Brain drain risks after joining the European Union?

ironstag8 said:I’d honestly suggest looking toward Spain. Unemployment there is practically non-existent, and if you happen to be a young professional with a university degree, you'll find yourself a complete stranger to the concept of being jobless. While things aren't quite as perfect in other European Union nations—though they remain promising enough—they seem to be just waiting for us to show up. That magical date of July 13, 2013, is fast approaching, and they are already busy carving out job openings for our fleeing youth, our intellectuals, and even our blue-collar workers alike.

Bradley Smith said:🙏 Which version of Spain are you hallucinating about???
The one where people have been out in the streets for a month straight protesting because unemployment is sitting at 20%, and for kids, it's closer to 35% with zero hope for anything better???
Give me a break. Spain right now is a complete disaster. 🤷
Tons of people are idle and tons of people aren't getting paid, while the banks are squeezing everyone harder than ever before.
Seriously, stop misleading people. Spain is on its knees, the right wing has tightened its grip after the last elections, and they don't want new immigrants—and honestly, they don't even want the ones who are already there.

ironstag8 said:I’d honestly suggest looking toward Spain. Unemployment there is practically non-existent, and if you happen to be a young professional with a university degree, you'll find yourself a complete stranger to the concept of being jobless. While things aren't quite as perfect in other European Union nations—though they remain promising enough—they seem to be just waiting for us to show up. That magical date of July 13, 2013, is fast approaching, and they are already busy carving out job openings for our fleeing youth, our intellectuals, and even our blue-collar workers alike.

Linda Johnson15 said:I honestly don't see it happening... they don't even seem to know how to handle their own people. If you're looking to move abroad for work, you’ve got to meet way more requirements and fight tooth and nail against the local workforce there.
The reality is, you'll have a slight edge over most of the world—take Norway, for example. They prioritize their own unemployed first, then Scandinavians, then those from the European Union, and finally everyone else. Joining the EU gives us a seat at one level of that ladder, but it’s not going to be a game-changer.

At the end of the day, a high-quality worker can land a job anywhere regardless of where they're from, especially if they've got specialized skills or they're top-tier experts.

Locals are mostly just worrying about competing with cheaper labor coming in from places like Romania and Bulgaria. Our people are too valuable to settle for entry-level roles just to survive—jobs they could easily grab abroad without any hassle—only to have someone from Bulgaria or Romania swoop in and take that same spot right under their noses. That's where the real friction is going to happen.

briskdrifter3 said:My colleague is being sarcastic... perhaps try reading more carefully before jumping in with an answer...

I dropped those numbers because I keep getting grilled by people asking me to basically hand them a job over here. It’s always the same story—everyone has this delusional vision of Spain being some kind of economic powerhouse like it was five years ago. Get real.
Look, please, just drop the instructions on how I should respond to the thread. I've been holding my own on this forum for years now—I can handle myself just fine.

briskdrifter3 said:Alright, look—Spain might not be exactly the Promised Land, but there are plenty of other spots in Europe that are perfectly decent. All the Nordic countries, the United Kingdom, Germany, Austria, Italy, maybe even France... I might even go so far as to say Canada (don't come for me on that one). You have to admit, in these places, you’ll earn a higher wage for the exact same job compared to what we see here in America—and you'll live better once you actually have your paperwork sorted... you know, a permanent residency and a proper work permit. I’m not even counting temporary gigs, because honestly, even if you're highly educated, the pay won't match.
For instance, a colleague of mine was over in the United Kingdom recently, and the place is absolutely swamped with people from Poland. He was in a neighborhood in some smaller town where you don't hear a word of English—just Polish—where even the street signs are in Polish. Historically, the United Kingdom had those restrictions limiting Poles to seven years maximum after joining the European Union.
We probably won't face those kinds of bans... since there are only about four million of us, most countries would likely assimilate us pretty quickly.

Look, a work ban isn't some personal grudge or a decision based on how big a country is or whether someone likes you. It’s pure administrative diplomacy. Period. It works like this: just like every other country hit with the maximum ban—take Spain, for example—we’re going to get slapped with the exact same thing. This is a diplomatic move, plain and simple. Nobody wants to start making enemies out of the other nations that already took the full hit. That’s just how the game is played.

Look, when it comes to getting your paperwork sorted, obviously having the right docs in hand makes life a hell of a lot easier. But honestly? That’s just how the world works. It’s been that way forever, and it hasn't changed now.

ironstag8 said:@briskdrifter3
Honestly, your chances of finding work in European Union countries are pretty slim—lower than rock bottom—unless you happen to be some kind of superstar in a niche field they’re absolutely desperate to fill. Having a degree and being fluent in a language? That's basically peanuts in this market.

briskdrifter3 said:I agree with all of that... the competition is intense, quite frankly. But do you really believe finding a meaningful job there is harder than being a recent college grad in some small town in America, staring at one local company in bankruptcy proceedings and a municipality where you don't know a soul?
If you ask me, that scenario is a much bigger disaster than being last in line after all the groups you mentioned—and I see examples of it constantly in my own circle, among family and friends alike...

Larry Williams5 said:Any serious assessment must take into account the demographic trends within immigration-destination countries:
For instance: According to the Eurostat population projection tool, looking specifically at the 20-24 age bracket, we see the following:

SEX: Total AGE: From 20 to 24 years
TIME GEO 2010 2015 2020
Bulgaria 516,606 413,395 314,216
Czech Republic 700,740 653,331 506,140
Poland 2,957,225 2,536,915 2,042,583
Romania 1,725,796 1,262,653 1,106,628
Slovakia 419,859 373,504 298,201

By 2020, these nations have been effectively hollowed out; there simply aren't enough young people left to replace the local workforce as they retire.

Conversely, in the countries receiving immigrants, the influx of new labor into the market is steadily declining:
If immigration were to cease entirely, the 20-24 age demographic would look like this:

AGE: From 20 to 24 years
SEX: Total
TIME 2010 2020
GEO
European union 31,871,673 26,131,294
Germany 4,934,457 3,955,921
Spain 2,619,904 2,108,488
Austria 520,986 443,761
Canada 132,119 93,595
Sweden 605,453 496,054
United Kingdom 4,305,902 3,577,258
Switzerland 470,871 416,567

The bottom line is that the demand for settlement will be massive, even if not a single new job is ever created.

ironstag8 said:briskdrifter3, just take a look at where our young people are heading for school and what they’re actually graduating with—then tell me honestly, how many of them do you think will actually land a high-paying job out there in the States?

briskdrifter3 said:That is precisely the case. It isn't just that jobs won't decrease—rather, the needs across Europe will actually expand, though certainly not uniformly across all sectors. The economy is fundamentally broken... my colleague Linda Johnson15 serves as a perfect illustration here. Europe is absolutely saturated with economists and various types of managers. Young people seem quite fond of sketching out charts and wearing expensive suits, but unfortunately, a corporation doesn't consist solely of upper management and sales departments... and everything cannot simply be outsourced..
On the other hand, there is a glaring deficit of technical expertise in virtually every field. Some might argue that we simply cannot compete with the Chinese or Indians, but they are gravely mistaken. Anyone who has worked directly with them—as I have, within my own firm, dealing with both groups—understands there is zero chance they can ever compete with a European in roles requiring genuine expertise and inventiveness. Sure, they are inexpensive, but cultural and historical traditions have molded the Chinese into obedient, uninspired workers, while the Indians have become a mass of lazy individuals with degrees... My company actually shuttered its office in India, not because of the cost, but because of the staggering expenses required to fix the blunders they committed. They were useful only for mindless copying and pasting—and even then, they were incredibly lazy..

Scott Rodriguez19 said:"A mass of lazy idiots with fancy degrees."😁 It turns out Germans and Austrians hold very similar opinions about us.
"We're only good for copying and pasting, and even then, we're incredibly lazy."👍
It isn't that we don't want to work—the issue is that we don't have the damn time!