Posts by casualwolf48

panglu said:Look, blue zg, I get it—he was a founder and led the whole region through those struggles for this country, so I respect that. But honestly, what am I supposed to tell the kids? The younger generation who won't even remember who Debt was? I guess I’d just say, "Look, he was a legend, but man, he really messed things up at the end." So, maybe the good and the bad just cancel each other out... kind of like how he ended up. You guys from his era can hold onto those memories if you want—nobody's stopping you—but for us younger folks, he's just another soul who sold out. I mean, anyone who treats me and my friends like garbage while siding with the people doing the treating doesn't deserve any kind of honor... may God forgive him...

We didn't fight for this, and I think everything else you said is pretty much spot on.

Honestly, it feels kind of pointless to even talk about this when my own feelings are such a mess. It’s only natural that I’m feeling emotional—I grew up alongside this guy, so of course I’m disappointed after he turned his back on everything we stood for, including the group he actually started himself.
Then again, the man struggled with PTSD, and honestly, nobody really understands just how brutal that battle can be unless they've lived it.
I don't think there's any excuse for veterans, but for what he did back in the '80s and '90s, you have to give him credit. People who hate him aren't wrong, but it’s also tough for those of us he let down—I guess you can only truly feel that kind of letdown from someone you actually respected.
That's my final word on the matter.

Henry Grant51 said:Maybe let the old guy rest in peace—honestly, though, after everything lately, I’d probably rather just spit in his face for selling out.
He went from being a legend to just being some pathetic traitor, along with a bunch of other people who were once right there with him but turned their backs on the group they used to call home.
They weren't even showing up to the games or traveling with the team for years, yet now they're peddling this story about being true Bad Boys legends and die-hard fans.
Just a bunch of losers and bottom-feeders.

It’s just common decency—and part of our values here in America—to speak well of those who have passed. Who are we to judge? I guess we all answer to a higher power eventually.
What can I say, though... I was there at the games from '83 right up until the war started, then obviously I couldn't go during the conflict since I was serving my country for four years.
After that, I wasn't around much because I was... well, dealing with some health stuff and doing some time. But I was back at it until the bans hit, and then right back again once things cleared up. I'm 45 now, and I've always stayed on the one side that actually matters. But just because you or someone else didn't see me there doesn't mean I wasn't a fan. I mean, how many away games do you think the guy actually attended in those random cities down South?
I'm not really looking to get into a fight with you here, mostly because you're right. Those veterans are way more of a disappointment to me than anyone else, simply because they used to be my friends—and honestly, I feel the most betrayed because I spent my youth with some of them. Though, to be fair, I don't even know most of that crew anymore since they never showed up; I barely know who they even are, aside from the fact that they seem to be chasing shady money.
I've always felt like it's a huge issue for us Americans—how easily we tend to walk away from our history and what we inherited.
The man was a veteran when a lot of the big names and the Bad Boys were busy at that big battle in Frankfurt or traveling for Real Madrid's European matches. He messed up regarding the veterans, sure, but he had plenty of good moments too, and now that he's gone, maybe it's okay to remember those parts. That's just how we warriors try to move forward, I guess. Maybe it's just veteran solidarity, or whatever.
But you should save your energy for the living. As for those guys who stood by him back then and still do... I worry that from what I've seen, they might have been manipulating him all along.
At the end of the day, nobody's life is purely black and white. There's always a bit of good and a bit of bad in everyone.

I accidentally double-posted—so I just went ahead and deleted the extra one.

Having been his contemporary and knowing him quite well—really well, actually—I wanted to share a quick memory of him. Even though we drifted apart lately, I have to say I’m pretty shaken by this news. Long ago, he was a true friend of mine; he was a veteran, sure, but he was also a legend on the streets of New York. Without a doubt, he was the first real leader of the Bad Boys. He had the presence of a general, but he was never a politician.
This isn't just about losing a founder of the Bad Boys; it feels like losing another veteran in such a tragic way.
I guess I'll try to describe one shared experience of ours that really captures the kind of guy he was.
I’ll start near the end, just so I don't get too deep into the details while I'm still processing this. It was somewhere around '87 or '88. Some Partizan fans came into the city, and about 30 of us ended up crossing paths with their group on a street near the main station—right near Times Square. There were more of them than us, and they charged toward us without a second thought, making a massive amount of noise. They were a tough crew, probably at their peak back then. A few of our guys hesitated and took a couple of steps back. I should mention that both sides were pretty well armed with the usual stuff—pipes, chains, you know the drill...
I honestly think if they had kept charging, we might have just backed off; everyone knows how that works. It's just mass psychology in a street fight—if a crowd moves forward, people tend to move backward.
Right when they were charging, he yelled out: "Hold it! Nobody runs!! Let's go!" and that was it—we charged right at them. That gave us that crucial psychological edge of surprise. They stumbled for a second, then things got messy with the sticks and everything. We definitely landed more hits than we took, even though they outnumbered us. Since we were right in the heart of the city, the police showed up quickly after the scuffle. They swarmed the other group, and we all managed to slip away.
To this day, I truly believe that when those fans moved toward us and he shouted "Stay!", some of us were actually more afraid of him than of those thousand fans. We respected him so much—it was like, if I back down now, I won't be able to look him or the guys in the eye ever again.
I don't even need to say that immediately after he yelled "Stay! Don't anyone run!", he was the first one to charge at them.
I've never forgotten it; even now, I can still see his face and picture our charge. And that was just one of countless adventures from those years. I feel bad now that I didn't try to talk to him before things got so heated with the veterans' groups. I regret turning down his invite to join them with such disdain, instead of maybe suggesting that he was just surrounded by the wrong people in the wrong circles.
May you rest easy in the land you fought for.

Looking at their signs, you can really tell how much those NFL fans loved marching through downtown Chicago—just being able to walk through the city, maybe grab a coffee or chat with some locals (or not), and actually feel at home in the biggest city in the country.
I guess it’s kind of the same way people from the West Coast love heading over to Miami, walking along the coast, catching a different vibe, and just chilling out by the water before the big game starts.
It just goes to show that even with all the tension between the North and the South, we've never really seen it turn into actual hatred—it's mostly stayed as a healthy rivalry.
But it also shows how mature this current generation is—yours, specifically—the group in their 20s and 30s who are basically carrying the weight of this whole thing on their shoulders right now.
Still, I suppose you have to stay smart and watch out for provocateurs and their little spin stories.
After all, if we look back at what happened between our two groups, back in the early 90s, things went from being incredibly united to having these intense conflicts almost overnight, without any real reason.

Ryan Chavez3 said:I've been scrolling through some of those comments over on the main fan forums—man, it’s a joke. It's like people treat every opinion there like it's holy scripture. Most of them are just saying things like, "Yeah, the owner might be shady, but at least we beat the rivals." They act like they're all these old-school hardcore ultras from back in the day, too.

It's hard to believe some of the stuff being said. I honestly thought things were shifting in the city and that the fans weren't really backing him anymore... but apparently, everyone's just happy as long as we get the win. As long as we crushed the other guys, anything goes, I guess. It's wild how many people think like that.

They don't seem to get that while thirty of our guys are sitting in a holding cell during the holidays, everyone else is back home having a feast with their families—all under the guise of making "sports cleaner" or whatever excuse they use.

Honestly... it's just disappointing to see this kind of thing happening everywhere.

I wasn't even planning on posting here—I usually just stick to my usual spot—but I had to jump in just to reply to you.
All that talk about how the only thing that matters is that we beat your team? Honestly, screw those bandwagoners. They're a tiny minority, really. And these "old school" types they claim to be? Who even are they?
I might actually head over to that forum now just to argue with them.
You put it perfectly. I've been through a lot myself—I was actually in a French prison last Christmas, so I know what it's like.
I'm 44, and I've been going to games since '83. I served in the military, I was there when the first major supporter movements started up—though I'm sidelined for now. And trust me, man, I'm definitely not the only veteran on our side.
There are more of us real fans than those fair-weather types, especially once you hit 40.
Anyway, keep doing your thing. You guys played an incredible game, truly. Hats off to you.