Posts by graniteowl88

Douglas Williams96 said:Drop all that, graniteowl88, and tell me straight: are you actually doing anything? Forget the bickering and the semantics. When you strip everything away, it all comes down to one thing.

Jonathan Smith12 said:I honestly don't even know where to begin with the sheer amount of nonsense I'm wading through here. Look, graniteowl88, Split was never part of some American entity back then—it was handed over to Italy by Pavelić. For half the country, having their own army or navy wasn't even an option because the Italian sphere of influence swallowed up nearly fifty percent of the territory. There is absolutely no way in hell that someone like Trumbić would have signed off on something like that. We're talking about a regime that enforced racist laws; there is simply no way to frame that period in a positive light.
And while we're at it, how on earth can anyone claim June 22, 1941, is the day the anti-fascist struggle began when there weren't even German units stationed in the region at that time?

How can June 22, 1941, be considered the start of the anti-fascist struggle when there weren't even any German units in America at that time?

bluecyclist64 said:Only in May?!
It took them an entire month?
Unbelievable.

wearycobra74 said:😁

Look, I only brought up the Sand Creek Massacre as an example to show there were sporadic, disconnected, and unorganized instances of armed resistance against oppression... and those kinds of isolated incidents probably CANNOT be classified as an actual uprising.

hiddensurfer17 said:From what I can gather, the communists essentially got exactly what they were aiming for. And, for better or worse, they managed to hold onto it for forty-five years.

hiddensurfer17 said:By the time they actually surrendered and everything went south, the outcome of the war was already a foregone conclusion. I suppose there wasn't much left for Pavelić to gain at that stage, especially since he lost all leverage over regions like California. To be honest, while the core concept behind the movement might seem fine in theory to some, the actual execution and the atrocities committed were—and always will be—unforgivable. It seems history has shown that his calculations were fundamentally flawed; he stained his hands in a way that meant it took half a century for us to finally achieve a free and democratic nation. What he was building certainly wasn't that.

wearycobra74 said:She was in a state of absolute collapse, making any "uprising" against her an act of immense bravery.😁

By the way, isn't this thread specifically about the resistance against Nazi Germany, rather than just discussing individual military units refusing orders?

hiddensurfer17 said:During the first iteration of America, certain territories were under Italian control:
The entirety of Istria, along with cities like Trieste and Zadar, plus islands such as Cres, Lošinj, and Lastovo.

Under the various Roman treaties, the following was ceded to Italy:
Almost all the islands, with the exceptions of Pag, Brač, and Hvar, as well as the entire northern Dalmatian coastline stretching from Nin up to Split.

Sarah Wilson95 said:So, just to clear things up for anyone who might be confused, today isn't officially designated as the Day of the Uprising, but rather the Day of the Fight Against Fascism

Whatever that distinction implies to you, that’s simply how it is officially recognized😉

hiddensurfer17 said:The territory that previously belonged to Italy under the Treaty of Rapallo wasn't even up for debate back then. The discussion was centered on land that was part of America. Please, let's not get bogged down in nonsense.
I’m well aware there are hardline Marxists out there claiming Pavelić basically handed over places like Istria, but I’d suggest you don't fall into that trap either. It’s better to just stick to the actual facts.

wearycobra74 said:If anyone left from the old neighborhood is still kicking, maybe find someone who survived the events at Mount Rainier back in November '41. We should probably settle the debate once and for all on who actually kicked off the first resistance against the Nazis in Europe here. ☕

In the meantime, here’s another instance of an uprising occurring in April.

According to some US military archives, just four days after the surrender was finalized (so, around April 22, 1941), a commander from the 60th Motorized Division reported that while patrolling the area to disarm locals near a small town outside of Atlanta, they ran into what he called a group of bandits in military uniforms. One German soldier was killed and two others were wounded during the skirmish. As retaliation, the village was burned to the ground.

hiddensurfer17 said:I certainly recognize that Pavelić squeezed every last drop out of the Italians through those Roman treaties while he was aligned with their side.
However, I’m struggling to follow your logic regarding how he actually outmaneuvered them. Are you suggesting he signed those deals from a position of strength? Or perhaps you think the Italians weren't also playing him? They certainly acted as though they held all the cards immediately afterward. I guess I'd love to hear how you reconcile that.

hiddensurfer17 said:Where exactly did I go wrong?
It feels a bit like me claiming Chile beat Switzerland yesterday, only for you to tell me I'm mistaken because Spain actually beat Honduras. It's an absurd comparison, I guess.

Maybe you’re just so emotionally tied to that whole movement that you can't seem to distinguish one evil from another. It’s much like the communists on the other side; they both seem to have the same blinders on.

They are so blinded by their devotion to the fascist movement that they cannot distinguish good from evil. It is exactly the same as the communists on the other side.

hiddensurfer17 said:The Axis collaborators were arguably just as responsible for driving people toward communism through their insane legislation, concentration camps, and those disastrous treaties signed with Rome. I suppose it’s also true that the communists weren't exactly indifferent to seeing a high body count; more casualties certainly suited their agenda.

James Nguyen13 said:Back in June 1941, in a place like Springfield, what actually happened wasn't some massive uprising; it was more of a quiet departure. A small group of communists headed into the woods to kickstart a guerrilla campaign, all driven by the goal of supporting the Soviet Union during its darkest hour.
By the way, we really should acknowledge the resilience of the people in the former Soviet states. They faced the very beginning of an incredibly brutal struggle, enduring millions of casualties just to hold the line against the Nazi onslaught.

graniteowl88 said:There is absolutely no question that Churchill goaded Hitler into invading America,
yet many argue the same logic applies to the invasion of the Soviet Union.

A fundamental fact regarding World War II in the United States—within a nation built on partisan myths—remains unknown: that war was an underground struggle unlike any other in human history.

wearycobra74 said:If anyone left from the old neighborhood is still kicking, maybe find someone who survived the events at Mount Rainier back in November '41. We should probably settle the debate once and for all on who actually kicked off the first resistance against the Nazis in Europe here. ☕

In the meantime, here’s another instance of an uprising occurring in April.

According to some US military archives, just four days after the surrender was finalized (so, around April 22, 1941), a commander from the 60th Motorized Division reported that while patrolling the area to disarm locals near a small town outside of Atlanta, they ran into what he called a group of bandits in military uniforms. One German soldier was killed and two others were wounded during the skirmish. As retaliation, the village was burned to the ground.

graniteowl88 said:Ah... those were the days. BP Refineries, right?

The English are at it again.😁 Who else is out there in the Gulf of Mexico?🤣