Doctors' strike

If I’m reading this right, the strike kicks off this Monday, April 11th, 2005—but what I really need to know is how long they're planning to hold out?

I’ve got a checkup scheduled for the 15th down in Washington, D.C., at the Mayo Clinic, and I’d really rather not show up to an empty office or get caught in some kind of mess.

I’ve got a follow-up appointment scheduled at the hospital on April 13th for the exact same reason. 😢

So, I'm gonna double-check the timing this coming Monday...

All in all... what a joke.

I'd say double-check everything, because one doctor told me, ''They'll put in the papers that we're on strike, and then nobody shows up all day.'' 😁 But they were actually working normally...🙂

Alright, I need someone to weigh in on this one: if I end up laying out a doctor who’s currently on strike because he refuses to examine my wife, are the other doctors actually going to step up and help us, or are they all just going to join the picket line too?

Samuel Lewis3 said:Can someone answer this for me: if I end up laying out a doctor who's on strike and refusing to see my wife, will the other doctors step in to help, or are they all gonna strike too?

Well, they're colleagues, right? And colleagues should probably have each other's backs. 😁

He could end up behind bars for all we know... are their doctors even allowed to go on strike?

I honestly feel like you can walk into any hospital whenever you need to, especially if you’ve already got an appointment on the books.
You just have to be ready to really turn up the heat if they start trying to pull some shady nonsense on you. I'm talking about getting loud—threatening to call the local news, demanding the specific name of the doctor who's giving you a hard time, insisting they put their refusal in writing, or just making enough noise to end up in the administrator's office... that kind of thing.

Scott Allen10 said:I believe you can walk into any hospital if there is an emergency or a scheduled appointment.
You just have to push back hard if they start playing games. I mean threatening to call the media, demanding the name of the doctor refusing treatment, insisting on their signature for a refusal, making a scene, going straight to the administration... and so on.

Thanks, Scott Allen10. I think you always provide a realistic view of the situation.

It’s just that from a patient's perspective, things look a bit different. I remember about two and a half years ago when I finally decided to deal with my sinus issues. They were becoming serious, affecting both my career and my personal life.

I would wake up every morning feeling congested, exhausted, sleep-deprived, and unable to breathe. Midway through some tests, the doctors timidly suggested that the indicated surgery—for some significant polyps—would have to wait until July because of the physician strikes this spring.

Fine. No one dies from sinus issues, and generally, I support the medical staff's cause; they deserve better pay. So, I waited until summer.

Two and a half years later, history repeats itself. My brother—and I don't know if it's genetic, which is almost funny, though he isn't laughing—has terrible ENT problems. He deals with such bad tonsillitis four times a year that he gets knocked out of work for ten days every single time. After extensive testing, it was determined he has a severe deviated septum.

The referral says to contact them after May 15th for the surgery, "because of the current strike, and because once that's over, we'll be overwhelmed by patients with tumors."

To hell with sinuses, polyps, or septums, but seriously—are you postponing surgeries for people with tumors? Is that ethical? Does that align with the Hippocratic Oath? You should be ashamed.

By the way, this isn't directed at Scott Allen10, but rather at any physician reading this...

trebor said:I completely agree—this situation is grotesque, to say the least. Especially since politics seems to be dragging its feet through the middle of it all. And the salaries? Honestly, calling it anything other than hypocrisy is a stretch. When you're pulling a guaranteed $1,500 or more every single month here in America, and you turn down a 10% raise just to demand more, more, and more... hiding behind notions of "dignity" or being "undervalued"... it defies both common sense and basic morality.
As one doctor put it: we’ll all eventually pile into our Mercedes-Benzes, Audis, and BMWs, honking our horns through the streets about how underpaid and undervalued we are.
Good luck to all the patients. Stay strong.

By the way, who on earth is this Babić guy?😕

What exactly has he done for the American healthcare system? Shouldn't the head of a medical union be someone who actually commands respect among their peers and possesses a legitimate professional background?

trebor said:...
You just have to go in there guns blazing if they start playing games. I mean, threatening to go to the press, demanding to know which doctor is refusing to help, calling them out on their refusal to sign off on things—you’ve got to make some noise, go straight to the hospital administration... you know, escalate everything.

Buahaha... Like those people aren't already immune to all that even without a strike... My wife was actually stuck in the hospital for a few days a while back because the doctors wanted to "observe" her. Now, don't get me wrong, my wife is a total knockout, but what exactly are they planning to observe? They weren't even running any actual tests or anything! So she's lying there, and then on the third day during rounds, she asks the doctor to please just explain clearly what's going on and exactly what medications they're giving her and what they're for. And the guy actually laughs in her face! He tells her he's gonna kick her out of the hospital just for asking questions!??!!?
I seriously wanted to deck the guy!
So, I called up a buddy of mine who's a doctor, and he told me I should just pull her out of there because, honestly, there was absolutely no medical reason for her to be staying. So we got her discharged, and of course, everything turned out fine.
I just can't wrap my head around the sheer arrogance of these people. Seriously. If veterinarians treated animals the way these folks treat humans, they'd be dead within a day. A cow would probably gore them just for the hell of it...

Sometimes I actually find myself missing the old days of strict government control. Sending people out to do hard labor in the middle of nowhere for a few years just to teach them a lesson... $3333 they’d have nothing left to show for it when they finally returned 😁

As for healthcare, all I hear are horror stories about how patients are treated. Honestly, maybe full privatization is the answer here. Patients are complaining, hospitals aren't seeing any profit, and doctors are getting fired left and right 🤔

I was just wondering if the doctors running their own private practices are joining the strike too? 😕

I feel like I just have to say something about these random claims

Earning a guaranteed monthly salary of $1,500 or more in America

So, if you look at that $3333 from a senior specialist doctor's base pay $2267 (which the Secretary tends to conveniently forget whenever it suits them), they’re actually pulling an extra $500 or so from maybe four or five on-call shifts. That means being stuck in a hospital for four or five 24-hour stretches, away from family, through holidays, weekends, and everything else. If you calculate the hourly rate for someone who spent ten years in medical school and keeps studying their whole life—mostly out of their own pocket, even though it's legally required—it ends up being about $10 per hour. Meanwhile, kids making money through campus jobs can pull in $10 for some gigs. Not to mention the endless overtime and all those unused vacation days basically gifted to the government that nobody ever compensates them for...

Refusing a 10% raise and asking for more, more, more... hiding behind notions of dignity or feeling undervalued and pleading for empathy... honestly, it seems totally irrational and wrong to me.

Nobody is really asking for anything beyond what THIS specific administration signed off on and allocated funds for—so there's no point blaming whatever unrepresentative previous government was in charge. Besides, a doctor's rights are all regulated by the signed professional agreements, so right now, even old earned rights aren't being met because only the branch collective agreement is active.

Like one doctor put it—we'll all just hop into our Mercedes-Benzes, Audis, and BMWs and honk through town complaining about how we're underpaid and undervalued.

Pretty much. Everyone's driving high-end cars and suddenly doesn't know where all that cash went.

And I guess nobody wonders why certain legal matters get dragged through the Supreme Court (where, by the way, judges have salaries that doctors try to match), yet when the state goes against a union, things move from lawsuit to verdict in a single day. It seems they definitely know how to use those high judicial salaries to ensure the courts stay on the state's side when necessary.

Just a quick side note: when people start talking about medical humanitarianism, they should remember that a doctor shouldn't be filling up their Mercedes-Benz at the gas station on the taxpayer's dime in the name of compassion, nor do their kids live off of being "humanitarian."

And honestly, I'd trade my $10,000 for any programmer, manager, or consultant's $10,000 $0.00 in a heartbeat.

Maybe we should just scrap those 24-hour shifts and let doctors work regular rotations instead. I mean, I guess nobody's really built to stay on call for 24 hours straight. Plus, if they're trying to catch some sleep during a shift, you probably shouldn't be waking them up anyway...

The core issue here is that we can't seem to get doctors to clarify which country they actually reside in.

As for the patients out there cheering on this doctors' strike, I suppose they haven't realized the reality of the situation yet. Soon enough, they'll be the ones carrying their own medicine and hygiene supplies into the hospital, all while risking sepsis because the facility's sanitation budget has been gutted. And if we go ahead and hike up physician salaries now, what happens next? They'll just end up having to haul their own hospital beds from home and foot the entire bill for their own treatment:
it’s all one big pot and the coffers are empty. If you hand more money to the doctors, it’s being snatched directly out of the patients' pockets.
plain and simple.

A bit of advice for those doctors who seem to think they're the only undervalued professionals left, acting as if they hold some kind of superior rights over the rest of this pathetic nation: why not switch careers to landmine clearance? You could spend your days as forestry workers clearing out the wilderness for $0.50.

And regarding that idiot spokesperson, Babić: when they finally stumble upon a bomb, I hope they toss a handful of rotting filth right onto it!

Everyone seems to forget that doctors are just one piece of the puzzle. They rely on nurses, technicians, and all the support staff who keep the entire system running. Without them, nothing gets done. Yet, the conversation always centers on physician salaries. We really ought to see a breakdown of what everyone else in the hierarchy is actually making. No one ever complains about the rest of the staff, but they should. It would be quite something to see if the rest of the workforce went on strike—let’s see those "all-powerful" doctors try to handle the "unimportant" tasks themselves...

I know I shouldn't generalize... but my hair is practically standing on end because of doctors (you should take a look at www.healthgrades.com). I deal with chronic health issues, and honestly, the way physicians treat their patients just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I’m also one of those people who is going to lose ten (TEN) months of waiting time for an appointment next Thursday. Yesterday, I received such a condescending explanation from the hospital: "Do you have a tumor? No? Then book again later or just go to a private clinic." (And I should mention, I need this specific checkup at least once a year SO THAT I DON'T MISS A POTENTIAL TUMOR, and of course, I'll be scraping together $200 for a private visit, on top of the mountain of other regular tests I have to pay for).
If I, as someone working at a high school, were to mention that after 14 years on the job, my salary is roughly $1467, that doctor above would probably tell me I'm in the lowest-paid profession and suggest I find a corporate job instead. Well, fine—let him open his own private practice and rake in the cash, because nowadays in hospitals in this country, you can make $6,800 plus $3,200 for on-call shifts.
My studies took over seven years, and I am constantly pursuing continuing education because my subjects are so specialized. I pay for everything myself (I don't have some big pharmaceutical company sponsoring me), I spend two hours every single day prepping lessons (who's to blame if I try to work honestly with kids and actually love what I do?), and then there are extracurricular activities that run on Saturday mornings and late evenings too. I'm not saying I'm a genius, but I've certainly sweated blood to get to where my knowledge level is today.
I'm honestly just so tired of this intense mystification surrounding medical school, as if they're training superheroes or some higher species there, right?
And please, don't lecture me about "heavy responsibility" because you clearly don't carry any. People die every single day due to medical errors, and it's not like nothing happens!
Doctors are basically just extorting the public because they know they can squeeze every last cent out of people when it comes to their own health or their family's well-being.
Look, I’d love for us all to live a high standard of living and for doctors to earn $10,000 a month, but we live in America, so I guess we just have to shoulder this collective burden together.

trebor said:I think you can pretty much walk into any hospital if it’s an emergency or if you’ve got an appointment scheduled.
You just gotta go in guns blazing if they start playing games. I mean, threaten to call the local news, demand the name of the doctor refusing you, get their signature on the refusal, make a massive scene, storm the administrator's office... you know the drill.

Hmm, hmm... well, my appointment is conditional... so I have to check on Monday if my Wednesday slot actually holds up.

Nothing else comes to mind... I don't feel quite well enough to have the energy for a huge blowout... which is exactly why I asked for an earlier checkup than what was suggested.

Still, thanks! I honestly still believe they'll see me even without making a scene, just because I'll be there... and I'm not budging.😳

I haven't really been following the specific progression of the negotiations between the Federal Government and the medical union, so I’m not entirely sure what exactly was being debated or whether this strike is even justified. It seems to me that a significant number of doctors don't actually support the walkout or Dr. Babić, though I can't say for certain who is acting as a spokesperson or what kind of political maneuvering might be driving this whole situation. What I do observe, both now and during the previous strike, is the relentless manipulation of the public by the media; they consistently push inaccurate data regarding physician salaries. It also appears to me that the public is absolutely livid with the doctors, almost as if people are taking their general frustration with a failing healthcare system and directing it squarely at the physicians, as if they are somehow personally responsible for the systemic issues. I find it particularly absurd when people suggest—as they did during a phone-in segment on a talk show hosted by Ladišić—that doctors are already accepting bribes and gifts, so why should they demand higher pay. I have no idea which salaries they are supposedly using to buy all those Audis and BMWs, as I certainly wouldn't go so far as to claim that every doctor owns a fleet of luxury cars like that.

On a separate note, during the last strike, I underwent surgery at the Mayo Clinic and continued to attend my follow-up appointments there, and not a single person turned me away despite the labor action, even though the surgeon who operated on me and handled my check-ups was a supporter of the strike. That said, if you have any scheduled exams or procedures, it would be wise to call ahead and confirm everything.

novinick said:I know you shouldn't generalize, but...

Dealing with chronic health issues really gives you a front-row seat to how poorly doctors treat their patients. I’m one of those people whose appointment is going to be pushed back yet again next Thursday, meaning I've been waiting ten whole months just for a check-up.

If I mentioned that after fourteen years of service, my salary at the local high school is roughly what it is, $1467 some doctor up there would probably patronize me, telling me I have the lowest-paying job in the country and suggesting I find work at a major corporation instead. Well, if they're so brilliant, they should go open a private practice and rake in the cash, because working in hospitals in this country today pays about $7,000 base plus another $3,500 for on-call shifts.

It took me over seven years of grueling study to get where I am, and I'm constantly paying out of pocket to stay current because my field is so specialized—I don't have some massive pharmaceutical giant sponsoring my continuing education.

Look, I’m not claiming to be some kind of genius, but I’ve worked my tail off to acquire the knowledge I have today.

Honestly, I’m tired of this constant mystification surrounding Medical School, as if they’re training a master race of superhumans or something.
And please, don't lecture me about "heavy responsibility," because clearly, it isn't being taken seriously. People die every single day due to medical errors, and it’s not like nothing happens.

It feels like doctors are essentially holding the public hostage, knowing full well that people will squeeze every last cent out of their wallets just to ensure their own survival or their family's health.
I’d love for everyone to enjoy a high standard of living and for doctors to earn $10,000 a month, but we live in America, so we all just have to shoulder this collective burden.

- I also try not to generalize, and credit goes to the honest, conscientious doctors out there, but unfortunately, they seem to be becoming a vanishing breed. 😢

- Someone can actually die waiting ten months for an appointment, yet if you grease the right palms, suddenly that machine that was supposedly "broken" or "occupied" becomes available instantly. 😕

- You need real guts to go into private practice, because you're entirely dependent on your own skill and hard work; you can't just slack off like you might elsewhere. 🙂

- The pharmaceutical industry basically funds our entire medical system, essentially "training" doctors to act as their glorified sales reps; they've even started showing up in TV commercials lately. 😢 😠

- It almost feels like any knowledge you can't turn a profit on is viewed as a liability, though there's a certain peace of mind in knowing you're on the right path.

- The irony is that Medical School doesn't even offer a course on nutrition anymore, even though everyone and their mother is talking about how much diet affects health. It makes you wonder what healthcare has actually become—just a mechanism for selling drugs and serving the interests of Big Pharma. 😢

- And hey, I wouldn't mind if everyone was pulling in $10,000 a month too... 👍