Is having five kids actually worth it?

Quincy:

You wouldn't be facing this if you had cranked out five kids. Sure, one would probably turn out to be an idiot. One might get hit by a subway train, but that would leave you with three healthy individuals—healthy because they were forced to learn how to share, and because since you couldn't focus all your dysfunction on just one child, they didn't develop crippling neuroses.

This is appalling.😲
I have one child, and I don't plan on having more. My child was planned, wanted, and loved—not just churned out.

Quincy:

And those three healthy individuals will love you. They'll remember how warm and happy their home was, conveniently forgetting that it was only warm because you could only afford them one bedroom. They’ll romanticize every struggle of their upbringing. They’ll care for you in your old age because they grew up to be good people. And when you die, someone will weep for you. There is nothing more a person can wish for than that.

That depends entirely on other factors, not the number of children.

When you approach parenthood from such a selfish, lazy perspective—basically thinking, "I’ll have kids so they can look after me when I'm old since I can't be bothered to dedicate my free time to them"—it's no wonder those kids grow up without any love or respect for their parents.

Honestly, someone made a great point earlier—we really ought to come up with some kind of psychological screening process for anyone thinking about having children. ☕

Assuming the OP actually meant what they wrote, here’s my take:
.. I don't get people who obsess over what happens to them after they're gone (🤣)—where they end up buried, what people say about them, whether anyone cries, all that nonsense. When I'm gone, I'm gone. Whether I'm in a cemetery or scattered over the Pacific doesn't matter to me..Particularly I have zero desire for my kids to weep over me (I have two)... quite the opposite, actually. If they remember me, I'd rather an occasional smile hit their face alongside the nostalgia..
Regarding this whole concept of children "owing" their parents (which seems to be the core of the argument about having five kids)—I think that "debt" isn't paid back to the parents, but through how we care for our own children. Our parents looked after us, so we look after ours, and the cycle continues. There is no such thing as a debt owed to a parent. It's one of the most absurd ideas out there, and it's pathetic that it persists as "truth" in so many parents' minds 👎

I mean, honestly, some people just can't handle even one kid.

Austin Vaughn3 said:Assuming the OP actually meant what they wrote, here’s my take:
.. I don't get people who obsess over what happens to them after they're gone (🤣)—where they end up buried, what people say about them, whether anyone cries, all that nonsense. When I'm gone, I'm gone. Whether I'm in a cemetery or scattered over the Pacific doesn't matter to me..Particularly I have zero desire for my kids to weep over me (I have two)... quite the opposite, actually. If they remember me, I'd rather an occasional smile hit their face alongside the nostalgia..
Regarding this whole concept of children "owing" their parents (which seems to be the core of the argument about having five kids)—I think that "debt" isn't paid back to the parents, but through how we care for our own children. Our parents looked after us, so we look after ours, and the cycle continues. There is no such thing as a debt owed to a parent. It's one of the most absurd ideas out there, and it's pathetic that it persists as "truth" in so many parents' minds 👎

You know, you might be surprised—that whole concept is actually pretty widespread and deeply ingrained in how things work around here.

jadewalker63 said:Excellent post.👍
I wouldn't have written it any differently myself—except I'm about 10 years older.
If this isn't too off-topic, I'm honestly glad there are people out there who aren't ashamed to admit they love their peace. Once you've done your part, the chaos of other people's kids and the constant mess can really get under your skin—and it's fine to enjoy the quiet.
My kid is almost grown and fully independent now. I gave them the years they needed, gladly. Now that I'm in my 40s, I'm basically rebuilding my own life. I travel, stay busy with different hobbies, and I'm just happy those kinds of obligations are behind me.
When I'm around people with little kids, I have to watch what I say—it's practically heresy to admit you don't want more children and that you actually enjoy the silence. Still, I see I'm not alone. 🙂

I find this incredibly fascinating—mostly because it’s so far removed from my own situation. Examples like this really give hope to those perpetual cynics who seem afraid to actually live life. For women, specifically, if they wait too long, their chances of having more children diminish significantly. You end up potentially seeing only one child, often reaching that stage of parenting just as others are entering their "second youth" and finally relaxing now that their kids are grown. That sense that you might have wasted precious time—well, by definition, that realization hits a bit late. At that point, you just have to make the most of whatever you've got.

Austin Vaughn3 said:Assuming the OP actually meant what they wrote, here’s my take:
.. I don't get people who obsess over what happens to them after they're gone (🤣)—where they end up buried, what people say about them, whether anyone cries, all that nonsense. When I'm gone, I'm gone. Whether I'm in a cemetery or scattered over the Pacific doesn't matter to me..Particularly I have zero desire for my kids to weep over me (I have two)... quite the opposite, actually. If they remember me, I'd rather an occasional smile hit their face alongside the nostalgia..
Regarding this whole concept of children "owing" their parents (which seems to be the core of the argument about having five kids)—I think that "debt" isn't paid back to the parents, but through how we care for our own children. Our parents looked after us, so we look after ours, and the cycle continues. There is no such thing as a debt owed to a parent. It's one of the most absurd ideas out there, and it's pathetic that it persists as "truth" in so many parents' minds 👎

He actually wrote that the best thing you can possibly expect from death is simply having someone weep for you—which, I guess, is a rather touching sentiment.

Regarding that matter— I suppose I should probably mention that debts—well, they can really start to pile up if you aren't careful—but honestly, managing them is such a headache. It’s one of those things where everything seems fine until suddenly it isn't, I guess.Parenting—it’s really a two-way street between children and their parents, I suppose. We are, fortunately, civilized enough to understand and respect the various cycles of life. For me, the only parts of those old folklore tales that feel truly haunting or tragic are the episodes involving alienated elderly people. You know, those folks with sunken cheeks and dark circles under their eyes wandering near nursing homes—people I have to pass by, looking all mournful, while I'm just trying to go grab some pastries from a local bakery. Or perhaps it's the abandoned seniors who happen to own nice real estate, or even those who mutter to themselves at a red light—and when I look into their eyes, I can see both a son and a daughter living full, healthy lives elsewhere. It’s sad, really. The very least we can do is afford them a shred of basic dignity, if nothing else. And, I guess, that's exactly what we should expect in return.

I know of a case involving a woman in her fifties—someone who had perfectly healthy children, by all accounts—who passed away from cancer while literally lying in her own waste. Right there in her own home. All alone. And when I think about what she was actually doing to herself in those final moments—she was essentially killing herself, quite literally—it makes me lose all respect for our lack of basic human decency.

Lisa Hernandez3 said:I find this incredibly fascinating—mostly because it’s so far removed from my own situation. Examples like this really give hope to those perpetual cynics who seem afraid to actually live life. For women, specifically, if they wait too long, their chances of having more children diminish significantly. You end up potentially seeing only one child, often reaching that stage of parenting just as others are entering their "second youth" and finally relaxing now that their kids are grown. That sense that you might have wasted precious time—well, by definition, that realization hits a bit late. At that point, you just have to make the most of whatever you've got.

He actually wrote that the best thing you can possibly expect from death is simply having someone weep for you—which, I guess, is a rather touching sentiment.

Regarding that matter— I suppose I should probably mention that debts—well, they can really start to pile up if you aren't careful—but honestly, managing them is such a headache. It’s one of those things where everything seems fine until suddenly it isn't, I guess.Parenting—it’s really a two-way street between children and their parents, I suppose. We are, fortunately, civilized enough to understand and respect the various cycles of life. For me, the only parts of those old folklore tales that feel truly haunting or tragic are the episodes involving alienated elderly people. You know, those folks with sunken cheeks and dark circles under their eyes wandering near nursing homes—people I have to pass by, looking all mournful, while I'm just trying to go grab some pastries from a local bakery. Or perhaps it's the abandoned seniors who happen to own nice real estate, or even those who mutter to themselves at a red light—and when I look into their eyes, I can see both a son and a daughter living full, healthy lives elsewhere. It’s sad, really. The very least we can do is afford them a shred of basic dignity, if nothing else. And, I guess, that's exactly what we should expect in return.

I know of a case involving a woman in her fifties—someone who had perfectly healthy children, by all accounts—who passed away from cancer while literally lying in her own waste. Right there in her own home. All alone. And when I think about what she was actually doing to herself in those final moments—she was essentially killing herself, quite literally—it makes me lose all respect for our lack of basic human decency.

Whether I act or stay still... that’s my call. I make my own choices, regardless of whatever colorful mess of reasons drives them. Maybe it’s a gut feeling, maybe it’s love. Maybe it’s just duty, tradition, or habit. It doesn't matter. I choose my path because I want to, not because I’m looking for a payout. As Quincy put it, I'm not doing this expecting the same thing back. If I take care of my parents only because I expect my own kids to return the favor one day, then my intentions aren't honest. They're just a transaction.
Don't kid yourself. No mother has kids "for them." It’s always about the parent. Caring for a child is the bare minimum requirement for someone who brought a life into this world without that child's consent. If a mother "literally dies" for her children, that’s her own choice. The story about the mother lost to cancer is genuinely heartbreaking, sure. But my point stands: we don't have children just to have someone wipe our waste when we get old, whether we have one kid or five.

briskpuma23 said:I know it’s not exactly trendy to advocate for large families these days, unless you’re coming from the Catholic Church—but it’s easy for them to talk when they don't even recognize their own kids.

To be clear, my stance on needing at least five kids has nothing to do with some nonsense about "procreation" or any kind of moral crusade.

The truth is, you have children for your own sake.

When our time finally runs out, most people—especially people today—will find it pretty hard to sing My Way while looking back at their lives as a selfless sacrifice for others. There's no way. Most of us are just focused on how to cut corners, how to get the most out of life while spending the least, how to hustle, how to score a weekend trip to a beach house, then head to work, maybe join a committee, and so on. In short, we'd rather people didn't judge us by our actions.

And given the kind of shallow people society has turned us into, we can barely manage to bring one child into this world; having two would already feel like an incredible sacrifice.

Because we are so spiritually numb and, let's be honest, lazy and immature, we’ll probably end up ruining the kid too. We’ll pass all our neuroses down to them, instill hypochondria and cynicism, blast them with antibiotics the second they cough, and then complain at the office about how "fragile" our child is. Besides, if you spend your time talking about your kid at work, only the worst kind of boss would actually trust you with a serious project. So, that one child becomes the perfect excuse to stay lazy and avoid doing any real work.

But again, after fifty or sixty years of dodging actual life, retirement rolls around with its tiny pension, and you realize that your one precious child doesn't really love you. They’re busy living their own selfish little lives with an equally rotten spouse and an only child of their own—an obnoxious, spoiled brat who won't even bother to visit Grandma. That's when you realize you have nobody.

That wouldn't happen if you had managed to have five kids. Granted, one would probably be an idiot. One might get hit by a bus, but that still leaves you with three healthy individuals. Healthy because, by necessity, they had to learn how to share, and because you didn't have enough time to focus all your dysfunction on just one person, they didn't develop those stupid neuroses. Plus, a big family naturally builds a competitive spirit, starting from when they're toddlers fighting over fries at McDonald's during a Happy Meal you take them to on Sundays because you're too lazy to cook a Sunday roast.

And those three healthy ones will actually love you. They’ll remember how warm and happy the home felt, conveniently forgetting the fact that it was only warm because you could only afford to give them one bedroom. They’ll turn all the flaws of their upbringing into beautiful memories. And they’ll take care of you in your old age because they grew up to be decent people. When you die, someone will actually cry for you. And honestly, there’s nothing more a person can wish for than that.

Killer post. Totally true.
And there is zero chance I'm having five kids.
Three sounded fine once.
Then I realized I'd end up being some thirty-year-old student running around like a caffeinated hamster on a wheel, sprinting from work to class to work to school until retirement.
The rich kids who look ahead usually don't even want kids, while those of us with no prospects who actually *want* them are too terrified to try because we're constantly stressing about the future. If I could just chill and live like some person on welfare with half a dozen toddlers hanging off me, man, where would it end? Five, ten... who knows. But nah, no way. Without a degree or the right connections, you're basically a walking dead man in this country. And right now, I'm not moving overseas just so I can finally have some breathing room.

But seriously, great intro.
And spot on.

Lisa Hernandez3 said:I find this incredibly fascinating—mostly because it’s so far removed from my own situation. Examples like this really give hope to those perpetual cynics who seem afraid to actually live life. For women, specifically, if they wait too long, their chances of having more children diminish significantly. You end up potentially seeing only one child, often reaching that stage of parenting just as others are entering their "second youth" and finally relaxing now that their kids are grown. That sense that you might have wasted precious time—well, by definition, that realization hits a bit late. At that point, you just have to make the most of whatever you've got.

He actually wrote that the best thing you can possibly expect from death is simply having someone weep for you—which, I guess, is a rather touching sentiment.

Regarding that matter— I suppose I should probably mention that debts—well, they can really start to pile up if you aren't careful—but honestly, managing them is such a headache. It’s one of those things where everything seems fine until suddenly it isn't, I guess.Parenting—it’s really a two-way street between children and their parents, I suppose. We are, fortunately, civilized enough to understand and respect the various cycles of life. For me, the only parts of those old folklore tales that feel truly haunting or tragic are the episodes involving alienated elderly people. You know, those folks with sunken cheeks and dark circles under their eyes wandering near nursing homes—people I have to pass by, looking all mournful, while I'm just trying to go grab some pastries from a local bakery. Or perhaps it's the abandoned seniors who happen to own nice real estate, or even those who mutter to themselves at a red light—and when I look into their eyes, I can see both a son and a daughter living full, healthy lives elsewhere. It’s sad, really. The very least we can do is afford them a shred of basic dignity, if nothing else. And, I guess, that's exactly what we should expect in return.

I know of a case involving a woman in her fifties—someone who had perfectly healthy children, by all accounts—who passed away from cancer while literally lying in her own waste. Right there in her own home. All alone. And when I think about what she was actually doing to herself in those final moments—she was essentially killing herself, quite literally—it makes me lose all respect for our lack of basic human decency.

Maybe.
But I'll say it again: I’d much rather deal with a cynic who understands their own limits than parents who have kids for all the wrong reasons and have no clue what to do with them. They end up failing both themselves and the kids.

And even that cynic had to be born and raised by someone—likely a parent who had them for the wrong reasons in the first place.

briskpuma23 said:I know it’s not exactly trendy to advocate for large families these days, unless you’re coming from the Catholic Church—but it’s easy for them to talk when they don't even recognize their own kids.

To be clear, my stance on needing at least five kids has nothing to do with some nonsense about "procreation" or any kind of moral crusade.

The truth is, you have children for your own sake.

When our time finally runs out, most people—especially people today—will find it pretty hard to sing My Way while looking back at their lives as a selfless sacrifice for others. There's no way. Most of us are just focused on how to cut corners, how to get the most out of life while spending the least, how to hustle, how to score a weekend trip to a beach house, then head to work, maybe join a committee, and so on. In short, we'd rather people didn't judge us by our actions.

And given the kind of shallow people society has turned us into, we can barely manage to bring one child into this world; having two would already feel like an incredible sacrifice.

Because we are so spiritually numb and, let's be honest, lazy and immature, we’ll probably end up ruining the kid too. We’ll pass all our neuroses down to them, instill hypochondria and cynicism, blast them with antibiotics the second they cough, and then complain at the office about how "fragile" our child is. Besides, if you spend your time talking about your kid at work, only the worst kind of boss would actually trust you with a serious project. So, that one child becomes the perfect excuse to stay lazy and avoid doing any real work.

But again, after fifty or sixty years of dodging actual life, retirement rolls around with its tiny pension, and you realize that your one precious child doesn't really love you. They’re busy living their own selfish little lives with an equally rotten spouse and an only child of their own—an obnoxious, spoiled brat who won't even bother to visit Grandma. That's when you realize you have nobody.

That wouldn't happen if you had managed to have five kids. Granted, one would probably be an idiot. One might get hit by a bus, but that still leaves you with three healthy individuals. Healthy because, by necessity, they had to learn how to share, and because you didn't have enough time to focus all your dysfunction on just one person, they didn't develop those stupid neuroses. Plus, a big family naturally builds a competitive spirit, starting from when they're toddlers fighting over fries at McDonald's during a Happy Meal you take them to on Sundays because you're too lazy to cook a Sunday roast.

And those three healthy ones will actually love you. They’ll remember how warm and happy the home felt, conveniently forgetting the fact that it was only warm because you could only afford to give them one bedroom. They’ll turn all the flaws of their upbringing into beautiful memories. And they’ll take care of you in your old age because they grew up to be decent people. When you die, someone will actually cry for you. And honestly, there’s nothing more a person can wish for than that.

whatever happens, happens🙄
There are five of us—we're basically just counting down the days until we can finally have some peace from our parents. My dad doesn't even live with us anymore because keeping up with four daughters and one disinterested son is just too much work for him, and Mom... well, she moved out for a few years before eventually coming back.🙄
I guess we're stuck with her forever.

Sometimes I honestly feel like she doesn't even love us; she just uses us as a prop so people will tell her, "Wow, you're such an amazing mother." Honestly, forget that. We’re young, we’re healthy, we actually enjoy each other's company—and then she shows up with that whole "I brought you into this world" attitude.🙄

I am definitely not having any kids. I'd rather die alone than raise someone who is just waiting for me to kick the bucket.

Love and respect are things you have to earn.
Deep down, we all have that "but she's our mom" mindset, but there are so many times we find ourselves daydreaming about how great life was when we were on our own.

Anyway.

Having five kids is great if you want your house to be loud and chaotic 24/7.👋

I love my sisters and my idiot brother.🙂

😍

Having read through this entire thread, I honestly find myself agreeing with everything Satoshi Nakamoto wrote.
It’s just sad that people have kids based on the mindset of "I need someone to inherit my stuff" or "I need someone to look after me when I'm old."
If you actually have a great spouse, solid friends, and a good community, they can step up for you too.
But let's be real—that's rarely the case nowadays because people can be selfish. It feels easier to just leave everything to your kid (assuming your own flesh and blood is honest, loves you, and will actually show up to care for you once you're helpless and sick) rather than leaving anything to a neighbor or anyone else outside the family bubble.
But hey, why shouldn't you?

It all comes down to how people think.
Personally, I can't stand the way so many people act like the sole purpose of life is to have three, four, or five kids.
Just have one and actually pour your heart into raising them right.
Don't have five just to struggle to make ends meet.
When you have a massive family, you can't give every child the attention they actually deserve.
Instead, parents just dump all the responsibility onto teachers and daycare workers, acting like those institutions are paid to raise their children for them.

It’s pathetic that people don't realize everything starts with parenting.
Who you become and how you view the world depends almost entirely on how you were raised.

Kids simply mirror the environment they live in.

Anyone planning on becoming a parent really needs to grasp that.

(Maybe that was a bit simplistic, but there... my humble contribution to the discussion.)
🙂