anyway (so even using states wouldn't be the most logical choice here)—and just go from there. That's really all there is to it.

We really ought to be focusing strictly on daily migration patterns—not getting bogged down by weekly, bi-weekly, or longer-term shifts.
I mean, nobody wants cities that are completely overwhelmed right now.

Is there any chance this decision could be temporarily frozen during Holy Week, so that people with family living halfway across the country might actually be able to spend Easter with them?

Gregory Robinson11 said:Is there any chance this decision could be temporarily frozen during Holy Week, so that people with family living halfway across the country might actually be able to spend Easter with them?

But then what’s even the point of all these rules if we just let everyone travel wherever they please and spread the virus around?

Gregory Robinson11 said:Is there any chance this decision could be temporarily frozen during Holy Week, so that people with family living halfway across the country might actually be able to spend Easter with them?

Nope.

Unless Corona stops acting up by Easter?

nimblelynx7 said:Unless Corona stops acting up by Easter?

It clearly isn't. 🙄

ruggedhawk20 said:Cut the drama. Honestly, I’m in almost the exact same boat as you—I've got property in a neighboring city and scored my permit in less than 24 hours after hitting submit on the online application. Now I can legally roll over there whenever I feel like it to check on things.

Did you even bother to submit the application online?

I did. They won't let me get to the next town over—let alone the one that's practically 1.6 miles miles away—$10. They just simply WON'T. Plain and simple.

Why do you think I'm making a scene? Why do you think I'm calling out this whole absurdity?

Because whether or not they hand out permits depends entirely on who's running the local town hall.

While some people breeze through without any issues at all (you're one of them, apparently)—I'm getting a hard NO!

Jesse Flores842 said:A Colleague.
They just sent her right back. No penalties were handed out.

Alright. Thanks.
(sent you a DM 😉)

Joseph Taylor11 said:I did. They won't let me get to the next town over—let alone the one that's practically 1.6 miles miles away—$10. They just simply WON'T. Plain and simple.

Why do you think I'm making a scene? Why do you think I'm calling out this whole absurdity?

Because whether or not they hand out permits depends entirely on who's running the local town hall.

While some people breeze through without any issues at all (you're one of them, apparently)—I'm getting a hard NO!

So, members of the Democratic Party can just go wherever they want?

Man, what was I even saying two days ago?

Nicholas King said:Honestly, whoever decided that movement restrictions should be tied directly to city and municipal borders... well, they clearly aren't the sharpest tools in the shed. I mean, if the actual goal is to limit how much people are circling around the country, then one could just look at the boundaries of major metropolitan areas—which, let’s be honest, don't necessarily have to align with state lines anyway (so even using states wouldn't be the most logical choice here)—and just go from there. That's really all there is to it.

It just goes to show that our current administrative borders are totally insane. It's pure gerrymandering, just like how they draw voting districts.

Administrative lines should be drawn so people inside them can get everything they need locally, leaving travel for actual emergencies only.

Back in the day, having a smaller number of organized districts was way more efficient than dealing with this mess of 550+ municipalities and over 130 "cities." You've got a massive metro like New York City with millions of people sitting right next to some tiny town with maybe a thousand. What kind of nonsense is that?