Posts by Jason Ortiz5

So, look, I’m raising my kid with a strictly atheist mindset. Honestly? I think I’d be pretty crushed if, after everything we've talked about and all the facts she's been given, she suddenly decided there was some higher power out there watching us. Call me a hardline non-believer if you want—I really don't care what anyone says.

My whole approach is teaching her to respect what other people believe, because that's just being a decent human being. But when it comes to forming her own worldview? It's all about science, common sense, and actual logic. And I've made it very clear: she shouldn't let anyone push their nonsense onto her.

brightheron64 said:And that is exactly why religious studies are still part of the curriculum, isn't it...? 😵

Now, I have to admit, this part is still feeling a bit fuzzy to me... Is it better to go with a public school or stick with a private academy?
My kids are enrolled in music school as well, but honestly, there isn't even a conversation about "status" or connections there. You just take the entrance exam, and if you pass, you're in... simple as that. We actually saw a bit of an uproar once when both parents were professional musicians, yet their child didn't quite make the cut during the audition, so they were denied enrollment entirely...

And honestly, it’s such a gift for a child to master music theory and sight-reading. Maybe it’s just because I’m a complete novice when it comes to anything musical, but there is something truly captivating about watching a kid look at a sheet of music and actually grasp the meaning behind it... much like they would if they were simply reading a great novel...

And just to wrap things up, speaking as someone who actually works in tech, I have to admit that I’d much rather see my kid find success in music than in computer science... It's true that the tech industry offers a certain level of stability and a future, but let's be honest—it's a brutal, absolutely soul-crushing grind...

We definitely still have religious ed. Plus we've got the choir singing hymns and the drama club doing plays based on religious texts, and so on.
Off-topic, but I don't mind music school at all, as long as they aren't messing with the core curriculum just to accommodate extracurriculars. Good for them if they want to focus on that, but I send my kid to school to prepare them for the workforce (and for general knowledge, obviously).

brightheron64 said:I’m all for getting rid of religious education in public schools, mostly because I’m tired of watching my three kids sit through those classes while they’re essentially wasting precious school hours... meanwhile, for their actual electives—things like a second foreign language, math, or computer science—they have to deal with double periods, staying way past dismissal, or even showing up on a Saturday just to catch up.

If anyone actually believes that religious studies should take precedence over core subjects like foreign languages, mathematics, or tech... well, cheers to you, I guess.
We made our own choices, and now we have to live with the consequences. Much like carrying a heavy cross...

And honestly, I’m genuinely curious.
Can someone please be blunt with me: would you rather your child walk away with an A in religion but only a C in math or English... or would you prefer the exact opposite?

One more thing. Unfortunately for my generation, things like Marxism or radical political theory were mandatory parts of the curriculum. If those had been optional electives, do you really think more than 10% of students would have opted in? Come on, parents, let's be real here. Let your child be different once in a while, let them stand out, and stop forcing them to just follow the herd...

Look, let me give you a peek into my world so you can judge the mindset of your average parent. Back in first grade, the school actually offered computer lab classes—pretty rare for a small town like ours. By second grade? Poof, gone. Parents were all over choosing choir instead (mostly singing songs for those church-themed school plays), or they felt computers messed up the schedule for music lessons. (We live in a tiny suburb where hitting up the local conservatory is basically a requirement if you want to look like you have your life together. ) So yeah, priorities. It’s more vital that a kid masters music theory than knowing how to use a PC. Who knows, maybe my hometown will eventually produce the next big Sevka.

Jessica Kelly4 said:Because the majority's will is expressed either through the actions of an elected political party or via a referendum if a specific interest group thinks that's their best shot at getting what they want.

I know this belongs in a different thread, but to wrap this up: even if we held a referendum right now to pull religious studies out of our public schools, I bet the government would just point to some international treaty and claim it’s a non-starter. Honestly, politicians get way too much out of playing nice with the church hierarchy. I think you know that too.
Democracy isn't just about whatever the majority wants in the moment. It’s a whole lot deeper than that.

Jessica Kelly4 said:Exactly how they do things in modern democracies. You can scrap it without a referendum just by making a political call to terminate an international treaty based on the established rules.

So why is it that religious folks always seem to troll about the "will of the majority" or demand a referendum whenever they don't get their way?

I find this whole situation kind of freaky. If the church says kids need both school religion classes and Sunday school to receive their sacraments, then parents who actually value their faith—especially those facing their final days—should probably just embrace it. They should be encouraging their kids to go, or at least not making such a fuss about it.
It’s always so easy to play devil's advocate with someone else's beliefs or struggles, isn't it? But the second our own comfort zone gets poked, we suddenly stop being so casual and dismissive...

Jessica Kelly4 said:It wasn't done illegally.

And it certainly wasn't done in any civilized or democratic way, either. But honestly, that kind of making excuses is just classic for religious folks—there’s always some way to justify it, or they claim everyone else is the one being unfair or overreacting.

Jessica Kelly4 said:America is a parliamentary democracy. There are perfectly legal ways to push for the changes you're demanding.

The truth is, religious studies didn't get added through any official democratic process—it was just cheap political maneuvering.

Lawrence Torres56 said:Nah, that's the absolute truth, and if I were you, I'd report that teacher immediately. They don't have the right to act like that, especially not in an American religious studies class.

She doesn't even do it during the actual religious studies period, though. She usually just pops into the classrooms during break time. And look, it doesn't bother me one bit, and the girls actually find it pretty funny. If the church is truly demanding that kind of thing, then fine by me—people calling themselves believers should probably just step up and live it. Or, you know, fight their own battles.

Lawrence Torres56 said:Look, during Catholic school religion classes, the teachers honestly couldn't care less whether a kid actually shows up to mass or not, let alone if they're calling kids out or docking their grades for it...
if you actually know of a teacher doing something like that, you should totally report them.
Besides, that doesn't even happen in Sunday school because the whole point of religious education isn't to force some kid to sit in a pew, right? It's about introducing them to faith and the service if they're actually interested.

but if I recall correctly, back when they were pushing religion into the public schools, they renamed Santa Claus to "Santa Claus" as some sort of local, traditionalist twist, didn't they?🥳
so, does he exist or what?

This has nothing to do with local politics; the whole rebranding of Santa Claus was just a political move because under the old regime, it was always the old-school Santa giving gifts, so anything tied to the former government was automatically labeled "out," while everything Western was deemed "in."
Actually, back in the day, the old-school Santa used to give kids gifts for New Year's, whereas the Western Santa Claus shows up on Christmas Eve, or rather, at Christmas...

That’s just not true, and honestly, it probably just depends on which teacher you get. This little girl has pointed her finger at people more than once, yelling things like, "You! You! And you over there! You guys don't go regularly!" It was almost like she was trying to trigger some kind of meltdown from the teacher during recess.

brightheron64 said:It's such a difficult paradox to escape when you're dealing with this kind of power dynamic and this specific mindset...

You see these high-achieving kids spending their Saturday mornings in advanced math tutoring, or doubling up on foreign languages and computer science, all while religious studies remains a mandatory part of the weekly curriculum.

A truly flawless roadmap for the future. 👏👏:

If only it were that simple...

My kid’s history teacher was just going over early civilizations lately—stuff like writing systems, Jews, Egypt, and so on. Then, out of nowhere, she asks the class what they learned about all that from the Old Testament. My daughter came home totally stumped, asking me, "What am I even supposed to say?" And honestly, what *can* I say to her? Should I tell her to explain to the teacher that the Old Testament is basically just a collection of legends from some ancient desert outpost rather than actual historical fact?

Anyway, I just told her to stay quiet when those questions pop up. Just focus on learning the languages and, at the first chance she gets, find a way to hop on a plane to somewhere more civilized. I really don't know how else to help her...

shadowcrane91 said:So why is everyone blaming religious education for EVERYTHING???? Instead of blaming the government that actually put it there...
What exactly is the problem with it for you guys?

I honestly feel worse for the kids sitting through religion class when their whole family doesn't even live like that at home... they aren't even trying...
Since it's an option, I'm happy my kids attend...
If we were a different faith or if I just didn't care, they'd be going regardless, even if it meant having a gap in their schedule...

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The current administration's term expired ages ago, the main puppeteer is gone, and that joke of a Supreme Court basically claimed they had nothing to do with it. And yeah, we tend to blame every government that follows. You can see it right here in this thread. But still, that doesn't make the hypocrisy or having religious classes in public schools any less inappropriate.

shadowcrane91 said:Ripped it down??? He probably just took them down, honestly I'm not even surprised. Religion class and Halloween?
Since when do those two things go together in any Catholic community in America????
Teaching about God while celebrating witches????

And then—the religion teacher removes a Halloween poster....
The same guy who's supposed to be teaching these kids to follow God instead of witches????
Oh no..... what a tragedy he's caused......

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There are non-Catholics going to that school too. Who cares?

Besides, even Christmas was pulled from paganism. Is the priest gonna go visit a Christmas tree next?

Jessica Kelly4 said:Of course they can. They can just hire a tutor. Or pay for private school.

Publicly funded education, where everyone chips in through federal taxes, is just a social contract shaped by whoever holds political power at the time. It’s the same deal with religious studies in schools. As soon as the balance of power shifts, religious education goes. Maybe public schooling will eventually shift from a shared responsibility to a market-driven model too. Anything can happen.

So, what does "balance of power" actually mean here? Religious ed was brought back in through political horse-trading. If more than half the population had identified as atheists back then, those agreements with the Vatican would have been signed regardless—it simply would have suited the government of the day. All these attempts to justify having religion in the classroom by leaning on some big "traditional American values" thing are honestly just pretty silly.

Honestly, I gave up halfway through. There aren't even any real arguments about specific activities here (except for that bit about Memphis—but let's be real, everyone does that when they're just looking for some cheap self-promotion). The rest is just a massive pile of "look how great I am." It was a super boring read, btw.

Jessica Kelly4 said:I’m glad my kids can take both parish religion classes and school ones. It gives them a chance to pull from different perspectives and let the two programs complement each other. At my kids' school, they managed to schedule religion for either the first or last period, so there aren't any logistical headaches. Honestly, I think many local teachers provide a great service to the community by offering extra value beyond just the standard curriculum.

Could you dive into that a bit more? Like, maybe share a specific example or something?

Lawrence Torres56 said:Do you actually have any proof for these claims of yours?

Or are you just trying to use religion to justify violence—using an elective subject as a way to wrap up bullies in cellophane and sell them to us as victims?

And hey, no offense intended... but seriously, violence comes from the home; it has nothing to do with faith or religious studies. Honestly, after reading a post like this, the only thing I can do as a decent human being is fight to make religious education mandatory, with strict grading criteria based on sincerity, honesty, and respect. Then, when some kid fails because they aren't living up to those standards, maybe their parents will finally take a hard look at how they're raising them. That way, the fake believers won't be able to hide behind their various masks anymore, and if people are going to criticize the church, at least let them do it for a legitimate reason.

I hope you realize that things like honesty, integrity, and respect aren't really "educational metrics." Plus, those standards are incredibly subjective. You’d have to hold every single religious instructor to those exact same harsh standards first. And let me tell you, finding even one who passes that test would be harder than winning the Powerball. Only then could we even talk about making it a required subject for students with such intense grading.

Not to mention all the parents out there who would totally fail a test like that. Especially the ones who constantly brag about how much they value being righteous and fair.

Lawrence Torres56 said:You're kidding, right? Too many cooks in the kitchen just leads to a messed-up kid... especially once puberty hits.
Back in the day, maybe a hundred years ago, when everyone basically looked out for themselves and the church held way more sway over people than politics ever did, puberty was just about physical maturity. The whole concept of an "adolescent crisis" didn't even exist back then.

Plus, kids learn about morality throughout their entire education; you can't just single out religious studies because it doesn't sit well with your personal views.😁

And besides, if a subject's scheduled hours aren't enough for students to actually master the material, what do you do? You increase the class time, you don't just kick the subject out of the school entirely, 😉 because cutting it out is just going to trigger the exact opposite effect.

First off, please explain to me how on earth you plan to limit or totally wipe out the influence of the media, schools, or peer groups on kids? What, by locking them up in a convent? When people claim things were "better back then," it's usually just selective memory. And hormones? Hormones have been a thing for the last 500 years too. Doesn't matter what the church or the old ladies at the grocery store say about it.

Can you actually point to what specific kind of morality is being taught in math, foreign languages, or computer science? Like, what, if you commit a sin before marriage, will your motherboard overheat?

Jesse Cook4 said:I actually had some American colleagues visiting the other day. Americans are EXTREMELY religious; they take that stuff very seriously.

But they were absolutely horrified by the mere idea of organizing religious education in our public schools—let alone when I told them about a few specific incidents (like a teacher tearing down displays the kids put up for Halloween etc).

I won't stick my nose where it doesn't belong, but they found the whole thing bizarre...

I’ve got family living in the States, so I totally get where they're coming from. It feels like we have this knack for taking everything to an extreme or making it completely absurd. Usually both at the same time. ☕

Jesse Cook4 said:What would be the big deal if religious studies in school were only as frequent as people actually show up to church?

Twice a year, maybe twice a year... why does school need to be more Catholic than the Pope? 🙂

Man, you just don't get it... What would we even do with all those extra religion teachers? Where would they even work?

Not to mention how embarrassing that would be for the church itself... Totally unacceptable...