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2014 Monaco Grand Prix Recap & Discussion

Started by silentbadger17 · · 👁 18 views · 203 replies

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Participants silentbadger17darkmarlin16jadeseal7dustycyclist19cosmiccyclist8Edward Howard2Jamie Hallsteelmaker83stormybadger8Drew Bennett68gentlecobra23Amanda Williams13Nancy Scott5Peter Carter6Megan Alvarez3graniteharbor502Samuel Ruiz4shadowhawk24Jerry Rogers6swifttiger75ruggedfox28Kate Wilson8wiredscout14neonfox65 …
ruggedfox28 ruggedfox28 Regular
255 messages
joined Aug 2018
#101 ·
dustycyclist19 said:Look, man, while you were away, things went totally sideways. Once you're back, everything should settle down...
Because when people claim we’re just watching an internal team battle, they look at the standings, but then they go and pick favorites like they're choosing sides in some weird fan war. It’s pretty funny considering one of those "favorites" is actually one of the fastest things on the planet. So, who’s really being objective here?...🤷

ruggedfox28 said:image

Man, you hit the nail right on the head...

image

😂
steelmaker83 steelmaker83 Active Member
215 messages
joined May 2019
#102 ·
stormybadger8 said:Good grief, what's next? Are you seriously going to claim the Earth is just a flat disc being carried on the back of some giant red turtle named Fernando Alonso?🤣

Look, do you actually get how this works? For Fernando Alonso to have overtaken Kimi Räikkönen, he would have had to jump both Daniel Ricciardo and Kimi at the exact same time. It’s simple math.
Another potential scenario was Kimi losing out to both Daniel Ricciardo and Fernando Alonso at once, but that borders on science fiction—especially when you factor in Fernando Alonso.
Daniel Ricciardo might have actually stood a chance, but Fernando Alonso is basically out of luck—unless Kimi Räikkönen pulls some kind of stunt or his team completely screws him over.
Take a second to actually think about this. How exactly is Fernando Alonso supposed to outmaneuver Kimi Räikkönen when Kimi was already ahead on track and would have been hitting the pits first? It just doesn't add up.
If you gave Fernando Alonso a set of old, worn-out tires, he’d probably still pull off a fastest lap that beats everyone else on the track by four or five seconds.😂
That gap was anything but small...http://en.mclarenf-1.com/index.php?p...nando%20Alonso

Even beyond that, nothing went right for Fernando Alonso, not even during those initial pit stops. The gap was significantly smaller in Spain. I don't know what the hell the team was thinking giving him priority...
Honestly, if I were racing in Monaco, I could have easily made up a four or five-second gap and overtaken Daniel Ricciardo along the way.😍
Who knows? Maybe Lewis Hamilton and Nico Rosberg don't even realize how lucky they actually are. If Fernando Alonso had decided to step on the gas just a little harder, he probably would have gapped them both before they even hit the pit lane.🤣

What's wrong with you?

What do you mean, 4 or 5 seconds? At the moment the Safety Car came out, Fernando Alonso had already sliced his lead from 7 seconds down to just 3.3. My take is that if they had held off on those regular pit stops for another 2 or 3 laps, that gap would have dropped to under 2 seconds easily.

It’s critical to consider exactly where Kimi Räikkönen would have emerged from his pit stop and what kind of traffic he’d be hitting. In the Monaco Grand Prix, pitting is always a massive gamble because the track is so narrow; if Kimi gets caught behind slower cars, he could easily lose two seconds in a single lap. As for my theory that Fernando Alonso could maintain pace on old tires, I'm basing that on Massa's performance. Massa was flying on ancient rubber after everyone else had already pitted, putting in laps that were significantly faster than his teammate on fresh tires.

So... anyway...
darkmarlin16 darkmarlin16 Veteran
1K messages
joined Nov 2015
#103 ·
steelmaker83 said:what is actually wrong with you?

What do you mean 4 or 5 seconds? At the exact moment the SC came in, Fernando Alonso had already slashed his lead from 7 seconds down to just 3.3. My gut feeling is that if they were doing standard pit stops, they would’ve hung around for another 2 or 3 laps, which would have dropped that gap to under 2 seconds easy.

So, the whole thing really hinges on where Kimi Räikkönen would have come out and what kind of traffic he’d be stuck in. Pitting in the Monaco Grand Prix is a massive gamble specifically because of the traffic. If Kimi gets caught in a pack, he could lose those 2 seconds in a single lap, no problem. Also, my theory about Fernando Alonso being able to hold off the field on old tires is based on what we saw with Massa. Massa was absolutely flying on ancient rubber after everyone else pitted—honestly, he was significantly faster than his teammate on fresh ones.

So basically.......

... look, it's not like this is some groundbreaking revelation that pit stops shuffle the order and staying out longer can actually pay off, especially at a place like the Monaco Grand Prix.

But apparently, some people here are too dense to grasp even the simplest logic, so they just sit there trolling and spamming without anyone ever stepping in to stop them.
steelmaker83 steelmaker83 Active Member
215 messages
joined May 2019
#104 ·
Jamie Hall said:@steelmaker83/">@@steelmaker83 you've got thin skin, don't you? First you were being somewhat objective, but once you got your answers, you decided Kimi actually showed nothing and deserved nothing.
Maybe try being consistent with yourself for once. 😂

It isn't about thin skin; it’s just irritating to witness the sheer lack of intelligence some people here are displaying. As a rule, Kimi hasn't shown anything this season, and that is a plain fact. He had some tough luck with setbacks, sure, but overall, he has produced nothing.

The race start at the Monaco Grand Prix was certainly impressive and deserves credit. Building a 7-second lead—the first time this season he's pulled away from Fernando Alonso—was also noteworthy. At first glance, it looked phenomenal.

On second thought—and I always like to take a second look—it turns out to be a total illusion. Some people are bothered by facts, some don't understand them, and others simply ignore them. But that doesn't change reality. Here is the fact: Kimi's 7-second lead over Fernando Alonso, and his 4-second gap over Daniel Ricciardo, began to evaporate (and eventually vanished) at the exact same moment and at the exact same pace during the most critical part of the race.

If anyone here can logically explain how that constitutes good pace, I'll happily accept it. So far, nobody has even tried. All I see is a bunch of emojis, fake surprise, and people acting like absolute animals.
darkmarlin16 darkmarlin16 Veteran
1K messages
joined Nov 2015
#105 ·
steelmaker83 said:Look, it’s not even about having thin skin or whatever, it just drives me absolutely insane seeing the sheer lack of intelligence some people are displaying on this forum. It’s a straight-up fact that Kimi hasn't shown anything worth mentioning this season. Sure, he dealt with some rough luck and bad breaks, but let's be real—he's basically been invisible out there.

That opening lap at the Monaco Grand Prix was actually pretty impressive and deserves some credit, and building up a 7-second lead—which, by the way, was the first time anyone managed to pull ahead of Fernando Alonso in a race this season—was also wild. On paper, it looked totally phenomenal.

The start was killer, but honestly, Fernando Alonso had a great launch too; he just got boxed in by Daniel Ricciardo, which gave Kimi Räikkönen the perfect opening to dive into that empty space ahead of him.
steelmaker83 steelmaker83 Active Member
215 messages
joined May 2019
#106 ·
darkmarlin16 said:The start was solid. Fernando Alonso had an excellent launch, but he got blocked by Daniel Ricciardo, which allowed Kimi Räikkönen to take advantage of the open space ahead of him.

isn't being stingy😁 I don't even want to get into that... just let them have something to celebrate, you can tell they need it. It hasn't been easy for them...

Basically, the start and the restart (that jump on Daniel Ricciardo) were great. Everything else...
stormybadger8 stormybadger8 Veteran
1.8K messages
joined Apr 2013
#107 ·
Just more mindless nonsense🤣
Like I said, if Fernando Alonso couldn't find a way to jump Kimi Räikkönen in Spain—where he was trailing by about half a second before the pit stops—and even with his crew pulling out all the stops to get him in first, then it’s pretty obvious. There was zero chance once that gap blew out to over three seconds.☕
Jamie Hall Jamie Hall Newcomer
2 messages
joined Jul 2014
#108 ·
steelmaker83 said:It’s not about being cheap, 😁 and I don't even want to get into that... just let them have something to celebrate; you can tell they need it. It hasn't been easy for them...

For the most part, the start and the restart (that jump on Daniel Ricciardo) were excellent. Everything else...

I honestly don't know who's trying to split hairs here. If Fernando Alonso's fans are this ecstatic and proud just because he finished ahead of Kimi Räikkönen, it only proves one thing: they know exactly how good Kimi really is.

As for me and the other Kimi fans around here—since we clearly "don't value anyone"—we respect others while standing our ground for our own.
steelmaker83 steelmaker83 Active Member
215 messages
joined May 2019
#109 ·
stormybadger8 said:Just more mindless rambling.🤣
As I’ve already stated, if Fernando Alonso couldn't manage to overtake Kimi Räikkönen in Spain—where he was trailing by about half a second before hitting the pits, despite all the strategic help from his crew to ensure he pitted first—then it's obvious it was just a bad day. Having a gap of over three seconds meant he didn't stand a chance.☕

Exactly.

🤣
steelmaker83 steelmaker83 Active Member
215 messages
joined May 2019
#110 ·
Jamie Hall said:I have no idea who here is looking for problems where none exist. If the fans of Fernando Alonso are getting this worked up and acting so proud just because he's ahead of Kimi Räikkönen, it really only proves one thing: they know exactly how good Kimi actually is.

And for the record, as if you couldn't tell by the way the other Kimi fans act around here, we aren't out to tear anyone down. We respect others while standing our ground for our own.

Of course he’s good; he’s still a top four driver. He's also arguably the best teammate Fernando Alonso has had since Lewis Hamilton. When the championship isn't on the line, it always comes down to the internal battle for dominance within the team. It works that way in every single squad—every driver wants to outperform their teammate, and frankly, they have to.
stormybadger8 stormybadger8 Veteran
1.8K messages
joined Apr 2013
#111 ·
steelmaker83 said:Exactly.

🤣

Short and sweet: Alonso had his shot. Kimi only stands a chance if his pit crew screws up—like, a massive delay—or if someone else on the track just messes it up.

And now, for something a little longer... a visit. fia.com Seriously, give it a rest... stop embarrassing yourself.
Right before hitting the pits, Kimi got caught behind a Caterham and spent a whole lap just tailing him. Honestly, it’s no mystery why he was bleeding time right then.
If Kimi had actually hit his pit stop on time—which takes about 25 seconds—he would’ve popped out right ahead of Jenson Button and just before Jean-Éric Vergne. He would've had a nice little 5 or 6-second cushion, too. Meanwhile, Fernando Alonso probably would've finished right behind Jenson Button, maybe even ahead of Valtteri Bottas since they were all running pretty close on track. So, even if he did manage to jump Bottas, he’d have slammed straight into Jenson Button again.

Traffic was basically only going to screw over Fernando Alonso. Kimi managed to clear out the pack right before his pit stop, which would’ve let him rejoin in clean air. Meanwhile, Alonso was stuck catching up to the slower guys, meaning he would've popped out of the pits right behind a sluggish Jenson Button and Valtteri Bottas. ☕
Alonso started pushing that hard at that moment just so he wouldn't finish behind Bottas or Jenson Button, not because he actually thought he had a shot at overtaking Kimi Räikkönen or Daniel Ricciardo.
dustycyclist19 dustycyclist19 Member
13 messages
joined Apr 2014
#112 ·
Jamie Hall said:I honestly don't get who's out here looking for drama where there isn't any. If the Fernando Alonso fans are getting this hyped just because he's ahead of Kimi Räikkönen, it pretty much tells you just how much they respect Kimi's talent.

And look, for those of us following Kimi—and if you've been paying attention, you know we aren't here to tear anyone down—we respect everyone else's drivers, we just stand by our guy.

We're well aware. But do you happen to realize that the Maestro actually beats that "great" driver nearly 4 to 1 when they're sitting in the exact same car?😁
Jamie Hall Jamie Hall Newcomer
2 messages
joined Jul 2014
#113 ·
dustycyclist19 said:We all know that. But do you realize the Maestro beats that talented driver nearly 4 to 1 while driving the exact same car?😁

Do you honestly believe Ferrari favors Fernando Alonso? It seems like Kimi Räikkönen has some kind of bad luck every single weekend, whether it's a mechanical failure or a sudden puncture.

Most of those races always end up finishing just behind Fernando Alonso.☕
dustycyclist19 dustycyclist19 Member
13 messages
joined Apr 2014
#114 ·
Jamie Hall said:Do you even realize that Ferrari plays favorites with Fernando Alonso, and that Kimi seems to deal with some random car glitch or a puncture every single weekend?

Even with all that nonsense, he still finishes just behind Fernando most of the time...☕

And honestly, Fernando Alonso deals with his fair share of technical issues too.
Right behind😂 😂
61-17😂 right behind😂
graniteharbor502 graniteharbor502 Regular
443 messages
joined Apr 2016
#115 ·
steelmaker83 said:I find myself wondering, quite sincerely, what exactly seems to be the trouble with you? Is there some underlying cause for this sudden shift in temperament, or perhaps a misunderstanding that has gone unaddressed between us?

What do you mean by a four or five-second gap? At the exact moment the Safety Car pulled in, Fernando Alonso had already managed to slash his lead from seven seconds down to just 3.3 seconds. If one were to assume that standard pit stops would have waited another two or three laps, wouldn't that have brought the margin down to under two seconds?

It is truly vital to consider exactly where Kimi Räikkönen might emerge from his pit stop and what kind of traffic he would find himself navigating on track. In a place like the Monaco Grand Prix, deciding when to dive into the pits is an incredibly risky gamble, primarily because of how congested the circuit becomes. Would it not be devastating if Kimi Räikkönen simply got caught in the pack, losing two full seconds in a single lap just by being stuck behind slower cars?

If one were to take a moment to carefully examine the lap times recorded during the initial tire stint, an interesting pattern begins to emerge, wouldn't you agree? When you look closely at the data, you will find that Kimi Räikkönen's fastest single lap actually outpaced Fernando Alonso's best effort; in fact, if we delve even deeper into the telemetry, it becomes quite clear that Kimi Räikkönen managed to clock three separate laps that were all faster than Fernando Alonso's very best time.
Is it not truly fascinating how we find ourselves once again reflecting upon the storied career of Fernando Alonso, particularly when one considers the sheer weight of his legacy within the sport? As I sat contemplating the various trajectories a driver can take, I couldn't help but wonder if anyone else feels that profound sense of nostalgia when revisiting the milestones of his journey. Does the passage of time not make these historical achievements feel even more significant than they did in the heat of the moment? It seems to me that his ability to navigate the complexities of the track remains a subject worthy of endless study, wouldn't you agree?

After Alonso, it becomes quite evident that overtaking at the Monaco Grand Prix is an almost impossible feat, isn't it? When a driver holds the position ahead—in this specific instance, Kimi Räikkönen—they essentially possess the absolute authority to dictate their own pace for the entire field. Now, one must consider that Kimi Räikkönen is far too seasoned a veteran to simply burn through his tires during those opening laps of the race; therefore, I find myself leaning toward a different interpretation of the unfolding events. Is it not more likely that Kimi Räikkönen was simply preserving his rubber in anticipation of one final charge before his pit stop? Furthermore, if we take a moment to scrutinize those closing laps leading up to the deployment of the Safety Car, can we not observe that Fernando Alonso's own pace began to taper off, causing the gap between him and the Finn to steadily diminish? At that stage, Kimi Räikkönen held a 17-second cushion over Kevin Magnussen, a margin that seemed to be widening continuously. Within just a few more laps, that buffer would have been more than sufficient to allow Kimi Räikkönen to pit seamlessly and rejoin the track still positioned ahead of the Dane. It brings to mind how, during his own initial pit entry, Felipe Massa held a 14.3-second advantage over Kimi Räikkönen, only to emerge from the pits trailing by a mere 2.7 seconds.
Following that drop in position caused by Chilton's oversight, it becomes quite difficult to make any meaningful comparisons regarding pace, particularly since Kimi found himself trailing behind Kobayashi and then subsequently stuck behind Sergio Gutiérrez. As for Fernando Alonso, Daniel Ricciardo had already pulled away, leaving him with nothing but clear track ahead of him. However, if we take into account that Gutiérrez spun out on lap 60, and noting that by lap 68 Kimi was already tucked up against the rear of Jenson Button's car, we can at least attempt to compare the pace maintained by the Ferrari drivers between laps 61 and 67; during that stretch, Kimi managed to chip away at Alonso's lead by 3.1 seconds. Of course, one shouldn't overlook Kimi Räikkönen's fastest lap. In the realm of fastest lap statistics, only Michael Schumacher—and perhaps Alain Prost, depending on whether one counts those laps following the disqualifications of other drivers who set faster times—stands ahead of Kimi. Yet, am I personally thrilled? Not exactly. Primarily because it seems as though a podium finish has simply vanished into thin air. It almost makes all this analysis feel somewhat futile, doesn't it? Regardless, we must remember that none of this fault lies with Kimi.

steelmaker83 said:Furthermore, my hypothesis regarding whether Fernando Alonso could maintain competitive lap times on aged tires is rooted in what we observed from Felipe Massa. It was quite remarkable, wasn't it? Even after the rest of the field had already made their pit stops, Massa managed to clock incredibly impressive times while running on those worn-out tires; in fact, he was significantly faster than his own teammate who was benefiting from a fresh set of rubber.

So... where does that leave us?

If you look strictly at the lap times, sure, it might seem like Felipe Massa was faster than Valtteri Bottas while running on those older tires. But when you actually observe the track situation, you see Massa cruising with clear air right in front of him, whereas Bottas is stuck trailing behind Jenson Button in a little train. How can we truly know how fast he could have been if he weren't being held up? And then there is Fernando Alonso; his pace on the old rubber was dropping, hitting a 1:21.8 on that final lap just before the Safety Car came out, yet just look at the pace he found on the soft tires once the Safety Car cleared. By only the third lap—right after Daniel Ricciardo gave him a bit of breathing room—he was already clocking times eight tenths faster than that. In recent seasons, the concept of the "undercut" has become such a standard fixture, where the driver who pits earlier gains the advantage by utilizing those fresh tires. Given everything I have just laid out, I find myself wondering upon what basis you are building this optimism that Fernando Alonso might actually manage to leapfrog Kimi Räikkönen.🤷
Jason Campbell70 Jason Campbell70 Veteran
1K messages
joined Jun 2017
#116 ·
Can someone please post a video or even just some screenshots of that massive blunder by Kimi Räikkönen at Lowes? 🤣🤣🤣🙏

Total Maldonado style. 🙂
swifttiger75 swifttiger75 Active Member
179 messages
joined Nov 2013
#117 ·
LINK
Jamie Hall Jamie Hall Newcomer
2 messages
joined Jul 2014
#118 ·
dustycyclist19 said:Alonso keeps dealing with constant car issues too.
Right behind😂😂
61-17😂 right behind😂

Ha, just face the facts: Alonso won titles with teams similar to today's Mercedes—not with quite as much power, obviously, but then again, who actually had it?

Kimi won with Ferrari back when they weren't untouchable. Kimi secured one title at Ferrari, while Alonso has zero...

What good are all these season statistics if Alonso ends up achieving nothing again?

And have some decency; stop mocking my wording. It’s getting pretty unprofessional on your end.
dustycyclist19 dustycyclist19 Member
13 messages
joined Apr 2014
#119 ·
Jamie Hall said:Haha, just face the facts, Alonso won titles with teams similar to today's Mercedes, obviously not with quite that much raw power, but then again, who actually had it back then anyway...

Kimi Räikkönen won one with Ferrari, which wasn't an untouchable beast at the time. Kimi won one title at Ferrari, while Alonso hasn't won any there..

What good are all these season stats if Alonso ends up achieving nothing again?

And seriously, have some respect and stop mocking my phrasing because you're starting to get a bit ridiculous.

How am I supposed to not laugh when you're talking nonsense? Right now, the biggest factor is that Kimi Räikkönen won the championship with Ferrari. Does that make Kimi a bigger athlete than, say, Roger Federer?
Kimi lost out to Felipe Massa, and even back in 2007, Massa was fighting for the title until the very end of the season. Kimi is an overrated driver. But even so, he's still better than that four-time fraud, let's be real.
Anyway, let's move past the speculation. I want to point out one interesting truth here. Let's say most people watching Formula 1 root for Kimi Räikkönen, Alonso, Lewis Hamilton, or maybe Sebastian Vettel (though I doubt that). But they tend to cheer for the most successful ones. So honestly tell me: how many of them can actually separate their loyalty from reality? For example, someone roots for Kimi and says he's the best. Fair enough. It's the same with other drivers; people root for them and consider them the greatest. Now, the interesting ones are those who root for one driver but actually consider someone else to be the best. If we could tally those votes, the driver with the most of those specific votes might truly be the greatest. I often hear people say they root for that other trio, yet they think Alonso is the best. I haven't really heard anyone say the opposite, though.??🤷 🤷
Jason Campbell70 Jason Campbell70 Veteran
1K messages
joined Jun 2017
#120 ·
Jamie Hall said:Look, just face the facts. Alonso won championships with teams similar to what Mercedes-Benz is running today. Sure, maybe they weren't quite that dominant back then, but then again, who actually had that kind of power at the time?

Haha, I'll take those facts as they are. 😍

Jamie Hall Asks:
Kimi took a win with Ferrari back when they were actually a force to be reckoned with. He secured one victory there. Alonso? Not a single one.

What good are all these season statistics really worth if Alonso ends up walking away empty-handed again?

And exactly how does that data help that Finnish fraudster prevent the Maestro from absolutely slapping him for the sixth race in a row?

Good grief, they aren't helping at all.

image

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