Buddhism

It’s laughable. These people are debating mind control and thought patterns—nightmares fueled by internet forums and some guy who can barely hold onto a single dream. It's pure fiction.

The dreams have nothing to do with this forum, just like this forum has nothing to do with reality.🙂 🙂

Go ahead and philosophize until you're blue in the face. Practice is what matters. Theory is just a playground for lost souls with too much time on their hands.

Practical application and enlightenment aren't even in the same zip code.🙏 🙂

Now, regarding lucid dreaming—that part actually holds water.

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If you actually have techniques that work, stop preaching and just DM them to me.😉

As long as you possess a body and intend to actually use it—assuming you have the self-awareness to realize it exists—you ought to maintain it.

I’ll say it again: your physical form and your thoughts are separate entities. There is no reason to waste energy trying to soothe them.

While the mind persists, one should keep it sharp; otherwise, it simply goes soft.

🙄

Balkanijan Pig said:LOL, talking about mind control and thought patterns when you're just some guy scrolling through internet forums at 3 AM who can't even remember his own dreams 🤣. B

That was the one and only. 😢 😁

I’ll bet you anything that if you follow my lead for just a week, you'll start remembering your dreams and probably even hit a lucid dream or two. 😉

Actually, I already remember my dreams, and whenever I have a lucid one—hey, I'm all for it. 🙂
I think we're totally missing each other here. Like I mentioned in a previous post, sure, you can push a single thought to the forefront, focus on it, and maybe—just maybe—get somewhere with it. That's basically how visualization techniques work; I used to do it myself back in the day. But once you stick with it long enough, you start realizing that you can't actually force certain things to happen just by thinking about them (even if you use the exact same method). Eventually, you realize you aren't actually *doing* anything. What you thought you triggered through visualization was likely going to happen anyway, and your desire for it was just a sign that it was coming. It's hard to put into words, but you eventually just get it. If you stop trying to micromanage everything and just follow your intuition and flow, you see that life follows its own course regardless—you just trick yourself into thinking you're the one driving. It sounds a bit trippy, but I hope that makes sense.

You guys can play philosopher all you want, but practice is what matters. Theory is just for people with too much free time on their hands. 🙂

Look above; there's a perfect example of my "practice" in action.

Karen Sanchez19 said:Dreaming has nothing to do with this, and neither does the forum.🙂 🙂

Practice and enlightenment are two different things.🙏 🙂

But the stuff about lucid dreaming is spot on.

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And since you mentioned you have techniques, shoot me a DM and share them!😉

It actually has everything to do with dreams. Once you learn how to stay mindful and conscious while you're awake, that awareness starts bleeding into your sleep too.

When your life and your mind are disciplined, everything falls into place—including your dreams. They’re really just an echo of your waking state.

If you just start going to bed at a decent time instead of staying up until 2 AM and then getting up at 4 AM, you'll notice a difference. If you write down your dreams in a journal right when you wake up (ideally while you're still tucked in), you'll start remembering them much more often. Throw in some meditation—like Vipassana or even just some Zen practice—before bed and right after you wake up, and you'll be golden. If you want to go lucid, any standard technique works, but I recommend doing it this way: meditate at 4 AM, then lie back down for about an hour. That's usually the sweet spot for lucid dreaming.

Staying away from forums, TV, computers, and other brain-rot distractions helps a lot, too.

It doesn't have to be just a few hours before bed; it's more about your whole evening routine.

I honestly believe if you stick to this for a few days (just living a healthy lifestyle + keeping a dream journal), you'll start remembering your dreams.

Whenever I'm scrolling through forums late into the night, I never remember anything. But if I hit the sack early and get up before sunrise, they come back to me.

They might not happen at the exact same time, but I'm betting your chances will definitely improve.

Balkanijan Pig said:It’s the same deal with the body. If you stop working out, you’re going to lose your shape. Does that mean you shouldn't exercise? Not at all. Once you move beyond the physical—when you’ve transcended the body and reached a state of pure consciousness or whatever you want to call it—there won't be a need for it anymore. But as long as you have a body and are living in it, you have to maintain it. It’s the exact same thing with the mind. Once you rise above thoughts and the ego, sure, Ramani wouldn't need to meditate, yet he highly recommended atma vichara as an incredibly effective form of meditation for his students. As long as the mind exists, you have to keep it in shape, otherwise, it just gets sluggish and messy.

Yeah, I’m with you there, though I envision "maintaining the mind" a little differently. To me, that means learning, sharpening my memory, honing logic, and building up those mental muscles, rather than just focusing on a single point or something like that. Just like the body, the mind serves a practical, material purpose—it's what allows us to navigate life in this reality.

By the way, I swear I just had total déjà vu while typing this out.

Karen Sanchez19 said:Practice and enlightenment aren't even related🙏 🙂

Look, we’ve already been through this. We showed our mentor—no matter how much he screamed and threw a fit about it—that every single expert except for Ramani actually put in the work. Even Amanu was recommending the process. So, if those people claim they're "enlightened," are you really going to sit there and act like you know better?🤣

Maybe once you actually reach "enlightenment" yourself, I'll take you seriously. Until then, you're just making noise.🙂

Balkanijan Pig said:If I stay up too late on the forums, I can never recall them. But if I head to bed early and wake up before the sun comes up, they stick with me.

I’m always hanging out online late into the night, and I remember them every single time. It’s just that I can't be bothered to type them all out here. I still remember last night's vividly. 😉

But honestly, what's the point? Sure, it might be fun, but whether you remember your dreams or not—lucid or not—it doesn't really matter. There are plenty of other ways to have a good time. 😉

Karen Sanchez19 said:Look, I’m telling you again—this has nothing to do with your physical body or even your thoughts, so there’s really no point in trying to calm them down...

🙄

If that's true, then why bother eating, sleeping, moving, or doing anything at all? If the body doesn't matter, why waste any time on it?

That sounds like something Vivekanand would say while someone's swatting mosquitoes at him and he doesn't even flinch because he's totally detached from his physical self—meanwhile, the whole group meditating around him is jumping up and reacting to everything.

You might get the intellectual concept behind it, but I highly doubt you've ever actually experienced a state of pure consciousness that's completely detached from the body and the mind.😉

It's all just theory, theory, theory... honestly, five minutes of actual practice would do you more good than all this endless debating.

Enchantress said:Personally, I’m already starting to remember my dreams, and when those lucid ones actually happen—man, they are something else. 🙂
I feel like we haven't quite been on the same page here. Like I mentioned in one of my previous posts, you can take a single thought, pull it to the forefront, and focus on it to potentially trigger something. That's basically how most visualization techniques work. I know from experience because I used to dive deep into that stuff myself. But if you stick with it long enough, you start to realize that you can't just manifest everything through sheer willpower (even if you're using the exact same method). Eventually, you hit this realization where you see that YOU aren't actually the one pulling the strings. What you *thought* you triggered through visualization was probably going to happen anyway; your desire for it was really just a sign that it was coming. It’s hard to put into words, but over time, it just clicks. Once you stop trying so hard to force changes or chase specific desires and ideas, and just follow your intuition instead, you realize everything is already unfolding on its own. You just trick yourself into thinking you're the driver. It’s a bit trippy, but I hope that makes sense.

The whole thing about memory applied to Karen Sanchez19😁

But isn't observing and monitoring your thoughts considered a practice in itself? Your consciousness and attention are right there in the mix, so that constitutes training. Using observation is one of those very standard "techniques." Still, the ultimate goal is to reach a state of no-mind. If you get too caught up watching all the different mental fireworks and states of being, you run the risk of just getting distracted by playing games with your own mind.

Balkanijan Pig said:That’s easy for someone like Vivekanand to say when he’s sitting there totally oblivious to a mosquito swarm hitting him because he’s so detached from his physical body, while the entire group meditating around him is jumping up and catching everything.

Honestly, sometimes when I log onto this forum, I get so sucked into the discussions that I completely retreat into my own head. I lose track of everything—hunger, thirst, the temperature in the room—I don't even hear what's going on around me. Nothing hits me quite like an intense online debate. There have been times where I finally unplug and suddenly realize I’m freezing, starving, parched, and have a massive headache from just sitting there. Did I actually achieve some kind of mental breakthrough, or did I just find a way to hyper-focus so hard that I basically lost touch with reality? Everyone probably has their own "trigger" for that kind of state. For me—believe it or not—it’s this forum! But really, it’s nothing mystical; it’s just extreme mental concentration.
I’m sure everyone has their own way of entering those states, or maybe they just happen spontaneously, like they do for me. 😛

Enchantress said:I’m always hanging out on the forum late at night, so I never really forget them. It’s just a hassle to keep posting about them all the time. I can still vividly remember last night's dream. 😉

But why bother? I mean, sure, it might be fun, but whether you remember your dreams or not—lucid or not—it doesn't really matter. There are plenty of other ways to have a good time. 😉

Actually, it does matter to me because the clarity and intensity of my dreams act as a mirror for my mental state; it's one of my main indicators. When I'm feeling sharp, both mentally and physically, my dreams are incredible. If I'm focused but not quite at my peak, the dreams are vivid but usually pretty unpleasant. And if I'm feeling sluggish and shut down, I don't dream at all. It isn't the end-all-be-all, but it's definitely a symptom.

If we're feeling "dead" inside, I truly believe something is off with our lifestyle. This is just how it works for me, so it won't hurt Karen Sanchez19 to give it a shot. I'm sure they can handle skipping the bourbon and staying off the forums for a few days. 😁

But Pigo, it seems I have no desire to hold onto dreams anymore...

When life and the mind are finally under control, everything falls into place—even your dreams. They aren't some mystical phenomena; they're just the echoes of a disciplined waking state.

My dreams? They’re perfectly organized. I don't have any.🙂 🙂

When I want to, I can even trigger lucid dreams. It’s like having a direct line to the subconscious. Whatever you desire, whatever occupies your thoughts—it all manifests right there in the dreamscape.

My dreams? A total blank. Nothing. No visions, no cinematic masterpieces, just absolute, crushing silence from my subconscious. It’s like the lights go out and nobody’s home.🙂

Maybe once you’ve actually reached some state of "enlightenment," I might consider taking you seriously. Until then? It's just mindless noise.

If I were actually enlightened... how on earth would I even begin to explain that to you?
🙂 🙂

I am no deity. I refuse to stake my entire existence on the ground beneath my feet.🙂 🙂

Or perhaps I should just rephrase the question:

It’s a bit of a stretch to say:
How can one even begin to measure the absence of enlightenment? It’s an elusive metric. You don't find it in a textbook or a diagnostic test from the Mayo Clinic. It’s more like realizing you’ve been driving a car through a fog in downtown Chicago for hours, thinking you were seeing clearly, only to realize you haven't actually moved an inch. You’re just spinning your tires in the muck. The signs are subtle, yet damning. It’s that persistent, nagging friction between your ego and reality. It’s the way you react when someone cuts you off in traffic on the I-95—that sudden, irrational surge of white-hot fury. If your internal peace is shattered by something as trivial as a stranger's incompetence, you aren't enlightened. You are still a slave to your own impulses. True awareness isn't a destination you reach after reading a few self-help books. It's the absence of the noise. If the noise is still deafening—if the constant chatter of "me, myself, and I" is still running like a broken engine in a quiet suburb—then you’re still lost in the woods.🙂 🙂

Enchantress said:Sometimes when I jump on here, I get so sucked into the discussions that I completely retreat into my own head. I lose track of everything—hunger, thirst, even the temperature in the room. It’s like the world just disappears. Nothing hits me quite like an intense online debate. There have been times where I finally log off and suddenly realize I’m freezing, starving, dehydrated, and nursing a massive headache. I feel absolutely trashed. I can't tell if I've actually achieved some kind of peak mental state or if I've just found a way to hyper-focus so deeply that I lose touch with reality. Most people probably have their own version of this. For me—believe it or not—it's this forum! But honestly, it's nothing special; it's just intense mental concentration.
I'm sure everyone has their own trigger for entering that zone, or maybe it just happens spontaneously, like it does for me. 😛

Well, I wouldn't say it's exactly the same thing. It's easy enough to get lost in a great movie, a night of good sex, or something similar.

The things that naturally grab our attention and pull us into focus aren't the point. The whole purpose of these exercises is to learn how to consciously control and understand our own mental processes, rather than just being a leaf blowing in the wind, tossed around by whatever pops into our heads.

Then why bother eating, sleeping, moving, or doing anything at all? If there's no connection to the body, why waste any time on it?

Because that’s just how NATURE (GIVEN REALITY) works.🙂 🙂

You might grasp the concept intellectually, but I highly doubt you've ever actually experienced pure consciousness—unbound by both body and mind.

The only thing you can experience is an object. And tell me, is pure consciousness an object?

🙂 🙂

Balkanijan Pig said:Isn't just tracking and observing your thoughts considered a practice in itself? Your awareness and focus are right there—that's the actual exercise. Using "observation" is really just one specific technique among many. At the end of the day, the goal is to reach a state of thoughtlessness. If you get too caught up in watching all the different mental gymnastics and weird states the mind goes through, you run the risk of just entertaining yourself with your own ego.

I think you missed my point. I wasn't suggesting that you consciously track every single thought (because let's face it, using thoughts to monitor thoughts is just more thinking). What I meant was trying to be more mindful of the insights you gain, those sudden urges, or deep desires that bubble up. By paying attention to how you feel and what's happening around you, you eventually start to notice how everything just naturally falls into place on its own.

By the way, I'm not even sure it’s possible to exist without thoughts. That feels a bit like trying to exist without a body.

Balkanijan Pig said:It’s actually a big deal for me because my dream recall and how vivid they are act like a barometer for my mental state. It’s one of those indicators. When I’m feeling mentally and physically on top of my game, my dreams are incredible. If I’m focused but feeling physically sluggish, the dreams stay vivid but turn into nightmares. And if I’m just totally checked out and numb, I don't dream at all. It isn't the main issue itself, but it's definitely a symptom.

If we feel "dead" inside, I truly believe something is off with our lifestyle. This is just how it works for me personally, so it won't cost Karen Sanchez19 anything to give it a shot—I'm sure they can handle a few days without bourbon or checking the forums. 😁

True, but like you said—that’s just your experience. 😉 That doesn't mean it applies to anyone else on the planet.
Everything is subjective. For me, dreams don't mean anything beyond being a fun ride. I love dreaming simply because it's entertaining. 🙂

I lose all sense of hunger, thirst, or even the biting cold. The world goes silent. Time? It becomes a meaningless concept.

The online generation🙂 🙂

By the way, I’m not convinced existence is possible without thought. That would be like trying to exist without a physical body.

What exactly does your "possession" do to the body or the consciousness???

Karen Sanchez19 said:The only thing you can actually experience is an object. But wait—is pure consciousness itself just another object?

Honestly, screw philosophy.

There’s no other way to describe anything when our entire vocabulary is trapped by our own thoughts and this whole dualistic view of the world.

To philosophy is a damn joke.

There is simply no other way to put it. Language itself is shackled; our vocabulary is a prisoner to thought and this whole exhausting world of duality.

Looks like Pigg is getting worked up.

The moment you attempt to describe it, you’ve already lost the plot..

I follow your logic, really I do, but the answer remains stubbornly the same.😉 😁

Let me break this down for you:

If you're hunting for some "experience" of the truth, stop looking. Experience has absolutely nothing to do with it..

You could say: Miles reached enlightenment...

But then we have to ask—who exactly is Miles?

Enchantress said:By the way, I'm not so sure you can actually exist without thoughts. It feels as impossible as trying to exist without a physical body.

Actually, you totally can. 😉

Even when you're in a deep sleep, your mind isn't racing with thoughts. In fact, there's a real connection between deep sleep and states of samadhi—it’s just that the former happens unconsciously.

Besides, you can hit a thoughtless state in everyday life during intense moments. Think about being in a car accident (or narrowly dodging one on the highway), or when you're so completely overwhelmed by something that the external input is so loud it just shuts down your internal monologue. Samadhi goes way deeper than that, though, so why would it be any different?