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Grading Freshmen

Started by Michelle James13 · · 👁 40 views · 608 replies

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Betty Gray84 Betty Gray84 Member
13 messages
joined Jun 2013
#301 ·
wanderinggardener12 said:What people call "posters" aren't actually posters at all; they are just a chaotic mess of cutouts or, if you’re lucky, some independently written paragraphs glued onto a large sheet of paper. I imagine professional graphic designers and fine artists would probably clutch their heads in exasperation if they saw them.

When it comes to those oversized displays used in classrooms, I struggle to see much value in them unless the students are creating them during class time—ideally working in pairs or small groups after they've actually processed the material and done some preliminary work (like studying, digging through extra resources suggested by the teacher, or collaborating with an art instructor on visual layouts...).

For the more diligent and capable students, it offers a chance to dive deeper into a subject; for those who are notoriously hard to motivate, it might spark some engagement; for the slackers, perhaps some knowledge will finally stick through collaborative effort; and for everyone, it serves as a lesson in teamwork (and for some, a chance to practice leadership and coordination).
In the end, everyone gets a brief reprieve from the usual repetitive methods, they have a bit of fun, they might actually learn something, and most kids genuinely enjoy the process of creating something alongside their peers.

But of course, it's foolish to pass judgment on it. I only hope this kind of thing is becoming less common.

As for the "posters" being churned out at home, I agree with you that it's often too late for many parents to suddenly become experts—you can tell just by looking at the walls in certain schools. I don't know how one is supposed to grade such a thing, but I certainly know what I would say to a parent who ends up doing their child's homework, and I'd have plenty to say to a teacher assigning such pointless busywork.

Surely we aren't seeing this even in first grade?!

Personally, I'm not a fan of posters in the traditional sense (where a child makes them at home with their parents). I prefer a different approach, usually toward the end of the school year when things settle into a few weeks of review. For instance, while reviewing 4th-grade social studies using mind maps, I'll tell my students to jot down whatever interests them about the topic on the back of the paper. Since kids have such wonderful imaginations, someone might link the concept of the sun (as a requirement for life) to aliens, planets, or space travel.
If there's a lot of interest in a specific topic, I'll suggest they use the school library and home resources to dive deep and then present their findings however they like. We once spent a little over 😬 exploring the Bermuda Triangle that way. The kids teamed up, met at each other's houses, and ended up producing a mix of YouTube clips, online articles, and photos—they even invited a geography professor to join in, and there was one poster involved!

In first grade, we do "posters," but strictly as a group activity during review sessions. For example, I'll split the class into groups; one group might draw the different rooms in the school, while another focuses on the staff, all working together on large sheets of paper.
I don't grade them on aesthetics; the goal is simply to encourage teamwork, communication, and social skills.
Grace Kern3 Grace Kern3 Newcomer
8 messages
joined Jul 2013
#302 ·
Nicholas King said:I suspect most parents either already possess those skills themselves or, frankly, it's a bit too late in their lives to start acquiring them by making their kid's school projects...

Personally, I think it’s just way easier for parents to DIY the project themselves rather than actually putting in the effort to sit down and help their kid do it on their own. Maybe I'm being an idealist here, but I see it as a chance for parents to actually bond with their kids—though it seems like unless there's some "complicated" homework involved, they rarely bother finding the time.

Edit: It's the exact same thing as when parents write the book reports, essays, or solve math problems for them, so I don't get why posters specifically are such a huge deal.
fadedtrucker8 fadedtrucker8 Member
27 messages
joined Jun 2008
#303 ·
Grace Kern3 said:Personally, I think it’s just way easier for parents to DIY the project themselves rather than actually putting in the effort to sit down and help their kid do it on their own. Maybe I'm being an idealist here, but I see it as a chance for parents to actually bond with their kids—though it seems like unless there's some "complicated" homework involved, they rarely bother finding the time.

Edit: It's the exact same thing as when parents write the book reports, essays, or solve math problems for them, so I don't get why posters specifically are such a huge deal.

We worked on a poster with our son until he eventually just collapsed from exhaustion... but honestly, topics regarding American involvement in World War I are hardly appropriate material for fourth graders... period.

That is precisely the point, much like assigning PowerPoint presentations to third graders...

They should really provide assignments that are age-appropriate...

As parents, we have little choice but to step in and help so our children can maintain good grades. Sending a child to school with nothing but an excuse that the curriculum isn't suitable wouldn't exactly produce any positive results.
Betty Gray84 Betty Gray84 Member
13 messages
joined Jun 2013
#304 ·
fadedtrucker8 said:We worked on a poster with our son until he eventually just collapsed from exhaustion... but honestly, topics regarding American involvement in World War I are hardly appropriate material for fourth graders... period.

That is precisely the point, much like assigning PowerPoint presentations to third graders...

They should really provide assignments that are age-appropriate...

As parents, we have little choice but to step in and help so our children can maintain good grades. Sending a child to school with nothing but an excuse that the curriculum isn't suitable wouldn't exactly produce any positive results.

It's true that the PPP curriculum includes topics regarding American history, but there's really no need to dive into the heavy details. It should be enough for kids to simply grasp that the US has always been part of a larger global community.
To me, this assignment feels like one of those "for those who want to go the extra mile" type of tasks.
Grace Kern3 Grace Kern3 Newcomer
8 messages
joined Jul 2013
#305 ·
fadedtrucker8 said:We worked on a poster with our son until he eventually just collapsed from exhaustion... but honestly, topics regarding American involvement in World War I are hardly appropriate material for fourth graders... period.

That is precisely the point, much like assigning PowerPoint presentations to third graders...

They should really provide assignments that are age-appropriate...

As parents, we have little choice but to step in and help so our children can maintain good grades. Sending a child to school with nothing but an excuse that the curriculum isn't suitable wouldn't exactly produce any positive results.


I already said this at the start; if this is part of the actual curriculum, fine, but it shouldn't be a massive take-home project.😉

Regarding the PowerPoints, kids today grow up with computers. If they've been taking computer lab since first grade, I don't see why they can't actually use those skills instead of spending five hours a day playing video games.🤷
Rachel Jones8 Rachel Jones8 Active Member
220 messages
joined Dec 2011
#306 ·
Grace Kern3 said:I already said this at the start; if this is part of the actual curriculum, fine, but it shouldn't be a massive take-home project.😉

Regarding the PowerPoints, kids today grow up with computers. If they've been taking computer lab since first grade, I don't see why they can't actually use those skills instead of spending five hours a day playing video games.🤷

The key part is— if.
Grace Kern3 Grace Kern3 Newcomer
8 messages
joined Jul 2013
#307 ·
Yeah, emphasis on if and an even bigger emphasis on gamingfor five hours a day...😉
How is that supposedly a better option? 🤣
I mean, that’s what computers are for, right? If a kid pulls straight A's by the end of the school year, Mom and Dad reward their little genius with a top-of-the-line, high-end PC loaded with a massive library of games just so their "investment" stays busy and doesn't bother them.
Then some bratty teacher has the audacity to suggest actually using that computer for something productive, and—shocker!—everyone is appalled. They even go so far as to reward the collective effort of the whole family, friends, neighbors, passersby, tech support, the Democratic Party... and anyone else who helped get that assignment done.🙂
Betty Gray84 Betty Gray84 Member
13 messages
joined Jun 2013
#308 ·
I honestly feel like most of these tasks are just optional extras, but kids jump at them because they're eager, and then parents end up thinking it's mandatory without even realizing it. I can't even count how many times I've said things like, "Hey, check if anyone has an old sheet lying around that you don't need anymore so we can use it for our class play." Instead, I end up with a brand-new sheet, still in its packaging, and a parent asking why they had to make a special trip to Target.

That said, if a child is genuinely hungry to learn more, we really should lean into that curiosity, especially since school resources aren't always distributed equally across all districts.

The ultimate goal should be helping them build the competence to learn independently and figure out how to navigate various information sources on their own. That's what we should be aiming for.
Nicholas King Nicholas King Regular
716 messages
joined Jan 2023
#309 ·
Grace Kern3 said:Yeah, emphasis on if and an even bigger emphasis on gamingfor five hours a day...😉
How is that supposedly a better option? 🤣
I mean, that’s what computers are for, right? If a kid pulls straight A's by the end of the school year, Mom and Dad reward their little genius with a top-of-the-line, high-end PC loaded with a massive library of games just so their "investment" stays busy and doesn't bother them.
Then some bratty teacher has the audacity to suggest actually using that computer for something productive, and—shocker!—everyone is appalled. They even go so far as to reward the collective effort of the whole family, friends, neighbors, passersby, tech support, the Democratic Party... and anyone else who helped get that assignment done.🙂

Is this supposed to be some kind of insightful commentary, or just a sweeping, passive-aggressive attack on parents? I can't quite tell what the goal here is.
And then you’ve got some cranky teacher who actually has the audacity to suggest that the computer should be used for something productive.

In my opinion—and I say this very deliberately—a teacher who demands a computer be "used for something useful" in a way that wasn't part of the actual curriculum isn't being "cranky"—they're just being dense.
Rachel Jones8 Rachel Jones8 Active Member
220 messages
joined Dec 2011
#310 ·
Grace Kern3 said:Yeah, emphasis on if and an even bigger emphasis on gamingfor five hours a day...😉
How is that supposedly a better option? 🤣
I mean, that’s what computers are for, right? If a kid pulls straight A's by the end of the school year, Mom and Dad reward their little genius with a top-of-the-line, high-end PC loaded with a massive library of games just so their "investment" stays busy and doesn't bother them.
Then some bratty teacher has the audacity to suggest actually using that computer for something productive, and—shocker!—everyone is appalled. They even go so far as to reward the collective effort of the whole family, friends, neighbors, passersby, tech support, the Democratic Party... and anyone else who helped get that assignment done.🙂

It's just wrong to assign homework on Google Classroom if the kid isn't even taking a tech class.
And let's face it, computer science isn't even a required course in most schools.
fadedtrucker8 fadedtrucker8 Member
27 messages
joined Jun 2008
#311 ·
Rachel Jones8 said:It's just wrong to assign homework on Google Classroom if the kid isn't even taking a tech class.
And let's face it, computer science isn't even a required course in most schools.

As I recall, computer science is only offered as an elective starting in fifth grade, at least here in our local school district...
Nicholas King Nicholas King Regular
716 messages
joined Jan 2023
#312 ·
Irrelevant. Election matter.

In our schools—and honestly, you wouldn't believe it—you've even got kids who are completely digitally illiterate because of their parents.
Rachel Jones8 Rachel Jones8 Active Member
220 messages
joined Dec 2011
#313 ·
They’re graduating high school without ever touching a computer science class? In this day and age, that’s just wild.
And honestly, expecting kids to nail their homework—no matter what grade they're in—is kind of a joke, right? It's just not fair.
If the trend is that everything from assignments to basically life happens on a laptop... isn't it about time computer literacy became a mandatory subject?
Grace Kern3 Grace Kern3 Newcomer
8 messages
joined Jul 2013
#314 ·
Nicholas King said:Is this supposed to be some kind of insightful commentary, or just a sweeping, passive-aggressive attack on parents? I can't quite tell what the goal here is.
And then you’ve got some cranky teacher who actually has the audacity to suggest that the computer should be used for something productive.

In my opinion—and I say this very deliberately—a teacher who demands a computer be "used for something useful" in a way that wasn't part of the actual curriculum isn't being "cranky"—they're just being dense.

Hell no. 🤣 I’m just simplifying things. What I’m really trying to say is that if parents weren't already totally defensive against their teacher, they might see this as a nudge to get kids off gaming and social media and actually use those home computers for something productive.

A teacher demanding kids use computers for "useful stuff" in ways they haven't even been taught at school isn't being tough—she's just being clueless.

...So you're actually enjoying insulting the teacher? 😕
I'll give you this: a project like that only works if the kids have had computer lab since first grade and if they've already been doing this type of work in class, which is exactly what I said before. 😉
Rachel Jones8 Rachel Jones8 Active Member
220 messages
joined Dec 2011
#315 ·
Grace Kern3 said:Hell no. 🤣 I’m just simplifying things. What I’m really trying to say is that if parents weren't already totally defensive against their teacher, they might see this as a nudge to get kids off gaming and social media and actually use those home computers for something productive.

A teacher demanding kids use computers for "useful stuff" in ways they haven't even been taught at school isn't being tough—she's just being clueless.

...So you're actually enjoying insulting the teacher? 😕
I'll give you this: a project like that only works if the kids have had computer lab since first grade and if they've already been doing this type of work in class, which is exactly what I said before. 😉A teacher demanding kids use computers for "useful stuff" in ways they haven't even been taught at school isn't being tough—she's just being clueless.

...So you're actually enjoying insulting the teacher? 😕
I'll give you this: a project like that only works if the kids have had computer lab since first grade and if they've already been doing this type of work in class, which is exactly what I said before. 😉A teacher demanding kids use computers for "useful stuff" in ways they haven't even been taught at school isn't being tough—she's just being clueless.

...So you're actually enjoying insulting the teacher? 😕
I'll give you this: a project like that only works if the kids have had computer lab since first grade and if they've already been doing this type of work in class, which is exactly what I said before. 😉
It’s not an insult, it’s just the truth. Right?
What would you even say to someone like that? Imagine being assigned programming homework when you never even had a computer science class in school, nobody ever showed you what coding actually is, and you might not even have a laptop at home. How is that even fair?
I'm all for a project like that, honestly. But is it really enough? What if? Kids are already taking computer classes starting in first grade? Seriously? What's up? They already pulled that stunt back in school, just like I said before. Didn't I tell you? 😉

When you look at the big picture, this project just doesn't sit right. Most of the younger kids haven't even touched computer science yet, and let's be real—not everyone is sticking around for the advanced classes anyway. Is it really fair to give that kind of assignment to everyone? Not really.
Grace Kern3 Grace Kern3 Newcomer
8 messages
joined Jul 2013
#316 ·
I honestly don't even know how to approach her. Should I just tell her straight up that this assignment is totally inappropriate for these reasons and suggest they make a poster instead? 😁 Just kidding... sort of.
But seriously, you hit the nail on the head—we really need computer science integrated into the curriculum starting as early as first grade.
Rachel Jones8 Rachel Jones8 Active Member
220 messages
joined Dec 2011
#317 ·
Grace Kern3 said:I honestly don't even know how to approach her. Should I just tell her straight up that this assignment is totally inappropriate for these reasons and suggest they make a poster instead? 😁 Just kidding... sort of.
But seriously, you hit the nail on the head—we really need computer science integrated into the curriculum starting as early as first grade.

I wasn't asking what you'd say to her, I was asking what you'd say about her.
Is she just clueless?
Since when is calling someone out for doing something stupid the same thing as calling them dumb?
Actually, like you said, computer science should be a mandatory subject starting back in first grade.

It’s honestly wild to me that computer science hasn't been a required class for ages... doesn't matter if it's first grade or fourth, but it's definitely bad that kids can graduate high school today and be totally tech-illiterate.
If it were a required course, even kids with parents who don't know a thing about computers or just aren't interested would actually learn something.
Grace Kern3 Grace Kern3 Newcomer
8 messages
joined Jul 2013
#318 ·
Look, I’m a pacifist at heart, so my first move would be to approach her with a chill, conciliatory vibe. I’d try to figure out what her actual reasoning or justification was for handing out an assignment like that when the kids clearly haven't been taught the basics—all before I even think about calling her out. But if she can't give me a straight, logical explanation? Then yeah, maybe it's time to start throwing some labels around.

The fact that computer science isn't a core part of the curriculum is another massive failure in our American education system. You finish school, you head out into the job market, and suddenly "computer literacy" is a mandatory line on every single resume. How are we supposed to expect that from students when the school system just keeps skipping over tech classes? At the end of the day, it just means these skills have to be picked up at home—relying on whatever little tips a teacher might throw out and hoping the parents actually know how to use a computer.
Jessica Chavez4 Jessica Chavez4 Active Member
67 messages
joined Jul 2012
#319 ·
Honestly, it’s probably for the best they don't have them. Knowing how our American school system operates, I can only imagine what a disaster that would turn out to be. 😬
Rachel Jones8 Rachel Jones8 Active Member
220 messages
joined Dec 2011
#320 ·
Jessica Chavez4 said:Honestly, it’s probably for the best they don't have them. Knowing how our American school system operates, I can only imagine what a disaster that would turn out to be. 😬

You really think so?
Even if the facilities suck and the teaching quality isn't always great—do you seriously think it's okay for an 18-year-old to graduate in this country without having taken a single computer science class? 😕

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