2010 British GP - Silverstone (July 11)

Michael Lee4 said:I don't recall. Refresh my memory... and what does that have to do with Fernando Alonso?

It’s the exact same scenario, except the Germans were neck and neck back then, whereas this "duo" of ours is stuck mid-corner.
Michael Schumacher still left a little room for Sebastian Vettel—not much, but enough. If he hadn't, it would've been an illegal move.

cosmicridge5 said:If you just hate Fernando Alonso for no reason, then obviously nothing matters. 😁

The whole debate really boils down to whether it's worse to blindly loathe him or to worship him. 🙏 🤣

Love this subforum. 😍

So, basically the FIA hates an unspecified driver, which is why they slapped him with a penalty?

I live for this subforum. 🙏

Roger Wright94 said:It's the exact same setup, except the Germans were side-by-side while our duo was mid-corner.
Michael Schumacher definitely left enough room for Sebastian Vettel—just barely, but enough. If he hadn't, it would’ve been an illegal move.

Remind me again... you got a YouTube link for that clip?

I vaguely remember a moment where someone tried to pass the veteran, shoved him halfway onto the grass, and the old man ended up dropping out. Can't recall if it was Vettel or someone else though... 🤷

Roger Wright94 said:It’s the exact same scenario, except the Germans were on the straight and these two "locals" are right in the middle of the turn.

And honestly, driving on a straight versus hitting an entry into a corner is basically the same thing...🙄

cosmicridge5 said:I mean, if you’re just blindly hating on Fernando Alonso, then obviously nothing else matters 😁
At the end of the day, the whole debate really just boils down to whether it's more biased to be one of those people who can't stand him or the ones who worship the ground he walks on 🙏 🤣
Love this subforum 😍

exactly 🙏 The haters are honestly the most brilliant people out there 🙂

@Amanda Kelly—nicely put 👍 I'm totally with you on that.

Michael Lee4 said:So, I guess the FIA just hates unspecified drivers, which is why they slapped him with a penalty?

I really love this subforum. 🙏

It seems pretty obvious the FIA has nothing better to do than hand out penalties for things that actually matter and things that don't, at least in my opinion. 🤷 😁

But if we're being logical, the whole point of a penalty should be to give Robert back his "undue advantage." Instead, they just gift positions to everyone else. 😁 Since Robert couldn't reclaim the spot anyway...

Oh, and David Coulthard was already on the BBC claiming the penalty was totally unjustified and just a racing incident. 😳 😁😁

Look, folks, you can't just label everyone who disagrees with you an Alonso hater. I’ll be the first to admit I’m not exactly a huge fan of Ferrari, but Fernando Alonso spent years at Renault, and for some reason, I still feel a sense of loyalty toward him. Sure, I call him a whiner—but he’s been that way forever. He won the championship back in 2006, and even then, he was busy tearing into his own team toward the end of the season just to cover his tracks when things weren't going his way...

But this specific situation isn't about personality. It's basic racing logic: if you overtake by cutting a corner, you have to give the position back. If they felt Robert Kubica made an illegal move, they should have just taken it to the stewards and let them hand out a penalty. Instead, they decided to "balance the scales" by offsetting Kubica's supposed error with Alonso's illegal maneuver. Where does that leave the sport? If every driver starts trying to mathematically compensate for someone else's mistakes on the track, the whole thing falls apart. At the end of the day, when an official authority tells you three times straight that you messed up and need to yield to avoid a penalty, ignoring them is just plain foolish. You can't act surprised when the hammer finally drops. 🤷

hollowgull5 said:driving straight before hitting the turn counts as the same thing 🙄

Does a corner even count as part of the track?
Or are there some special rules just for turns?

And sorry, one quick correction—we aren't talking about entering the corner, we're talking about driving through it, where they were actually neck and neck!

cosmicridge5 said:The FIA clearly has nothing better to do than throw penalties around for absolutely no reason. It's basically common knowledge at this point 🤷 😁

But if we're being logical, the whole point of a penalty should be to give Robert back his "undue advantage." Instead, they just handed positions to everyone else 😁 which doesn't help since Robert can't get that spot back now..

Oh, and David Coulthard told the BBC right away that the penalty was unjustified and just a racing incident 😳 😁😁

From what I can tell, the point of a penalty like that is just to signal to everyone else that you can't overtake like that... even if you're clearly faster. They weren't even trying to punish him; they just wanted him to yield the position. If those idiots on the pit wall had even a shred of brainpower, they would have told him immediately. He could've let him through right after the chicane and then reclaimed it by the next lap. Easy.

That's where I leave it. It's obvious some people need their hands held through every little detail... To me, punishing Hamilton was even stupider, not because he passed Kimi Räikkönen, but because he wasn't let through enough to utilize the slipstream 🤣 that's just pure nonsense.

Whatever. Ferrari will probably screw something up again next race, so we'll have plenty to talk about then 🍿

Joshua Newman2 said:Look, this whole thing misses the point entirely. It’s common sense: if you try to overtake by cutting the corner, you have to give the space back. If they thought Kubica made an illegal move, they should have just lodged a formal protest with the stewards and let them hand out a penalty. Instead, they decided to balance out Kubica's mistake by letting Alonso get away with his own. Since when did we start letting drivers play judge and jury on the track, trying to math out their way through penalties? At the end of the day, when someone with actual authority tells you three times that you messed up and need to yield—and promises you won't be penalized if you do—it's just plain stupid to ignore them and then act shocked when you actually get hit with a penalty. 🤷

I'm only halfway with you on that one.
What you're saying would be the pragmatic move. Just tie your horse up wherever the boss tells you to.

Look, now that everything has finally settled down and a few days have passed, I’ve been sitting around chewing over the whole situation. I've been talking it through with other racing fans, too, and...
Trust me, I’m actually glad things played out exactly the way they did. It was a reality check. Everyone finally showed their true colors.

Neither Ferrari nor Alonso are to blame here—or at least, nothing they did is worth my breath to complain about.

Alonso 👍
Ferrari. 👍
Race leadership. 👎
Kubica 🙂

Michael Lee4 said:... If those idiots on the pit wall had even a shred of sense, they would've told him right then. He would've let him go immediately after the chicane, or at the latest, caught him on the next lap, and that's that...

First off, we don't have access to the exact timing of their radio chatter or how the whole situation actually unfolded.
Until we see that, your take on this just isn't fair.

And do you honestly believe that people who do this for a living—actual professionals—are really as clueless as you're making them out to be?
Do you seriously think you or I know more than they do?

Roger Wright94 said:First of all, we don't have access to the precise timing of any of those conversations or how this whole situation actually unfolded.
Until we have that data, your assessments aren't exactly hitting the mark...

And do you honestly believe that the people doing this job constantly—hardcore professionals who live and breathe this stuff—are actually the idiots you're painting them out to be?
Do you truly think that you or I possess more information than they do?

Do you seriously think the race officials are just sitting there for the sake of being present, watching the race just to look like complete fools?🤷

Surely they know something, and they certainly have more experience than you Alonso fans can possibly imagine... after all, Mansell was right there...

You're just bashing Kubica because Zalonso is passing him, so the guy needs to get out of the way to let him through—but what "get out of the way"? Kubica should have probably driven straight into the grass just so he wouldn't accidentally wave or call out to Charlie...🙂

Roger Wright94 said:First off, we don't actually have a clear timeline for how those conversations went down or how the whole situation unfolded. I guess we're pretty much in the dark about the actual sequence of events.
Until we actually have that in hand, I guess your assessments aren't exactly fair.

Do you honestly believe that people who do this non-stop—the actual professionals who live and breathe this stuff—are really as clueless as you seem to think they are?

👍

Even if everything turned out exactly how you all claim it did, and they actually... At the exact same time. So, they actually signaled him—well before Kubica had even started slowing down—and then they went ahead and repeated it three times. 😁So, they're supposed to just hand back the lead or face a penalty? You guys seriously think they’d actually listen to that? I mean, come on. As if they’d ever go for that. 🤣

If they really were that much of a bunch of morons and lunatics—which is what you guys seem to be implying—then I guess they would have probably just ignored this drive-through later on, too. 🤣 🤣

Roger Wright94 said:First off, we don't actually have the exact timeline for those conversations or how this whole mess unfolded.
Without that, your take is pretty much baseless.

And do you honestly believe the pros who handle this stuff daily are as clueless as you're making them out to be?
You really think you and I are better informed than they are?

Here’s what I know:

- I saw what Alonso did. My first thought was that it was illegal, and my second was that Alonso would fix it himself immediately. He didn't. I follow racing enough to know right away that it wasn't allowed. They could have told him to give the spot back instantly, or he could have just done it. Whether it was Alonso playing dumb, the pit wall, or everyone collectively pretending not to see it... who cares? It's exhausting.

- After the race, everyone just got hit with news about three warnings before a penalty...

That’s plenty for me. ☕

As for the Ferrari professionals on the pit wall and their massive blunders over the last few seasons—specifically since Napoleon left—you could write a whole book on it. ☕

I think I've said all I need to say on this. I'm sticking to my guns.

James Smith50 said:I guess they might actually know what they’re doing, and they certainly have more experience than you Alonso fans could probably fathom... after all, Mansell was right there.....

Oh, and Coulthard mentioned the exact same thing on the BBC after the race—as if that proves these driver-advisors don't really have much sway over the stewards or their calls 😁 since Mansell would likely view it as just a racing incident himself and wouldn't suggest a penalty for it.😁 hihihi 😍 😁

Michael Lee4 said:Look, here's my take:

- I saw what Alonso did. Right away, I thought—there's no way he can pull that—and I figured Alonso would just hand the spot back immediately. He didn't. I follow enough racing to know instantly that wasn't allowed. And honestly, they could've told him right then and there to give the position back, like, Alonso should have just done it himself. Who was actually playing dumb here? Was it Alonso, the wall, or just everyone collectively pretending not to notice... man, it's exhausting...
And I feel like I've already said everything worth saying on this, so I'm not adding anything else... I'm sticking to my guns.

Okay, seriously, do you actually think Alonso is such an idiot that he’d just ignore a penalty? 🙏 It's more likely that he and Ferrari had some grounds for "insubordination" (if we even believe that whole three-warning thing, which sounds pretty sketchy to me). Sure, if Alonso was being a total mastermind and chasing fast laps just to minimize the damage from a penalty, maybe. But he was stuck behind Rosberg after that mess happened.
That was just a racing incident—and there have been plenty of those in Formula history to judge them objectively.

But hey... like you said: better you stay stuck in your own head.👍

Nicole Reyes97 said:Seriously, do you actually believe Alonso is such an idiot that he would just ignore a penalty order... 🙏 I suppose both he and Ferrari had plenty of reasons to be "disobedient," even if the claims that they were warned three separate times feel like a complete stretch to me... Sure, let’s just assume Alonso was being his usual calculating self, pushing for those fast laps so that even if he caught a penalty, he wouldn't drop too far down the order. But the reality is he was stuck right behind Rosberg after that incident happened...
That was just a racing incident, and if you look at the history of Formula 1, there have been plenty of moments like that which could easily be prosecuted objectively...

But... just like you said yourself: you’re probably better off staying blissfully ignorant in your own little bubble... 👍

I honestly can’t tell who’s more dim-witted here—is it us, or is it Alonso and his whole entitled little entourage that seems to be happening, quite frankly...Always... There are enough ingredients here for a massive blowout... and I can't help but wonder who’s going to end up taking the fall when the season wraps up. Unless this ends in a total disaster like the Prost-Ferrari situation—getting kicked out of the team because he just couldn't stop complaining about everyone and everything...

James Smith50 said:I honestly don't know who's more clueless—us or Alonso and his little entourage of divas who—it just happens, you know—always find something to bicker about... I mean, who's actually going to take the fall at the end of the season? Unless it ends like that whole Prost-Ferrari mess, where he gets kicked out because the guy—well, he was constantly complaining about everyone else.

Yeah, totally... that "entourage of divas" will always be fighting amongst themselves, while the rest of them—the smart, level-headed, sensible drivers—are basically just circling like vultures, waiting for some "Alonso situation" to pop up so they can finally jump him while he's down. ☕

Nicole Reyes97 said:Yeah, exactly... that "diva squad" will always be bickering amongst themselves while the rest of the drivers—the smart, level-headed, and composed ones—are just circling like vultures, waiting for some "Alonso situation" to arise so they can finally nail him to the cross... ☕

The man is nailing himself to the cross, and he’s been doing it for quite a while now.

James Smith50 said:He’s basically been martyring himself at this point—it's been going on for a while now.

Yeah, he's definitely trying to play to the crowd...🙄

You keep being so objective* when you judge Alonso, and I’ll just keep "arguing" with you. Peace be with you☕

*Look, if one of you smart—well, actually, let's say "intense"—folks can actually convince me (with actual logic, mind you) that there isn't even a tiny shred of bias in your take on Alonso and how he's handled things, then I'll stop "arguing."